https://journalnow.com/sports/college/q-...db5ca.html

Karl Benson's thoughts on the realignment landscape in the G5. Karl is a former MAC, WAC and Sun Belt commissioner.

Appy State is the school Benson suggests by name for the American

So we're listening to realignment advice from Karl Benson without mentioning that his strategy for the WAC pretty much burned the conference to the ground?

(09-19-2021 11:33 PM)Wedge Wrote:  So we're listening to realignment advice from Karl Benson without mentioning that his strategy for the WAC pretty much burned the conference to the ground?

And also set the Sun Belt Conference up for the success it is currently experiencing now (Not that I necessarily disagree on the WAC part though). But both experiences definitely give him a unique perspective into the college sports realignment landscape.

(09-19-2021 05:16 PM)No Bull Wrote:  Appy State is the school Benson suggests by name for the American

It’s an interview with a Winston-Salem newspaper though so he’s going to mention the home team.

(09-19-2021 05:16 PM)No Bull Wrote:  Appy State is the school Benson suggests by name for the American

It’s not really an institutional fit—but out of all the potential G5 eastern replacements—it’s the team that’s most likely to draw casual fan interest if it’s given a bigger stage. That said, if Aresco can pull MW teams as replacements—that’s by far the better route to take.

(09-19-2021 11:33 PM)Wedge Wrote:  So we're listening to realignment advice from Karl Benson without mentioning that his strategy for the WAC pretty much burned the conference to the ground?

I’m not a fan of Benson but to be fair, the WAC-16 wasn’t his idea. He became WAC commissioner right after the decision to expand to 16 was made in 1994.

(09-20-2021 07:51 AM)Cruhawk Wrote:  

(09-19-2021 11:33 PM)Wedge Wrote:  So we're listening to realignment advice from Karl Benson without mentioning that his strategy for the WAC pretty much burned the conference to the ground?

And also set the Sun Belt Conference up for the success it is currently experiencing now (Not that I necessarily disagree on the WAC part though). But both experiences definitely give him a unique perspective into the college sports realignment landscape.

I don't know that I would credit him for much of the SBC success. The SBC lost a bunch of programs last go round (some good, some awful) and added strong FCS teams. Benson was part of the reasons the programs left in the first place. The SBC at the time had bad media payouts and awful bowl tie-ins. The SBC is in a much better place now, but I attribute that more to the member programs than Benson.

Before we totally trash Benson, let’s remember that there was a logic behind the BYU deal but it was predicated upon the WAC schools sticking together. I think Benson thought he could pull off reunification of the WAC and MWC under the the WAC banner.

Quad 1: LA Tech, TCU, NMSU, New Mexico
Quad 2: AFA, Colorado St, Wyoming, Utah St
Quad 3: Boise, Idaho, UNLV, Nevada
Quad 4: San Jose St, Fresno St, San Diego St, Hawaii
+non-fb BYU

(09-20-2021 10:18 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Before we totally trash Benson, let’s remember that there was a logic behind the BYU deal but it was predicated upon the WAC schools sticking together. I think Benson thought he could pull off reunification of the WAC and MWC under the the WAC banner.

Quad 1: LA Tech, TCU, NMSU, New Mexico
Quad 2: AFA, Colorado St, Wyoming, Utah St
Quad 3: Boise, Idaho, UNLV, Nevada
Quad 4: San Jose St, Fresno St, San Diego St, Hawaii
+non-fb BYU

TCU was going to be a part of all this? This was before Big East and Big 12 invites?

(09-20-2021 10:18 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Before we totally trash Benson, let’s remember that there was a logic behind the BYU deal but it was predicated upon the WAC schools sticking together. I think Benson thought he could pull off reunification of the WAC and MWC under the the WAC banner.

Quad 1: LA Tech, TCU, NMSU, New Mexico
Quad 2: AFA, Colorado St, Wyoming, Utah St
Quad 3: Boise, Idaho, UNLV, Nevada
Quad 4: San Jose St, Fresno St, San Diego St, Hawaii
+non-fb BYU

We're the Rose Bowl champs and #2 in the Final AP poll and we're stuck with that??!! That's the very reason we should start totally trashing Benson. He was our hero in 1998, but definitely the villain in 2010.

(09-20-2021 10:51 AM)Scoochpooch1 Wrote:  

(09-20-2021 10:18 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Before we totally trash Benson, let’s remember that there was a logic behind the BYU deal but it was predicated upon the WAC schools sticking together. I think Benson thought he could pull off reunification of the WAC and MWC under the the WAC banner.

Quad 1: LA Tech, TCU, NMSU, New Mexico
Quad 2: AFA, Colorado St, Wyoming, Utah St
Quad 3: Boise, Idaho, UNLV, Nevada
Quad 4: San Jose St, Fresno St, San Diego St, Hawaii
+non-fb BYU

TCU was going to be a part of all this? This was before Big East and Big 12 invites?

I don’t think the TCU to the Big East announcement had happened yet when Benson was trying to lure in BYU. Had Benson pulled off this merger and then lost TCU, they could have always pushed out LA Tech and settled at a 14 fb/15 Olympic set up.

(09-20-2021 09:36 AM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  

(09-19-2021 11:33 PM)Wedge Wrote:  So we're listening to realignment advice from Karl Benson without mentioning that his strategy for the WAC pretty much burned the conference to the ground?

I’m not a fan of Benson but to be fair, the WAC-16 wasn’t his idea. He became WAC commissioner right after the decision to expand to 16 was made in 1994.

I'm not referring to the WAC-16. I'm referring to Benson's scheme to give BYU a "Notre Dame deal" in the WAC while also recruiting SDSU and UNLV to switch from the MWC to the WAC. That fiasco is why the WAC is no longer an FBS conference.

(09-20-2021 10:58 AM)Wedge Wrote:  I'm not referring to the WAC-16. I'm referring to Benson's scheme to give BYU a "Notre Dame deal" in the WAC while also recruiting SDSU and UNLV to switch from the MWC to the WAC. That fiasco is why the WAC is no longer an FBS conference.

It was a gamble. But I remember being surprised at the MWC's response. In cannibalizing the WAC, they destroyed a natural scheduling peer for OOC games & bowls.

The MWC would have been fine without those schools. The Front Range schools are solid institutions with a history of sticking together. They also had Boise & TCU, the best G5 brands in the west. The latter could have been a tent pole in a TX wing, maybe even blocking Big East expansion into TX.

Time will tell if App spent their money wisely on this piece.

(09-20-2021 12:42 PM)ManleyPointer Wrote:  

(09-20-2021 10:58 AM)Wedge Wrote:  I'm not referring to the WAC-16. I'm referring to Benson's scheme to give BYU a "Notre Dame deal" in the WAC while also recruiting SDSU and UNLV to switch from the MWC to the WAC. That fiasco is why the WAC is no longer an FBS conference.

It was a gamble. But I remember being surprised at the MWC's response. In cannibalizing the WAC, they destroyed a natural scheduling peer for OOC games & bowls.

The MWC would have been fine without those schools. The Front Range schools are solid institutions with a history of sticking together. They also had Boise & TCU, the best G5 brands in the west. The latter could have been a tent pole in a TX wing, maybe even blocking Big East expansion into TX.

Looks like CSU and AFA are about to disprove the bolded statement.

Benson pitched SDSU on moving to the WAC to be together with Fresno, and pitched UNLV on being together with Nevada. SDSU and UNLV told Thompson about the contact from the WAC, Thompson presumably told the MWC presidents they could put those schools together in the MWC instead of the WAC, so they did. I don't think that's a surprising response.

(09-19-2021 11:33 PM)Wedge Wrote:  So we're listening to realignment advice from Karl Benson without mentioning that his strategy for the WAC pretty much burned the conference to the ground?

The move to 16 took place before he took the job. His attempt to squeeze MWC by taking BYU non-football blew up.

[i]Edit saw your later reply[/i]

His attempt to go into Texas and NOT TAKE Idaho blew up.

He had the chance to kill Sun Belt by taking UNT, Louisiana, AState, and MTSU and said no and tried to get UNT only and when they said no went to UL and they said no so got stuck taking Idaho.

The way Georgia State was added nearly broke up the Sun Belt because he had convinced the presidents to give an expansion committee binding authority to add teams touting the need to move fast chasing UTSA and La.Tech, they got neither and added Georgia State without a full vote. They probably still get in but the manner created a lot of anger.

(09-20-2021 09:59 AM)freshtop Wrote:  

(09-20-2021 07:51 AM)Cruhawk Wrote:  

(09-19-2021 11:33 PM)Wedge Wrote:  So we're listening to realignment advice from Karl Benson without mentioning that his strategy for the WAC pretty much burned the conference to the ground?

And also set the Sun Belt Conference up for the success it is currently experiencing now (Not that I necessarily disagree on the WAC part though). But both experiences definitely give him a unique perspective into the college sports realignment landscape.

I don't know that I would credit him for much of the SBC success. The SBC lost a bunch of programs last go round (some good, some awful) and added strong FCS teams. Benson was part of the reasons the programs left in the first place. The SBC at the time had bad media payouts and awful bowl tie-ins. The SBC is in a much better place now, but I attribute that more to the member programs than Benson.

You reminded me of another example.

Sun Belt wanted a 10th football team. Benson arranged for EKU and Liberty to make presentations. The western teams were 100% opposed and said if those are the choices let’s add NMSU back.

The App president asked to table expansion consideration. Called up Coastal Carolina and they expressed tentative interest. App got AState involved and the two schools looked at the campus and facilities, told Coastal what they felt they’d need to be competitive. Coastal concluded those expenses were feasible and agreed to join even though their long-range plan had them waiting another ten years prior to considering FBS.

Coastal applied and was admitted with full support from the western teams because they balanced the league mostly and had a history of success across multiple sports. One good thunderstorm and their CWS championship would have come their first day in Sun Belt.

(09-20-2021 12:57 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(09-20-2021 12:42 PM)ManleyPointer Wrote:  

(09-20-2021 10:58 AM)Wedge Wrote:  I'm not referring to the WAC-16. I'm referring to Benson's scheme to give BYU a "Notre Dame deal" in the WAC while also recruiting SDSU and UNLV to switch from the MWC to the WAC. That fiasco is why the WAC is no longer an FBS conference.

It was a gamble. But I remember being surprised at the MWC's response. In cannibalizing the WAC, they destroyed a natural scheduling peer for OOC games & bowls.

The MWC would have been fine without those schools. The Front Range schools are solid institutions with a history of sticking together. They also had Boise & TCU, the best G5 brands in the west. The latter could have been a tent pole in a TX wing, maybe even blocking Big East expansion into TX.

Looks like CSU and AFA are about to disprove the bolded statement.

Benson pitched SDSU on moving to the WAC to be together with Fresno, and pitched UNLV on being together with Nevada. SDSU and UNLV told Thompson about the contact from the WAC, Thompson presumably told the MWC presidents they could put those schools together in the MWC instead of the WAC, so they did. I don't think that's a surprising response.

I agree. Travel to AAC west isn’t outrageous from the AFA/CSU perspective and AFA has previously stated quite plainly that they are opposed to the current MWC TV revenue sharing model and want one more in align with the idea, the MWC is a partnership with 12 equal partners.

Enhancing attention on AFA vs Navy doesn’t hurt AFA’s thinking about leaving either.

(09-20-2021 01:17 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  

(09-20-2021 09:59 AM)freshtop Wrote:  

(09-20-2021 07:51 AM)Cruhawk Wrote:  

(09-19-2021 11:33 PM)Wedge Wrote:  So we're listening to realignment advice from Karl Benson without mentioning that his strategy for the WAC pretty much burned the conference to the ground?

And also set the Sun Belt Conference up for the success it is currently experiencing now (Not that I necessarily disagree on the WAC part though). But both experiences definitely give him a unique perspective into the college sports realignment landscape.

I don't know that I would credit him for much of the SBC success. The SBC lost a bunch of programs last go round (some good, some awful) and added strong FCS teams. Benson was part of the reasons the programs left in the first place. The SBC at the time had bad media payouts and awful bowl tie-ins. The SBC is in a much better place now, but I attribute that more to the member programs than Benson.

You reminded me of another example.

Sun Belt wanted a 10th football team. Benson arranged for EKU and Liberty to make presentations. The western teams were 100% opposed and said if those are the choices let’s add NMSU back.

The App president asked to table expansion consideration. Called up Coastal Carolina and they expressed tentative interest. App got AState involved and the two schools looked at the campus and facilities, told Coastal what they felt they’d need to be competitive. Coastal concluded those expenses were feasible and agreed to join even though their long-range plan had them waiting another ten years prior to considering FBS.

Coastal applied and was admitted with full support from the western teams because they balanced the league mostly and had a history of success across multiple sports. One good thunderstorm and their CWS championship would have come their first day in Sun Belt.

Some schools stink at the wrong time (e.g. Southern Miss at the formation of the AAC) and some school achieve unfathomable success at the right time (e.g. Coastal Carolina winning the CWS).