(08-27-2018 11:15 AM)TechRocks Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 10:46 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  I thought the market best set the wage and a forced minimum wage would actually do more damage than good? Surely, you're not saying it will raise the standard of living in Mexico?

I imagine a rising standard of living in Mexico scares the living crap out of you leftists as there'd be less need for undocumented democrats to be crossing the border to vote in the United States and looking for gubmint handouts.

Would you kindly just stop making **** up please?

(08-27-2018 11:37 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 11:15 AM)TechRocks Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 10:46 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  I thought the market best set the wage and a forced minimum wage would actually do more damage than good? Surely, you're not saying it will raise the standard of living in Mexico?

I imagine a rising standard of living in Mexico scares the living crap out of you leftists as there'd be less need for undocumented democrats to be crossing the border to vote in the United States and looking for gubmint handouts.

Would you kindly just stop making **** up please?

Four illegal aliens from Mexico were just indicted for voting in the 2016 election in NC. He might be engaging in a little hyperbole with the "gubmint handouts" part, but he isn't "making **** up".

(08-27-2018 11:41 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 11:37 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 11:15 AM)TechRocks Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 10:46 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  I thought the market best set the wage and a forced minimum wage would actually do more damage than good? Surely, you're not saying it will raise the standard of living in Mexico?

I imagine a rising standard of living in Mexico scares the living crap out of you leftists as there'd be less need for undocumented democrats to be crossing the border to vote in the United States and looking for gubmint handouts.

Would you kindly just stop making **** up please?

Four illegal aliens from Mexico were just indicted for voting in the 2016 election in NC. He might be engaging in a little hyperbole with the "gubmint handouts" part, but he isn't "making **** up".

Not the part I'm referring to.

So much winning.

(08-27-2018 11:47 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 11:41 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 11:37 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 11:15 AM)TechRocks Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 10:46 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  I thought the market best set the wage and a forced minimum wage would actually do more damage than good? Surely, you're not saying it will raise the standard of living in Mexico?

I imagine a rising standard of living in Mexico scares the living crap out of you leftists as there'd be less need for undocumented democrats to be crossing the border to vote in the United States and looking for gubmint handouts.

Would you kindly just stop making **** up please?

Four illegal aliens from Mexico were just indicted for voting in the 2016 election in NC. He might be engaging in a little hyperbole with the "gubmint handouts" part, but he isn't "making **** up".

Not the part I'm referring to.

Blacks in the rust belt now working in numbers like never before and with solid wages to boot?

The bizarro-world antics of opposing a minimum wage at home but insisting upon one abroad. To thunderous applause.

If you're going to be full on nationalist why bother with a trade deal to begin with?

(08-27-2018 11:37 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 11:15 AM)TechRocks Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 10:46 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  I thought the market best set the wage and a forced minimum wage would actually do more damage than good? Surely, you're not saying it will raise the standard of living in Mexico?

I imagine a rising standard of living in Mexico scares the living crap out of you leftists as there'd be less need for undocumented democrats to be crossing the border to vote in the United States and looking for gubmint handouts.

Would you kindly just stop making **** up please?

I won't put words in your mouth and will assume that you are interested in seeing wages go up in foreign lands as well to improve quality of life. However, I am interested in the contrarian view that mensa had in this thread. I recall over 10 years ago that Nike and Reebok were dragged thru the mud because they made their products in countries where workers were treated little better than slaves. It used to be common place to slam corporations engaging in these types of practices. However, we now live in a world where slave labor used to make Apple products is given little to no press. It goes to show you that SJW beliefs are in fact supported on a sliding scale and is dependent upon who is doing the bad deeds as opposed to being against the bad deeds themselves.

Same cases can be made for illegal immigrants who by an extremely wide margin are here for economic reasons and not for political asylum. When the unions were more powerful, illegal immigration was the scourge of the U.S. and was killing the middle class. Now that unions are not nearly as powerful politically and certain minority groups are growing in the U.S. demographics - illegal immigration is viewed to be a good thing. Now why would that be???

(08-27-2018 11:58 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  The bizarro-world antics of opposing a minimum wage at home but insisting upon one abroad. To thunderous applause.

If you're going to be full on nationalist why bother with a trade deal to begin with?

It's not bizarre to me at all when you approach it from a pragmatic POV. U.S. labor rates and the costs for doing business are governed by a cost floor. The western world is all in the same position, and failing to acknowledge that the third world should not be given a free pass to trade with us without there being an equalizer to make trading more fair is short sighted.

Their "unions" in Mexico keep the wages poverty level low so the corporations keep all of the money. Trump just put those unions out of business.
carmaker wages

(08-27-2018 11:58 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  The bizarro-world antics of opposing a minimum wage at home but insisting upon one abroad. To thunderous applause.

If you're going to be full on nationalist why bother with a trade deal to begin with?

I compare it to the neighbor who has a very sick elephant, the cure costs only a few bucks, yet he's not spending it. Also, you know damned good and well when the beast dies on your fenceline, he's not gonna clean up the mess. I'd give him the few bucks today and then work on longer range plans to get rid of the beast.

(08-27-2018 12:11 PM)miko33 Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 11:58 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  The bizarro-world antics of opposing a minimum wage at home but insisting upon one abroad. To thunderous applause.

If you're going to be full on nationalist why bother with a trade deal to begin with?

It's not bizarre to me at all when you approach it from a pragmatic POV. U.S. labor rates and the costs for doing business are governed by a cost floor. The western world is all in the same position, and failing to acknowledge that the third world should not be given a free pass to trade with us without there being an equalizer to make trading more fair is short sighted.

Who benefits from third world nations making stuff at wages too low to be realistic here? Answer: Poor people.

Every time you hear somebody say we need to stop importing x from China or we need to have minimum wages and minimum standards of "labor cost" from our importers ... you should translate that in real time to "we need to make things more expensive for poor people."

The second thing you'll do by poking the free market with this artificial price structuring for labor is increase the incentive to automate entirely thus eliminating the jobs completely.

(08-27-2018 12:11 PM)Eagleaidaholic Wrote:  Their "unions" in Mexico keep the wages poverty level low so the corporations keep all of the money. Trump just put those unions out of business.
carmaker wages

The cartels and drug violence are keeping wages low in Mexico. The end.

(08-27-2018 11:37 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 11:15 AM)TechRocks Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 10:46 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  I thought the market best set the wage and a forced minimum wage would actually do more damage than good? Surely, you're not saying it will raise the standard of living in Mexico?

I imagine a rising standard of living in Mexico scares the living crap out of you leftists as there'd be less need for undocumented democrats to be crossing the border to vote in the United States and looking for gubmint handouts.

Would you kindly just stop making **** up please?

Incredible irony coming from a lib

(08-27-2018 10:58 AM)shere khan Wrote:  So much MAGA. Trump might make Mexico great. Not again but for the first time

I'd settle for good.

(08-27-2018 12:15 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 12:11 PM)miko33 Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 11:58 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  The bizarro-world antics of opposing a minimum wage at home but insisting upon one abroad. To thunderous applause.

If you're going to be full on nationalist why bother with a trade deal to begin with?

It's not bizarre to me at all when you approach it from a pragmatic POV. U.S. labor rates and the costs for doing business are governed by a cost floor. The western world is all in the same position, and failing to acknowledge that the third world should not be given a free pass to trade with us without there being an equalizer to make trading more fair is short sighted.

Who benefits from third world nations making stuff at wages too low to be realistic here? Answer: Poor people.

Every time you hear somebody say we need to stop importing x from China or we need to have minimum wages and minimum standards of "labor cost" from our importers ... you should translate that in real time to "we need to make things more expensive for poor people."

The second thing you'll do by poking the free market with this artificial price structuring for labor is increase the incentive to automate entirely thus eliminating the jobs completely.

In theory you are correct, and classical economics explains it well regarding comparative advantage. However, what classical economics cannot account for is corruption in the foreign markets and gov'ts that will make economic slaves out of its own people. Foxconn has made the news concerning the deplorable conditions the Chinese workers had to endure making Apple products - gross overtime and severely underpaid. This is not unique to just Foxconn but can be see with other companies with agreements between various local Chinese gov'ts and MNC's.

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2...ce-extract

Chinese and Indian firms don't have to work to the same environmental standards as the U.S. firms do. While this gives these companies a gov't induced competitive advantage, their actions are also having a horrible effect on the environment. With the increasing level of connectivity in the world, Chinese pollution ultimately affects us.

https://www.reuters.com/news/picture/who...dUSRTXRKSI

https://www.forbes.com/sites/hannahleung...d083123490

I use to date a girl that worked in the maquiladora in Juarez, she was a looker. Anyway I found out that she was earning from $35 to $40 A WEEK! There's no wonder we have cleaning women coming to EP for $60 to $100 per week with less stress. That's still low for our standards but it's pretty good for them.

(08-27-2018 12:15 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 12:11 PM)miko33 Wrote:  

(08-27-2018 11:58 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  The bizarro-world antics of opposing a minimum wage at home but insisting upon one abroad. To thunderous applause.

If you're going to be full on nationalist why bother with a trade deal to begin with?

It's not bizarre to me at all when you approach it from a pragmatic POV. U.S. labor rates and the costs for doing business are governed by a cost floor. The western world is all in the same position, and failing to acknowledge that the third world should not be given a free pass to trade with us without there being an equalizer to make trading more fair is short sighted.

Who benefits from third world nations making stuff at wages too low to be realistic here? Answer: Poor people.

Every time you hear somebody say we need to stop importing x from China or we need to have minimum wages and minimum standards of "labor cost" from our importers ... you should translate that in real time to "we need to make things more expensive for poor people."

The second thing you'll do by poking the free market with this artificial price structuring for labor is increase the incentive to automate entirely thus eliminating the jobs completely.

Or those items that might cost 15% more, might also last a lot longer.....

I recall a time when a VCR was expected to last years, probably till something different came out. Not something newer in six months.

There's a balance that needs to be met...we are not close to being there today like we were till NAFTA took over.

Cheap just means something is being replaced a lot sooner and in the end the cost will be more.

(08-27-2018 12:11 PM)Eagleaidaholic Wrote:  Their "unions" in Mexico keep the wages poverty level low so the corporations keep all of the money. Trump just put those unions out of business.
carmaker wages

BOOM-SHAKA-LAKA!!!!

(08-27-2018 12:41 PM)olliebaba Wrote:  I use to date a girl that worked in the maquiladora in Juarez, she was a looker. Anyway I found out that she was earning from $35 to $40 A WEEK! There's no wonder we have cleaning women coming to EP for $60 to $100 per week with less stress. That's still low for our standards but it's pretty good for them.

Correct and even if they are staying 7,8,9,10 to a home and spiting cost....that is still better than what they left.

When people are willing to work for half or even a third of what it takes an American to live on. It lowers wages for the working class across the board. That savings from lost cost labor is not being passed back to the consumers