(08-20-2011 01:00 PM)cardshouse Wrote:  The whole problem is the Big East waits for other conferences to make the first move...We need 3 teams right now that are ready for the move...And they are all CUSA EAST teams. We are not gonna be able to take any other team from a BCS conference because we are not making as much money...So I guess we will wait for the new TV contract while the ACC gets ready to take 3 or 4 Big East North teams...Thats how it will go down if we just dream of getting a few Big 12 or ACC schools....

Now you know if any new schools that come in would be under the new TV contract since the earliest they would be able to start play-(including the C-USA East schools) is 2013/2014.

You also realize that by announcing schools the league would already have a pretty good idea how much the new TV contract would be-(It has been verified that the BIG EAST has already turned down 15 Million per football school from ESPN which is more then the current & new TV contract the ACC just agreed to).

(08-20-2011 08:30 AM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Maryland, Mizzou, and Kansas may be even better, Maize. IMO Kansas football is about on par with BC, and their basketball is far better. Plus, they actually have fans, something BC has never really had in large numbers...

That would be awesome if we can make it work.

By the way, Kansas State isn't worthless. They have had success in football and have a nice basketball program. Their fanbase is local but rabid, similar to ECU (only larger).

IMO, the Big East should add Maryland, Boston College, and Penn State. But seeing how Penn State won't be leaving the Big 10, Virginia Tech would be my pick. Personally, you cannot grab Kansas without Kansas State, the state won't allow it. Kansas State also has ties to Bob Huggins, so I could see Kansas State, Kansas, and Maryland being the three teams. We would add to the best Basketball Conference in America, as well as create a stronger football conference with the ties WVU and MD share.

(08-20-2011 01:00 PM)cardshouse Wrote:  The whole problem is the Big East waits for other conferences to make the first move...We need 3 teams right now that are ready for the move...And they are all CUSA EAST teams. We are not gonna be able to take any other team from a BCS conference because we are not making as much money...So I guess we will wait for the new TV contract while the ACC gets ready to take 3 or 4 Big East North teams...Thats how it will go down if we just dream of getting a few Big 12 or ACC schools....

You can bet The BIG East has contract projections from ESPN's competitors. I'm sure these 12 programs that OC outlined above have some idea what The BIG East will be able to do. I don't know 3 or 4 BIG East teams that would jump to an ACC that in The ACC's words is waiting to be reactive instead of proactive as far as expansion goes.
CJ

(08-20-2011 01:22 PM)cardshouse Wrote:  Well you cant deny that Boston College & Va. Tech have done well in the ACC..Its the other teams that have not done well....I really don't think we are in a position to go after BCS schools unless 2 or 3 teams left the Big 12 & ACC..Then we might be able to do buisness...For now we need to protect ourselfs if we do get poached in the future...Most football fans want 12....But its like they want a BCS school or a school that is in Utah or a school that averages 10,000 a game.....We need a model that is true to the Big East....Rival schools in our territory are much more fun to watch. IMO.

I can deny Boston College. They have sucked in The ACC. Their conference basketball record is 49-47 since joining The ACC. One whole game over 500. If you classify that as doing well, OK. As for football they averaged a 5-3 conference record in The ACC. Again one game over 500.

Can't deny VaTech has done well. All that does is underscore how disappointing The ACC expansion has truly been. VaTech is the player to be named later. The program that was forced on The ACC by UVa to get expansion to pass.

I love the fact we kept Syracuse the last go round. Imagine, however, if The BIG East had kept VaTech and lost Syracuse. How would The ACC expansion be viewed? Think about that.

It's sad to think of all the upheaval caused by The ACC for what. The success of a program they didn't even want?
CJ

(08-20-2011 01:12 PM)brista21 Wrote:  

(08-20-2011 03:51 AM)omnicarrier Wrote:  

(08-20-2011 03:22 AM)CardinalJim Wrote:  Looks like some one else has the same idea that many here have had for months: The BIG East may be getting ready to raid The ACC.
CJ

The BIG East could take 2 from Big 12 and 1 from The ACC

If this scenario plays out I'd rather it be 2 from the ACC (BC and MD) and 1 from the Big 12 (Kansas).

Cheers,
Neil

Agreed. That would be a great power move by us.

+1

That would be a great, almost dream scenario

Jackson

(08-20-2011 01:00 PM)cardshouse Wrote:  The whole problem is the Big East waits for other conferences to make the first move...We need 3 teams right now that are ready for the move...And they are all CUSA EAST teams. We are not gonna be able to take any other team from a BCS conference because we are not making as much money...So I guess we will wait for the new TV contract while the ACC gets ready to take 3 or 4 Big East North teams...Thats how it will go down if we just dream of getting a few Big 12 or ACC schools....

Not sure it would be in the Big East's best interest to move first.
Texas A&M is obviously disgruntaled and will certainly move. The question is who else does the SEC take. Does the SEC go for Missouri or ACC teams. There is also the possibility that the PAC 12 might go after some Big XII teams. Once this starts there may be opportunities for the Big East to scoop up teams that may get desperate, especially if it looks like their conference is going to implode. The Big XII looks like there is a strong possibility that they are going to implode.
If the ACC loses two or three teams to the SEC then the Big East could act and possibly get Maryland and possibly Boston College.

(08-20-2011 11:50 AM)adcorbett Wrote:  

(08-20-2011 11:34 AM)Cubanbull Wrote:  Mizzou,kansas and maryland would be a nice trio

West: TCU,Kansas,Missouri, Louisville, Cinncinati,USF
East: West Virginia,Rutgers,Maryland,UConn, Syracuse,Pitt

They could also go 14 and add BC in East and KST in West

The bad thing about that scenario is it seems to much old BE vs. New BE. On the flip side, the "East" teams should see an attendance spike since they will often play teams whose fans should be able to drive there.

Going to 14 would be too much unless you are adding a homerun type. Once you go past twelve, you more or less becoem two conferences and only play cross division opponents every few years, depending on the set up.

If a conference is willing to go to a 10-game schedule, 14 can work:

6 intra-division games
1 permanent interdivision rival game
3 interdivision games alternating annually

(08-20-2011 03:42 PM)uconnbaseball Wrote:  By the way, Kansas State isn't worthless. They have had success in football and have a nice basketball program. Their fanbase is local but rabid, similar to ECU (only larger).

The problem with K State is that they come as part of a 2-team package that includes KU. In addition, the state's biggest metro market (Kansas City, KS/MO) has pro teams.

Kansas is a state with a smaller population that CT. Does it really make sense to go after 2 teams to get a market that size with pro competition?

The biggest problem that the Big XII has had all along is that the small market states have to defer to Texas because those small markets don't bring much to the table. While KU is a national name in basketball & therefore has value beyond what it brings from Kansas, neither school's football has any national appeal.

If this is our time to pick a couple of schools then we MUST CHOOSE WISELY. We might be one of the 4 standing mega conferences and we should try to get schools that will be loyal through and through. We cannot have a school that might potentially look elsewhere because we have a hybrid + ND. They should also know that our conference won't ever be that "it" conference in football but we are by far the best conference in basketball.

Criteria for the 3 schools if we hold the line after the reshuffle...
1.) Emphasis on basketball but has a decent football program
2.) Strong football program
3.) Will not be one of the rumor schools thats been talked about moving to the SEC or Big10.

Each school thats been mention above has their pros and cons...

Kansas - I feel that they are the type of team that is in line with the Big East. Their fans love basketball and basketball will always be no.1. Their football is decent and at least has a chance to get into the BCS. Problem: Are they tie to the hip with KSU? Kansas says no but we shall see.

Maryland - Eastern school that has great success in basketball and decent in football. Imagine the rivalries between WVU and Georgetown. Problem: They've been linked to Big10 and big 10 may look into Maryland in the future, whether its 5 years or 10 years. They are also in love with the ACC and get to be associated with some of the finest schools in that area.

Boston College - aka Benedict College. Shook hands with Big East members and pledging their loyalty to Big East while scheming with the ACC. UConn doesn't want them back and will probably block BC from coming back. Advantage: Northeast school, aligns them with the catholic schools, decent basketball and football. Great tradition with Syracuse and UConn.

-------------

Our conference is probably the only conference where we do not have a "flagship football program" unlike the big 12 where Texas or OU pretty much rules that conference. For any school to come here, they will get a top flight basketball conference that is not top heavy unlike ACC where UNC and Duke rules the conference and brings in most of the revenue.

I think the perception around the nation is that we don't have a school that is consistently winning the Big east like Miami and VT did years ago and thats why many fans and media thinks we are crap which data and record shows that we have been a pretty good conference OVERALL.

So whoever we pick... I hope they aren't looking elsewhere in 5 years. I want this conference to be finally stable and everyone just STFU about our hybrid. Almost 10 years ago... people were whining and laughing about the size of our conference yet no one is laughing at SEC, Pac12, or big10 thinking about going to 16 damn football teams. So the nation can just look themselves in the mirror and STFU.

<rant over>

(08-21-2011 01:39 AM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  

(08-20-2011 03:42 PM)uconnbaseball Wrote:  By the way, Kansas State isn't worthless. They have had success in football and have a nice basketball program. Their fanbase is local but rabid, similar to ECU (only larger).

The problem with K State is that they come as part of a 2-team package that includes KU. In addition, the state's biggest metro market (Kansas City, KS/MO) has pro teams.

Kansas is a state with a smaller population that CT. Does it really make sense to go after 2 teams to get a market that size with pro competition?

The biggest problem that the Big XII has had all along is that the small market states have to defer to Texas because those small markets don't bring much to the table. While KU is a national name in basketball & therefore has value beyond what it brings from Kansas, neither school's football has any national appeal.

FYI...KU is located in suburb of Kansas City (31st largest TV market) so yes, a lot of KU's fan support (and some KSU support) is located just across the border in KC.

NOTE: KC is an interesting "town"...as the city is basically "split up" mostly between Mizzou and KU fans...with the other smaller share split up with KSU and Nebraska fans/alumni.

(08-20-2011 09:33 AM)CardinalJim Wrote:  

(08-20-2011 09:24 AM)KnightLight Wrote:  Confused...since when has a blog ever been dared to NOT run a silly rumor/scenario?

I thought thats why they were blogs...because anyone, anywhere could write/say anything they want...regardless if its true, strange, silly or outrageous.

Right on cue ......
A wannabe shows up to remind us how much better The ACC is then we are. It's a new day in The BIG East. CUSA programs need to apply over at The ACC. No room here.....
CJ

I will use a quote that CardinalJim used yesterday in another thread where someone disagreed with one of his posts:

I apologize if my opinion offended you. It was not my intention.

Its just sad that CJ has to continually bash another fan base (this time an entire conf) when someone offers up a different opinion than his own.

(08-21-2011 05:01 AM)thatsnotgrass Wrote:  If this is our time to pick a couple of schools then we MUST CHOOSE WISELY. We might be one of the 4 standing mega conferences and we should try to get schools that will be loyal through and through. We cannot have a school that might potentially look elsewhere because we have a hybrid + ND. They should also know that our conference won't ever be that "it" conference in football but we are by far the best conference in basketball.

Criteria for the 3 schools if we hold the line after the reshuffle...
1.) Emphasis on basketball but has a decent football program
2.) Strong football program
3.) Will not be one of the rumor schools thats been talked about moving to the SEC or Big10.

Each school thats been mention above has their pros and cons...

Kansas - I feel that they are the type of team that is in line with the Big East. Their fans love basketball and basketball will always be no.1. Their football is decent and at least has a chance to get into the BCS. Problem: Are they tie to the hip with KSU? Kansas says no but we shall see.

Maryland - Eastern school that has great success in basketball and decent in football. Imagine the rivalries between WVU and Georgetown. Problem: They've been linked to Big10 and big 10 may look into Maryland in the future, whether its 5 years or 10 years. They are also in love with the ACC and get to be associated with some of the finest schools in that area.

Boston College - aka Benedict College. Shook hands with Big East members and pledging their loyalty to Big East while scheming with the ACC. UConn doesn't want them back and will probably block BC from coming back. Advantage: Northeast school, aligns them with the catholic schools, decent basketball and football. Great tradition with Syracuse and UConn.

-------------

Our conference is probably the only conference where we do not have a "flagship football program" unlike the big 12 where Texas or OU pretty much rules that conference. For any school to come here, they will get a top flight basketball conference that is not top heavy unlike ACC where UNC and Duke rules the conference and brings in most of the revenue.

I think the perception around the nation is that we don't have a school that is consistently winning the Big east like Miami and VT did years ago and thats why many fans and media thinks we are crap which data and record shows that we have been a pretty good conference OVERALL.

So whoever we pick... I hope they aren't looking elsewhere in 5 years. I want this conference to be finally stable and everyone just STFU about our hybrid. Almost 10 years ago... people were whining and laughing about the size of our conference yet no one is laughing at SEC, Pac12, or big10 thinking about going to 16 damn football teams. So the nation can just look themselves in the mirror and STFU.

<rant over>

I suspect football may have a bit higher priority than basketball with the Big East conference office, after all the league is already the best in basketball.
One other criteria that would be important is market size. Specifically, when you consider the Big East TV Network is coming and they need to see this channel to cable subscribers. If market size is considered then: Maryland and Missouri will be up top targets. I am not sure how Boston College is considered in the Boston area. If they are deemed to be a plus then they may get invited.
Another intriguing possibility might be Virginia. Things would really have to go bad for the ACC for Virginia to be in play but who knows, especially if the SEC goes for 3 ACC teams and the Big East gets Maryland and Boston College then Virginia may be obliged to follow them to the Big East.
I like Kansas too as they have a good basketball program so they may be another possibility. Not sure whether KSU or ISU would be in the Big East's top choices.

(08-21-2011 07:19 AM)KnightLight Wrote:  I will use a quote that CardinalJim used yesterday in another thread where someone disagreed with one of his posts:

I apologize if my opinion offended you. It was not my intention.

Its just sad that CJ has to continually bash another fan base (this time an entire conf) when someone offers up a different opinion than his own.

It should be obvious to you by now but I will remind you again. This is THE BIG EAST board. If you don't want to see us bash another conference perhaps you should stay on The CUSA board. If you do decide to stay here perhaps you need to get a thicker skin. BTW thanks for the negative. What are you a child?
CJ

If the SEC does not want FSU due to overlapping markets, then I believe the BE should make a HUGE push and presentation to try to get FSU. I say the BE better think BIG if they think they smell blood in the water with the ACC due to Miami's pending demise. Here is who I hope the BE is trying to court right now:

Growth to 12
FSU
Clemson
GT

Growth to 14
FSU
Clemson
GT
VT
Virginia

In my growth to 14 scenario, I assume that VT and UVa are a pair. Why am I not enamored with the BigXII north schools? Simple, their demographics suck (shrinking population) and they are poor recruiting grounds (most try to sponge off the states of TX and LA).

(08-21-2011 01:30 AM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  

adcorbett dateline=' Wrote:  Once you go past twelve, you more or less becoem two conferences and only play cross division opponents every few years, depending on the set up.

If a conference is willing to go to a 10-game schedule, 14 can work:
6 intra-division games
1 permanent interdivision rival game
3 interdivision games alternating annually

You can make it work with nine games. Five intra divisional games, one permananent cross divisional rival, and 3 inter divisional games. Then you play everyone at least once every two years. You just skip one intra division game each year, which just means that you skip one division opponent once every six years. The only down side this is each year one team in each division can only play four division games which means they have an extra inter division game. Now that is not big deal since every conference is seede on conference record and not division record, but I can imagine the unbalance ruffling a few feathers.


The permanent rival is actually overrated and despite what people think, only one conference uses it (and it was done to protect one rivalry game). But it becomes useful in a division setup where you have an uneven number of teams per division to balance a schedule.

Temple discussion split out:

http://ncaabbs.com/showthread.php?tid=509393

Thanks, beej...

That's what I'm here for Bit RESPECT MY AUTHORIT-AH :cartman: