Yeah most kids are not going home. My intern this summer goes to Johns Hopkins and even though they started all virtual he still is living in Baltimore because he had already signed his lease.

(09-02-2020 02:50 PM)jmu98 Wrote:  Yeah most kids are not going home. My intern this summer goes to Johns Hopkins and even though they started all virtual he still is living in Baltimore because he had already signed his lease.

JMU is kicking kids out of the dorms.

Hard to believe the virus would spread quickly through dorms. Go figure. (I kid)

JMU was the lead story on ABC national news tonight. All about sending the kids home. Not the kind of PR you’d want.

(09-02-2020 06:53 PM)Longhorn Wrote:  JMU was the lead story on ABC national news tonight. All about sending the kids home. Not the kind of PR you’d want.

Can you provide some insight from your faculty perspective? Did JMU not have the proper protocols in place? Contingency plan? Etc. This seems like such a fail by JMU. It’s hard to understand. Did Alger not think Covid was real? I am at a loss. Brand harming.

(09-02-2020 02:14 PM)Polish Hammer Wrote:  

(09-02-2020 09:05 AM)JMU_Newbill Wrote:  And I would be surprised if more than 10% of off campus students (only @6000 live on campus) leave Harrisonburg. Why would they, they are paying rent and are city residents. They played by the JMU rules last Spring, I doubt that happens this time. And Tim Miller can pound sand with his threats of police ride alongs and suspension......they would not just be Harrisonburg residents that take online classes at the JMU Community College.

And probably 10% of the off campus kids are following proper protocol which is why JMU is in this position.

And since they are mostly staying ... sending some kids home won't change much for H'burg other than getting JMU on prime time news ... yay!

Hopefully the old "no such thing as bad publicity" saying plays out well. Though I'd rather see us on CGD.

(09-02-2020 06:53 PM)Longhorn Wrote:  JMU was the lead story on ABC national news tonight. All about sending the kids home. Not the kind of PR you’d want.

Alger seems to be pointing the finger at VDH somewhat in his letter... perhaps more digging there should occur. Are other public schools disclosing as openly as JMU ? On campus vs off campus cases ? who is next in line to close the doors ?

What I'm struggling with is why JMU didn't reach out and coordinate with other schools with medical experience, like UVA as part of their planning?

I mean we've got their logo on our court, and they seem to have their act together on this ...

(09-02-2020 07:13 PM)jmufbs Wrote:  

(09-02-2020 06:53 PM)Longhorn Wrote:  JMU was the lead story on ABC national news tonight. All about sending the kids home. Not the kind of PR you’d want.

Alger seems to be pointing the finger at VDH somewhat in his letter... perhaps more digging there should occur. Are other public schools disclosing as openly as JMU ? On campus vs off campus cases ? who is next in line to close the doors ?

From conversations I had with someone who's close to people within the Central Shenandoah Health Department, the CSHD's perspective is that a widely available vaccine for COVID isn't coming any time soon, COVID isn't going away any time soon, and we need to learn how to deal with it and get on with our lives in the mean time. I'm sure that's a very non-nuanced version of their position, but it would align with some of the guidance they've given.

Harrisonburg City Schools and Rockingham County Public Schools decided to start online pretty much under their own volition, they were not told to do so by the CSHD. AFAIK Augusta County is still having school in person under a hybrid model, Staunton and Waynesboro decided on their own to start online. Dr. Laura Kornegay appeared on WHSV as late as July 30 saying that schools in Staunton, Augusta, and Waynesboro could open. For most of the school districts you can find their reasoning for opening in person or online through their district website.

As best as I can guess given the breadcrumbs, no one from the CSHD or VDH was telling JMU they shouldn't open so they opened. I don't know how much support there was, internally or externally, for that decision, but that's what happened.

(09-02-2020 07:08 PM)JMU Wrote:  

(09-02-2020 06:53 PM)Longhorn Wrote:  JMU was the lead story on ABC national news tonight. All about sending the kids home. Not the kind of PR you’d want.

Can your provide some insight from your faculty perspective? Did JMU not have the proper protocols in place? Contingency plan? Etc. This seems like such a fail by JMU. It’s hard to understand. Did Alger not think Covid was real? I am at a loss. Brand harming.

JMU took all the correct necessary steps. Communicated what the students were to do before coming to campus, and after coming to campus and going to class. JMU coordinated with the Commonwealth health gurus and guidelines, and assisted the faculty in trying to prepare for a VERY fluid situation. IMO, no one individual or group is to blame, but the same disregard for following proper COVID protocols (wearing masks, social distancing, etc.) were ignored off campus by students, who predictably did what students have always done. They partied/gathered in large groups, and here we are.

Hindsight is 20-20, and announcing the Fall 2020 term would be taught all online from day one would have been the smartest/safest/most conservative choice. But the university has bills. Dorms have a mortgage. Athletic facilities have a mortgage. About 3/4 of the university’s annual budget (faculty and staff salaries among the largest items) are generated and paid for by tuition and fees. JMU’s endowment isn’t big enough to cover the shortfalls, hence the administration rolled the dice and tried to open for in-person business. So did UNCC. Temple. Roll Tide Alabama. JMU is not alone in the path we choose. JMU even set aside about 140 rooms for quarantine use, but the positive Covid numbers have apparently blown the doors off of that option.

The issue with me was not opening online, or in person - it was sending infected students home and back to their communities. Harrisonburg was already infected, sending the students home now was going to accomplish little.

College itself is actually a good way of flushing the virus through a large % of the population in semi pod conditions. I would of sent the students pack with online classes for the first 4 weeks while the virus got out of their system. While that is my 20-20 opinion, I don't blame someone for trying to make a safer decision.

That said, I personally would not advocate football in the current covid situation. I would of started school, and football a month later heading towards fanless or lowly attended out door games.

I'm not sure why everyone is so surprised JMU is sending students home, it's part of their Campus Reopening Plan. The number of beds that they had set aside for quarantining and isolating people was drying up fast, which was their main way of dealing with outbreaks on campus.

In a section on the the degree of response relative to the level of community transmission.

Quote:Level 3: Substantial Community Transmission

While continuing to coordinate with local public health officials, during this phase JMU will suspend in-person classes and consider sending residential students home to attend class remotely.

There's not really a great way out of this situation that JMU created. Students who are in quarantine or isolation are being advised to stay on campus until the end of their quarantine or isolation time. AFAIK they can't force students out of off-campus housing, although it sounds like JMU Police will be patrolling areas where the student population density is high to ensure there are no parties or large gatherings happening.

This is a genie that's very difficult to put back into the bottle, but JMU decided that they had to/wanted to rub the lamp.

The obvious underlying reason JMU went through this in-person charade is financial. So look at the top for who drove that decision. President Alger and whoever is the chief financial administrator at the school. They put collecting those checks above all else, including the health/well-being of the greater Harrisonburg/Rockingham community. Now, they’re endangering communities far and wide by sending students home. It’s greed, pure and simple.Plus a dash of self-preservation. Not willing to make the tough fiscal decisions that would happen otherwise. Gotta protect your professional legacy. Can’t have JMU in a financial hardship. Gotta cause countless other avoidable health problems for others so that they can retire with their financial management legacy intact. JMU’s finances are in great shape thanks to these guys. We should all be thankful.

(09-02-2020 07:59 PM)Longhorn Wrote:  

(09-02-2020 07:08 PM)JMU Wrote:  

(09-02-2020 06:53 PM)Longhorn Wrote:  JMU was the lead story on ABC national news tonight. All about sending the kids home. Not the kind of PR you’d want.

Can your provide some insight from your faculty perspective? Did JMU not have the proper protocols in place? Contingency plan? Etc. This seems like such a fail by JMU. It’s hard to understand. Did Alger not think Covid was real? I am at a loss. Brand harming.

JMU took all the correct necessary steps. Communicated what the students were to do before coming to campus, and after coming to campus and going to class. JMU coordinated with the Commonwealth health gurus and guidelines, and assisted the faculty in trying to prepare for a VERY fluid situation. IMO, no one individual or group is to blame, but the same disregard for following proper COVID protocols (wearing masks, social distancing, etc.) were ignored off campus by students, who predictably did what students have always done. They partied/gathered in large groups, and here we are.

Hindsight is 20-20, and announcing the Fall 2020 term would be taught all online from day one would have been the smartest/safest/most conservative choice. But the university has bills. Dorms have a mortgage. Athletic facilities have a mortgage. About 3/4 of the university’s annual budget (faculty and staff salaries among the largest items) are generated and paid for by tuition and fees. JMU’s endowment isn’t big enough to cover the shortfalls, hence the administration rolled the dice and tried to open for in-person business. So did UNCC. Temple. Roll Tide Alabama. JMU is not alone in the path we choose. JMU even set aside about 140 rooms for quarantine use, but the positive Covid numbers have apparently blown the doors off of that option.

Not arguing the point or initial decision making b/c that is not changeable.

But b/c of JMU's and Alger's decision making in the last 1.5 weeks he has effectively pissed off both sides of the equation in that timeframe. Based on Alger's decision making he has made I would wager 90%+ of the students and parents quite angry. Not too mention every alumni I have spoken too is also not pleased with this entire situation and PR it has generated.

This was an epic fail.

Maybe this will lead to a new President that actually has charisma and vision.

Honestly, some of the "total fail," "embarrassment," or "furious" stuff is an overreaction (I know very edging of my to say an opinion on the internet in 2020 is an overaction).

The leading national story regarding colleges just a couple days was about widespread bribery to get kids into a college. That is a big deal. A school, or person in charge, or just regular citizens, making mistakes during a global pandemic is pretty standard news these days.

I just searched "college covid outbreaks" on google; the first story in "news" is from NBC and names Ohio State, Iowa State, University of Iowa, JMU, Notre Dame, NC State, NYU, and University of Wisconsin; then an ABC story that names UMiss, UNC, and JMU; then a colorado paper talking about colorado college; then a michigan paper with "8 new COVID outbreaks in michigan schools" as the headline, then a US News story that names University of Illinois; then CNN story that names College at Oneonta; then a USA today story that names NC State, Syracuse, UConn, Purdue, Tenn; then the denver post with a "3 more colorado schools report outbreaks".

For those that lost count, that was 28 different schools named in the first few stories on google (yes, JMU and NC State were named twice). Its confirmation bias, you see JMU in news and you get embarrassed/furious by it, but you forget the other 27 schools that also had difficulties navigating a global pandemic.

Front and center in today's Daily News-Record is a picture of a young man loading up his car to drive home.......to California. He is quoted as saying it will take him three...count them three... days to get home. I hope and pray he is not infected as he leaves our community and potentially spreads the virus all across the country.

I work in a retirement community. We have been locked down for months. Our residents have not seen their families in an eternity. I have not seen my family for longer than I can imagine. We are vigilant about not doing anything that puts our residents and employees at risk. To see 5000 students turned out to possibly take this virus to their family makes my skin crawl.

I wish all of them safe travels and a stop to the spread. I am not hopeful this will happen.

(09-03-2020 09:52 AM)DoubleDogDare Wrote:  Honestly, some of the "total fail," "embarrassment," or "furious" stuff is an overreaction (I know very edging of my to say an opinion on the internet in 2020 is an overaction).

The leading national story regarding colleges just a couple days was about widespread bribery to get kids into a college. That is a big deal. A school, or person in charge, or just regular citizens, making mistakes during a global pandemic is pretty standard news these days.

I just searched "college covid outbreaks" on google; the first story in "news" is from NBC and names Ohio State, Iowa State, University of Iowa, JMU, Notre Dame, NC State, NYU, and University of Wisconsin; then an ABC story that names UMiss, UNC, and JMU; then a colorado paper talking about colorado college; then a michigan paper with "8 new COVID outbreaks in michigan schools" as the headline, then a US News story that names University of Illinois; then CNN story that names College at Oneonta; then a USA today story that names NC State, Syracuse, UConn, Purdue, Tenn; then the denver post with a "3 more colorado schools report outbreaks".

For those that lost count, that was 28 different schools named in the first few stories on google (yes, JMU and NC State were named twice). Its confirmation bias, you see JMU in news and you get embarrassed/furious by it, but you forget the other 27 schools that also had difficulties navigating a global pandemic.

+1

If Alger and Bourne (you must blame them both at all times...Dukes Domain Standard Operating Procedure :>) had stated back in July or August that JMU was not allowing students on campus and were continuing with virtual classrooms for fall semester, they would've been heavily criticized for that and labeled failures going that route as well. No win situation here, but that's why they get paid the big bucks to take that criticism in no-win scenarios.

And to your point, you just mentioned 20-30 schools in the short Google search you performed. There are plenty and I mean P-L-E-N-T-Y of others that are experiencing the exact same thing that didn't make the random Google search at that moment in time. To me, not much has significantly changed from the spring thanks to many reasons - with the key word being "significantly". Some things have perhaps gotten better such as treatment and awareness. But, point being, we aren't really that much better now than we were back in March/April when classes were suspended, went virtual, or some combo. And, that goes for K-12 as well.

This should come as absolute no surprise whatsoever that spread was/is going to take place at rapid paces on college campuses. And, at K-12 as well. I'm just glad both of mine have graduated from college and my much better half and I aren't dealing with this now as parents of college students (or K-12 either for that matter). I empathize with those parents who are - and, for the responsible students (and there are many of them) who followed the guidances and weren't selfish or stupid.

The fact of the matter is there are outbreaks at schools that are all remote since many kids have gone to the city or town the campus is in because they are paying rent. I mentioned yesterday that my intern this summer is living in Baltimore as he attends Hopkins. IN my local area the College of NJ is all remote, but there is already an outbreak in kids attending parties house parties in the town that the school is located. Police are breaking up parties like they always would but they are not trying to get the kids to leave as it is not legal. I think they had like 10 cases but expected many more as they contract trace who these kids have been around. Hits close to home as many of those kids come into surrounding towns such as mine for haircuts, grocery shopping, etc. That said these kids would be partying and breaking social distancing rules if they were at home as well which is exactly why it is spreading as kids came to school with the virus unknowingly. In NJ I also don't worry as much as people wear masks everywhere that I go and people are good at keeping their distance.

This seems pretty obvious

https://6abc.com/fauci-college-quarantin...n/6405044/

(09-03-2020 09:17 PM)Centdukesfan Wrote:  This seems pretty obvious

https://6abc.com/fauci-college-quarantin...n/6405044/

For sure. Hooray for agreeing!

More than 1000 students at University of South Carolina have tested positive for COVID-19.

President Robert Caslen, "we do not have any plans to close, the last thing i want to do is take his university, shut it down, and dump the problem on the city of Columbia, i prefer to work through this."