(06-29-2026 10:08 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  The RNC pointed out one tiny issue I thought was going to be the killer argument, and one I couldnt disagree with. The RNC pointed out that *in person* ballot ended typically at some time in the evening (like typically 7 or 8 pm). Postmark rules allowed folks to vote *after* the time of the closure of the state mandated time of end of balloting.

I don't think that argument holds water. The post office does not stay open until after 7 or 8 pm to postmark ballots as far as I'm aware. So if you don't drop it in the postal box by last pickup time on election day...or at the postal office before they close for the day...it's not going to be postmarked on election day, so it's not going to get counted.

And one more thing, pretty sure every state law allows voters who are in line by polling location closing time to remain in line and vote. I remember in 2022 that both Michigan State University and the University of Michigan polls were open until around midnight due to long lines.

(06-29-2026 10:43 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-29-2026 10:08 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  The RNC pointed out one tiny issue I thought was going to be the killer argument, and one I couldnt disagree with. The RNC pointed out that *in person* ballot ended typically at some time in the evening (like typically 7 or 8 pm). Postmark rules allowed folks to vote *after* the time of the closure of the state mandated time of end of balloting.

I don't think that argument holds water. The post office does not stay open until after 7 or 8 pm to postmark ballots as far as I'm aware. So if you don't drop it in the postal box by last pickup time on election day...or at the postal office before they close for the day...it's not going to be postmarked on election day, so it's not going to get counted.

And one more thing, pretty sure every state law allows voters who are in line by polling location closing time to remain in line and vote. I remember in 2022 that both Michigan State University and the University of Michigan polls were open until around midnight due to long lines.

I've never paid attention for election day, but they have definitely stayed open and postmarked things for tax day before.

(06-29-2026 10:45 AM)mlb Wrote:  

(06-29-2026 10:43 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-29-2026 10:08 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  The RNC pointed out one tiny issue I thought was going to be the killer argument, and one I couldnt disagree with. The RNC pointed out that *in person* ballot ended typically at some time in the evening (like typically 7 or 8 pm). Postmark rules allowed folks to vote *after* the time of the closure of the state mandated time of end of balloting.

I don't think that argument holds water. The post office does not stay open until after 7 or 8 pm to postmark ballots as far as I'm aware. So if you don't drop it in the postal box by last pickup time on election day...or at the postal office before they close for the day...it's not going to be postmarked on election day, so it's not going to get counted.

And one more thing, pretty sure every state law allows voters who are in line by polling location closing time to remain in line and vote. I remember in 2022 that both Michigan State University and the University of Michigan polls were open until around midnight due to long lines.

I've never paid attention for election day, but they have definitely stayed open and postmarked things for tax day before.

Right, that's the only time I remember them doing this. You'd always see the report on the nightly news of mopes waiting until 11:59 to drop off their tax return.

EDIT: CoPilot says no state has post offices that stay open until midnight (or well beyond normal hours) on election day.

(06-29-2026 10:49 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-29-2026 10:45 AM)mlb Wrote:  

(06-29-2026 10:43 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-29-2026 10:08 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  The RNC pointed out one tiny issue I thought was going to be the killer argument, and one I couldnt disagree with. The RNC pointed out that *in person* ballot ended typically at some time in the evening (like typically 7 or 8 pm). Postmark rules allowed folks to vote *after* the time of the closure of the state mandated time of end of balloting.

I don't think that argument holds water. The post office does not stay open until after 7 or 8 pm to postmark ballots as far as I'm aware. So if you don't drop it in the postal box by last pickup time on election day...or at the postal office before they close for the day...it's not going to be postmarked on election day, so it's not going to get counted.

And one more thing, pretty sure every state law allows voters who are in line by polling location closing time to remain in line and vote. I remember in 2022 that both Michigan State University and the University of Michigan polls were open until around midnight due to long lines.

I've never paid attention for election day, but they have definitely stayed open and postmarked things for tax day before.

Right, that's the only time I remember them doing this. You'd always see the report on the nightly news of mopes waiting until 11:59 to drop off their tax return.

EDIT: CoPilot says no state has post offices that stay open until midnight (or well beyond normal hours) on election day.

Main postal centers and/or airport located facilities are open.

In a previous life, I had a docket that was fundamentally postmark driven. I can’t tell you the number of times I needed to do a “thunder run” to such a facility to get the before midnite postmark.

Another ‘get’ was to have a friend or professional colleague in Alaska to get a fax (afterwards an email) who would print the document and get it to *their* after hours drop to get a postmark.

That all changed with direct filing practice. Every now and then one might squeeze anywhere from 5 to 8 hours extra with time zone games and the existence of the open all the time postal hubs.

But those facilities still exist in every major metro area. I still have a list of them, but haven’t had to utilize them in close to 20 years.

But copilot is correct that *normal* post offices dont have that. I should have been clearer.

Edited to add: Could be those hub / centers have done away with the ‘always open’ thing that was very definitely existent 10 years ago. To be clear I didn’t verify. I don’t think so, bc 2 justices brought up that very issue on their own in the oral argument. Further mlb’s point makes it clear that PO *can* remain open after hours —- April 15 shows that that isnt precluded entirely.

That being said, still seems inherently unfair to allow possible voting in the timeframe between polls close and midnight.

Decision after decision goes in favor of Repubs...not a peep.

Decision goes in favor of Dems...the "Independents" are out in full force.

Independents….

(06-29-2026 12:43 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  That being said, still seems inherently unfair to allow possible voting in the timeframe between polls close and midnight.

Possible...maybe...but practical or actually even happening? Highly doubtful.

Further, the USPS doesn't put a time stamp on their postmark. Additionally, mail isn't necessarily all processed and postmarked on the date it's received. Often times votes dropped in blue boxes go to processing centers and don't even get postmarked by election day. Under current California law, those votes don't get counted even if mailed by election day.

So that further limits the guarantee that waiting until the last minute would even get you anywhere.

I can't see any rationale where a court could reasonably say someone trying to mail a vote after the polls close on election day would give them any sort of right not afforded every other voter.

(06-29-2026 01:18 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-29-2026 12:43 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  That being said, still seems inherently unfair to allow possible voting in the timeframe between polls close and midnight.

Possible...maybe...but practical or actually even happening? Highly doubtful.

Doesnt matter if practical or not. On one hand the state says 'no voting after 7pm'. The ability to get a vote in after that time is problematic in my view. Kind of a equal protection concern on one hand, or a hard issue that the state law has a problem.

If state law says polls close at 8pm, or 'dropboxes locked at 8pm', and at the same time leave the door open for further voting past that time with 'postmarks' -- that is an equal protection problem. You simply have some people entitled to vote later than others. Not good. That should be fatal to the issue. Unless polls are also open till midnite.

Quote:Further, the USPS doesn't put a time stamp on their postmark.

I didnt say it did. 12:00 am is day 1. And postmarked day 1. 11:59 pm is day 0. And postmarked day 0.

That difference of X hours is problematic.

Quote:Additionally, mail isn't necessarily all processed and postmarked on the date it's received. Often times votes dropped in blue boxes go to processing centers and don't even get postmarked by election day. Under current California law, those votes don't get counted even if mailed by election day.

So what. That isnt the issue being discussed between us. That is the proper manner.

When you drop it at the main hub, its postmarked right then and there. I.e., the *reason* *why* we did 'thunder runs' to Houston Intercontinental when in Houston, or Austin airport when in Austin. When you need the timestamp of that day.

Quote:So that further limits the guarantee that waiting until the last minute would even get you anywhere.

But there is an actual mechanism to get votes in *after* the polls close. It takes effort, but it exists. and that to me makes the 'if your timestamp shows day of' you are okay. There is an actual, solid mechanism to get votes in and be valid *after* the polls close.

Quote:I can't see any rationale where a court could reasonably say someone trying to mail a vote after the polls close on election day would give them any sort of right not afforded every other voter.

When it comes to a fundamental right, and violation of that right has to pass strict scrutiny. Im basing my comments on the meaning of the word 'voting' the case goes into for about 8 pages in the current case. In the issue, and in the way they parse the term 'voting' in the case (and that parsing is critical for the outcome) -- I think the issue of having state laws that bar otherwise valid votes in one path and allow potential later cast votes actually becomes fatal to the majorities scheme and foundation.

The *Way* that they came to the conclusion makes the ruling somewhat self-defeating, from my perspective.

Supreme Court upholds bans on transgender athletes in girls’ sports.

(06-30-2026 09:13 AM)UofMTigerTim Wrote:  Supreme Court upholds bans on transgender athletes in girls’ sports.

Good. Men don't belong in women's sports. (A woman is a human who was born with XX chromosomes, FYI.)

Supreme Court upholds birthright citizenship.

Congratulations Justice Roberts, you've created the next modern day Roe v Wade

Congress can do nothing about citizenship and now the court will be more politicized as a result

Well done sir

The “Independents” are back to celebrate the destruction of our once great country.

I'm very concerned about the campaign financing ruling... I'm ready to remove all donations to political candidates, parties, and PACs and have everyone get the same amount of money from the federal government. Too many political favors are owed after every election anymore.

(06-30-2026 09:45 AM)UofMTigerTim Wrote:  Supreme Court upholds birthright citizenship.

Very, very disappointed in Roberts and Barrett. There is just no way you can find anything in the law to support tourism citizenship. I figured they would stick with precendent and ignore intent on the illegals. But there are just so many problems with birthright tourism. They aren't residents. They aren't under our jurisdiction.

I was expecting the EO being overturned and putting the burden on Congress to change it

This ruling prevents Congress from doing anything about it and set the impossible bar of amendment as the only way to get change

This is exactly what the Court did for abortion and Roe v Wade and it was disastrous

When the Court makes political change impossible, nothing good arises

(06-30-2026 09:45 AM)UofMTigerTim Wrote:  Supreme Court upholds birthright citizenship.

Disaster.

(06-30-2026 09:13 AM)UofMTigerTim Wrote:  Supreme Court upholds bans on transgender athletes in girls’ sports.

Common sense prevails!

(06-30-2026 10:41 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(06-30-2026 09:45 AM)UofMTigerTim Wrote:  Supreme Court upholds birthright citizenship.

Very, very disappointed in Roberts and Barrett. There is just no way you can find anything in the law to support tourism citizenship. I figured they would stick with precendent and ignore intent on the illegals. But there are just so many problems with birthright tourism. They aren't residents. They aren't under our jurisdiction.

I am guessing they ruled the way they did because of the pandoras box that would be opened with a reversal. Can you imagine having to try and retroactively enforce an overturning of the birthright citizenship? I personally don't like the decision and feel the original intent was only for children born of slaves. But after over 100 years allowing birthright citizenship it doesn't surprise me, they didn't overturn it. This puts more of a spotlight (if that is possible) on illegal immigration. Congress needs to address anchors babies somehow, but I am sure they won't.

(06-30-2026 10:46 AM)b2b Wrote:  

(06-30-2026 09:45 AM)UofMTigerTim Wrote:  Supreme Court upholds birthright citizenship.

Disaster.

Well, it's in the fourteenth amendment of the Constitution, so it being upheld was more or less a foregone conclusion. Only way to change it is to amend the Constitution.