(06-11-2021 08:03 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:59 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:54 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:49 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:32 AM)VA49er Wrote:  Yes, the sample size is small. However, I have no doubt that even it was larger, and peer reviewed, the left would still discredit it because Trump.

If so, the problem is trump, not the left.

There was no data affirming this drug at the time he made it! Hell it took well over a year to get one small study to even claim it was. Much like his claim that a lab released the virus. Sure, maybe he was right, but at the time he provided no data to affirm that and his own DNI was saying the opposite. Also, he was praising China and Xi at the same time for handling it well!

The guy is just not credible. If you recall, he was privately telling Woodward how dangerous the virus was at the same time he was telling the public it was just a flu that would magically disappear by Easter with warmer weather.

He. Is. Not. Credible.

Well, looks like he was right about Wuhan and everything you say above was said about that situation as well. We'll see....

It was a 50/50 proposition.

I can say it going to rain tomorrow. If it does, that doesn't make me a meteorologist!

Again, he provided no evidence when he made the claim. His own DNI said the exact opposite at that time. He was praising China and Xi for handling the virus well.

Yet he was correct. Pretty sure Trump had access to data back then anyway. If it had been ANYONE other than Trump, the left would have taken it seriously. He was quickly dismissed because Trump. Everything now is backfill. It is interesting that even though now the admin is saying the same thing Trump said they aren't getting lambasted by the medai,quite the opposite. No, it's not because new info has came out, that info was there before but the media hate towards Trump didn't allow the left to accept it.

(06-11-2021 08:33 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 08:03 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:59 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:54 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:49 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  If so, the problem is trump, not the left.

There was no data affirming this drug at the time he made it! Hell it took well over a year to get one small study to even claim it was. Much like his claim that a lab released the virus. Sure, maybe he was right, but at the time he provided no data to affirm that and his own DNI was saying the opposite. Also, he was praising China and Xi at the same time for handling it well!

The guy is just not credible. If you recall, he was privately telling Woodward how dangerous the virus was at the same time he was telling the public it was just a flu that would magically disappear by Easter with warmer weather.

He. Is. Not. Credible.

Well, looks like he was right about Wuhan and everything you say above was said about that situation as well. We'll see....

It was a 50/50 proposition.

I can say it going to rain tomorrow. If it does, that doesn't make me a meteorologist!

Again, he provided no evidence when he made the claim. His own DNI said the exact opposite at that time. He was praising China and Xi for handling the virus well.

Yet he was correct. Pretty sure Trump had access to data back then anyway. If it had been ANYONE other than Trump, the left would have taken it seriously. He was quickly dismissed because Trump. Everything now is backfill. It is interesting that even though now the admin is saying the same thing Trump said they aren't getting lambasted by the medai,quite the opposite. No, it's not because new info has came out, that info was there before but the media hate towards Trump didn't allow the left to accept it.

Remember?

He told people to drink bleach...

#morefakenarrativeswhy?OMB

(06-11-2021 08:29 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 08:23 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Other than the Trump-hate, why doubt these Docs that are on the front line that are reporting they had good results when given early, in the correct dosages for the right length of time? What do you think they have to gain from lying about it?

This illustrates exactly the difference between bureaucrat and emergency responder thinking.

Bureaucrat: "OMG, we haven't had the full regimen of placebo-controlled clinical tests. We can't use this stuff."

Emergency responder: "OMG, nothing works, nothing is where it is supposed to be, and people are dying right and left. Might as well give it a try."

I have often wondered how a bureaucrat would act if you took him/her out of his/her ivory tower and placed him/her on the front lines.

(06-11-2021 08:41 AM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  I think it was actually injecting it.
“And then I see the disinfectant, where it knocks it out in a minute. One minute. And is there a way we can do something like that, by injection inside or almost a cleaning? ”

(06-11-2021 08:41 AM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 08:33 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 08:03 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:59 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:54 AM)VA49er Wrote:  Well, looks like he was right about Wuhan and everything you say above was said about that situation as well. We'll see....

It was a 50/50 proposition.

I can say it going to rain tomorrow. If it does, that doesn't make me a meteorologist!

Again, he provided no evidence when he made the claim. His own DNI said the exact opposite at that time. He was praising China and Xi for handling the virus well.

Yet he was correct. Pretty sure Trump had access to data back then anyway. If it had been ANYONE other than Trump, the left would have taken it seriously. He was quickly dismissed because Trump. Everything now is backfill. It is interesting that even though now the admin is saying the same thing Trump said they aren't getting lambasted by the medai,quite the opposite. No, it's not because new info has came out, that info was there before but the media hate towards Trump didn't allow the left to accept it.

Remember?

He told people to drink bleach...

#morefakenarrativeswhy?OMB

I think it was actually injecting it.

“And then I see the disinfectant, where it knocks it out in a minute. One minute. And is there a way we can do something like that, by injection inside or almost a cleaning. Because you see it gets in the lungs, and it does a tremendous number on the lungs. So it would be interesting to check that.”

(06-11-2021 08:10 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 08:06 AM)bearcat65 Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 08:01 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:56 AM)bearcat65 Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:49 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  If so, the problem is trump, not the left.

There was no data affirming this drug at the time he made it! Hell it took well over a year to get one small study to even claim it was. Much like his claim that a lab released the virus. Sure, maybe he was right, but at the time he provided no data to affirm that and his own DNI was saying the opposite. Also, he was praising China and Xi at the same time for handling it well!

The guy is just not credible. If you recall, he was privately telling Woodward how dangerous the virus was at the same time he was telling the public it was just a flu that would magically disappear by Easter with warmer weather.

He. Is. Not. Credible.

There were numerous doctors here and overseas who claimed this in conjunction with zinc had some effect.

Do you label Fauci as not credible as he was saying mask were not effective early on?

Must suck to continue to say he was not credible when much of what he was saying about this and other things continues to be shown correct.

I licensed physician in Ohio said this week that spoons and forks magnetically stick to the bodies of people who have gotten the Covid vaccine.

And you're not providing proper context for Fauci's mask comments at the very beginning of a virus outbreak that we still knew little about.

Which has zero to do with the multiple doctors who were not quacks who claimed to have success.

So Fauci gets a pass because at the beginning we didn't know what we were dealing with but Trump doesn't. Okay.

The more that comes out the more it seems that the bureaucrats and press were the ones who had credibility issues.

Yet one of the guys who touted this early on WAS a quack. We discussed his "proof" last year. Don't have the desire to look him up, but knock yourself out. The point is that so called doctors, like Dr. Oz, can still be quacks.

(06-11-2021 08:52 AM)memtigbb Wrote:  Yep, it was sort of like a impromptu brainstorming session that you would normally do behind closed doors because chances are some silly ideas are going to pop out.. but great things have come from silly ideas when looked at in the right perspective. which is why people have brainstorming sessions... just throw it out there... there are no wrong answers.

(06-11-2021 08:53 AM)bearcat65 Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 08:10 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 08:06 AM)bearcat65 Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 08:01 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:56 AM)bearcat65 Wrote:  There were numerous doctors here and overseas who claimed this in conjunction with zinc had some effect.

Do you label Fauci as not credible as he was saying mask were not effective early on?

Must suck to continue to say he was not credible when much of what he was saying about this and other things continues to be shown correct.

I licensed physician in Ohio said this week that spoons and forks magnetically stick to the bodies of people who have gotten the Covid vaccine.

And you're not providing proper context for Fauci's mask comments at the very beginning of a virus outbreak that we still knew little about.

Which has zero to do with the multiple doctors who were not quacks who claimed to have success.

So Fauci gets a pass because at the beginning we didn't know what we were dealing with but Trump doesn't. Okay.

The more that comes out the more it seems that the bureaucrats and press were the ones who had credibility issues.

Yet one of the guys who touted this early on WAS a quack. We discussed his "proof" last year. Don't have the desire to look him up, but knock yourself out. The point is that so called doctors, like Dr. Oz, can still be quacks.

I understand that Tom and I agree there were and are quacks out there but there were also a substantial number of reputable doctors who claimed success with the combination of zinc and hydroxychloroquine.

(06-11-2021 08:23 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:22 AM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(06-10-2021 11:52 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Keep looking Elvis,

Long Island has one I believe, and other aggregate studies appear to be right in line.

Not the fish bowl cleaner, mind you, the stuff your Doc would give you, not the local PetCo.

If the evidence is out there (randomized placebo controlled clinical trail) post it. The study posted by the op isn’t it.

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2772922?utm_campaign=articlePDF&utm_medium=articlePDFlink&utm_source=articlePDF&utm_content=jama.2020.22240

“Findings In this randomized clinical trial that included 479 hospitalized adults with respiratory symptoms from COVID-19, the distribution of the day 14 clinical status score (measured using a 7-category ordinal scale) was not significantly different for patients randomized to receive hydroxychloroquine compared with placebo (adjusted odds ratio, 1.02).”

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2779044

Findings In this trial that included 685 patients, rates of COVID-19–associated hospitalization in patients treated with hydroxychloroquine or lopinavir-ritonavir were not significantly different compared with those who received placebo.

https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/global-research-on-novel-coronavirus-2019-ncov/solidarity-clinical-trial-for-covid-19-treatments

The Solidarity Trial published interim results on 15 October 2020. It found that all 4 treatments evaluated (remdesivir, hydroxychloroquine, lopinavir/ritonavir and interferon) had little or no effect on overall mortality, initiation of ventilation and duration of hospital stay in hospitalized patients.

I've posted them before, going back a year or more including this one by Raoult and then others that are meta-analysis of other studies merged into one wide review. One Long Island Doc primarily treating the Hasidic community reported good results back in March or so of last year.

Other than the Trump-hate, why doubt these Docs that are on the front line that are reporting they had good results when given early, in the correct dosages for the right length of time? What do you think they have to gain from lying about it?

Wracking up that new yacht $4.40 at a time?

(06-11-2021 09:04 AM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 08:23 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 07:22 AM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(06-10-2021 11:52 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Keep looking Elvis,

Long Island has one I believe, and other aggregate studies appear to be right in line.

Not the fish bowl cleaner, mind you, the stuff your Doc would give you, not the local PetCo.

If the evidence is out there (randomized placebo controlled clinical trail) post it. The study posted by the op isn’t it.

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2772922?utm_campaign=articlePDF&utm_medium=articlePDFlink&utm_source=articlePDF&utm_content=jama.2020.22240

“Findings In this randomized clinical trial that included 479 hospitalized adults with respiratory symptoms from COVID-19, the distribution of the day 14 clinical status score (measured using a 7-category ordinal scale) was not significantly different for patients randomized to receive hydroxychloroquine compared with placebo (adjusted odds ratio, 1.02).”

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2779044

Findings In this trial that included 685 patients, rates of COVID-19–associated hospitalization in patients treated with hydroxychloroquine or lopinavir-ritonavir were not significantly different compared with those who received placebo.

https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/global-research-on-novel-coronavirus-2019-ncov/solidarity-clinical-trial-for-covid-19-treatments

The Solidarity Trial published interim results on 15 October 2020. It found that all 4 treatments evaluated (remdesivir, hydroxychloroquine, lopinavir/ritonavir and interferon) had little or no effect on overall mortality, initiation of ventilation and duration of hospital stay in hospitalized patients.

I've posted them before, going back a year or more including this one by Raoult and then others that are meta-analysis of other studies merged into one wide review. One Long Island Doc primarily treating the Hasidic community reported good results back in March or so of last year.

Other than the Trump-hate, why doubt these Docs that are on the front line that are reporting they had good results when given early, in the correct dosages for the right length of time? What do you think they have to gain from lying about it?

Wracking up that new yacht $4.40 at a time?

Anecdotal evidence doesn’t prove anything. Leeches were reported to have good results by the doctors on the front lines a few hundred years ago.

We’re these actual clinical trails, or more observational / retrospectives which are more prone to bias than randomized placebo controlled trials?

(06-11-2021 09:13 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Yea, this is akin to leeches a couple hundred years ago. Mmmmmkay

You DO understand that people were dying and a nationwide panic was afoot, right? People reported in what they saw was working, the clinical trials would have to wait and THAT is all Trump was mentioning at the time. Offering some hope in the face of widespread fear.

One whack-job broad kills her abused husband by giving him fishbowl cleaner and an otherwise possibly helpful prophylactic goes right out the window. Replete with the dumasss infotainment narrative "Trump is killing people".

Put people like you in charge of something like this and we'd still be stacking bodies like cordwood.

(06-11-2021 09:13 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Yea, this is akin to leeches a couple hundred years ago. Mmmmmkay

You DO understand that people were dying and a nationwide panic was afoot, right? People reported in what they saw was working, the clinical trials would have to wait and THAT is all Trump was mentioning at the time. Offering some hope in the face of widespread fear.

One whack-job broad kills her abused husband by giving him fishbowl cleaner and an otherwise possibly helpful prophylactic goes right out the window. Replete with the dumasss infotainment narrative "Trump is killing people".

Put people like you in charge of something like this and we'd still be stacking bodies like cordwood.

(06-11-2021 10:03 AM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 09:13 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Yea, this is akin to leeches a couple hundred years ago. Mmmmmkay

You DO understand that people were dying and a nationwide panic was afoot, right? People reported in what they saw was working, the clinical trials would have to wait and THAT is all Trump was mentioning at the time. Offering some hope in the face of widespread fear.

One whack-job broad kills her abused husband by giving him fishbowl cleaner and an otherwise possibly helpful prophylactic goes right out the window. Replete with the dumasss infotainment narrative "Trump is killing people".

Put people like you in charge of something like this and we'd still be stacking bodies like cordwood.

Clinical trials are in, trumps FDA pulled the emergency auth, and other treatments showed better results (corticosteroids and remdesivir). Yet you guys are still harping on HCQ because of trump.

I’ve seen people on here post “we didn’t need a lock down, we had a cure” talking about HCQ. Yeah, if you look at the study in the OP 201 of 255 patients receiving HCQ died. Not quite the cure.

So anyway, you have those clinical trials that showed positive results?

(06-11-2021 10:26 AM)stinkfist Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 10:03 AM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 09:13 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Yea, this is akin to leeches a couple hundred years ago. Mmmmmkay

You DO understand that people were dying and a nationwide panic was afoot, right? People reported in what they saw was working, the clinical trials would have to wait and THAT is all Trump was mentioning at the time. Offering some hope in the face of widespread fear.

One whack-job broad kills her abused husband by giving him fishbowl cleaner and an otherwise possibly helpful prophylactic goes right out the window. Replete with the dumasss infotainment narrative "Trump is killing people".

Put people like you in charge of something like this and we'd still be stacking bodies like cordwood.

Clinical trials are in, trumps FDA pulled the emergency auth, and other treatments showed better results (corticosteroids and remdesivir). Yet you guys are still harping on HCQ because of trump.

I’ve seen people on here post “we didn’t need a lock down, we had a cure” talking about HCQ. Yeah, if you look at the study in the OP 201 of 255 patients receiving HCQ died. Not quite the cure.

So anyway, you have those clinical trials that showed positive results?

wrong again admiral pseudo-intellectual…

it’s $$$ vs. real health care

#lostInSpaceHippaHypocrite #preyingOnBoomers

@fkEwereLobbiedStats

addendum: g’damn I miss fk’n with the tenured profs

(06-11-2021 08:52 AM)memtigbb Wrote:  Yep, it was sort of like a impromptu brainstorming session that you would normally do behind closed doors because chances are some silly ideas are going to pop out.. but great things have come from silly ideas when looked at in the right perspective. which is why people have brainstorming sessions... just throw it out there... there are no wrong answers.

(06-11-2021 08:11 AM)AdoptedMonarch Wrote:  Eldonabe was correct, Tom. You refuse to accept truth, even when it barrels down upon you like a freight train. (I don't know why that is. Those who accuse you of being a paid troll are at least giving you the benefit of the doubt that you cannot be as stubbornly dumb as you present. But that's neither here nor there.)

If your only point is that President Trump has a credibility problem, that's a chip shot. But you, and progressives generally, went for more than that. As Owl Numbers points out, you pushed a narrative. And now you are being confronted by your own lies.

You can deny it all you wish - - and I have no doubt that you will. But the rest of us see it. Quite clearly.

(06-11-2021 11:16 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-11-2021 08:11 AM)AdoptedMonarch Wrote:  Eldonabe was correct, Tom. You refuse to accept truth, even when it barrels down upon you like a freight train. (I don't know why that is. Those who accuse you of being a paid troll are at least giving you the benefit of the doubt that you cannot be as stubbornly dumb as you present. But that's neither here nor there.)

If your only point is that President Trump has a credibility problem, that's a chip shot. But you, and progressives generally, went for more than that. As Owl Numbers points out, you pushed a narrative. And now you are being confronted by your own lies.

You can deny it all you wish - - and I have no doubt that you will. But the rest of us see it. Quite clearly.

What narrative did I specifically push other than trump not being credible? Which you agree with, by the way.

And regardless, my postings on this obscure message board has no effect on any progressive agenda.