I find the MAC Divisions unusual. Toledo and Bowling Green are separated by about 25 miles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bowling_Gr...ll_rivalry) and have a big rivalry with each other but are in opposite divisions. Miami is further west of both schools and while no Ohio school would want to be in the West Division they would make the most geographic sense of any Ohio school and Toledo and Bowling Green could be in the East Division together. Now that would split up Miami University with Ohio University. They could also move Bowling Green to the West (rename it the North) and move Ball State to the East (or South) so Toledo and Bowling Green are together and Toledo can stay with the Michigan schools. I just think it doesn't make sense that Toledo and Bowling Green are split up, especially since the MAC uses its divisions in basketball as well.

I think Toledo and BG are protected rivals.

(08-20-2020 08:31 AM)esayem Wrote:  I think Toledo and BG are protected rivals.

Yes, and for scheduling purposes so are Miami and Ball State even though we're not rivals except through a manufactured trophy.

That system works and basically negates the OP. Basketball technically uses divisons for standings but they have zero impact on anything else. Originally when UMass was invited for football when we had Temple we were gonna put both in the East so BG could go West, but that quickly became an outdated plan.

(08-20-2020 09:24 AM)Love and Honor Wrote:  

(08-20-2020 08:31 AM)esayem Wrote:  I think Toledo and BG are protected rivals.

Yes, and for scheduling purposes so are Miami and Ball State even though we're not rivals except through a manufactured trophy.

That system works and basically negates the OP. Basketball technically uses divisons for standings but they have zero impact on anything else. Originally when UMass was invited for football when we had Temple we were gonna put both in the East so BG could go West, but that quickly became an outdated plan.

Hey now! Don't disparage the legacy, heritage, and pageantry that is the Red Bird Rivalry




/s

Maybe a North/South alignment would make more sense :)

(08-20-2020 09:53 AM)Ohio Poly Wrote:  Maybe a North/South alignment would make more sense :)

But that would break up the sacred Ball St - NIU rivalry!

Let’s face it, there’s no good way to split the MAC into divisions of 6 because everyone is so close together. There’s always going to be somebody with a rival in the opposite division.

It would be more clear cut had Buffalo not joined. If there was a western school instead you’d have 6 Ohio schools in one division and everyone else in the other. Illinois St Redbirds fans—it could have been you.

I am an alum of a MAC school and I just think you’re looking at it all wrong.

The idea is to get as many of the Ohio schools (and Michigan schools too) to play each other as often as possible. That group is the heart of the MAC in the same way that the Tobacco Road schools comprise the heart of the ACC.

Unfortunately, in an East-West split, somebody has to be the odd school out and it is Toledo. it wouldn’t make any sense to put another team out as well and bring in say, Ball State.

Current Divisions:
East
Akron
Bowling Green
Buffalo
Kent State
Miami (OH)
Ohio

West
Ball State
Central Michigan
Eastern Michigan
Northern Illinois
Toledo
Western Michigan

Honestly, I have always thought that the answer to that is simple. Just do a North/South split and trade Toledo for Buffalo. That’s less than ideal for Buffalo’s travel, but really, is it a big deal for Buffalo to go to Michigan, Indiana and Illinois instead of Ohio?

Honestly, you could call it the Ohio Division and the Great Lakes Division.

(08-20-2020 10:38 AM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  I am an alum of a MAC school and I just think you’re looking at it all wrong.

The idea is to get as many of the Ohio schools (and Michigan schools too) to play each other as often as possible. That group is the heart of the MAC in the same way that the Tobacco Road schools comprise the heart of the ACC.

Unfortunately, in an East-West split, somebody has to be the odd school out and it is Toledo. it wouldn’t make any sense to put another team out as well and bring in say, Ball State.

Current Divisions:
East
Akron
Bowling Green
Buffalo
Kent State
Miami (OH)
Ohio

West
Ball State
Central Michigan
Eastern Michigan
Northern Illinois
Toledo
Western Michigan

Honestly, I have always thought that the answer to that is simple. Just do a North/South split and trade Toledo for Buffalo. That’s less than ideal for Buffalo’s travel, but really, is it a big deal for Buffalo to go to Michigan, Indiana and Illinois instead of Ohio?

Honestly, you could call it the Ohio Division and the Great Lakes Division.

When the quickest way to and from the Michigan schools requires 2 international crossings each way, it does.

Toledo and BG are separated by 25 miles.
Ball and Miami are separated by 75 miles.

The solution is obvious - Ball St and BG should've been flipped.

No crossovers would've been required. Clean 5 + 3/6 for everyone. Everyone visits everyone's stadium in a 4-year span.

Instead, Toledo and Miami were about to go 10 years without playing each other. They haven't met since 2011 and Toledo hasn't visited Miami since 2009.

Why not:

Ohio Division: Akron, Bowling Green St, Kent St, Miami (OH), Ohio, Toledo
Midwest Division: Ball St, Buffalo, Central Michigan, Eastern Michigan, Northern Illinois, Western Michigan

Buffalo travel expenses.

(08-20-2020 11:27 AM)Steve1981 Wrote:  Buffalo travel expenses.

That shouldn't be a barrier for football. Other sports may as well rid of divisions.

I've always liked the zipper format

I: NIU, Ball St, EMU, BG, Miami, Ohio
II: WMU, CMU, Toledo, Kent, Akron, Buffalo

Protected rivalries BG/Toledo, EMU/CMU

-Splits up the Ohio schools evenly (3 in each division).
-Each state has 3 states in it.
-Less of an Ohio/Michigan conference look for FB.
-Divides up the FB power better than currently.

Basketball is currently a 20 game schedule and 1 division for the next 4 years. Almost a full home and home BB schedule.

(08-20-2020 11:33 AM)BePcr07 Wrote:  

(08-20-2020 11:27 AM)Steve1981 Wrote:  Buffalo travel expenses.

That shouldn't be a barrier for football. Other sports may as well rid of divisions.

Buffalo should be in a division with Kent/Akron for sake of regionalism but otherwise travel doesn't mean that much in the MAC.

It's not broke, what are you trying to fix.

The current divisions are fine

(08-20-2020 08:29 AM)schmolik Wrote:  ...especially since the MAC uses its divisions in basketball as well.

No, they don't, not any more. That was announced last year.

Since they will now be playing 20 games, AFAIU, the two games that are not home and away are decided by ending conference ladder of the previous year ... 1/2 home or away vs 11/12, 3/4 home or away vs 9/0, 5/6 home or away vs 7/8. Also no first round to the playoff, top eight go to Cleveland.

(08-23-2020 07:13 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  

(08-20-2020 08:29 AM)schmolik Wrote:  ...especially since the MAC uses its divisions in basketball as well.

No, they don't, not any more. That was announced last year.

Since they will now be playing 20 games, AFAIU, the two games that are not home and away are decided by ending conference ladder of the previous year ... 1/2 home or away vs 11/12, 3/4 home or away vs 9/0, 5/6 home or away vs 7/8. Also no first round to the playoff, top eight go to Cleveland.

Beautiful

If the MAC could go to 14 by adding Illinois State and Indiana State? You could slip the lone Ohio school on the west to the east.

WEST:
Northern Illinois
Illinois State
Ball State
Indiana State
Central Michigan
Eastern Michigan
Western Michigan

East:
Buffalo
Toledo
Ohio U.
Kent State
Miami
Bowling Green
Akron

It would give both Ball State and Northern Illinois as travel mates.

(08-24-2020 03:15 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  If the MAC could go to 14 by adding Illinois State and Indiana State? You could slip the lone Ohio school on the west to the east.

WEST:
Northern Illinois
Illinois State
Ball State
Indiana State
Central Michigan
Eastern Michigan
Western Michigan

East:
Buffalo
Toledo
Ohio U.
Kent State
Miami
Bowling Green
Akron

It would give both Ball State and Northern Illinois as travel mates.

A David St post that makes sense!

Mitigating factors include the payout structure for CFP de-incentivizes G5’s bigger than 10 members but yes, if those 2 MVFC schools were equipped to move up that would clean things up.

It could line up a good rivalry week:

Akron vs Kent St
Ohio vs Miami
Toledo vs BG
Ball St vs Indiana St
NIU vs Illinois St

Two of the MI schools play while the odd ball gets Buffalo.