(04-25-2023 04:18 PM)Attackcoog Wrote: (04-25-2023 03:49 PM)tanqtonic Wrote: (04-25-2023 03:27 PM)Was SoMs Eagle Wrote: (04-25-2023 03:00 PM)tanqtonic Wrote: (04-25-2023 02:43 PM)Was SoMs Eagle Wrote: Funny how many of those pesky conspiracy theories have morphed into truth.
I’ll take JRs vigilance over Tanqs apologetic eyes wide shut every day.
As long as government is run by man there will be errors and outright abuse. I can handle errors. I have no patience with abuse. These democrats abuse power right and left and their minions are OK with it. Trump saw abuse and made errors in judgment at the end. I’ll take the errors going forward. To hell with the abuse.
I have zero problem castigating wrong actions.
Democrats no doubt abuse power.
But do not try to smooth over 'trying to subvert the procedure for counting and certifying electors for President and trying to get himself *declared* President by violating the law and Constitution' as an 'error in judgement' at the same stroke.
How do you morph trying to get himself *declared* President by fiat (as opposed to a vote of state certified electors) as anything *but* abuse of power?
Because the electors were arguably illegally elected.
I can point to several lawsuits by Trump pre- and post- election that cry that same thing. And without exception, the state courts tossed them.
On top of it, every state, without exception, certified the results sent to Congress for 1/6 certification and counting.
Please do tell how those are 'illegal'?
Quote: The state legislatures did not change the voting laws.
Again, every state, without exception, certified the results sent to Congress for 1/6 certification and counting.
Quote: Other officials not mentioned in the constitution arbitrarily changed voting laws. So my question to you is who actually DID defy the constitution.
The determination of the state electors is a matter for each state. Period. Every state, without exception, certified the results sent to Congress for 1/6 certification and counting.
The Constitution mandates that the Congress count each of the *states'* results. Nothing more, nothing less.
Please name every state where a final court decree has determined that "Other officials not mentioned in the constitution arbitrarily changed voting laws". I look forward to your list.
Exactly. Trump made his legal and political case for the election being fraudulent and when time ran out to overturn the election---he vacated the White House and Biden took over (just as it has occurred in every prior disputed election).
And in distinction to every transition, tried to vacate and short circuit the ECA, the counting, and the certification. That is, tried to act like the certification and counting was an act he could preempt by fiat.
A somewhat interesting distinction. One that doesnt seem to really make any pathway in your 'analysis' above, mind you.
Quote:I fail to see why you continue to throw yourself on the ground in a "Im Big MAD" tantrum
Stating facts is a "Big Mad"? Got it. Lolz. Good grief.....
Quote:over what amounted to using whatever legal and political levers he had to dispute an election he believed was fraudulent.
Problem is that short circuiting the certification and having himself declared President by fiat doesnt seem to fit in the legal levers of this country. In fact, it seems blatantly illegal, and blatantly unconstitutional.
Please do tell where you think a legal basis resides for declaring broad swaths of electors invalid simply by decree for purposes of a Presidential election? This could be *really* finig fascinating to hear.... Not even considering that the person who wrote this groundwork conceded that there wasnt any basis in the law and that it would lose 9-0 in the SCOTUS.....
I *would* agree with you if, that when the court cases all got waxed, Trump said 'okey dokey, even SCOTUS (in the Texas v. Pennsylvania case) hasnt found my way, Im out of here', Trump packed it up and scotched, he had every right to put it that far. But that isnt the case. He actually tried to short circuit the law itself -- actively tried to create a Constitutional crisis like this country has *never* seen, to get himself 'decreed' President by fiat. I draw the line with that being horribly overboard.
Quote:In the end, he availed himself to every legal and political avenue possible to dispute the election and then acceded to every legal and political decision that was made by the judicial and constitutional power structures in place.
Actually he tried the Eastman plan *after* losing every fing lawsuit. From that perspective, he really didnt 'accede' to the judicial or constitutional power structures -- he pulled that crap *in spite* of him losing at every fing step. But please, try some more of that 'excuse juice' that comes so easily.
Quote:Its no different that Bush-Gore----except the courts back then werent scared to death and looking for ways to avoid having to make a decision in the dispute.
Funny, I saw 50+ courts that made a ruling. And I saw a President so engrained in personal power that he tried to *circumvent* not just 50+ courts, but tried to have himself declared President *in spite* of a certification process.
Quote: Back then, the courts understood thier role, and came up with a reasonable solution that put the results under a microscope that everyone could see----allowing people to have complete confidence that the election results would be handled with complete transparency. Instead, in 2020, it felt more like the courts just wanted to not be stuck in the middle of it all and were hoping to run out the clock so it could just be over.
Did you read any of the rulings? Or are you just making up your feelings on them without doing that?
Congrats on the pro level effort to edit out the 'bad bits' that dont fall your way, though.
