(07-28-2013 11:33 PM)jml2010 Wrote:  The 29th largest football fan base in America will not be ignored or denied.

LOL! That was arguably the greatest line in the history of this message board.

I think they should change the name to the Hubris 5.

(07-28-2013 07:33 PM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  actually it's Big 4 with the ACC tagging along

No.

You can really break it down to individual schools that have true power. The Big Ten and SEC are the only conferences with more than 2 "power broker" type of schools. It's almost easier to list the schools that don't matter than the schools that do matter in those conferences.

Think about which schools would still be able to make the massive amounts of money they are right now if they were to go independent. These are the true power players of college football:

SEC: Alabama, Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, LSU, Texas A&M, Tennessee
B1G: Penn State, Ohio State, Michigan, Wisconsin, Nebraska
PAC12: USC, Oregon
BXII: Texas, Oklahoma
ACC: FSU, Clemson
Independent: Notre Dame

That's pretty much it. Pretty much everyone else currently in a P5 conference would take a 90% paycut if they were to try to go independent or if they fell into a G5 conference.

It makes sense that the Power 5 would want to re-brand themselves as the Big 5 even though that name is associated with the 5 basketball playing schools in Philadelphia. Power 5 has a more arrogant connotation to it that might hurt as the P5 try to pull off some serious power restructuring in the next 6 month. But they really need the re-brand to stick before football starts this fall. Will it work? I guess we'll see soon. I like Big 5 better.

(07-29-2013 08:25 AM)Maize Wrote:  

(07-29-2013 03:40 AM)Underdog Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 08:30 PM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 07:33 PM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  actually it's Big 4 with the ACC tagging along

The Big XII has four members ripped away by three separate conferences in a mere 19 years of existence. Fans still think they're bigger, better, and more stable than the ACC.

It should have been six.... The PAC was foolish to turn down OU and OSU.

True...people forget that the Pac 12 turned those two down...nothing wrong with the Big XII just find it odd that some out of Morgantown have this "Thing" with the ACC...I thought they are/were happy in the Big XII...just saying...

we're very happy but I just find it amusing when ACC fans think their conference is equal to the big 4 power leagues

(07-29-2013 01:51 PM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  

(07-29-2013 08:25 AM)Maize Wrote:  

(07-29-2013 03:40 AM)Underdog Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 08:30 PM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 07:33 PM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  actually it's Big 4 with the ACC tagging along

The Big XII has four members ripped away by three separate conferences in a mere 19 years of existence. Fans still think they're bigger, better, and more stable than the ACC.

It should have been six.... The PAC was foolish to turn down OU and OSU.

True...people forget that the Pac 12 turned those two down...nothing wrong with the Big XII just find it odd that some out of Morgantown have this "Thing" with the ACC...I thought they are/were happy in the Big XII...just saying...

we're very happy but I just find it amusing when ACC fans think their conference is equal to the big 4 power leagues

That's ok, everyone is laughing their heads off at WVU fans who beat their chest about their last option desperation conference. But then, you guys were feeding so long at the trough of the Dudes and Ethridges of the world that it's no surprise that you can't discern fantasy from reality.

Who cares.

(07-29-2013 01:51 PM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  

(07-29-2013 08:25 AM)Maize Wrote:  

(07-29-2013 03:40 AM)Underdog Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 08:30 PM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 07:33 PM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  actually it's Big 4 with the ACC tagging along

The Big XII has four members ripped away by three separate conferences in a mere 19 years of existence. Fans still think they're bigger, better, and more stable than the ACC.

It should have been six.... The PAC was foolish to turn down OU and OSU.

True...people forget that the Pac 12 turned those two down...nothing wrong with the Big XII just find it odd that some out of Morgantown have this "Thing" with the ACC...I thought they are/were happy in the Big XII...just saying...

we're very happy but I just find it amusing when ACC fans think their conference is equal to the big 4 power leagues

Is that what the Dude told you guys? Or was it MFer3? Or one of your other inside sources? Guess what? The ACC is in better position than the B12 going forward. WVU is looking at a tough battle to stay relevant playing teams a half a continent away.

(07-29-2013 11:48 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(07-29-2013 01:51 PM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  

(07-29-2013 08:25 AM)Maize Wrote:  

(07-29-2013 03:40 AM)Underdog Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 08:30 PM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote:  The Big XII has four members ripped away by three separate conferences in a mere 19 years of existence. Fans still think they're bigger, better, and more stable than the ACC.

It should have been six.... The PAC was foolish to turn down OU and OSU.

True...people forget that the Pac 12 turned those two down...nothing wrong with the Big XII just find it odd that some out of Morgantown have this "Thing" with the ACC...I thought they are/were happy in the Big XII...just saying...

we're very happy but I just find it amusing when ACC fans think their conference is equal to the big 4 power leagues

Is that what the Dude told you guys? Or was it MFer3? Or one of your other inside sources? Guess what? The ACC is in better position than the B12 going forward. WVU is looking at a tough battle to stay relevant playing teams a half a continent away.

and we're still making more money than the ACC

(07-29-2013 09:42 PM)CrazyPaco Wrote:  

(07-29-2013 01:51 PM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  

(07-29-2013 08:25 AM)Maize Wrote:  

(07-29-2013 03:40 AM)Underdog Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 08:30 PM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote:  The Big XII has four members ripped away by three separate conferences in a mere 19 years of existence. Fans still think they're bigger, better, and more stable than the ACC.

It should have been six.... The PAC was foolish to turn down OU and OSU.

True...people forget that the Pac 12 turned those two down...nothing wrong with the Big XII just find it odd that some out of Morgantown have this "Thing" with the ACC...I thought they are/were happy in the Big XII...just saying...

we're very happy but I just find it amusing when ACC fans think their conference is equal to the big 4 power leagues

That's ok, everyone is laughing their heads off at WVU fans who beat their chest about their last option desperation conference. But then, you guys were feeding so long at the trough of the Dudes and Ethridges of the world that it's no surprise that you can't discern fantasy from reality.

fantasy is that Pitt is still relevant in college sports discussions; reality is that no one gives a fuzzy rat's butt about you

reality is that we're still making more money than Pitt and the ACC

fantasy is that anyone cares what a Pitt "fan" has to say

(07-28-2013 10:02 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 09:39 PM)john01992 Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 09:25 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 09:12 PM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 08:51 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  Do all WVa fans have ***** envy?

It's called psycho ex-girlfriend syndrome (PEGS). The ACC rejected them, then chose their arch rivals in their place, and - like all psycho ex-girlfriends - they lost their cotton-picking minds.

Don't be fooled. That's what all of this nonsense has always been about.

You are correct. West Va was a mistake first made in 1950. They destroyed the Southern Conference in just two years by supporting VT's then president on his anti-bowl game stance. MD, Clemson, South Carolina, NC State, Wake and UVa were all so disgusted by West Va, that when UNC's represenative nominated them for the 9th spot in the ACC, the motion died for lack of a second. Even VT got 4 votes despite pissing off MD, Clemson, and Duke.

ive never heard this story before but would like to hear more about it

The ACC and SEC are both children of the mother conference the Southern Conference. It formed in 1921 and by 1933 had grown way too big (23 schools). Tulane, Bama, Georiga, Florida, GT, Sewanee, Tennessee, Ole Miss, Mississippii State, Kentucky, Auburn, Vandy and LSU pulled out in 1933, leaving NC State, UNC, Clemson, Duke, South Carolina, Maryland, UVa, VT, Washington and Lee and VMI. In 1937 the SoCon started up again with adding schools after UVa left - fed up with UNC's cheating (it's in their minutes), adding Wake Forest at the behest of NC State, UNC, and Duke (at the time WF was near Raleigh). Then William and Mary and a few others were added.

(Lots of folks forget that Tulane, Sewanee, and GT were SEC members and that the SEC had shrunk to ten by 1964)

Everything was fine in the SoCon - Duke, Clemson, Maryland and even UNC were regulars in the Rose, Sugar, Cotton, and Orange Bowls. The SoCon had a tie to the Orange Bowl and NC State had build the largest basketball arena in the South - Reynolds Colesium.

Then in 1950 someone got the bright idea to add West Va. and all hell broke loose. (It was VT's and VMI's idea)

VT's president was the defacto SoCon President at the time and wanted to ban post season bowls (remember this is at a time that MD is the number one team in the nation and Duke has been to 2 Rose, 2 Orange and 1 Cotton Bowls over prior dozen or so years).

It was West Virginia's addition that gave VT's president the mathematical majority to push through the change and West Virginia supported the change to stick it to MD.

Maryland responded by meeting with Duke, Clemson, and SC and they formed the ACC, bringing along NC State and UNC and bringing WF, at NC State and UNC's behest. It was already decided that UVa would be invited and they were the first "expansion". These 8 then meet in Greensboro in late 1953 regarding rules, etc.

UNC proposed forgiving VT since VT had been a conference mate of UNC and NC State since the 19th Century - the motion died 4-4 with UVa essentially casting the deciding vote against VT. Duke, MD, and Clemson were still mad at VT. UNC, Wake, NC State and South Carolina were willing to forgive.

Then UNC turned around and proposed West Va. The motion died for lack of a second and the rest of the represenatives were so mad that the session ended (Bill Brill a UVa grad and now dead sports writer has written all about this).

The league learned to live without VT and then in 1962 Duke had a change of heart about football, did not want to recruit a certain kind of kid and pushed through the 800 minimum SAT rule that kept most all blacks and as well as dumb white kids out of the ACC a decade.

It set ACC football back 20 years. In 1962 Duke went to the Cotton Bowl, and an ACC team would not go to a major bowl again for 15 years and the ACC would not be truly competitive at the national level again for 20 years (Clemson-1982).

This is the history of the SoCon/ACC. Almost all of the SoCon time is forgotten which is due primarily to UNC not wanting those record to count. The Big 12 and PAC 12 by contrast keep their old records even under different conference names.

The ACC is far older than the 1953 date indicates. For all practical purposes the ACC's formation date is really 1933 - when the SEC schools left the Southern Conference - as such when you wonder why the ACC does things a certain way - you need to go back to the SoCon and that will answer EVERY question.

These fan created stories sound so hilarious sometimes. I can assure you some of this played a roll but it did not happen like that.

(07-28-2013 11:33 PM)jml2010 Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 09:46 PM)nzmorange Wrote:  Smack coming from a TTech fan is also pretty rich. When's the last time they mattered, even in their own state?

Ask Texas in 2002 & 2008. Ask Texas A&M from 1960-2008. Ask Oklahoma in 2005, 2007,2009 & 2011.

The 29th largest football fan base in America will not be ignored or denied. The rest is pure jealously because you live in a state where no one cares about you. Have fun playing the AAC champ in the who cares bowl. Meanwhile the power 4 conferences will play in the Rose and Sugar and our champs will play for a MNC. Florida St and Clemson will come begging when they realize they were hung out to dry by the BBall schools.

Having the (29th) largest fan base in America is cool but....that's like an Olympic distance runner bragging about coming in last place. There is a HUGE gap between 1 and 29 and to be honest there's probably only about 6-8 truly national fan bases.

ND
Ohio State
Michigan
USC
Texas
Oklahoma

There are some others with huge followings like Alabama but it has more to do with winning and being pushed on viewers by ESPN. I can walk into a Hibbet Sports in nowheresville, Georgia and probably find gear for those six teams and fans.

(07-28-2013 11:33 PM)jml2010 Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 09:46 PM)nzmorange Wrote:  Smack coming from a TTech fan is also pretty rich. When's the last time they mattered, even in their own state?

Ask Texas in 2002 & 2008. Ask Texas A&M from 1960-2008. Ask Oklahoma in 2005, 2007,2009 & 2011.

The 29th largest football fan base in America will not be ignored or denied. The rest is pure jealously because you live in a state where no one cares about you. Have fun playing the AAC champ in the who cares bowl. Meanwhile the power 4 conferences will play in the Rose and Sugar and our champs will play for a MNC. Florida St and Clemson will come begging when they realize they were hung out to dry by the BBall schools.

And the Big XII is a bastion of stability? You've lost Nebraska, Colorado, Missouri, and Texas A&M in the last 4 years, and a glorified MWC team is the preseason favorite to win your conference. Get over yourself. And you aren't even either Texas' or Oklahoma's 2nd rival, and there's a strong argument that you aren't even #3 on that list. The same goes for A&M.

Citing individuals wins (1 time in the last 10 years and 2 in the last 11) reeks of being pathetic. Navy beat ND in '07, '09, '10 and ND is the biggest fish in the college football pool and a national team. Does that mean ND was nationally relevant for 3 of the last 6 years?

When's the last time that any major school in the state to Texas looked at you as an equal? Honestly, TTech has resorted to using political ties to the University of Texas to stay in a power conference. Trash Syracuse all you want, but at least we don't run to our big brother every time we get our feelings hurt.

By the way, did you really citing something the dude said? Good grief!

EDIT: By the way, who brags about not even being in the top 25?

(07-29-2013 03:40 AM)Underdog Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 08:30 PM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote:  

(07-28-2013 07:33 PM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  actually it's Big 4 with the ACC tagging along

The Big XII has four members ripped away by three separate conferences in a mere 19 years of existence. Fans still think they're bigger, better, and more stable than the ACC.

It should have been six.... The PAC was foolish to turn down OU and OSU.

I don't think they were foolish considering the monumental shift required on Scott's part to even get the P10 to expand in the first place. Expansion by 6 was Ok'd b/c of access to the CST Zone along with a favorable divisional split. (P8 and everyone else)

But issues surrounding divisional alignment emerged when they only expanded to 12. Everyone wanted games with the CA schools and the CA schools still wanted to play each other. What they have right now is somewhat tolerable but the experience was truly instructive lesson.

Without a power school (read UT) eastern expansion isn't worth the headache. Taking the OK schools would have only been worth it if there was some guarantee of picking up the 'Horns later.

(07-30-2013 01:34 AM)Theodoresdaddy Wrote:  and we're still making more money than the ACC

That's absolutely true; almost all Big 12 schools are making slightly more money than their ACC counterparts. West Virginia and TCU probably are not as they are not cut in on revenue sharing to start and won't be for a few years. Conversely, Pitt and Syracuse begin as full partners right from the get go. However, it is true that everyone else in that league probably is making slightly more than their ACC peers. Also, that will continue for at least the next 2-3 years....until the ACC Network is up and running.

At that point, WVU will be both poorer and considerably more isolated than their neighboring ACC schools.

Why else do you think everyone - including Florida State and Clemson - so eagerly signed on to the long term GOR? Throughout the past few years I have learned that you Big 12 folks don't seem to be so good at simple logic and basic math so I'll give you a hint. They didn't do it for kicks and nor did they do it to show solidarity. They couldn't care less about any of that happy horseschitt. They did it because they studied the issue and saw the huge pile of money and exposure awaiting them on the other side. It is no different than what the B1G pioneered and what the Pac-12 and SEC have recently decided to capitalize on.

Don't worry though as I just heard from the Dude that ESPN is going to tell the ACC that a network will not work....no wait, what I meant to say was that Congress won't allow it...scratch that, I meant...uh....Oh, I know! The B12 is going to have a conference network of its own involving all of that league's power brokers except Texas and Oklahoma that will be worth eleventy billion dollars per academic quarter. Florida State and Clemson are so intrigued by the unlimited potential that network has that they are actively negotiating to get out of the GOR they just signed with the ACC to get in on that action. The press conference announcing the departure is set for next Tuesday afternoon at 2 p.m.

Book it.

It funny that some WVU fans just don't get it...they should be happy since they are above the Mandoza Line like every school in the Big XII, SEC, ACC, Pac 12 & B1G.

But I guess the years of rejection and the fact that Pitt, Miami, Virginia Tech, Syracuse, Boston College & even Louisville were chosen instead of them really get to some of them...some not all act like the Batcrap Crazy Ex that got dump...oh we'll...

I like to share these at every opportunity.
CJ

Real WVU fans disown these two. What makes this one so special is it was written four days after The GOR was signed. If he was an "inside' The Dude would have known that.
CJ

(07-30-2013 09:59 AM)Maize Wrote:  It funny that some WVU fans just don't get it...they should be happy since they are above the Mandoza Line like every school in the Big XII, SEC, ACC, Pac 12 & B1G.

But I guess the years of rejection and the fact that Pitt, Miami, Virginia Tech, Syracuse, Boston College & even Louisville were chosen instead of them really get to some of them...some not all act like the Batcrap Crazy Ex that got dump...oh we'll...

Agree 100%
By the same logic Louisville fans should be waging a jihad against The Big 12 because WVU got the blessed invite ahead of UofL. Instead Louisville fans are ecstatic that The Big 12 turned them down.
Bottom line is WVU and UofL both got what they wanted, a way out of The Big East.
CJ