(09-16-2013 09:19 AM)stever20 Wrote:  Maryland left 6 weeks after the ACC jacked up the exit fee. According to the ACC bylaws, the fee not supposed to go up until the next ACC calendar year. ACC tried to ramrod that thru. It won't hold up.

It'll be amazing if this does go thru to court I can't imagine the ACC want's all of it's laundry going thru discovery.

I agree with SteveR that this is the key issue - not whether a conference can levy a $50M exit fee, but whether they can push it through the way the ACC did it. Thus, I would not be surprised if Maryland is only required to pay the old exit fee (what was it, $25M I think?). Still not chump change.

(09-16-2013 09:41 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 09:19 AM)stever20 Wrote:  Maryland left 6 weeks after the ACC jacked up the exit fee. According to the ACC bylaws, the fee not supposed to go up until the next ACC calendar year. ACC tried to ramrod that thru. It won't hold up.

It'll be amazing if this does go thru to court I can't imagine the ACC want's all of it's laundry going thru discovery.

I agree with SteveR that this is the key issue - not whether a conference can levy a $50M exit fee, but whether they can push it through the way the ACC did it. Thus, I would not be surprised if Maryland is only required to pay the old exit fee (what was it, $25M I think?). Still not chump change.

I, too, agree on the whole procedure thing.

Discovery, however, can go in any number of directions, and the ACC still shot first, from their home turf.

(09-16-2013 07:18 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 03:14 AM)Rich52c Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 12:03 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 12:01 AM)stever20 Wrote:  5 million vs 50 million is a HUGE difference. It's not a lock by any stretch of the imagination that the ACC will get all 50 million.

in terms of legal concept not really. maryland did the exact same thing that the BE schools did, wether the fee is $1, $5 mill, $50 mill or $100 mill they still have to pay it

If the ACC gets the full $52 million from its friendly NC court another verdict will come from MD court.Then they can settle and it will end up in the federal courts.

UM will lose in the Maryland courts too.

No way!!!

I think the old exit fee was 20 million. I really think that's going to be close to what they play.

I think if someone tried to leave now(absent the GOR), it'd be easily the 50 million.

I am kind of surprised after the ACC got the GOR that they are continuing to pursue this. I think one could say that they're not so sure how well the GOR will hold up in court, so trying to play both sides sort of speak.

(09-16-2013 10:12 AM)Rich52c Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 07:18 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 03:14 AM)Rich52c Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 12:03 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 12:01 AM)stever20 Wrote:  5 million vs 50 million is a HUGE difference. It's not a lock by any stretch of the imagination that the ACC will get all 50 million.

in terms of legal concept not really. maryland did the exact same thing that the BE schools did, wether the fee is $1, $5 mill, $50 mill or $100 mill they still have to pay it

If the ACC gets the full $52 million from its friendly NC court another verdict will come from MD court.Then they can settle and it will end up in the federal courts.

UM will lose in the Maryland courts too.

No way!!!

Rich are you saying that as a legal expert or as an ACC hating fanboy?

(09-16-2013 10:20 AM)stever20 Wrote:  I am kind of surprised after the ACC got the GOR that they are continuing to pursue this. I think one could say that they're not so sure how well the GOR will hold up in court, so trying to play both sides sort of speak.

I think the rumblings about certain schools taking a walk from the conference were more fiction than fact, though it sounds like the ACC's GoR had a lot to do with some additional television opportunities coming through.

The question is going to be, were there schools who were close to walking away, if the progress isn't to their liking, do you want to find out how serious the ACC is?

I'd say 20-30m, which is the amount b10 has set aside for Md. 'travel subsidy'.

(09-16-2013 02:42 PM)TIGER-PAUL Wrote:  I'd say 20-30m, which is the amount b10 has set aside for Md. 'travel subsidy'.

yep, I think that's exactly where it'll wind up. I think we'll find it done sooner rather than later quite frankly.

The thing that is amazing is in a lot of ways, the ACC could craft something so easily that the only reason why Maryland gets out cheap is because they got out right after the exit fee was increased(6-8 weeks is right after). no schools have that ability to say that now a year out of the move. I wonder as we get closer to the 26th if we start hearing some rumblings of a settlement.

I'd be shocked if this and the Rutgers - AAC suits are not settled out of court over the next 6 to 8 weeks.

(09-16-2013 10:20 AM)stever20 Wrote:  I think the old exit fee was 20 million. I really think that's going to be close to what they play.

I think if someone tried to leave now(absent the GOR), it'd be easily the 50 million.

I am kind of surprised after the ACC got the GOR that they are continuing to pursue this. I think one could say that they're not so sure how well the GOR will hold up in court, so trying to play both sides sort of speak.

My pull out of my ass "legal" prediction has been $27 million for many months now.

The ACC has zero reason to settle this. They have given no indication that they will even try to settle this issue. The exit fee has risen to $60 million+ with the signing of the GOR, the addition of UofL and the agreement with ND. The exit fee is not a set amount but rather 3x the yearly operating budget. Maryland officials themselves have admitted that they may have to pay the entire amount but are trying to argue for something less. They are still going to the B1G. Their best hope is that the ACC would take their exit fee in payments over a period of time. That would enable the University of Maryland to borrow less money and perhaps begin to start receiving $ from the ACC again.

I think Terry is closer to it than you, dude...

(09-16-2013 03:54 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  I think Terry is closer to it than you, dude...

Is it his reasoning behind his guess or the dollar amount itself? I know Terry is a lawyer. What are the points you agree with Terry on?

Terry's opinion is that of someone trained in legal procedures. IMO that carries more weight than someone without such training...

Of course, the only decision involving Maryland that I'm really concerned about is coming up this Saturday. Other than that, I could care less. It's their money, not mine...

(09-16-2013 04:18 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Terry's opinion is that of someone trained in legal procedures. IMO that carries more weight than someone without such training...

Of course, the only decision involving Maryland that I'm really concerned about is coming up this Saturday. Other than that, I could care less. It's their money, not mine...

Maryland is going to whip that Mountaineer tail, Bitcruncher!

(09-16-2013 04:18 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Terry's opinion is that of someone trained in legal procedures. IMO that carries more weight than someone without such training...

Of course, the only decision involving Maryland that I'm really concerned about is coming up this Saturday. Other than that, I could care less. It's their money, not mine...

I agree that Terry's opinion carries more weight than yours or mine on legal issues. As a UofL fan, I don't like being called "dude". Other than the $27 mill. figure, what points regarding his opinion do you agree with?

(09-16-2013 04:24 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 04:18 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Terry's opinion is that of someone trained in legal procedures. IMO that carries more weight than someone without such training...

Of course, the only decision involving Maryland that I'm really concerned about is coming up this Saturday. Other than that, I could care less. It's their money, not mine...

Maryland is going to whip that Mountaineer tail, Bitcruncher!

Don't bet on it, Mark. The Terps had trouble with UConn, and they lost to Towson...

The key to beating Maryland is stopping Diggs. I seriously doubt the Terps will be able to run on WVU like they did against the Huskies...

(09-16-2013 04:30 PM)Dasville Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 04:18 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Terry's opinion is that of someone trained in legal procedures. IMO that carries more weight than someone without such training...

Of course, the only decision involving Maryland that I'm really concerned about is coming up this Saturday. Other than that, I could care less. It's their money, not mine...

I agree that Terry's opinion carries more weight than yours or mine on legal issues. As a UofL fan, I don't like being called "dude". Other than the $27 mill. figure, what points regarding his opinion do you agree with?

The old exit fee was 20 million. The new one was pushed through, and UofL is a more than adequate replacement. The ACC isn't being harmed by Maryland's exit, since they've fully restocked the cabinet. And considering that ND has since jumped on the bandwagon, you could argue that the ACC is far better off without the Terps...

Good enough for you?

BTW, I use dude or kiddo (depending on age), since me and names don't get along that well. You'll have similar problems some day...

(09-16-2013 04:32 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 04:24 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 04:18 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Terry's opinion is that of someone trained in legal procedures. IMO that carries more weight than someone without such training...

Of course, the only decision involving Maryland that I'm really concerned about is coming up this Saturday. Other than that, I could care less. It's their money, not mine...

Maryland is going to whip that Mountaineer tail, Bitcruncher!

Don't bet on it, Mark. The Terps had trouble with UConn, and they lost to Towson...

The key to beating Maryland is stopping Diggs. I seriously doubt the Terps will be able to run on WVU like they did against the Huskies...

(09-16-2013 04:30 PM)Dasville Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 04:18 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Terry's opinion is that of someone trained in legal procedures. IMO that carries more weight than someone without such training...

Of course, the only decision involving Maryland that I'm really concerned about is coming up this Saturday. Other than that, I could care less. It's their money, not mine...

I agree that Terry's opinion carries more weight than yours or mine on legal issues. As a UofL fan, I don't like being called "dude". Other than the $27 mill. figure, what points regarding his opinion do you agree with?

The old exit fee was 20 million. The new one was pushed through, and UofL is a more than adequate replacement. The ACC isn't being harmed by Maryland's exit, since they've fully restocked the cabinet. And considering that ND has since jumped on the bandwagon, you could argue that the ACC is far better off without the Terps...

Good enough for you?

BTW, I use dude or kiddo (depending on age), since me and names don't get along that well. You'll have similar problems some day...

I'm no kiddo that is for sure! Lol! Thanks for outlining your opinion.

No problemo...

(09-16-2013 04:52 PM)Dasville Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 04:32 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 04:24 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 04:18 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Terry's opinion is that of someone trained in legal procedures. IMO that carries more weight than someone without such training...

Of course, the only decision involving Maryland that I'm really concerned about is coming up this Saturday. Other than that, I could care less. It's their money, not mine...

Maryland is going to whip that Mountaineer tail, Bitcruncher!

Don't bet on it, Mark. The Terps had trouble with UConn, and they lost to Towson...

The key to beating Maryland is stopping Diggs. I seriously doubt the Terps will be able to run on WVU like they did against the Huskies...

(09-16-2013 04:30 PM)Dasville Wrote:  

(09-16-2013 04:18 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Terry's opinion is that of someone trained in legal procedures. IMO that carries more weight than someone without such training...

Of course, the only decision involving Maryland that I'm really concerned about is coming up this Saturday. Other than that, I could care less. It's their money, not mine...

I agree that Terry's opinion carries more weight than yours or mine on legal issues. As a UofL fan, I don't like being called "dude". Other than the $27 mill. figure, what points regarding his opinion do you agree with?

The old exit fee was 20 million. The new one was pushed through, and UofL is a more than adequate replacement. The ACC isn't being harmed by Maryland's exit, since they've fully restocked the cabinet. And considering that ND has since jumped on the bandwagon, you could argue that the ACC is far better off without the Terps...

Understandable logic, but faulty because it's based on looking at the ACC as a zero-sum entity with only a fixed number of teams. That's not what conferences are so the loss of Maryland can not be plugged by Louisville. The loss of Maryland is a unique loss to the conference and represents the loss not just of a 60 year ACC partner, but a 106 year partner to North Carolina and NC State (both have been in the same league as MD since 1907). The ACC can easily make the cased that Louisville was supposed to be a 16th team, not the 15th team and disproving that is impossible. The ACC can also contend that Maryland's defection, derailed a possible move by Penn State. Remember, the ACC is not attempting to keep Maryland in the ACC, just compensate league members for an unknowable cost of losing a member and since the exit applies to FSU and UNC as well as MD, the cost of Maryland of 3x is reasonable.

Maryland had a choice when the issue of going from 1.25X to 3X came to a vote - Maryland could have noticed an exit, but they didn't and continued to say one thing in public and another in private.

Good enough for you?

BTW, I use dude or kiddo (depending on age), since me and names don't get along that well. You'll have similar problems some day...

I'm no kiddo that is for sure! Lol! Thanks for outlining your opinion.

As to the $27 million that Terry D estimates, that number is close to what the ACC will have withheld from Maryland since January of 2013. Winning the suit and collecting by the ACC is two different matters. The ACC will win, but I don't know that they can collect on what could be a judgment of $62 million plus costs because collecting means getting money out of Maryland and at best it seems that the ACC would have to attempt to attach NCAA money, Playoff money and B10 money before it comes to MD. (I don't know the details on attempting to collect out of state - someone else might)

If the ACC attempts to collect beyond the withheld money, I doubt they can attach the B10 TV money because the B10 will fight that to the end of time. The Football playoff money also goes directly to the conference. Now the NCAA monies might be attachable, might not, and might end up as no more than a garnishment type attachment.

I think $27 million is a little low as the ACC should be able to withhold some $32 million from MD by June 30, 2014, but I'm unsure about exactly what the ACC withheld in fiscal 2012/13.