Will it cost the taxpayers to retrofit this gifted jet? Yes

And if you have a problem with this, then you should be able to tell me how much it will cost the taxpayers for the next handful of years (at least ) to maintain the current 35 year old AF1-s until the new AF-1s are delivered by Boeing. Taxpayers are also footing that bill.

It wouldnt surprise me if we see savings, at a minimum, in the hundreds of millions by doing this, even if it costs $1billion to retrofit.

The current AF1-s are 35 years old, and are going to be very expensive now to maintain.

(05-14-2025 11:16 AM)mlb Wrote:  I'll wait and see what they come back with, but it isn't as simple as sweeping it for bugs and putting in new communications equipment. There are medical bays that have to be installed, anti-SAM systems that have to be installed, anti-AAM systems that have to be installed, in air refueling capabilities to be installed. It isn't a simple modification, hence the time and money. And also no guarantee that this other contractor can complete it on time and on budget.

Has it ever occurred to you that maybe there's more to this than what is being reported?

(05-14-2025 11:16 AM)UofMstateU Wrote:  Will it cost the taxpayers to retrofit this gifted jet? Yes

And if you have a problem with this, then you should be able to tell me how much it will cost the taxpayers for the next handful of years (at least ) to maintain the current 35 year old AF1-s until the new AF-1s are delivered by Boeing. Taxpayers are also footing that bill.

It wouldnt surprise me if we see savings, at a minimum, in the hundreds of millions by doing this, even if it costs $1billion to retrofit.

The current AF1-s are 35 years old, and are going to be very expensive now to maintain.

Show me the numbers then. I don't want hypotheticals, what does it cost to maintain the current airplanes, and how much does it jump to keep them in service an extra couple years?

And assuming Trump can't use it after he leaves office and it gets retired, why are we spending $1B to retire it? Why not leave it in service until its service life has passed then put it in the Trump library?

Why do you need the numbers? What possible difference does it make to you.

Oh yeah,

ORANGE MAN BAD

(05-14-2025 11:19 AM)b2b Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 11:16 AM)mlb Wrote:  I'll wait and see what they come back with, but it isn't as simple as sweeping it for bugs and putting in new communications equipment. There are medical bays that have to be installed, anti-SAM systems that have to be installed, anti-AAM systems that have to be installed, in air refueling capabilities to be installed. It isn't a simple modification, hence the time and money. And also no guarantee that this other contractor can complete it on time and on budget.

Has it ever occurred to you that maybe there's more to this than what is being reported?

Please fill me in then. What else is going on? I'm open minded, but I am going to question the costs for something that is a 2 year stop gap (if we go with 2029 vs 2027).

(05-14-2025 10:00 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 07:23 AM)Eldonabe Wrote:  Is the title of this mis-leading?

It is not a "personal" Luxury Jet. It is a [temporary] replacement for AF1 which is the Presidential Jet.


In the long list of things to give any F's about, this is waaaaay down towards the bottom.

It will cost taxpayers hundreds of millions of dollars… some project it into the billions… to retrofit this 13 year old plane into an AF1. Too, it will take years to complete & then, after a year of service, be deeded over to the Trump Library… which, coincidentally does not exist.

So, we invest a billion, so Trump can get a personal jet equipped with top secret electronic & communication systems, only to have Boeing deliver 2 AF1’s at roughly the same time. Trump can then ride around in “his” plane for 12 months in his official capacity & then take control of it when he leaves office? Seems legit.

Who pays the millions to have the top secret communications systems removed once he leaves office & the plane returned to civilian service? Seems like an inordinate amount of money & resources for a year of service… unless the ultimate goal is for the plane’s life to extend well past Trump’s term in office.

Any plane a former POTUS flies around in has plenty of ‘lectronics. You do know they are still under SS protection, right?

You knew that, right?

Geeeeeeezzz, The Crazy is out today.

(05-14-2025 11:21 AM)BartlettTigerFan Wrote:  Why do you need the numbers? What possible difference does it make to you.

Oh yeah,

ORANGE MAN BAD

You think anytime someone questions decisions from Trump that it is TDS.

(05-14-2025 11:23 AM)mlb Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 11:21 AM)BartlettTigerFan Wrote:  Why do you need the numbers? What possible difference does it make to you.

Oh yeah,

ORANGE MAN BAD

You think anytime someone questions decisions from Trump that it is TDS.

Pretty much. What's the point?

(05-14-2025 11:19 AM)mlb Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 11:16 AM)UofMstateU Wrote:  Will it cost the taxpayers to retrofit this gifted jet? Yes

And if you have a problem with this, then you should be able to tell me how much it will cost the taxpayers for the next handful of years (at least ) to maintain the current 35 year old AF1-s until the new AF-1s are delivered by Boeing. Taxpayers are also footing that bill.

It wouldnt surprise me if we see savings, at a minimum, in the hundreds of millions by doing this, even if it costs $1billion to retrofit.

The current AF1-s are 35 years old, and are going to be very expensive now to maintain.

Show me the numbers then. I don't want hypotheticals, what does it cost to maintain the current airplanes, and how much does it jump to keep them in service an extra couple years?

And assuming Trump can't use it after he leaves office and it gets retired, why are we spending $1B to retire it? Why not leave it in service until its service life has passed then put it in the Trump library?

The moral of the story is to not b*tch about the cost to retrofit if you dont know how much we are currently spending and could save. Why dont you ask the people who wrote the article who said it would cost $1billion to retrofit. You should demand full accountability of numbers if you are really interested in the cost to tax payers.

(05-14-2025 11:19 AM)mlb Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 11:16 AM)UofMstateU Wrote:  Will it cost the taxpayers to retrofit this gifted jet? Yes

And if you have a problem with this, then you should be able to tell me how much it will cost the taxpayers for the next handful of years (at least ) to maintain the current 35 year old AF1-s until the new AF-1s are delivered by Boeing. Taxpayers are also footing that bill.

It wouldnt surprise me if we see savings, at a minimum, in the hundreds of millions by doing this, even if it costs $1billion to retrofit.

The current AF1-s are 35 years old, and are going to be very expensive now to maintain.

Show me the numbers then. I don't want hypotheticals, what does it cost to maintain the current airplanes, and how much does it jump to keep them in service an extra couple years?

And assuming Trump can't use it after he leaves office and it gets retired, why are we spending $1B to retire it? Why not leave it in service until its service life has passed then put it in the Trump library?

The new AF1s were supposed to be completed last year.

New Air Force one costs
Soon a New Air Force One Will Bring a New Set of Bills
A lot has been written about the cost of the work-in-progress Air Force One replacement program, which is scheduled to swap out the aging VC-25As in 2024 for newer, more sophisticated 747-8s dubbed VC-25B. In 2016, the replacement was projected to cost $3.2 billion. As is so often the case, an already big number kept getting bigger and by 2019, Air Force Magazine was reporting that the new planes were expected to cost $5.2 billion. Their 100,000-plus page manuals alone cost $84 million. Much less, however, has been written about what it costs to fly, operate and maintain Air Force One. These aren’t figures that are readily available — and no one even really started asking for them until 2014.

(05-14-2025 11:24 AM)UofMstateU Wrote:  The moral of the story is to not b*tch about the cost to retrofit if you dont know how much we are currently spending and could save. Why dont you ask the people who wrote the article who said it would cost $1billion to retrofit. You should demand full accountability of numbers if you are really interested in the cost to tax payers.

Fair point. I'll email the author of the article and the whitehouse and wait for them to give me a detailed break down both ways. I'll let you know what I get in response.

(05-14-2025 11:25 AM)Eagleaidaholic Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 11:19 AM)mlb Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 11:16 AM)UofMstateU Wrote:  Will it cost the taxpayers to retrofit this gifted jet? Yes

And if you have a problem with this, then you should be able to tell me how much it will cost the taxpayers for the next handful of years (at least ) to maintain the current 35 year old AF1-s until the new AF-1s are delivered by Boeing. Taxpayers are also footing that bill.

It wouldnt surprise me if we see savings, at a minimum, in the hundreds of millions by doing this, even if it costs $1billion to retrofit.

The current AF1-s are 35 years old, and are going to be very expensive now to maintain.

Show me the numbers then. I don't want hypotheticals, what does it cost to maintain the current airplanes, and how much does it jump to keep them in service an extra couple years?

And assuming Trump can't use it after he leaves office and it gets retired, why are we spending $1B to retire it? Why not leave it in service until its service life has passed then put it in the Trump library?

The new AF1s were supposed to be completed last year.

New Air Force one costs
Soon a New Air Force One Will Bring a New Set of Bills
A lot has been written about the cost of the work-in-progress Air Force One replacement program, which is scheduled to swap out the aging VC-25As in 2024 for newer, more sophisticated 747-8s dubbed VC-25B. In 2016, the replacement was projected to cost $3.2 billion. As is so often the case, an already big number kept getting bigger and by 2019, Air Force Magazine was reporting that the new planes were expected to cost $5.2 billion. Their 100,000-plus page manuals alone cost $84 million. Much less, however, has been written about what it costs to fly, operate and maintain Air Force One. These aren’t figures that are readily available — and no one even really started asking for them until 2014.

Back then, when they started getting some maintenance numbers, it was estimated that maintenance on the then 25 year old jets caused the per hour flight costs to double. Move forward 10 years to the present, and its estimated that the operational costs are now north of $250K to operate, so another $250K per hour for maintenance.

Trumps 4 day trip to the middle east would then equate to $24million to operate and another $24million for maintenance. These amounts are double what they were 10 years ago when the planes were only 25 years old.

Point is, that while we dont know exactly how much they cost to maintain, we have an idea that the costs are very high and that they have doubled in the last ten years. With the new AF-1's at least another half decade out from delivery, the maintenance costs for the old jets are continuing to rise.

(05-14-2025 11:10 AM)Eagleaidaholic Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 11:03 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 10:00 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 07:23 AM)Eldonabe Wrote:  Is the title of this mis-leading?

It is not a "personal" Luxury Jet. It is a [temporary] replacement for AF1 which is the Presidential Jet.


In the long list of things to give any F's about, this is waaaaay down towards the bottom.

It will cost taxpayers hundreds of millions of dollars… some project it into the billions… to retrofit this 13 year old plane into an AF1. Too, it will take years to complete & then, after a year of service, be deeded over to the Trump Library… which, coincidentally does not exist.

So, we invest a billion, so Trump can get a personal jet equipped with top secret electronic & communication systems, only to have Boeing deliver 2 AF1’s at roughly the same time. Trump can then ride around in “his” plane for 12 months in his official capacity & then take control of it when he leaves office? Seems legit.

Who pays the millions to have the top secret communications systems removed once he leaves office & the plane returned to civilian service? Seems like an inordinate amount of money & resources for a year of service… unless the ultimate goal is for the plane’s life to extend well past Trump’s term in office.

It will cost taxpayers hundreds of millions....lol

Add a couple digits to get to what Biden wasted. I don't recall your being so taxpayer concerned. Wonder what changed?

So, waaaaay less than the amount Congress gave Stacey Abrams orgs to install 36 stoves.

Yea, what was that? 2 billion, with a B?

I think they proudly called it “throwing the gold bars out the window”.

But mUh retrofit…

(05-14-2025 11:16 AM)mlb Wrote:  I'll wait and see what they come back with, but it isn't as simple as sweeping it for bugs and putting in new communications equipment. There are medical bays that have to be installed, anti-SAM systems that have to be installed, anti-AAM systems that have to be installed, in air refueling capabilities to be installed. It isn't a simple modification, hence the time and money. And also no guarantee that this other contractor can complete it on time and on budget.

Perhaps not, but you can guarantee Boeing won’t have it done on time and on budget.
Take the plane.

(05-14-2025 11:53 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 11:16 AM)mlb Wrote:  I'll wait and see what they come back with, but it isn't as simple as sweeping it for bugs and putting in new communications equipment. There are medical bays that have to be installed, anti-SAM systems that have to be installed, anti-AAM systems that have to be installed, in air refueling capabilities to be installed. It isn't a simple modification, hence the time and money. And also no guarantee that this other contractor can complete it on time and on budget.

Perhaps not, but you can guarantee Boeing won’t have it done on time and on budget.
Take the plane.

Yeah. Who turns down a plane??

(05-14-2025 10:52 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 09:10 AM)mlb Wrote:  Here is my question... can Trump and his family use the jet after it goes to his library? If so then this definitely reeks of grift, something that I think everyone had issues with in the last administration.

I bet it’ll stay in service, he’s got his own damn plane, how many does he need. But even if it does go to the library it’s still Fed property. NOT a “personal luxury plane” as the thread name lies.

Even Trump said it's not being given to him it's being given to the United States government. Accept the damned thing and say "thank you."

It would likely stay in service for future presidents.

I love that liberals are now spending hawks suddenly. lol

(05-14-2025 11:58 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 10:52 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(05-14-2025 09:10 AM)mlb Wrote:  Here is my question... can Trump and his family use the jet after it goes to his library? If so then this definitely reeks of grift, something that I think everyone had issues with in the last administration.

I bet it’ll stay in service, he’s got his own damn plane, how many does he need. But even if it does go to the library it’s still Fed property. NOT a “personal luxury plane” as the thread name lies.

Even Trump said it's not being given to him it's being given to the United States government. Accept the damned thing and say "thank you."

It would likely stay in service for future presidents.

I love that liberals are now spending hawks suddenly. lol

Let's be honest, we haven't had a spending hawk since Newt was in office. Neither party has worried about spending until January 20, 2025.

Dunno. I've seen more waste cut in the past 4 months than I have in 30 years combined.

(05-14-2025 12:07 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  Dunno. I've seen more waste cut in the past 4 months than I have in 30 years combined.

Since 2000 for sure. No argument from me at all. Newt and Clinton cleaned up welfare together, however, which was a significant chunk of money.

(05-14-2025 12:07 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  Dunno. I've seen more waste cut in the past 4 months than I have in 30 years combined.

Lots of smoke and mirrors so far. I'd advise waiting until you see a budget and how much actually ends up being spent.

But I'm sure you'll celebrate things being cut that you don't happen to agree...with as we all do...just don't ignore the spending increases on things you just happen to like.