"Rachel Maddow does the math" - I thought we had to listen to scientists?

Also, what are we doing sheltering in place then if the boogeyman has to come anyways?

6million dead? We're only at 201K. We still have a loooooong ways to go

No way that the fatality rate is 3%. Maddow is smoking crack.

Maddow and MSNBC apparently didn't see the CNN guy get slammed for this same thing.

CNN slammed over COVID claim

Doesn't surprise me -- they're so darn efficient in these MSM propaganda factories.. they're cranking out stories and don't have time to apply reason &/or logic.

(09-17-2020 02:48 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  Maddow and MSNBC apparently didn't see the CNN guy get slammed for this same thing.

CNN slammed over COVID claim

Doesn't surprise me -- they're so darn efficient in these MSM propaganda factories.. they're cranking out stories and don't have time to apply reason &/or logic.

You speak as if their intentions were ever to apply reason and/or logic. They sense Nov slipping away and this is what we will continue to see. MSM has no reason to think its followers will think for themselves.

Hmmm. Interesting assumptions and talking points, er, statistics. What if you postulate a much more accurate 'presumed case' infection rate to come up with a more accurate denominator than "confirmed cases"? You know, like the CDC does for influenza and other tracked viruses and diseases.

And, what would be the more accurate estimated mortality rates for the various U.S. age demographics? Would there be a way to set policies to better protect those demographics that are most vulnerable?

Quote:Currently, the U.S. has a case fatality rate of about 3%, based on 187,000 deaths and 6.2 million infections; however, the infection fatality rate is likely lower since most asymptomatic infections probably aren't detected. The CDC uses 0.65% in its pandemic planning scenarios.

The Cost of Herd Immunity in the U.S.

This is likely where they got their number from.

Regardless, if we stopped all mandates, etc. and just went back to pre-Covid normal, millions would more than likely die. Not to mention our health care system would be overrun.

Why does everything have to be a "policy"?

The Harris admin has already said they want to try to mandate masks. O.k., and what do you do if someone forgets the mask in the car? Leaves it at home? Gonna start locking people up? That'd make sense while we're releasing rapists and murderers. A fat ticket perhaps? Ok, good plan. Got people that haven't worked in 6 months and on the dole, let's just pinch them further.

Forget a "policy" solution to this. We know who it affects- the old and infirm. Diabetics, heart disease, COPD, survivors of other maladies. Those people just need to take good of themselves. Stay out of crowds, wash up, wear your mask and change or wash it frequently, don't go around anyone sick as best you can.

If you are sick, stay home. It's typically about 10 days to 2 weeks. Do everyone a favor and stay the eff home. Government can't solve this and we are being foolish hoping or relying on government to do so.

(09-17-2020 02:52 PM)VA49er Wrote:  

(09-17-2020 02:48 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  Maddow and MSNBC apparently didn't see the CNN guy get slammed for this same thing.

CNN slammed over COVID claim

Doesn't surprise me -- they're so darn efficient in these MSM propaganda factories.. they're cranking out stories and don't have time to apply reason &/or logic.

You speak as if their intentions were ever to apply reason and/or logic. They sense Nov slipping away and this is what we will continue to see. MSM has no reason to think its followers will think for themselves.

I'm sorry for the ambiguity. I know better than that and would never intentionally imply the left even had an inkling of an idea as to what reasoning or logic are.

(09-17-2020 02:58 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

Quote:Currently, the U.S. has a case fatality rate of about 3%, based on 187,000 deaths and 6.2 million infections; however, the infection fatality rate is likely lower since most asymptomatic infections probably aren't detected. The CDC uses 0.65% in its pandemic planning scenarios.

The Cost of Herd Immunity in the U.S.

This is likely where they got their number from.

Regardless, if we stopped all mandates, etc. and just went back to pre-Covid normal, millions would more than likely die. Not to mention our health care system would be overrun.

We can't say that with any certainty.

It seems hundreds of thousands of people had the virus but were asymptomatic and were never aware.

I imagine some of them passed away but most didn't.

How do we factor in those numbers?

How do we factor out false positives?

How do we adjust the fatality rate for incorrect cause-of-death statements?

(09-17-2020 02:58 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

Quote:Currently, the U.S. has a case fatality rate of about 3%, based on 187,000 deaths and 6.2 million infections; however, the infection fatality rate is likely lower since most asymptomatic infections probably aren't detected. The CDC uses 0.65% in its pandemic planning scenarios.

The Cost of Herd Immunity in the U.S.

This is likely where they got their number from.

Regardless, if we stopped all mandates, etc. and just went back to pre-Covid normal, millions would more than likely die. Not to mention our health care system would be overrun.

Nope.

Some states never really shut down, like the one I'm in. Not a problem. As long as you dont do something stupid like NY, MI, NJ, and PA did with the nursing homes, its not a big deal. Its not even as big of a deal as the flu, because the China flu doesnt affect the young, whereas the flu affects the entire population who wasnt vaccinated.

Someone posted about the thousands of cases among athletes in the NCAA yesterday. Of those thousands of cases, ZERO required hospitalization.

And now we find out, thru the Nashville Coverup, that their contact tracing showed that bars were not an issue in causing the spread.

The facts are the facts.

(09-17-2020 03:03 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  

(09-17-2020 02:58 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

Quote:Currently, the U.S. has a case fatality rate of about 3%, based on 187,000 deaths and 6.2 million infections; however, the infection fatality rate is likely lower since most asymptomatic infections probably aren't detected. The CDC uses 0.65% in its pandemic planning scenarios.

The Cost of Herd Immunity in the U.S.

This is likely where they got their number from.

Regardless, if we stopped all mandates, etc. and just went back to pre-Covid normal, millions would more than likely die. Not to mention our health care system would be overrun.

We can't say that with any certainty.

It seems hundreds of thousands of people had the virus but were asymptomatic and were never aware.

I imagine some of them passed away but most didn't.

How do we factor in those numbers?

How do we factor out false positives?

How do we adjust the fatality rate for incorrect cause-of-death statements?

Clearly, it's all an estimate, but we're at 200k in 6 months with all the lockdown measures that we have done. The problem is that for HI to work by most accounts, you need tens of millions to get infected.

Wasn't we supposed to have millions dead by now?

The problem is nobody gave herd immunity a chance and I'm curious out of that number, how many are attributed to nursing homes?

Look at Sweden:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-53498133

They peaked and then flattened the curve.

No masks. Social distancing. Only shut down a few things and reduced capacity and the numbers are falling... It was high at the peak of the outbreak in March and April.

(09-17-2020 02:48 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  Maddow and MSNBC apparently didn't see the CNN guy get slammed for this same thing.

CNN slammed over COVID claim

Doesn't surprise me -- they're so darn efficient in these MSM propaganda factories.. they're cranking out stories and don't have time to apply reason &/or logic.

They probably knew about the CNN story. Just making sure as many people as possible hear the lie.

(09-17-2020 02:58 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

Quote:Currently, the U.S. has a case fatality rate of about 3%, based on 187,000 deaths and 6.2 million infections; however, the infection fatality rate is likely lower since most asymptomatic infections probably aren't detected. The CDC uses 0.65% in its pandemic planning scenarios.

The Cost of Herd Immunity in the U.S.

This is likely where they got their number from.

Regardless, if we stopped all mandates, etc. and just went back to pre-Covid normal, millions would more than likely die. Not to mention our health care system would be overrun.

Bullsh*t. Plain and simple.

The scare tactics are tired and nobody with a brain believes them anymore.

(09-17-2020 03:12 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(09-17-2020 03:03 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  

(09-17-2020 02:58 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

Quote:Currently, the U.S. has a case fatality rate of about 3%, based on 187,000 deaths and 6.2 million infections; however, the infection fatality rate is likely lower since most asymptomatic infections probably aren't detected. The CDC uses 0.65% in its pandemic planning scenarios.

The Cost of Herd Immunity in the U.S.

This is likely where they got their number from.

Regardless, if we stopped all mandates, etc. and just went back to pre-Covid normal, millions would more than likely die. Not to mention our health care system would be overrun.

We can't say that with any certainty.

It seems hundreds of thousands of people had the virus but were asymptomatic and were never aware.

I imagine some of them passed away but most didn't.

How do we factor in those numbers?

How do we factor out false positives?

How do we adjust the fatality rate for incorrect cause-of-death statements?

Clearly, it's all an estimate, but we're at 200k in 6 months with all the lockdown measures that we have done. The problem is that for HI to work by most accounts, you need tens of millions to get infected.

How do we know we aren't already close to that "tens of millions" number? I have a feeling tons of people have already had COVID that have no idea they had COVID. Hell, even I could have already had it and have no idea.

question-

how is Kamala supposed to advance her career if she is wearing a mask?

(09-17-2020 03:12 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(09-17-2020 03:03 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  

(09-17-2020 02:58 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

Quote:Currently, the U.S. has a case fatality rate of about 3%, based on 187,000 deaths and 6.2 million infections; however, the infection fatality rate is likely lower since most asymptomatic infections probably aren't detected. The CDC uses 0.65% in its pandemic planning scenarios.

The Cost of Herd Immunity in the U.S.

This is likely where they got their number from.

Regardless, if we stopped all mandates, etc. and just went back to pre-Covid normal, millions would more than likely die. Not to mention our health care system would be overrun.

We can't say that with any certainty.

It seems hundreds of thousands of people had the virus but were asymptomatic and were never aware.

I imagine some of them passed away but most didn't.

How do we factor in those numbers?

How do we factor out false positives?

How do we adjust the fatality rate for incorrect cause-of-death statements?

Clearly, it's all an estimate, but we're at 200k in 6 months with all the lockdown measures that we have done. The problem is that for HI to work by most accounts, you need tens of millions to get infected.

Agreed. It is an estimate. It's a lot of estimates. Some accurate, some not.

We don't even have an accurate count for real cause of death.

I within the past 2 months there are 3 people I personally know who were tested and came back COVID positive.

1. The first guy is a close friend and co-worker. He's 60, obese and diabetic. He got hit hard -- definitely high-risk. Lots of symptoms and eventually he eventually called 911 and was taken to Baptist Hospital in Memphis. He also ended up with double-pneumonia. A committee in Nashville at Vanderbilt OKs all use of Remdesivir. He was approved. He pulled through, was able to go home and eventually tested negative.

2 and 3. An older couple from church, both in their 70s tested COVID positive.

2. The wife had spent a few weeks in Ridgeland, MS while her sister was in hospice. Their brother and his family came up from Louisiana. He apparently brought the virus with him and infected the lady. The sister passed away. The lady was feeling pretty bad and drove the 3 hours from Ridgeland (Jackson area) to Memphis. She felt exhausted.

3. The husband waited on his wife a couple of days while she rested. He started feeling bad. He's late 70s with diabetes. They both went to be tested and were COVID positive.

They both self-quarantined for 15 days. After about 4-5 days the wife felt fine. But the husband wasn't doing as well. I called him every couple of days. At first he sounded horrible. He said he had a horrible sore throat and he was exhausted.

After about a week he increasingly sounded better even though he still tired out easily.

He tested positive again and had to wait another 10 days. He tested again this past Tuesday (2 days ago) and tested negative.

All 3 of these people were high-risk. One was hospitalized.

Also, the elderly couple have two sons. They both tested positive as well and have since tested negative. I don't know them so I don't have details.


I understand this is only 3 cases (or 5 if you count the sons). But it's 5 cases with good resolutions.

The elderly lady whose only affects were feeling exhausted for a couple of days... how many people have been impacted the same way but never tested? We don't know.


My 20 year old daughter went to the urgent care clinic on Feb 6. She had the worst flu she's ever had. She was living in Jackson MS at the time and we later came to learn that Jackson was hit hard early on. When she went to the clinic they didn't test for COVID because it wasn't a thing at that point.

She eventually got over it but struggled with it through mid-March. She went back to the clinic on Mar 4 and Mar 8 because it was still lingering. She was also getting winded easily. She was living in Jackson because she was in a ballet training program there. She's in good physical shape so getting winded easy didn't make sense.

We don't know for certain, but we suspect she had COVID. If so, she's one case that never showed up in the count.

(09-17-2020 03:12 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(09-17-2020 03:03 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  

(09-17-2020 02:58 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

Quote:Currently, the U.S. has a case fatality rate of about 3%, based on 187,000 deaths and 6.2 million infections; however, the infection fatality rate is likely lower since most asymptomatic infections probably aren't detected. The CDC uses 0.65% in its pandemic planning scenarios.

The Cost of Herd Immunity in the U.S.

This is likely where they got their number from.

Regardless, if we stopped all mandates, etc. and just went back to pre-Covid normal, millions would more than likely die. Not to mention our health care system would be overrun.

We can't say that with any certainty.

It seems hundreds of thousands of people had the virus but were asymptomatic and were never aware.

I imagine some of them passed away but most didn't.

How do we factor in those numbers?

How do we factor out false positives?

How do we adjust the fatality rate for incorrect cause-of-death statements?

Clearly, it's all an estimate, but we're at 200k in 6 months with all the lockdown measures that we have done. The problem is that for HI to work by most accounts, you need tens of millions to get infected.

Man, I suspect tens of millions have already been exposed to it. My brother had it, was with him two days in a row indoors and out. I never got it, my wife never got it, his wife never got it. Within the same week my coworkers wife had it, him and I ate lunch together the day she tested positive and were with each other all that day. I never got it and neither did he. My senior citizen neighbors wife had it, he has to take care of her because she had a knee issue and he never got it. Had a customer who had a wife with it, they both quarantined together and he never got it.

You think no one in the situations above were exposed to it? We're probably closer to herd immunity than we think. We just need to keep a watch on the vulnerable. Not to mention another coworker had it and never even went to get tested, whats the point? How many other people do you think have had it and just stayed at home and got over it? It is really bad for some people pre-existing conditions and folks in nursing homes. But the rest of us need to move on.

To what MSNBC is reporting here it's just more scare tactics. Literally the "scientist" keep getting proven wrong over and over again with their predictions but it's somehow deemed OK because they're "scientist". Nobody has seen a virus like this and these doctors are flying by the seat of their pants. It'll be 15 years from now before they'll have the facts straight.

Sons GF was exposed to the rona at some kind of get together with other young ladies, so the two of them went to get tested. They wanted the quick one so they'd know. They had to wait 4 1/2 hours in his car to get the test.
On the way home they got the results. She tested positive, he tested neg. He never got it, nor any of his roomates who were around her too.

This was a Wednesday/Thursday, she started feeling poorly on Saturday, self quarantined, was feeling better by Tuesday. Over it by Friday completely.

Daughters school has been a hotspot on the National scene. Daily they report new cases and closed cases (recoveries). Cases in the thousands from kids being kids, they have quarantine beds set aside and they've bent the curve very effectively. Yesterday for the first time in a long time they reported no new cases, bed openings increasing by a dozen or so a day, recoveries in the dozens daily. Not one reported death.

How many off-campus kids are going to bother to report themselves to the school? Any school out there?