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Has anyone read where any UC players came out against the firing and defended Brannen?

(04-12-2021 12:18 PM)uchoops Wrote:  Has anyone read where any UC players came out against the firing and defended Brannen?

Even Chris Vogt didn't even send out a thank you or well wishes (publicly at least)...that was the one guy I figured would.

(04-12-2021 12:49 PM)BearcatMan Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 12:18 PM)uchoops Wrote:  Has anyone read where any UC players came out against the firing and defended Brannen?

Even Chris Vogt didn't even send out a thank you or well wishes (publicly at least)...that was the one guy I figured would.

Vogt apparently enjoyed the abuse so much, he followed it to Clifton and then came back for more after exploring pro options.

(04-12-2021 12:18 PM)uchoops Wrote:  Has anyone read where any UC players came out against the firing and defended Brannen?

Zero. Not even guys who were here in 2019-20’.

Now on the other hand the list that think the guy is a jerk....

(04-12-2021 01:32 PM)Dont tase me bro Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 12:49 PM)BearcatMan Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 12:18 PM)uchoops Wrote:  Has anyone read where any UC players came out against the firing and defended Brannen?

Even Chris Vogt didn't even send out a thank you or well wishes (publicly at least)...that was the one guy I figured would.

Vogt apparently enjoyed the abuse so much, he followed it to Clifton and then came back for more after exploring pro options.

Not a single player or assistant coach from what I've seen have backed Brannen whatsoever is definitely a horrible look for him, but I'm wondering if they were told to stay hush/hush from one side (whether UC or Brannen) or both in case it goes to courts and to just stay out of it for now. Who knows though maybe he was that bad? Vogt definitely didn't seem nearly as happy as last year. That could be due to his own play dropping off though. IDK. It's not really comparable, but the amount of former/current players/parents that stood up for Urby at OSU was insane. Then again he won a Natty, but even Ezequiel Elliot's dad went to campus while his son was on the Cowboys protesting or whatever they were all doing.

I just don't like that lawyer even if he is good at his job. Again like others have mentioned probably just because he appears to be so political and not on a side I agree with very often. He seems to know where the easy money is at in current day landscape though, but everything about him including the pic just look like typical bill board type of lawyer. Also, CLF tweet was BS unless approved by coach and I would never believe it unless it came out of CLF or or former CJB mouth to confirm it was real and approved.

Martin getting a couple of the guys in the portal to come back and then et the WVU starter who’s in the portal to come here would be a great start.

(04-12-2021 10:47 AM)Former Lurker Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 10:14 AM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 08:53 AM)levydl Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 08:40 AM)skylinecat Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 08:21 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  I've been pretty open minded about Brannen most his time here.

I said throughout the season there was a lack of talent in the upper class and the key to his success would be developing (and keeping) the talent in place he brought here. I wasn't calling for his head. I thought he might work out.

Even as a weird amount of players were leaving midseason over his first 2 years I shrugged it off saying it could be the circumstances he inherited and COVID.

The biggest red flag came when Mike Saunders wanted out. That was a kid he'd known forever. If he was bailing, there could be an issue. The mass exodus quickly followed.

Even then my position was, yea this is weird, it could be something and UC needs to be talking to all the players and interviewing Brannen for his job, but it could still just be kids who never had a real college experience hitting reset.

Then the school announced its investigation. I was hoping it wasn't just an attempt to trump up allegations. I was worried about that.

Then we heard reports from players regarding the environment in practice and medical staff having to step in. That was troubling. It gave me some indication maybe there was something more to it.

But really the thing that has pushed me toward my current position that I think the university is handling this correctly and has a pretty good case is how the parties have carried themselves. UC has taken strategic steps, without saying a ton. As an outsider they seem confident they have enough and that they needed to remove Brannen. Brannen and his attorney seem desperate and are just throwing anything they can out there. I could be wrong, but I think the university has taken the steps it should have taken and is in a good position with regard to Brannen's buyout.

Maybe facts will come out that change my mind. I haven't been set at any point and have moved as I've learned and observed more. I could be wrong, but that's where I am.

Brannen and or his lawyer releasing the text message about Fickell and apparently basing their case off who he was reporting to sealed the deal for me that UC was probably in a pretty good spot. I know there is more than one way to skin a cat but if you choose to go the media about a case, you better come with some serious juice and I just don't see that from them.

Mars saying that Cunningham wanted to fire Brannen to hire a more high-profile coach was also odd, given that the chances of that happening seem fairly low.

The early favorite from what I've read and heard was Miller who would qualify as more high profile (and uniquely affordable thanks to IU). From what I've heard and connecting the dots a bit, Miller is losing or has lost interest in the job based upon the answers Cunningham has given him about the job. So we're moving on to a new round of guys who aren't going to demand a lot financially (not that that makes them bad coaches).

Can you elaborate about these "answers"?

A small-time mentality does not surprise me, but I think we'd all like to hear the gory details.

Not really. Like I said it is more connecting the dots. Miller went from top of our board but supposedly having a lot of questions/concerns about the job on his end (I have some guesses about who and/or what but no proof) to apparently not a factor.

(04-12-2021 10:52 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 10:19 AM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 09:01 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Brannen should heed caution to the wind on litigating this matter. The most UC has to lose is money-- they have plenty of that

You cost yourself your credibility right there...

Meh... the athletic department may have budgetary issues, but there are other revenue streams and collateral sources the university has its disposal. If at the end of the day they have to pay a judgment to John it will not break them at all.

Sure. They can sign the big contract with our new highly in demand basketball coach in the new permanent FB practice structure. Wait, the new coach is coming on the cheap and there are no plans for the practice structure? Well maybe they can sign it in the Monster Factory (anybody heard the latest on that fiasco? You'll love it!).

Sarcasm aside, we're cutting varsity sports already. The Athletic Department is clearly hurting financially and that started before this whole Brannen mess.

(04-12-2021 08:53 AM)levydl Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 08:40 AM)skylinecat Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 08:21 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  I've been pretty open minded about Brannen most his time here.

I said throughout the season there was a lack of talent in the upper class and the key to his success would be developing (and keeping) the talent in place he brought here. I wasn't calling for his head. I thought he might work out.

Even as a weird amount of players were leaving midseason over his first 2 years I shrugged it off saying it could be the circumstances he inherited and COVID.

The biggest red flag came when Mike Saunders wanted out. That was a kid he'd known forever. If he was bailing, there could be an issue. The mass exodus quickly followed.

Even then my position was, yea this is weird, it could be something and UC needs to be talking to all the players and interviewing Brannen for his job, but it could still just be kids who never had a real college experience hitting reset.

Then the school announced its investigation. I was hoping it wasn't just an attempt to trump up allegations. I was worried about that.

Then we heard reports from players regarding the environment in practice and medical staff having to step in. That was troubling. It gave me some indication maybe there was something more to it.

But really the thing that has pushed me toward my current position that I think the university is handling this correctly and has a pretty good case is how the parties have carried themselves. UC has taken strategic steps, without saying a ton. As an outsider they seem confident they have enough and that they needed to remove Brannen. Brannen and his attorney seem desperate and are just throwing anything they can out there. I could be wrong, but I think the university has taken the steps it should have taken and is in a good position with regard to Brannen's buyout.

Maybe facts will come out that change my mind. I haven't been set at any point and have moved as I've learned and observed more. I could be wrong, but that's where I am.

Brannen and or his lawyer releasing the text message about Fickell and apparently basing their case off who he was reporting to sealed the deal for me that UC was probably in a pretty good spot. I know there is more than one way to skin a cat but if you choose to go the media about a case, you better come with some serious juice and I just don't see that from them.

Mars saying that Cunningham wanted to fire Brannen to hire a more high-profile coach was also odd, given that the chances of that happening seem fairly low.

Admittedly this is speculation, but there must have been a reason that the fairly high profile Miller jumped to the front of nearly all the UC hot lists from experts and insiders. Martin's profile nationally isn't much, but locally it is probably highest of all the candidates especially if you consider him and NVE as a tandem. Or Mars could simply be wrong about that.

(04-12-2021 02:19 PM)natibeast21 Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 01:32 PM)Dont tase me bro Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 12:49 PM)BearcatMan Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 12:18 PM)uchoops Wrote:  Has anyone read where any UC players came out against the firing and defended Brannen?

Even Chris Vogt didn't even send out a thank you or well wishes (publicly at least)...that was the one guy I figured would.

Vogt apparently enjoyed the abuse so much, he followed it to Clifton and then came back for more after exploring pro options.

Not a single player or assistant coach from what I've seen have backed Brannen whatsoever is definitely a horrible look for him...

I don't think you've been following this saga very closely. It's behind the Athletic paywall, but the title speaks for itself:

"David DeJulius speaks out on his support for coach John Brannen, commitment to Cincinnati basketball"

It's interesting that he's the one player on the team who's experienced first hand how it works at another major program iirc.

(04-12-2021 04:55 PM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 02:19 PM)natibeast21 Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 01:32 PM)Dont tase me bro Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 12:49 PM)BearcatMan Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 12:18 PM)uchoops Wrote:  Has anyone read where any UC players came out against the firing and defended Brannen?

Even Chris Vogt didn't even send out a thank you or well wishes (publicly at least)...that was the one guy I figured would.

Vogt apparently enjoyed the abuse so much, he followed it to Clifton and then came back for more after exploring pro options.

Not a single player or assistant coach from what I've seen have backed Brannen whatsoever is definitely a horrible look for him...

I don't think you've been following this saga very closely. It's behind the Athletic paywall, but the title speaks for itself:

"David DeJulius speaks out on his support for coach John Brannen, commitment to Cincinnati basketball"

It's interesting that he's the one player on the team who's experienced first hand how it works at another major program iirc.

Thanks I like to be informed and will admit when wrong. That’s why I noted “I” haven’t seen.

He’s also one that opted out due to mental health and then back in so that is very odd to me.

(04-12-2021 02:19 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 12:18 PM)uchoops Wrote:  Has anyone read where any UC players came out against the firing and defended Brannen?

Zero. Not even guys who were here in 2019-20’.

Now on the other hand the list that think the guy is a jerk....

Best I can tell, no player has said anything of consequence pro or con since the actual firing.

In the course of the saga, we have seen a player or more make anonymous accusations in the press, but we obviously don't know exactly who said what. With the one exception of DeJulius, the guy who's actually experienced firsthand how things work at another major basketball program and he expressed strong support for Brannen.

Why am I not surprised that he apparently wasn't contacted as part of the AD's totally legit investigation?

(04-12-2021 05:01 PM)natibeast21 Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 04:55 PM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 02:19 PM)natibeast21 Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 01:32 PM)Dont tase me bro Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 12:49 PM)BearcatMan Wrote:  Even Chris Vogt didn't even send out a thank you or well wishes (publicly at least)...that was the one guy I figured would.

Vogt apparently enjoyed the abuse so much, he followed it to Clifton and then came back for more after exploring pro options.

Not a single player or assistant coach from what I've seen have backed Brannen whatsoever is definitely a horrible look for him...

I don't think you've been following this saga very closely. It's behind the Athletic paywall, but the title speaks for itself:

"David DeJulius speaks out on his support for coach John Brannen, commitment to Cincinnati basketball"

It's interesting that he's the one player on the team who's experienced first hand how it works at another major program iirc.

Thanks I like to be informed and will admit when wrong. That’s why I noted “I” haven’t seen.

He’s also one that opted out due to mental health and then back in so that is very odd to me.

I'm with you there. This whole season has been very odd to me as well. I have no doubt that's exponentially true for both the players and coaches.

(04-12-2021 05:03 PM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 02:19 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 12:18 PM)uchoops Wrote:  Has anyone read where any UC players came out against the firing and defended Brannen?

Zero. Not even guys who were here in 2019-20’.

Now on the other hand the list that think the guy is a jerk....

Best I can tell, no player has said anything of consequence pro or con since the actual firing.

In the course of the saga, we have seen a player or more make anonymous accusations in the press, but we obviously don't know exactly who said what. With the one exception of DeJulius, the guy who's actually experienced firsthand how things work at another major basketball program and he expressed strong support for Brannen.

Why am I not surprised that he apparently wasn't contacted as part of the AD's totally legit investigation?

Jarron and sorolla both made negative comments about CJB

(04-12-2021 05:11 PM)Lurkercat Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 05:03 PM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 02:19 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 12:18 PM)uchoops Wrote:  Has anyone read where any UC players came out against the firing and defended Brannen?

Zero. Not even guys who were here in 2019-20’.

Now on the other hand the list that think the guy is a jerk....

Best I can tell, no player has said anything of consequence pro or con since the actual firing.

In the course of the saga, we have seen a player or more make anonymous accusations in the press, but we obviously don't know exactly who said what. With the one exception of DeJulius, the guy who's actually experienced firsthand how things work at another major basketball program and he expressed strong support for Brannen.

Why am I not surprised that he apparently wasn't contacted as part of the AD's totally legit investigation?

Jarron and sorolla both made negative comments about CJB

Since the firing (per OP's conditions)? I do vaguely recall them making very short tweets at one point, but I thought that was before the firing and not really consequential, especially to the main issue of "cause". But I'm open to hearing whatever they said if you've got it.

(04-12-2021 04:44 PM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 08:53 AM)levydl Wrote:  Mars saying that Cunningham wanted to fire Brannen to hire a more high-profile coach was also odd, given that the chances of that happening seem fairly low.

Admittedly this is speculation, but there must have been a reason that the fairly high profile Miller jumped to the front of nearly all the UC hot lists from experts and insiders. Martin's profile nationally isn't much, but locally it is probably highest of all the candidates especially if you consider him and NVE as a tandem. Or Mars could simply be wrong about that part.

Well it's his argument why the for-cause firing is pretext. If it has already fallen apart, that seems bad for him.

I guess Archie is at least arguably high-profile; there was a lot of publicity about how IU paid him $10 mil. to go away. Experts and insiders may have thought Miller was the likely pick, but it felt like a risky strategy for Mars to bet on that. I guess he could try to argue that Erik Martin is high-profile within the Cincinnati community. Cunningham just had to have him! When you see the opportunity to hand over a program with 4 players to a career assistant no one else was trying to hire, you make up a reason to fire the coach and you jump on it!

(04-12-2021 05:23 PM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 05:11 PM)Lurkercat Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 05:03 PM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 02:19 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 12:18 PM)uchoops Wrote:  Has anyone read where any UC players came out against the firing and defended Brannen?

Zero. Not even guys who were here in 2019-20’.

Now on the other hand the list that think the guy is a jerk....

Best I can tell, no player has said anything of consequence pro or con since the actual firing.

In the course of the saga, we have seen a player or more make anonymous accusations in the press, but we obviously don't know exactly who said what. With the one exception of DeJulius, the guy who's actually experienced firsthand how things work at another major basketball program and he expressed strong support for Brannen.

Why am I not surprised that he apparently wasn't contacted as part of the AD's totally legit investigation?

Jarron and sorolla both made negative comments about CJB

Since the firing (per OP's conditions)? I do vaguely recall them making very short tweets at one point, but I thought that was before the firing and not really consequential, especially to the main issue of "cause". But I'm open to hearing whatever they said if you've got it.

No, you're right. They're just little jabs at cjb. I misunderstood what you meant - I haven't heard any players provide any more info on the reasons brannen was fired

(04-12-2021 05:29 PM)levydl Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 04:44 PM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

(04-12-2021 08:53 AM)levydl Wrote:  Mars saying that Cunningham wanted to fire Brannen to hire a more high-profile coach was also odd, given that the chances of that happening seem fairly low.

Admittedly this is speculation, but there must have been a reason that the fairly high profile Miller jumped to the front of nearly all the UC hot lists from experts and insiders. Martin's profile nationally isn't much, but locally it is probably highest of all the candidates especially if you consider him and NVE as a tandem. Or Mars could simply be wrong about that part.

Well it's his argument why the for-cause firing is pretext. If it has already fallen apart, that seems bad for him.

I guess Archie is at least arguably high-profile; there was a lot of publicity about how IU paid him $10 mil. to go away. Experts and insiders may have thought Miller was the likely pick, but it felt like a risky strategy for Mars to bet on that. I guess he could try to argue that Erik Martin is high-profile within the Cincinnati community. Cunningham just had to have him! When you see the opportunity to hand over a program with 4 players to a career assistant no one else was trying to hire, you make up a reason to fire the coach and you jump on it!

Well, as I think we agree, it depends upon how you define "high profile" but it arguably applies to what seem to have been the top two candidates perhaps from the beginning. Even if it somehow falls through with Martin as it seems to have with Miller, it actually seems one of those two was the intent. Regardless I don't think the central legal issues are predicated around whoever the new coach is.

(04-13-2021 01:13 PM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

I hope he does wish UC basketball well. But the actions of his legal team last week speak otherwise. He is young enough that if stops the bs, settles, and pays his dues again another coaching job will be there.