And with the GoR done he also said their our now more opportunities in regards to TV-(Network $$$$) that was not possible before with their partnership with ESPN. Just my guess...the ACC once the network get up and running will be making a lot of $$$...which explains why FSU, Clemson, NC State etc.etc are on board with this...they saw the numbers from the World Wide Leader.

Also in ACC Division Lineup News...Louisville is going to take over Maryland slot & schedule starting in 2014.

(04-29-2013 09:07 AM)Maize Wrote:  And with the GoR done he also said their our now more opportunities in regards to TV-(Network $$$$) that was not possible before with their partnership with ESPN. Just my guess...the ACC once the network get up and running will be making a lot of $$$...which explains why FSU, Clemson, NC State etc.etc where on board...they saw the numbers from the World Wide Leader.

My disagreement with you (and Swofford) about the size of the ACC footprint aside, I bet the main reason that Clemson and FSU decided to sign the GoR was that they realized that an SEC invitation was not forthcoming. In fact, the FSU President Barron said as much in a Tallahassee Democrat article from April 26 explaining FSU's decision to sign the GoR:

"While it’s difficult to confirm how far those talks advanced, FSU officials came away with the understanding that the SEC saw little financial incentive to adding the Seminoles. Bringing on FSU would neither expand television markets nor open recruiting territories."

“If you go look at all the realignments that have occurred, with maybe one exception, (they have) been to add a new state – a new territory,” Barron said. “You look at what the SEC did; they go for Missouri and Texas. You look at the Big Ten; they hit Nebraska first, then Maryland and Rutgers in the New Jersey/New York market. So basically, they added contiguous real estate.”

I have tried to explain to FSU fans desperate to exit the ACC and join the SEC (by far the majority of Seminoles fans, btw) that the SEC did not want them, and they refused to believe it. But it is true.

(04-29-2013 09:19 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:07 AM)Maize Wrote:  And with the GoR done he also said their our now more opportunities in regards to TV-(Network $$$$) that was not possible before with their partnership with ESPN. Just my guess...the ACC once the network get up and running will be making a lot of $$$...which explains why FSU, Clemson, NC State etc.etc where on board...they saw the numbers from the World Wide Leader.

My disagreement with you (and Swofford) about the size of the ACC footprint aside, I bet the main reason that Clemson and FSU decided to sign the GoR was that they realized that an SEC invitation was not forthcoming. In fact, the FSU President Barron said as much in a Tallahassee Democrat article from April 26 explaining FSU's decision to sign the GoR:

"While it’s difficult to confirm how far those talks advanced, FSU officials came away with the understanding that the SEC saw little financial incentive to adding the Seminoles. Bringing on FSU would neither expand television markets nor open recruiting territories."

“If you go look at all the realignments that have occurred, with maybe one exception, (they have) been to add a new state – a new territory,” Barron said. “You look at what the SEC did; they go for Missouri and Texas. You look at the Big Ten; they hit Nebraska first, then Maryland and Rutgers in the New Jersey/New York market. So basically, they added contiguous real estate.”

I have tried to explain to FSU fans desperate to exit the ACC and join the SEC (by far the majority of Seminoles fans, btw) that the SEC did not want them, and they refused to believe it. But it is true.

FSU didn't want to join in 1990 or 2011. I think they probably would have gotten in over Missouri when the SEC was anxiously looking for a good #14. But adding value as #15 or #16 is a bigger hurdle.

it only matters how ESPN views the ACC's footprint that has any bearing on anything IMO

(04-29-2013 09:07 AM)Maize Wrote:  And with the GoR done he also said their our now more opportunities in regards to TV-(Network $$$$) that was not possible before with their partnership with ESPN. Just my guess...the ACC once the network get up and running will be making a lot of $$$...which explains why FSU, Clemson, NC State etc.etc are on board with this...they saw the numbers from the World Wide Leader.

Also in ACC Division Lineup News...Louisville is going to take over Maryland slot & schedule starting in 2014.

ACC could take a lesson from the B1G. Go geographic! FSU has more alumni in Georgia than any other two states combined (other than FL). Yet they will only play GT 2 times in 12 years. They want more fan interest-make more interesting games-create local rivalries.
S/B FSU/GT/Clemson/NCSU/WF/Duke/UNC vs. Pitt/SU/BC/UL/UVA/VT/Miami or
FSU/GT/Clemson/NCSU/WF/UL/Pitt vs. UVA/VT/Miami/UNC/Duke/BC/SU if UVA and UNC really need to stay together. Miami and FSU probably need to be split because of Florida recruiting and Miami recruits heavily from the mid-Atlantic and Northeast.

(04-29-2013 09:07 AM)Maize Wrote:  And with the GoR done he also said their our now more opportunities in regards to TV-(Network $$$$) that was not possible before with their partnership with ESPN. Just my guess...the ACC once the network get up and running will be making a lot of $$$...which explains why FSU, Clemson, NC State etc.etc are on board with this...they saw the numbers from the World Wide Leader.

Also in ACC Division Lineup News...Louisville is going to take over Maryland slot & schedule starting in 2014.

Wait, how are they going to set up a network when ESPN owns all of their rights? ESPN would have to agree to give you guys BACK inventory while paying you the same and allowing you to become a competitor against their own channels. This makes zero sense. The other leagues didn't have full exclusive contracts so it was able to be worked out. ESPN owns EVERYTHING the ACC could put on air already. Why would they agree to this?

(04-29-2013 09:26 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:07 AM)Maize Wrote:  And with the GoR done he also said their our now more opportunities in regards to TV-(Network $$$$) that was not possible before with their partnership with ESPN. Just my guess...the ACC once the network get up and running will be making a lot of $$$...which explains why FSU, Clemson, NC State etc.etc are on board with this...they saw the numbers from the World Wide Leader.

Also in ACC Division Lineup News...Louisville is going to take over Maryland slot & schedule starting in 2014.

ACC could take a lesson from the B1G. Go geographic! FSU has more alumni in Georgia than any other two states combined (other than FL). Yet they will only play GT 2 times in 12 years. They want more fan interest-make more interesting games-create local rivalries.
S/B FSU/GT/Clemson/NCSU/WF/Duke/UNC vs. Pitt/SU/BC/UL/UVA/VT/Miami or
FSU/GT/Clemson/NCSU/WF/UL/Pitt vs. UVA/VT/Miami/UNC/Duke/BC/SU if UVA and UNC really need to stay together. Miami and FSU probably need to be split because of Florida recruiting and Miami recruits heavily from the mid-Atlantic and Northeast.

I agree with the geographic divisions.

North-
BC
Cuse
Pitt
UofL
UVA
VT
NC St (One of the NC schools would need to go north and for competitive balance it's the Wolfpack)

South-
FSU
Miami
GT
Clemson
UNC
Duke
Wake

The ACC signed a GORs because the conference leaders: (1) the "academic" powers in UNC/Virginia didn't want to become second-class sports programs in the BIG, etc.; and (2) the others finally woke up and realized the ACC is a "better" conference of schools than the Big XII. The conference also put loyalty and relationships in front of cash flow. Ironic given the ACC built its middle by raiding the Big East . . . I admit I'm surprised by the leadership within the conference. I expected the BIG would poach a UNC/Virginia and in the ensuing panic, Florida, Miami, etc. would bolt to the Big XII . . . but this is what you get when you have "leadership" among your members, and a real conference commissioner.

(04-29-2013 09:29 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:07 AM)Maize Wrote:  And with the GoR done he also said their our now more opportunities in regards to TV-(Network $$$$) that was not possible before with their partnership with ESPN. Just my guess...the ACC once the network get up and running will be making a lot of $$$...which explains why FSU, Clemson, NC State etc.etc are on board with this...they saw the numbers from the World Wide Leader.

Also in ACC Division Lineup News...Louisville is going to take over Maryland slot & schedule starting in 2014.

Wait, how are they going to set up a network when ESPN owns all of their rights? ESPN would have to agree to give you guys BACK inventory while paying you the same and allowing you to become a competitor against their own channels. This makes zero sense. The other leagues didn't have full exclusive contracts so it was able to be worked out. ESPN owns EVERYTHING the ACC could put on air already. Why would they agree to this?

There is giant difference between footprints and great tv markets.Also being totally contolled by espn is quite different then having joint broadcasters.

(04-29-2013 09:29 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:07 AM)Maize Wrote:  And with the GoR done he also said their our now more opportunities in regards to TV-(Network $$$$) that was not possible before with their partnership with ESPN. Just my guess...the ACC once the network get up and running will be making a lot of $$$...which explains why FSU, Clemson, NC State etc.etc are on board with this...they saw the numbers from the World Wide Leader.

Also in ACC Division Lineup News...Louisville is going to take over Maryland slot & schedule starting in 2014.

Wait, how are they going to set up a network when ESPN owns all of their rights? ESPN would have to agree to give you guys BACK inventory while paying you the same and allowing you to become a competitor against their own channels. This makes zero sense. The other leagues didn't have full exclusive contracts so it was able to be worked out. ESPN owns EVERYTHING the ACC could put on air already. Why would they agree to this?

well for one if espn owns a percentage in the network it might interest them, and for what it's worth all the ACC has to do is move it's current syndication package of games(30 football,70 basketball) to it's proposed network.their's also soccer,lacrosse, baseball & so on.

(04-29-2013 09:35 AM)Rich52c Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:29 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:07 AM)Maize Wrote:  And with the GoR done he also said their our now more opportunities in regards to TV-(Network $$$$) that was not possible before with their partnership with ESPN. Just my guess...the ACC once the network get up and running will be making a lot of $$$...which explains why FSU, Clemson, NC State etc.etc are on board with this...they saw the numbers from the World Wide Leader.

Also in ACC Division Lineup News...Louisville is going to take over Maryland slot & schedule starting in 2014.

Wait, how are they going to set up a network when ESPN owns all of their rights? ESPN would have to agree to give you guys BACK inventory while paying you the same and allowing you to become a competitor against their own channels. This makes zero sense. The other leagues didn't have full exclusive contracts so it was able to be worked out. ESPN owns EVERYTHING the ACC could put on air already. Why would they agree to this?

There is giant difference between footprints and great tv markets.Also being totally contolled by espn is quite different then having joint broadcasters.

Right. How many people outside of NC and VA are going to "demand" this channel? People outside the region want to see UNC and Duke basketball and FSU football, plus a few other brands if they are really, really good that year. There are a ton of cable channels that have national broadcasting but make very little. The bottom line is what providers will pay for rights to broadcast, and I don't see the ACC cashing in like the BIG or SEC.

(04-29-2013 09:34 AM)UHCougar Wrote:  The ACC signed a GORs because the conference leaders: (1) the "academic" powers in UNC/Virginia didn't want to become second-class sports programs in the BIG, etc.; and (2) the others finally woke up and realized the ACC is a "better" conference of schools than the Big XII. The conference also put loyalty and relationships in front of cash flow. Ironic given the ACC built its middle by raiding the Big East . . . I admit I'm surprised by the leadership within the conference. I expected the BIG would poach a UNC/Virginia and in the ensuing panic, Florida, Miami, etc. would bolt to the Big XII . . . but this is what you get when you have "leadership" among your members, and a real conference commissioner.

the B1G was never a option for UNC period. anybody that knows & understands the way UNC operates knows this.

(04-29-2013 09:32 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  I agree with the geographic divisions.

North-
BC
Cuse
Pitt
UofL
UVA
VT
NC St (One of the NC schools would need to go north and for competitive balance it's the Wolfpack)

South-
FSU
Miami
GT
Clemson
UNC
Duke
Wake

Miami goes north.

North------------South
Boston College----Wake Forest
Louisville----------Clemson
Miami-------------Florida State
Pitt---------------NC State
Syracuse----------Duke
Virginia------------North Carolina
Virginia Tech-------Georgia Tech

(04-29-2013 09:46 AM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:32 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  I agree with the geographic divisions.

North-
BC
Cuse
Pitt
UofL
UVA
VT
NC St (One of the NC schools would need to go north and for competitive balance it's the Wolfpack)

South-
FSU
Miami
GT
Clemson
UNC
Duke
Wake

Miami goes north.

North------------South
Boston College----Wake Forest
Louisville----------Clemson
Miami-------------Florida State
Pitt---------------NC State
Syracuse----------Duke
Virginia------------North Carolina
Virginia Tech-------Georgia Tech

That could work too. Geographic divisions are the only way to go. I have no idea who is in which division right now.

(04-29-2013 09:22 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:19 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:07 AM)Maize Wrote:  And with the GoR done he also said their our now more opportunities in regards to TV-(Network $$$$) that was not possible before with their partnership with ESPN. Just my guess...the ACC once the network get up and running will be making a lot of $$$...which explains why FSU, Clemson, NC State etc.etc where on board...they saw the numbers from the World Wide Leader.

My disagreement with you (and Swofford) about the size of the ACC footprint aside, I bet the main reason that Clemson and FSU decided to sign the GoR was that they realized that an SEC invitation was not forthcoming. In fact, the FSU President Barron said as much in a Tallahassee Democrat article from April 26 explaining FSU's decision to sign the GoR:

"While it’s difficult to confirm how far those talks advanced, FSU officials came away with the understanding that the SEC saw little financial incentive to adding the Seminoles. Bringing on FSU would neither expand television markets nor open recruiting territories."

“If you go look at all the realignments that have occurred, with maybe one exception, (they have) been to add a new state – a new territory,” Barron said. “You look at what the SEC did; they go for Missouri and Texas. You look at the Big Ten; they hit Nebraska first, then Maryland and Rutgers in the New Jersey/New York market. So basically, they added contiguous real estate.”

I have tried to explain to FSU fans desperate to exit the ACC and join the SEC (by far the majority of Seminoles fans, btw) that the SEC did not want them, and they refused to believe it. But it is true.

FSU didn't want to join in 1990 or 2011.

There's a difference between what FSU's administrators wanted (they have always preferred the ACC because of its higher academic profile) with what the vast FSU fan base has wanted. FSU alumni and fans have always overwhelmingly desired SEC membership.

quo vadis -- there are two things beyond "death" and "taxes" that we can count on:

1) folks will confuse what the FSU administration wanted vs. what the FSU alum and Walmart fans want.

2) folks will always clamour for the ACC to adopt a N/S division alignment, despite the fact that the ADs don't want it.

That's what makes this board such a pleasant, active place to post :)














Bazinga

(04-29-2013 09:34 AM)UHCougar Wrote:  The ACC signed a GORs because the conference leaders: (1) the "academic" powers in UNC/Virginia didn't want to become second-class sports programs in the BIG, etc.; and (2) the others finally woke up and realized the ACC is a "better" conference of schools than the Big XII. The conference also put loyalty and relationships in front of cash flow.

IMO, you omit a big (3), which is that the agreement with Notre Dame boosted their cash flow (which ALWAYS matters to administrators. Always) up enough so that (1) and (2) could be implemented.

If the ACC's money was still stuck down at around $17 million, it would have been difficult if not impossible to get schools outside of NC and VA to sign a GoR.

(04-29-2013 09:43 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:35 AM)Rich52c Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:29 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:07 AM)Maize Wrote:  And with the GoR done he also said their our now more opportunities in regards to TV-(Network $$$$) that was not possible before with their partnership with ESPN. Just my guess...the ACC once the network get up and running will be making a lot of $$$...which explains why FSU, Clemson, NC State etc.etc are on board with this...they saw the numbers from the World Wide Leader.

Also in ACC Division Lineup News...Louisville is going to take over Maryland slot & schedule starting in 2014.

Wait, how are they going to set up a network when ESPN owns all of their rights? ESPN would have to agree to give you guys BACK inventory while paying you the same and allowing you to become a competitor against their own channels. This makes zero sense. The other leagues didn't have full exclusive contracts so it was able to be worked out. ESPN owns EVERYTHING the ACC could put on air already. Why would they agree to this?

There is giant difference between footprints and great tv markets.Also being totally contolled by espn is quite different then having joint broadcasters.

Right. How many people outside of NC and VA are going to "demand" this channel? People outside the region want to see UNC and Duke basketball and FSU football, plus a few other brands if they are really, really good that year. There are a ton of cable channels that have national broadcasting but make very little. The bottom line is what providers will pay for rights to broadcast, and I don't see the ACC cashing in like the BIG or SEC.

it also depends on what model the conference chooses. so many people are stuck on the traditional cable network model but it's possible a ACC network is completely digital ala espn3. you could sell it to ISP providers or pay services like netflix,hulu, amazon prime & x box live. the conference already has the infrastructure in place(studio etc) & already broadcast games on youtube

(04-29-2013 09:55 AM)mj4life Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:43 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:35 AM)Rich52c Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:29 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:07 AM)Maize Wrote:  And with the GoR done he also said their our now more opportunities in regards to TV-(Network $$$$) that was not possible before with their partnership with ESPN. Just my guess...the ACC once the network get up and running will be making a lot of $$$...which explains why FSU, Clemson, NC State etc.etc are on board with this...they saw the numbers from the World Wide Leader.

Also in ACC Division Lineup News...Louisville is going to take over Maryland slot & schedule starting in 2014.

Wait, how are they going to set up a network when ESPN owns all of their rights? ESPN would have to agree to give you guys BACK inventory while paying you the same and allowing you to become a competitor against their own channels. This makes zero sense. The other leagues didn't have full exclusive contracts so it was able to be worked out. ESPN owns EVERYTHING the ACC could put on air already. Why would they agree to this?

There is giant difference between footprints and great tv markets.Also being totally contolled by espn is quite different then having joint broadcasters.

Right. How many people outside of NC and VA are going to "demand" this channel? People outside the region want to see UNC and Duke basketball and FSU football, plus a few other brands if they are really, really good that year. There are a ton of cable channels that have national broadcasting but make very little. The bottom line is what providers will pay for rights to broadcast, and I don't see the ACC cashing in like the BIG or SEC.

it also depends on what model the conference chooses. so many people are stuck on the traditional cable network model but it's possible a ACC network is completely digital ala espn3. you could sell it to ISP providers or pay services like netflix,hulu, amazon prime & x box live. the conference already has the infrastructure in place(studio etc) & already broadcast games on youtube

Well then you still need cable providers who also provide a large amount of internet service to agree to carry it. Some don't carry ESPN3 right now.

(04-29-2013 10:00 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:55 AM)mj4life Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:43 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:35 AM)Rich52c Wrote:  

(04-29-2013 09:29 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  Wait, how are they going to set up a network when ESPN owns all of their rights? ESPN would have to agree to give you guys BACK inventory while paying you the same and allowing you to become a competitor against their own channels. This makes zero sense. The other leagues didn't have full exclusive contracts so it was able to be worked out. ESPN owns EVERYTHING the ACC could put on air already. Why would they agree to this?

There is giant difference between footprints and great tv markets.Also being totally contolled by espn is quite different then having joint broadcasters.

Right. How many people outside of NC and VA are going to "demand" this channel? People outside the region want to see UNC and Duke basketball and FSU football, plus a few other brands if they are really, really good that year. There are a ton of cable channels that have national broadcasting but make very little. The bottom line is what providers will pay for rights to broadcast, and I don't see the ACC cashing in like the BIG or SEC.

it also depends on what model the conference chooses. so many people are stuck on the traditional cable network model but it's possible a ACC network is completely digital ala espn3. you could sell it to ISP providers or pay services like netflix,hulu, amazon prime & x box live. the conference already has the infrastructure in place(studio etc) & already broadcast games on youtube

Well then you still need cable providers who also provide a large amount of internet service to agree to carry it. Some don't carry ESPN3 right now.

85 million do plus you could offer subcripitions to those who don't. a digital model allows each school to have it's own network to program & broadcast games on. it also allows fans to only watch the schools that interest them.