Its a good thing some posters on here are not in positions of leadership at their schools. I honestly do not understand how some people can say with a straight face that staying in a league with North Texas, Middle Tenn, ODU, UNC-C , is the same as being in a conf with UCF, USF,UCONN,CINN, ECU, Temple,SMU and HOuston. The BE is not a lateral move. The better conf's will get better recruits and have a much better chance of drawing better crowds, which of course helps the bottom line. BEtter recruits equal better football teams. Ask a recruit which group he would rather play against.
Maybe people really believe that staying in a conf with the first group I mentioned is the same as the second, if you are that person then good for you, I just to think your AD would say the same. I know ours did not. Staying in a conf with the first group would really hurt ECU attendance and our recruiting.

(01-01-2013 03:07 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  I think feelings are mutual.

C-USA should add, Tulane, Memphis, WKU & UCF.

You really think there are any circumstances that UCF is separating from USF? That's stupidity on your part. They have desired for years to be with them and then you think they'd go back to C-USA without them? At least throw out plausible scenarios for your hoping to **** over ECU.
[/quote]

Well that one went right over your head.

(01-01-2013 03:33 PM)baruna falls Wrote:  Its a good thing some posters on here are not in positions of leadership at their schools. I honestly do not understand how some people can say with a straight face that staying in a league with North Texas, Middle Tenn, ODU, UNC-C , is the same as being in a conf with UCF, USF,UCONN,CINN, ECU, Temple,SMU and HOuston. The BE is not a lateral move. The better conf's will get better recruits and have a much better chance of drawing better crowds, which of course helps the bottom line. BEtter recruits equal better football teams. Ask a recruit which group he would rather play against.
Maybe people really believe that staying in a conf with the first group I mentioned is the same as the second, if you are that person then good for you, I just to think your AD would say the same. I know ours did not. Staying in a conf with the first group would really hurt ECU attendance and our recruiting.

I agree with you... All those schools have more appeal than most C-USA teams, but the problem is, will a school pay 5-7 Million to join? And if they do, its no guarantee that Houston, SMU, Cincy, nor UConn will be there by the time they join.

Quote:I honestly do not understand how some people can say with a straight face that staying in a league with North Texas, Middle Tenn, ODU, UNC-C , is the same as being in a conf with UCF, USF,UCONN,CINN, ECU, Temple,SMU and HOuston.

1) SMU and Houston... going?
2) Uconn.. Going?
3) Cincinnati? May not have a choice in the matter.


Tell me where you're going to make up the $10-12Million that it would take to make that move when 4 of the teams you listed may not even be around?

Again, $6.8+ to leave C-usa, $5+ to join a conference we have been in previously (not counting UConn and Temple). How hard is that to understand? As a _fan_, you may like the name value. as an Athletic director I'd be telling you you were nuts right now.

Better crowds? Again, ODU is expanding their stadium with a waiting list. UNC-C is in "stage 1" of their stadium (BTW guess which schools those two are going to compete against for Recruits. I'll be really interested to see how that turns out over the next few years if things stay changed.). UTSA still puts up good numbers, let's see how well it continues (or will we have a UAB/Tulane/Memphis FB attendance situation on our hands?)

As for recruiting, again, Marshall/USM/UAb don't "need" UCF to recruit florida.. we've got the F_U schools.

Temple? PHILADELPHIA? A real "hotspot" for recruiting huh? Heck, look at where Pittsburgh and Penn state go for their recruits.. and it's not the Philadelphia area typically.

Listen to yourself, BF.. "Hey, we're ECU and the rest of these schools suck!".

(01-01-2013 03:43 PM)DaSaintFan Wrote:  

Quote:I honestly do not understand how some people can say with a straight face that staying in a league with North Texas, Middle Tenn, ODU, UNC-C , is the same as being in a conf with UCF, USF,UCONN,CINN, ECU, Temple,SMU and HOuston.

1) SMU and Houston... going?
2) Uconn.. Going?
3) Cincinnati? May not have a choice in the matter.


Tell me where you're going to make up the $10-12Million that it would take to make that move when 4 of the teams you listed may not even be around?

Again, $6.8+ to leave C-usa, $5+ to join a conference we have been in previously (not counting UConn and Temple). How hard is that to understand? As a _fan_, you may like the name value. as an Athletic director I'd be telling you you were nuts right now.

Better crowds? Again, ODU is expanding their stadium with a waiting list. UNC-C is in "stage 1" of their stadium (BTW guess which schools those two are going to compete against for Recruits. I'll be really interested to see how that turns out over the next few years if things stay changed.). UTSA still puts up good numbers, let's see how well it continues (or will we have a UAB/Tulane/Memphis FB attendance situation on our hands?)

As for recruiting, again, Marshall/USM/UAb don't "need" UCF to recruit florida.. we've got the F_U schools.

Temple? PHILADELPHIA? A real "hotspot" for recruiting huh? Heck, look at where Pittsburgh and Penn state go for their recruits.. and it's not the Philadelphia area typically.

Listen to yourself, BF.. "Hey, we're ECU and the rest of these schools suck!".

The easy thing to do is to dismiss what I wrote as some jerk ECU fan posting that his school is better than others. Read it as you may. No AD could afford not to leave Conf USA if they can. Again if you think the new teams are as good for your school to compete against as the ones in the BE, then we simply have differing opinions.

I didn't say they were as good as them right now... but you give them 2 to 3 years, and yes, I could see the ODU's and UTSA's having the success that the USF's and Temples' have had before they moved up to FBS level.

I apologize for the "rest of these schools suck" line.. I've seen way too many ECU fans lately who have gotten that attitude and carried it over to this forum and I just let it run away with me.

(01-01-2013 03:48 PM)baruna falls Wrote:  Again if you think the new teams are as good for your school to compete against as the ones in the BE, then we simply have differing opinions.

In the new set up a win over UCF and a win over FIU is going to be the same.

The real anger should placed with the system. At this point it may not really matter what conf any of the leftovers, (ECU included) are in. I still have no idea how the big 5 were able to dictate who is worthy and who is not, or why the schools that were left out of the Big Bowl access did not raise hell about being treated like second class citizens. The hard truth is that there are going to be many losers in this new system. The Big 5 will continue to pull away from the rest of us. This is a fight to the football death for many schools. Couple this with the desire of many D-1a schools wanting to move up and we have a very crowded field. In the end I suspect that teams like Southern MIss, Marshall and ECU are going to be okay, but we are going to have to fight for everything we can. This is why, I do believe who you play in your conf means more now than ever.

(01-01-2013 03:48 PM)baruna falls Wrote:  

(01-01-2013 03:43 PM)DaSaintFan Wrote:  

Quote:I honestly do not understand how some people can say with a straight face that staying in a league with North Texas, Middle Tenn, ODU, UNC-C , is the same as being in a conf with UCF, USF,UCONN,CINN, ECU, Temple,SMU and HOuston.

1) SMU and Houston... going?
2) Uconn.. Going?
3) Cincinnati? May not have a choice in the matter.


Tell me where you're going to make up the $10-12Million that it would take to make that move when 4 of the teams you listed may not even be around?

Again, $6.8+ to leave C-usa, $5+ to join a conference we have been in previously (not counting UConn and Temple). How hard is that to understand? As a _fan_, you may like the name value. as an Athletic director I'd be telling you you were nuts right now.

Better crowds? Again, ODU is expanding their stadium with a waiting list. UNC-C is in "stage 1" of their stadium (BTW guess which schools those two are going to compete against for Recruits. I'll be really interested to see how that turns out over the next few years if things stay changed.). UTSA still puts up good numbers, let's see how well it continues (or will we have a UAB/Tulane/Memphis FB attendance situation on our hands?)

As for recruiting, again, Marshall/USM/UAb don't "need" UCF to recruit florida.. we've got the F_U schools.

Temple? PHILADELPHIA? A real "hotspot" for recruiting huh? Heck, look at where Pittsburgh and Penn state go for their recruits.. and it's not the Philadelphia area typically.

Listen to yourself, BF.. "Hey, we're ECU and the rest of these schools suck!".

The easy thing to do is to dismiss what I wrote as some jerk ECU fan posting that his school is better than others. Read it as you may. No AD could afford not to leave Conf USA if they can. Again if you think the new teams are as good for your school to compete against as the ones in the BE, then we simply have differing opinions.

I don't argue that i'd much rather see USM playing ECU rather than say ODU, but what exactly are we getting other than the pleasure of having you on our schedule? You don't have a TV contract and projections of that contract are dropping daily. You don't know who will even be in this conference and you don't even know what it will be called for God's sake. No one in their right mind is paying millions of dollars to join that. A year ago we'd been right there with you. Probably even 6 months ago, but now? No thanks. We'll just try and wait you out. 6 months to a year from now there may only be 6 of you left.

(01-01-2013 12:36 PM)MUTeke Wrote:  Merge C-USA and the remnants of the nBE, its the only logical step left. The MWC is putting together a pretty strong group, especially if they add Houston, SMU, UTEP and Tulsa.

Instead of worrying about humiliating defectors out of spite, or silly pride, we need to worry about countering the growing presence in the west. We(C-USA and nBE) can fight each other for the nMWC's scraps or challenge them together for TV dollars and playoff access.

With 20 members we would have a built in hedge against further realignment. If we lose Cincy and UConn we could stay at 18 and be fine.

Football is king in the eastern US and basketball is important in the Northeast but does not draw the $$$. When the dust settles the nBE, becaues of the catholic 7 will be have little money in the bank. CUSA will financially be in good shape (we have the defectors buy-out $$ and newbies buy-in). Anyway you look a it the nBE is CUSA 2.0. I mean duh... Merge nBE/CUSA call it something else, to save face for those who left and lets move forward.

(01-01-2013 04:14 PM)BkGold Wrote:  

(01-01-2013 12:36 PM)MUTeke Wrote:  Merge C-USA and the remnants of the nBE, its the only logical step left. The MWC is putting together a pretty strong group, especially if they add Houston, SMU, UTEP and Tulsa.

Instead of worrying about humiliating defectors out of spite, or silly pride, we need to worry about countering the growing presence in the west. We(C-USA and nBE) can fight each other for the nMWC's scraps or challenge them together for TV dollars and playoff access.

With 20 members we would have a built in hedge against further realignment. If we lose Cincy and UConn we could stay at 18 and be fine.

Football is king in the eastern US and basketball is important in the Northeast but does not draw the $$$. When the dust settles the nBE, becaues of the catholic 7 will be have little money in the bank. CUSA will financially be in good shape (we have the defectors buy-out $$ and newbies buy-in). Anyway you look a it the nBE is CUSA 2.0. I mean duh... Merge nBE/CUSA call it something else, to save face for those who left and lets move forward.

"Greed" started the killing process and "egos" will finish the job.

I was thinking, how many people remember why C-USA was formed and who the original members were. I am one of those who do, and I have to say it is amusing to think that many of the original members could be right back together. Another example of marching in place it would seem.

(01-01-2013 04:19 PM)SgtGoldenEagle Wrote:  I was thinking, how many people remember why C-USA was formed and who the original members were. I am one of those who do, and I have to say it is amusing to think that many of the original members could be right back together. Another example of marching in place it would seem.

I'd love to see something that resembled what C-USA used to be. C-USA used to be a very good league, and if it could end up looking close to the real C-USA then I'll be very happy.

(01-01-2013 03:33 PM)baruna falls Wrote:  Its a good thing some posters on here are not in positions of leadership at their schools. I honestly do not understand how some people can say with a straight face that staying in a league with North Texas, Middle Tenn, ODU, UNC-C , is the same as being in a conf with UCF, USF,UCONN,CINN, ECU, Temple,SMU and HOuston. The BE is not a lateral move. The better conf's will get better recruits and have a much better chance of drawing better crowds, which of course helps the bottom line. BEtter recruits equal better football teams. Ask a recruit which group he would rather play against.
Maybe people really believe that staying in a conf with the first group I mentioned is the same as the second, if you are that person then good for you, I just to think your AD would say the same. I know ours did not. Staying in a conf with the first group would really hurt ECU attendance and our recruiting.

The question I have is....Do you honestly know who will be in your conference?.... And do you know how long UCF,USF and UConn have been D-1 schools? About as long as ODU, UNC-C, UTSA and MTSU will take to get to the same place. Some people are very shortsighted and looking forward is a problem for them.

As crazy as things are getting maybe the nBE would kick in some money or discount admission fees to get Southern Miss and Marshall.

IMO... basically the BE just needs to "give up the ghost" and disband.

Step 1) Let Houston/SMU/Boise St/SDSU go back to the MWC.
Step 2) UTEP/Tulsa allowed to go back to the MWC to give them 16
Step 3) Tulane/Memphis "re"Join C-uSA to replace UTEP/Tulsa
Step 4) ECU/UCF "re"Join C-USA to give them 16.
Step 5) Cincinnati offered to join the MAC. (MAC can state it gives them a regular "name") They can look at other alternatives if they wish (BigXII).
Step 6) UConn and Temple given the ACC invite. (not sure of their numbers? Even/odd? Not sure if the ACC is even interested in two schools, but might be if the BXII/SEC try to poach off one of their grumbling schools.). If they're not happy with that, they can rejoin the C-7 for basketball and move their football to a CAA-type league.
Step 7) USF can go full circle, and go right back to the SunBelt (it'd give the SunBelt a little more credibility if USF doesn't screw the pooch), and USF could have a chance of running that conference, and the sun-belt can call up one of those FCS schools that are interested to even out the numbers.)

Step 8) Make sure the networks don't screw over CUSA, MWC, MAC or SunBelt by lowballing them... stand together as the "Group of 4".

(01-01-2013 04:29 PM)BkGold Wrote:  

(01-01-2013 03:33 PM)baruna falls Wrote:  Its a good thing some posters on here are not in positions of leadership at their schools. I honestly do not understand how some people can say with a straight face that staying in a league with North Texas, Middle Tenn, ODU, UNC-C , is the same as being in a conf with UCF, USF,UCONN,CINN, ECU, Temple,SMU and HOuston. The BE is not a lateral move. The better conf's will get better recruits and have a much better chance of drawing better crowds, which of course helps the bottom line. BEtter recruits equal better football teams. Ask a recruit which group he would rather play against.
Maybe people really believe that staying in a conf with the first group I mentioned is the same as the second, if you are that person then good for you, I just to think your AD would say the same. I know ours did not. Staying in a conf with the first group would really hurt ECU attendance and our recruiting.

The question I have is....Do you honestly know who will be in your conference?.... And do you know how long UCF,USF and UConn have been D-1 schools? About as long as ODU, UNC-C, UTSA and MTSU will take to get to the same place. Some people are very shortsighted and looking forward is a problem for them.

Those 3 though have taken the lumps of being moved up and have established themselves as respectable FBS programs. The teams you mentioned (not sure why you put MTSU in there they have been FBS for a while) might do the same, but it's very likely at least 1 of them is going to be a failure. The history of FCS teams moving up is filled with success stories and failures. I'm not rooting for any to be failures, in fact I actually do hope ODU and Charlotte are good and ECU in the future after they have established themselves at this level are in a league with them, but I was not excited about ECU having to deal with the years of growing pains and the risk that they don't amount to anything.

Quote:n fact I actually do hope ODU and Charlotte are good and ECU in the future after they have established themselves at this level are in a league with them, but I was not excited about ECU having to deal with the years of growing pains and the risk that they don't amount to anything.

That's just it.. we (the current C-USA teams) have a vested interest in making sure those teams succeed and don't fall to the "we're here, now we're going to coast" story. (again wasn't that why Temple had been kicked out of the BE at one point? They weren't even making an attempt to succeed.)

(01-01-2013 04:24 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(01-01-2013 04:19 PM)SgtGoldenEagle Wrote:  I was thinking, how many people remember why C-USA was formed and who the original members were. I am one of those who do, and I have to say it is amusing to think that many of the original members could be right back together. Another example of marching in place it would seem.

I'd love to see something that resembled what C-USA used to be. C-USA used to be a very good league, and if it could end up looking close to the real C-USA then I'll be very happy.

I can remember when it was first reported that the conference was being formed. Many hated it because they said it was just a bunch of schools that were too unimportant to be with the big boys and didn't like being the big fish in the little pond. In fact there were many of the bigger named schools (SEC schools in large part, but others as well) who refused to even schedule games against C-USA members but said they would if they wouldn't be part of the conference.

USM wanted the conference for the same reason the others did, it would take the scheduling burden down immensely, and it gave them a title to play for since a National title was extremely unlikely. Of course after the first football season when USM and Houston were co-champs and Houston got the bowl and USM got left out, the bowl ties became important.

It took a lot of hard work and some great work to get each of the members to where they are today, and frankly USM sacrificed more than most since USM was one of the top Independent and lesser regarded conferences team. It is interesting because basically I see the same old story repeating all these years later and what might happen is most of the same teams will find themselves back together having to build up another conference while looking to jump to a bigger conference. What if everyone had looked more into the future to start with? I don't know what would have happened, but I have to wonder.

(01-01-2013 12:47 PM)GreenMississippi Wrote:  If we didn't jump the gun and invite FIU, FAU, La Tech, UNT, UTSA, and MTSU (6); we would have 8 schools and be in position to reabsorb the remnants of the Big East. We did not anticipate the collapse, and that in the end has turned C*USA into the Belt.

We have lost 6 schools, half the conference. If we had not added anyone we would be at 6 and vulnerable to say the least. Maybe adding only 2 would have been more prudent but it is what it is.