this thing may not be over.
Just read a story where the Pac12 may reconsider..and offer expansion bids to TCU and Houston.

https://www-frogsowar-com.cdn.ampproject...-after-all


"In other news, realignment might not be done yet, as Mac Engel of the Fort Worth Star Telegram reported that TCU and Houston are on the Pac 12’s radar — and could be extended invited to join the conference prior to the media rights deal is renegotiated before 2023.

(09-14-2021 01:05 PM)EarthBoundMisfit Wrote:  this thing may not be over.
Just read a story where the Pac12 may reconsider..and offer expansion bids to TCU and Houston.

https://www-frogsowar-com.cdn.ampproject...-after-all


"In other news, realignment might not be done yet, as Mac Engel of the Fort Worth Star Telegram reported that TCU and Houston are on the Pac 12’s radar — and could be extended invited to join the conference prior to the media rights deal is renegotiated before 2023.

Is that a fan blog.

(09-11-2021 12:00 AM)Seabee TIger Fan Wrote:  There are some really plausible scenarios that show that OUT playing football in the SEC this time next year.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.hookem....5423240001

If the 2022 scenario plays out, it sets in motion some potential big money moves. I don’t think Disney/ESPN cares too much about viewership on the west coast. The time slots/ eyeballs on TV sets aren’t worth the squeeze.

ESPN is on the hook for 160M for the soon to be defunct TLH, they have a vested interest to get UT into their locked in deal. https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/sec-...ghts-cbs/. It’s worth it to them to speed things along.

With the B12 tv deal probably becoming void with OUT leaving and the new additions coming in, and ESPN cutting the legs from the AAC on their deal, it stands to reason that we could be playing in the B12 by 2024 with exclusive rights to ESPN/ Disney.

But I thought this was all about tv market size?

/sarcasm

Money, contracts, and eyeballs.

What would be really nice is if we had A) a state legislature that gave a damn about us B) lobby type efforts (meetings) with Espn/Disney.

That’s where the real decisions are being made.

(09-14-2021 01:12 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(09-14-2021 01:05 PM)EarthBoundMisfit Wrote:  this thing may not be over.
Just read a story where the Pac12 may reconsider..and offer expansion bids to TCU and Houston.

https://www-frogsowar-com.cdn.ampproject...-after-all


"In other news, realignment might not be done yet, as Mac Engel of the Fort Worth Star Telegram reported that TCU and Houston are on the Pac 12’s radar — and could be extended invited to join the conference prior to the media rights deal is renegotiated before 2023.

Is that a fan blog.

I'll be honest...I do not know. It looks like an official TCU site over at SBNation

(09-14-2021 12:40 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(09-11-2021 08:00 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(09-11-2021 07:26 AM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(09-11-2021 06:25 AM)MemTigers1998 Wrote:  Who is “we” that could be playing in the big 12? Memphis got passed over again, and while lots of media people are saying the Tigers & Boise are next, 2-3 years is just enough time for USF to get their ish together, begin the process of their OCS and become decent on field so that they’d become a “travel partner” for UCF. I realize there’s no other option for us in a P5. It’s big 12 or nothing, but they’ve now passed us over twice. Hard to trust those people.

USF has floundered since taking a step down in the sports world. The football program has been awful. With UCF the Florida box is checked. B12 teams already recruit there so no advantage. The tv market is so fragmented and USF has virtual no identity and a small fan base.

The best thing for Memphis is for OUT to cut a deal to leave early so B12 can get on with their being the best version of the new them. They are losing their bell cows and there is still the chance they will lose more teams. As Dennis Dowd put it, there are few resumes left to consider that check the boxes.

Memphis is doing the right things but maybe try to aggressively grow student enrollment at any cost. Keep investing in the campus footprint. Fans keep the faith and keep showing up. Small pockets and deep pockets need to step. BB can help carry the National Image. The city needs to address some image issues.

Stop playing the victim and embracing the Debbie Downer approach to life.
We have a lot of positives and need to embrace the successes and the things that make Memphis and the Tigers unique instead of apologizing for who we are.

Agree, but it's not Debbie downer to realize a lot can happen in 2-3 yrs to change the landscape. In FL, USF will be working the legislature to put pressure on B-12 member, UCF, to sponsor & push USF for membership. USF will have their OCS underway, the Tampa Bay area market is 4x the size of the Memphis market & USF academics blow us away - all provide excuses or serve to justify to move USF over Memphis. Remember the BE chose USF when they were nothing. Rutgers was nothing (still is) when the B1G chose them. In the meantime we'll get no help from our state legislature. So we can't sit on our accomplishments & we can't wait for someone else to help us (other B-12 members). And BTW, spend $50M on the Liberty Bowl and its still the Liberty Bowl & is still a municipal property that outsiders, the evaluators still believe is old & dilapidated - and still owned by the city. Whether Memphians know & like the LB is not material. The fact that it is only 1.5 miles from campus means very little. Our university must have the mindset we are behind & have to move forward dramatically, unless we want to risk being left behind.....AGAIN!

When did OCS become so important...

You yourself just stated that USF was picked ahead of many people who already had OCS when the Big East expanded.

If the reason we don't get an invite is because our stadium is 3 miles down the road than the people making the decisions are idiots.

Academics...Sure.
TV Markets...Sure.
Geography...Sure.

Markets barely matter in the age of streaming. This isn’t 1956.

Fanbases (dedicated eyeballs) matter. Quality and potential to create matchups that drive casual fans to watch games matter.

Stop perpetuating this myth folks. The Designated Market Area (Neilson term) ranking of Austin Texas is 40! South bend Indiana doesn’t even rank.

If it was 20 years ago when most games were televised on local affiliates, this would be really important but it’s not.

(09-14-2021 01:28 PM)TGTiger Wrote:  

(09-14-2021 12:40 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(09-11-2021 08:00 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(09-11-2021 07:26 AM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(09-11-2021 06:25 AM)MemTigers1998 Wrote:  Who is “we” that could be playing in the big 12? Memphis got passed over again, and while lots of media people are saying the Tigers & Boise are next, 2-3 years is just enough time for USF to get their ish together, begin the process of their OCS and become decent on field so that they’d become a “travel partner” for UCF. I realize there’s no other option for us in a P5. It’s big 12 or nothing, but they’ve now passed us over twice. Hard to trust those people.

USF has floundered since taking a step down in the sports world. The football program has been awful. With UCF the Florida box is checked. B12 teams already recruit there so no advantage. The tv market is so fragmented and USF has virtual no identity and a small fan base.

The best thing for Memphis is for OUT to cut a deal to leave early so B12 can get on with their being the best version of the new them. They are losing their bell cows and there is still the chance they will lose more teams. As Dennis Dowd put it, there are few resumes left to consider that check the boxes.

Memphis is doing the right things but maybe try to aggressively grow student enrollment at any cost. Keep investing in the campus footprint. Fans keep the faith and keep showing up. Small pockets and deep pockets need to step. BB can help carry the National Image. The city needs to address some image issues.

Stop playing the victim and embracing the Debbie Downer approach to life.
We have a lot of positives and need to embrace the successes and the things that make Memphis and the Tigers unique instead of apologizing for who we are.

Agree, but it's not Debbie downer to realize a lot can happen in 2-3 yrs to change the landscape. In FL, USF will be working the legislature to put pressure on B-12 member, UCF, to sponsor & push USF for membership. USF will have their OCS underway, the Tampa Bay area market is 4x the size of the Memphis market & USF academics blow us away - all provide excuses or serve to justify to move USF over Memphis. Remember the BE chose USF when they were nothing. Rutgers was nothing (still is) when the B1G chose them. In the meantime we'll get no help from our state legislature. So we can't sit on our accomplishments & we can't wait for someone else to help us (other B-12 members). And BTW, spend $50M on the Liberty Bowl and its still the Liberty Bowl & is still a municipal property that outsiders, the evaluators still believe is old & dilapidated - and still owned by the city. Whether Memphians know & like the LB is not material. The fact that it is only 1.5 miles from campus means very little. Our university must have the mindset we are behind & have to move forward dramatically, unless we want to risk being left behind.....AGAIN!

When did OCS become so important...

You yourself just stated that USF was picked ahead of many people who already had OCS when the Big East expanded.

If the reason we don't get an invite is because our stadium is 3 miles down the road than the people making the decisions are idiots.

Academics...Sure.
TV Markets...Sure.
Geography...Sure.

Markets barely matter in the age of streaming. This isn’t 1956.

Fanbases (dedicated eyeballs) matter. Quality and potential to create matchups that drive casual fans to watch games matter.

Stop perpetuating this myth folks. The Designated Market Area (Neilson term) ranking of Austin Texas is 40! South bend Indiana doesn’t even rank.

If it was 20 years ago when most games were televised on local affiliates, this would be really important but it’s not.

I guess it is important if you have a large number of casual fans in that market. You know the I am a Texas fan but Houston is my 2nd team because I live here type of fans.

And if it doesn't matter why were 3 of the teams picked from 3 of the larger markets and the fourth has a dedicated national fanbase.

Of course performance matters...But market is also a huge factor as well.

Market size matter because cable companies can wedge in more sales of networks

Rutgers to the Big Ten didn’t bring many eyes, but it brought a lot of automatic cable sales of the Big Ten Network

The Big 12 was the only major without a network, allowing the Longhorn Network
And now they will clearly look to create one

And there are a lot of cable subscribers in Houston which will soon be paying small fees for the Big 12 Network, even if not so many of them watch

(09-14-2021 11:35 PM)Mimi Wrote:  Market size matter because cable companies can wedge in more sales of networks

Rutgers to the Big Ten didn’t bring many eyes, but it brought a lot of automatic cable sales of the Big Ten Network

The Big 12 was the only major without a network, allowing the Longhorn Network
And now they will clearly look to create one

And there are a lot of cable subscribers in Houston which will soon be paying small fees for the Big 12 Network, even if not so many of them watch

Cable will be a thing of the past within a decade. The TV networks know this. They did NOT know it when Rutgers went to the Big10.

(09-11-2021 03:07 AM)Alanda Wrote:  To me right now it seems like the only thing that might speed up the process would be OUT not wanting to be in the conference with the new additions. And unless those four could get in earlier, I think in that scenario OUT would wait as long as possible to lower those exit fees. I could be wrong, but I also don't see ESPN helping that much to speed up the process.

I'm pretty sure that almost every school that has switched conferences since the whole realignment circus started ended up cutting a deal and leaving their old conference earlier than the the contractual end date.

Market size has never mattered much compared to fans who watch the game. In basketball, we have a huge number of casual fans all over the country that never went to the University of Memphis, but grew up around these here parts as Tiger fans. They will miss games during a Tubby season, but when we hit the top 25 they are all watching. That is just not true for many other programs.

(09-15-2021 11:12 AM)cmt Wrote:  Market size has never mattered much compared to fans who watch the game. In basketball, we have a huge number of casual fans all over the country that never went to the University of Memphis, but grew up around these here parts as Tiger fans. They will miss games during a Tubby season, but when we hit the top 25 they are all watching. That is just not true for many other programs.

It matters because of bundled cable TV packages which subscribers pay for whether they use it or not
Even while cable is waning due to streaming it still matters
Streaming bundles will similarly include things like conference networks

(09-14-2021 12:40 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  Academics...Sure.
TV Markets...Sure.
Geography...Sure.

These are the factors that made us the #4/#5 tweener with Houston. They have advantages in those three, just went to a Final Four, and were on a roll in football from the end of C-USA to about 2016. My biggest hope was the Texas factor would hurt them.

There's no shame in losing out to any of those four, and hopefully space opens up for us. We have to keep improving and an OCS would be quite a pleasant surprise, but expansion was in no way a damning indictment of where we are.

(09-14-2021 11:53 PM)geosnooker2000 Wrote:  

(09-14-2021 11:35 PM)Mimi Wrote:  Market size matter because cable companies can wedge in more sales of networks

Rutgers to the Big Ten didn’t bring many eyes, but it brought a lot of automatic cable sales of the Big Ten Network

The Big 12 was the only major without a network, allowing the Longhorn Network
And now they will clearly look to create one

And there are a lot of cable subscribers in Houston which will soon be paying small fees for the Big 12 Network, even if not so many of them watch

Cable will be a thing of the past within a decade. The TV networks know this. They did NOT know it when Rutgers went to the Big10.

I thought that, too. But I thought it a few years ago.

So I guess I need a definition of "cable".

Quote:How many cable companies are there in the US? There are 450 cable internet service providers in the United States as of 2020. The largest provider in terms of coverage area is XFINITY from Comcast with availability in 40 states and an availability footprint covering 111,564,376 people.

Cable Internet Providers in the US - BroadbandNow.com

Are Hulu, Sling, YTTV, etc considered "cable"?

(09-14-2021 12:07 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  

(09-11-2021 07:26 AM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(09-11-2021 06:25 AM)MemTigers1998 Wrote:  Who is “we” that could be playing in the big 12? Memphis got passed over again, and while lots of media people are saying the Tigers & Boise are next, 2-3 years is just enough time for USF to get their ish together, begin the process of their OCS and become decent on field so that they’d become a “travel partner” for UCF. I realize there’s no other option for us in a P5. It’s big 12 or nothing, but they’ve now passed us over twice. Hard to trust those people.

USF has floundered since taking a step down in the sports world. The football program has been awful. With UCF the Florida box is checked. B12 teams already recruit there so no advantage. The tv market is so fragmented and USF has virtual no identity and a small fan base.

The best thing for Memphis is for OUT to cut a deal to leave early so B12 can get on with their being the best version of the new them. They are losing their bell cows and there is still the chance they will lose more teams. As Dennis Dowd put it, there are few resumes left to consider that check the boxes.

Memphis is doing the right things but maybe try to aggressively grow student enrollment at any cost. Keep investing in the campus footprint. Fans keep the faith and keep showing up. Small pockets and deep pockets need to step. BB can help carry the National Image. The city needs to address some image issues.

Stop playing the victim and embracing the Debbie Downer approach to life.
We have a lot of positives and need to embrace the successes and the things that make Memphis and the Tigers unique instead of apologizing for who we are.

It also might help if the PAC-12 revisits expansion and takes TCU and Houston.

Makes more sense for them to take TTech and OkSt.

(09-15-2021 01:55 PM)Psicosis Wrote:  

(09-14-2021 12:40 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  Academics...Sure.
TV Markets...Sure.
Geography...Sure.

These are the factors that made us the #4/#5 tweener with Houston. They have advantages in those three, just went to a Final Four, and were on a roll in football from the end of C-USA to about 2016. My biggest hope was the Texas factor would hurt them.

There's no shame in losing out to any of those four, and hopefully space opens up for us. We have to keep improving and an OCS would be quite a pleasant surprise, but expansion was in no way a damning indictment of where we are.

But you forget, they cooged it!

(09-15-2021 11:22 AM)Mimi Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 11:12 AM)cmt Wrote:  Market size has never mattered much compared to fans who watch the game. In basketball, we have a huge number of casual fans all over the country that never went to the University of Memphis, but grew up around these here parts as Tiger fans. They will miss games during a Tubby season, but when we hit the top 25 they are all watching. That is just not true for many other programs.

It matters because of bundled cable TV packages which subscribers pay for whether they use it or not
Even while cable is waning due to streaming it still matters
Streaming bundles will similarly include things like conference networks

Cable is dead. Cable companies make more off of being ISPs than they do off of cable.

You’re thinking in the past.

(09-14-2021 03:42 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(09-14-2021 01:28 PM)TGTiger Wrote:  

(09-14-2021 12:40 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(09-11-2021 08:00 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(09-11-2021 07:26 AM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  USF has floundered since taking a step down in the sports world. The football program has been awful. With UCF the Florida box is checked. B12 teams already recruit there so no advantage. The tv market is so fragmented and USF has virtual no identity and a small fan base.

The best thing for Memphis is for OUT to cut a deal to leave early so B12 can get on with their being the best version of the new them. They are losing their bell cows and there is still the chance they will lose more teams. As Dennis Dowd put it, there are few resumes left to consider that check the boxes.

Memphis is doing the right things but maybe try to aggressively grow student enrollment at any cost. Keep investing in the campus footprint. Fans keep the faith and keep showing up. Small pockets and deep pockets need to step. BB can help carry the National Image. The city needs to address some image issues.

Stop playing the victim and embracing the Debbie Downer approach to life.
We have a lot of positives and need to embrace the successes and the things that make Memphis and the Tigers unique instead of apologizing for who we are.

Agree, but it's not Debbie downer to realize a lot can happen in 2-3 yrs to change the landscape. In FL, USF will be working the legislature to put pressure on B-12 member, UCF, to sponsor & push USF for membership. USF will have their OCS underway, the Tampa Bay area market is 4x the size of the Memphis market & USF academics blow us away - all provide excuses or serve to justify to move USF over Memphis. Remember the BE chose USF when they were nothing. Rutgers was nothing (still is) when the B1G chose them. In the meantime we'll get no help from our state legislature. So we can't sit on our accomplishments & we can't wait for someone else to help us (other B-12 members). And BTW, spend $50M on the Liberty Bowl and its still the Liberty Bowl & is still a municipal property that outsiders, the evaluators still believe is old & dilapidated - and still owned by the city. Whether Memphians know & like the LB is not material. The fact that it is only 1.5 miles from campus means very little. Our university must have the mindset we are behind & have to move forward dramatically, unless we want to risk being left behind.....AGAIN!

When did OCS become so important...

You yourself just stated that USF was picked ahead of many people who already had OCS when the Big East expanded.

If the reason we don't get an invite is because our stadium is 3 miles down the road than the people making the decisions are idiots.

Academics...Sure.
TV Markets...Sure.
Geography...Sure.

Markets barely matter in the age of streaming. This isn’t 1956.

Fanbases (dedicated eyeballs) matter. Quality and potential to create matchups that drive casual fans to watch games matter.

Stop perpetuating this myth folks. The Designated Market Area (Neilson term) ranking of Austin Texas is 40! South bend Indiana doesn’t even rank.

If it was 20 years ago when most games were televised on local affiliates, this would be really important but it’s not.

I guess it is important if you have a large number of casual fans in that market. You know the I am a Texas fan but Houston is my 2nd team because I live here type of fans.

And if it doesn't matter why were 3 of the teams picked from 3 of the larger markets and the fourth has a dedicated national fanbase.

Of course performance matters...But market is also a huge factor as well.

Casual fans do matter but people are thinking about markets in terms of “getting eyeballs to sets.” People do not consume tv in the same way anymore.

(09-15-2021 03:01 PM)TGTiger Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 11:22 AM)Mimi Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 11:12 AM)cmt Wrote:  Market size has never mattered much compared to fans who watch the game. In basketball, we have a huge number of casual fans all over the country that never went to the University of Memphis, but grew up around these here parts as Tiger fans. They will miss games during a Tubby season, but when we hit the top 25 they are all watching. That is just not true for many other programs.

It matters because of bundled cable TV packages which subscribers pay for whether they use it or not
Even while cable is waning due to streaming it still matters
Streaming bundles will similarly include things like conference networks

Cable is dead. Cable companies make more off of being ISPs than they do off of cable.

You’re thinking in the past.

Cable is dying. It's not dead. It's still where the billion dollar deals are coming from. The fact that it is dying is why sports garner so much money from them in an attempt to hang on to their relevance for another half decade.

(09-15-2021 04:16 PM)Psicosis Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 03:01 PM)TGTiger Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 11:22 AM)Mimi Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 11:12 AM)cmt Wrote:  Market size has never mattered much compared to fans who watch the game. In basketball, we have a huge number of casual fans all over the country that never went to the University of Memphis, but grew up around these here parts as Tiger fans. They will miss games during a Tubby season, but when we hit the top 25 they are all watching. That is just not true for many other programs.

It matters because of bundled cable TV packages which subscribers pay for whether they use it or not
Even while cable is waning due to streaming it still matters
Streaming bundles will similarly include things like conference networks

Cable is dead. Cable companies make more off of being ISPs than they do off of cable.

You’re thinking in the past.

Cable is dying. It's not dead. It's still where the billion dollar deals are coming from. The fact that it is dying is why sports garner so much money from them in an attempt to hang on to their relevance for another half decade.

The billion dollar deals don’t come from cable. You know better than that.

(09-15-2021 04:16 PM)Psicosis Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 03:01 PM)TGTiger Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 11:22 AM)Mimi Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 11:12 AM)cmt Wrote:  Market size has never mattered much compared to fans who watch the game. In basketball, we have a huge number of casual fans all over the country that never went to the University of Memphis, but grew up around these here parts as Tiger fans. They will miss games during a Tubby season, but when we hit the top 25 they are all watching. That is just not true for many other programs.

It matters because of bundled cable TV packages which subscribers pay for whether they use it or not
Even while cable is waning due to streaming it still matters
Streaming bundles will similarly include things like conference networks

Cable is dead. Cable companies make more off of being ISPs than they do off of cable.

You’re thinking in the past.

Cable is dying. It's not dead. It's still where the billion dollar deals are coming from. The fact that it is dying is why sports garner so much money from them in an attempt to hang on to their relevance for another half decade.

Correct

But even as it loses share to streaming, the same bundling applies to that, so markets still matter whether the percentage of the population who watch the team is high or not

In Houston and buying cable OR a streaming package that includes sports (the future), Big 12 network which I imagine is coming soon will be a part of that