(10-22-2026 09:06 AM)Bear Catlett Wrote: I don’t see what the big issue is.
What’s the difference between a camera watching you and a cop sitting in a cruiser watching you except that the camera is ultimately cheaper.
Whenever something bad happens everyone wants the bad guys apprehended. It’s a heck of a lot easier with these cameras.
I’ll bet Savannah Guthrie wishes there were some flock cameras around her mom’s house.
Well... aside from it being the next logical step to the establishment of a nationwide mass surveillance state.
It's been abused by jealous cops to track their exes:
Quote:A police officer in Massachusetts is on leave after being accused of using the department's Flock camera system to track her ex-girlfriend, a restraining order revealed.
The restraining order request was filed by the ex-girlfriend of New Bedford police Officer Emily Pacheco.
It says Pacheco was harassing and stalking her after a breakup, noting, "there is an open (internal affairs) investigation of her running my license plate through Flock to follow me."
Flock cameras are mounted along public roads and take images of license plates and other vehicle characteristics for a database that is sold as a tool to help solve crimes.
It oftentimes makes mistakes leading to false arrests:
Quote:After driving three hours for a job in Lafayette, Indiana, Danny Brooks, an electrician, was hungry. So he stopped at a Chick-fil-A and ordered an original chicken sandwich with fries.
Brooks was seated in his white company pickup truck, about to chomp on a french fry in the Chick-fil-A parking lot, when he heard a loud, menacing shout.
“Turn off the vehicle!” a man hollered.
Brooks looked up, the fry dangling in his mouth, to see four Lafayette police officers surrounding his truck, their guns drawn.
“The very first thought was, ‘I’m going to die here today,’” recalled Brooks, a father of two college-age daughters. “My next feeling was, ‘I’m not going to be able to tell my daughters goodbye.’”
Officers handcuffed Brooks and placed him in the back of a police car. Then they told him the truck was reported stolen, prompting Brooks to call out that it was a commercial vehicle.
Only then did the officers realize they had the wrong man.
“I f-----g hate Flock,” one officer on the scene said, according to bodycam footage obtained by NBC News.
And people are worried that it will lead to private companies monitoring your movement. Not just law enforcement agencies tracking bad guys, but private companies monitoring everyday citizens.
Quote:Did you know that all those cameras you see on street corners in your neighborhood aren’t owned (and in some cases, aren’t monitored) by your local government or police department? Instead, the cameras are leased from and operated by Flock Safety, a private company. People in communities around the country are calling for the cameras to come down, so I asked Benn Jordan, a YouTuber who recently worked with security researchers and journalists at 404 Media to uncover vulnerabilities in those camera systems, about what the company and its cameras really do.
I was noticing the other day how heavily covered our area is by these Flock cameras. My local HEB grocery is just a 5 minute drive away----and I noted 11 Flock cameras just in that short drive---including one owned by our HOA covering the single entry/exit street for our subdivision. I'll admit to being of two minds on these things. I actually like the law and order aspect of them (just a few weeks ago a road rage murder was solved almost exclusively due to the evidence found on those cameras). On the other hand, Im not crazy about how much data regarding the where abouts and travels of law-abiding citizens is collected and stored---nor do I like how easy it seems to be for that data to be potentially misused.
(This post was last modified: 10-22-2026 11:43 AM by Attackcoog.)
(10-22-2026 11:40 AM)Attackcoog Wrote: I was noticing the other day how heavily covered our area is by these Flock cameras. My local HEB grocery is just a 5 minute drive away----and I noted 11 Flock cameras just in that short drive---including one owned by our HOA covering the single entry/exit street for our subdivision. I'll admit to being of two minds on these things. I actually like the law and order aspect of them (just a few weeks ago a road rage murder was apprehended almost exclusively due to the evidence found on those cameras). On the other hand, Im not crazy about how much data about the where abouts and travels of law-abiding citizens is collected and stored---nor do I like the fact that data can potentially be misused.
Law and order today -- maybe. We don't know that for sure. We see too many cases where LEO misuse the data.
(10-22-2026 08:59 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote: We finally found a topic Teddy and I can agree on.
Our county is 660 square miles and has 2 total traffic lights.
We have a dozen or so Flock cameras that went in over the past year. The subjects are not happy.
Flock doesn't charge the Sheriff for them so the county is saying they have no basis to remove them.
So I could go put up cameras in random places and collect unknown amounts of data?
Cool! What country is that?
How flock is getting around this is they use grants where it's all free to counties and municipalities. Once approved by officials, and approved before citizens are normally even aware, it's like pulling teeth to get them removed. It's normally the Sheriff's Dept. that pushes these through.
Lowes and now increasingly Home Depot is tied into the flock grid. They get you coming into and leaving the parking lots and when you use the self checkout with video.
(This post was last modified: 10-22-2026 12:25 PM by rath v2.0.)
And now Flock has a new partnership with a company that installs their devices on the flock mounts...it monitors and skins phone and watch data from every passing car and can match that up with what Flock gathers. Creepy AF.
(10-22-2026 09:06 AM)Bear Catlett Wrote: I don’t see what the big issue is.
What’s the difference between a camera watching you and a cop sitting in a cruiser watching you except that the camera is ultimately cheaper.
Whenever something bad happens everyone wants the bad guys apprehended. It’s a heck of a lot easier with these cameras.
I’ll bet Savannah Guthrie wishes there were some flock cameras around her mom’s house.
She sorta had one...they were in partnership with Ring. Remember last years creepy Super Bowl commercial? Ring is tied into flock so flock can help you find your lost dog?
Momma Guthrie disabled her ring service like a year earlier so it was no longer active and working...but they got the guy on her porch on video because Ring kept recording and storing locally on its own.
(10-22-2026 09:06 AM)Bear Catlett Wrote: I don’t see what the big issue is.
What’s the difference between a camera watching you and a cop sitting in a cruiser watching you except that the camera is ultimately cheaper.
Whenever something bad happens everyone wants the bad guys apprehended. It’s a heck of a lot easier with these cameras.
I’ll bet Savannah Guthrie wishes there were some flock cameras around her mom’s house.
She sorta had one...they were in partnership with Ring. Remember last years creepy Super Bowl commercial? Ring is tied into flock so flock can help you find your lost dog?
Momma Guthrie disabled her ring service like a year earlier so it was no longer active and working...but they got the guy on her porch on video because Ring kept recording and storing locally on its own.
Thats kinda one reason Im less concerned with Flock. There are already so many cameras on front doors, stores, automotive dash cams, and randoms using their phone cameras---that I just dont think anyone should have any real expectation of privacy once they leave their home. Additionally, we are all already carrying a smart phone that is probably the device most used (or should I say mis-used) to track your location, habits, and preferences in order to create a stored individual database allowing corporations to market to you. Soon, this individual data profile will be merged with your online habits (and any information corporations can scrape about your income) to introduce the wide spread use of "dynamic pricing". Dynamic pricing is a system by which your data profile will allow AI to determine how much you'd likely be willing to pay when setting the price for any item or service you are about to purchase. Under that system, the well heeled customer will see higher prices than lower income price sensitive budget shoppers. Point is, Flock is honestly unlikely to be the biggest real danger to your lifestyle and privacy----The biggest danger is more likely your phone (as well as your own on line profile).
(This post was last modified: 10-22-2026 01:00 PM by Attackcoog.)
Your government should not be filming you for the purpose of tracking movements. Likewise, your government should not be delegating that filming to a third-party who can keep that data forever to use for whatever purposes it once. It can build dossier on you. It can know when you go to work when you come home when you deviate from that pattern, who you travel with when you travel with them, when you home is not occupied, when your wife or kids are home without you...It's 1984 level stuff
Like the old saying goes:
Those who trade freedom for security deserve neither.
(This post was last modified: 10-22-2026 02:42 PM by rath v2.0.)
(10-22-2026 09:06 AM)Bear Catlett Wrote: I don’t see what the big issue is.
What’s the difference between a camera watching you and a cop sitting in a cruiser watching you except that the camera is ultimately cheaper.
Whenever something bad happens everyone wants the bad guys apprehended. It’s a heck of a lot easier with these cameras.
I’ll bet Savannah Guthrie wishes there were some flock cameras around her mom’s house.
Well... aside from it being the next logical step to the establishment of a nationwide mass surveillance state.
It's been abused by jealous cops to track their exes:
Quote:A police officer in Massachusetts is on leave after being accused of using the department's Flock camera system to track her ex-girlfriend, a restraining order revealed.
The restraining order request was filed by the ex-girlfriend of New Bedford police Officer Emily Pacheco.
It says Pacheco was harassing and stalking her after a breakup, noting, "there is an open (internal affairs) investigation of her running my license plate through Flock to follow me."
Flock cameras are mounted along public roads and take images of license plates and other vehicle characteristics for a database that is sold as a tool to help solve crimes.
It oftentimes makes mistakes leading to false arrests:
Quote:After driving three hours for a job in Lafayette, Indiana, Danny Brooks, an electrician, was hungry. So he stopped at a Chick-fil-A and ordered an original chicken sandwich with fries.
Brooks was seated in his white company pickup truck, about to chomp on a french fry in the Chick-fil-A parking lot, when he heard a loud, menacing shout.
“Turn off the vehicle!” a man hollered.
Brooks looked up, the fry dangling in his mouth, to see four Lafayette police officers surrounding his truck, their guns drawn.
“The very first thought was, ‘I’m going to die here today,’” recalled Brooks, a father of two college-age daughters. “My next feeling was, ‘I’m not going to be able to tell my daughters goodbye.’”
Officers handcuffed Brooks and placed him in the back of a police car. Then they told him the truck was reported stolen, prompting Brooks to call out that it was a commercial vehicle.
Only then did the officers realize they had the wrong man.
“I f-----g hate Flock,” one officer on the scene said, according to bodycam footage obtained by NBC News.
And people are worried that it will lead to private companies monitoring your movement. Not just law enforcement agencies tracking bad guys, but private companies monitoring everyday citizens.
Quote:Did you know that all those cameras you see on street corners in your neighborhood aren’t owned (and in some cases, aren’t monitored) by your local government or police department? Instead, the cameras are leased from and operated by Flock Safety, a private company. People in communities around the country are calling for the cameras to come down, so I asked Benn Jordan, a YouTuber who recently worked with security researchers and journalists at 404 Media to uncover vulnerabilities in those camera systems, about what the company and its cameras really do.
(10-22-2026 02:38 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote: Your government should not be filming you for the purpose of tracking movements. Likewise, your government should not be delegating that filming to a third-party who can keep that data forever to use for whatever purposes it once. It can build dossier on you. It can know when you go to work when you come home when you deviate from that pattern, who you travel with when you travel with them, when you home is not occupied, when your wife or kids are home without you...It's 1984 level stuff
Like the old saying goes:
Those who trade freedom for security deserve neither.
FWIW---It doesnt impact your freedom at all. It impacts your privacy---and Im not sure exactly what our rights of privacy are when we are in public---epspecially considering we are driving on publicly funded roads. Courts have ruled the spaces INSIDE your car still enjoy some privacy rights---but anything visible from outside your car has remained fair game to the best of my knowledge. Like I said, in my opinion---we already largely made that privacy trade when we started carrying cell phones with imbedded GPS everywhere we went. That GPS and cell tower data is stored. Just ask some of those charged on Jan6th how they were tracked down and identified.
(This post was last modified: 10-22-2026 05:38 PM by Attackcoog.)
(10-22-2026 09:06 AM)Bear Catlett Wrote: I don’t see what the big issue is.
What’s the difference between a camera watching you and a cop sitting in a cruiser watching you except that the camera is ultimately cheaper.
Whenever something bad happens everyone wants the bad guys apprehended. It’s a heck of a lot easier with these cameras.
I’ll bet Savannah Guthrie wishes there were some flock cameras around her mom’s house.
Well... aside from it being the next logical step to the establishment of a nationwide mass surveillance state.
It's been abused by jealous cops to track their exes:
Quote:A police officer in Massachusetts is on leave after being accused of using the department's Flock camera system to track her ex-girlfriend, a restraining order revealed.
The restraining order request was filed by the ex-girlfriend of New Bedford police Officer Emily Pacheco.
It says Pacheco was harassing and stalking her after a breakup, noting, "there is an open (internal affairs) investigation of her running my license plate through Flock to follow me."
Flock cameras are mounted along public roads and take images of license plates and other vehicle characteristics for a database that is sold as a tool to help solve crimes.
It oftentimes makes mistakes leading to false arrests:
Quote:After driving three hours for a job in Lafayette, Indiana, Danny Brooks, an electrician, was hungry. So he stopped at a Chick-fil-A and ordered an original chicken sandwich with fries.
Brooks was seated in his white company pickup truck, about to chomp on a french fry in the Chick-fil-A parking lot, when he heard a loud, menacing shout.
“Turn off the vehicle!” a man hollered.
Brooks looked up, the fry dangling in his mouth, to see four Lafayette police officers surrounding his truck, their guns drawn.
“The very first thought was, ‘I’m going to die here today,’” recalled Brooks, a father of two college-age daughters. “My next feeling was, ‘I’m not going to be able to tell my daughters goodbye.’”
Officers handcuffed Brooks and placed him in the back of a police car. Then they told him the truck was reported stolen, prompting Brooks to call out that it was a commercial vehicle.
Only then did the officers realize they had the wrong man.
“I f-----g hate Flock,” one officer on the scene said, according to bodycam footage obtained by NBC News.
And people are worried that it will lead to private companies monitoring your movement. Not just law enforcement agencies tracking bad guys, but private companies monitoring everyday citizens.
Quote:Did you know that all those cameras you see on street corners in your neighborhood aren’t owned (and in some cases, aren’t monitored) by your local government or police department? Instead, the cameras are leased from and operated by Flock Safety, a private company. People in communities around the country are calling for the cameras to come down, so I asked Benn Jordan, a YouTuber who recently worked with security researchers and journalists at 404 Media to uncover vulnerabilities in those camera systems, about what the company and its cameras really do.
Yet I’ll bet you’ve got a smartphone stuck in your pocket that tracks your every movement and listens to your conversations.
Exactly my point. Smart TV data is being stored and tracked too----and those smart devices like Alexa are always freaking listening. That said---while I do like the improved law enforcement aspect of a Flock camera network---I think there is the potential for real government abuse. Rather than rip them out----I think I'd prefer that the data become more secure and the ability to search the data needs to be more tightly restricted---for instance---maybe we need to get to the point that a search warrant is required to obtain the stored data.
(This post was last modified: 10-22-2026 05:45 PM by Attackcoog.)
(10-22-2026 02:38 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote: Your government should not be filming you for the purpose of tracking movements. Likewise, your government should not be delegating that filming to a third-party who can keep that data forever to use for whatever purposes it once. It can build dossier on you. It can know when you go to work when you come home when you deviate from that pattern, who you travel with when you travel with them, when you home is not occupied, when your wife or kids are home without you...It's 1984 level stuff
Like the old saying goes:
Those who trade freedom for security deserve neither.
FWIW---It doesnt impact your freedom at all. It impacts your privacy---and Im not sure exactly what our rights of privacy are when we are in public---epspecially considering we are driving on publicly funded roads. Courts have ruled the spaces INSIDE your car still enjoy some privacy rights---but anything visible from outside your car has remained fair game to the best of my knowledge. Like I said, in my opinion---we already largely made that privacy trade when we started carrying cell phones with imbedded GPS everywhere we went. That GPS and cell tower data is stored. Just ask some of those charged on Jan6th how they were tracked down and identified.
You need to bone up on constitutional law where governmental actors are concerned.
Freedom and privacy are often interchangeable when referenced in 1st, 4th and 14th amendment jurisprudence. Hard to have one without the other.
(This post was last modified: 10-22-2026 06:18 PM by rath v2.0.)
