Are you willing to let the no-science clowns that run Liberty ruin the ACC season? Syracuse, Virginia Tech, & NC State all play the Flames. Syracuse plays Clemson 7 days after facing Liberty. You up for that Dabo when Liberty hasn’t tested anyone in two weeks?

“Liberty football coach Hugh Freeze said the program hasn't had a positive test in three weeks. The screenings in the past two weeks haven't necessitated any tests because players are not showing symptoms.”

Hey, we don’t get positives if we don’t get anyone!

Though temporarily benched, Jerry Falwell Jr. is working feverishly behind the scenes to have the school renamed Libertine University. It's the only school in the country where the honor code forbids students from having sex while standing up because administrators fear that rabid church-goers might think the kids are dancing.

(08-14-2020 11:29 PM)CollegeCard Wrote:  Are you willing to let the no-science clowns that run Liberty ruin the ACC season? Syracuse, Virginia Tech, & NC State all play the Flames. Syracuse plays Clemson 7 days after facing Liberty. You up for that Dabo when Liberty hasn’t tested anyone in two weeks?

“Liberty football coach Hugh Freeze said the program hasn't had a positive test in three weeks. The screenings in the past two weeks haven't necessitated any tests because players are not showing symptoms.”

Hey, we don’t get positives if we don’t get anyone!

Doubt it's a problem because at this point I'd be surprised between the state mandates and their players pitching daily fits if Syracuse plays.

I think that most people who understand the South know that when you hook up with those that claim to be born again - you are going to get either a case of the crabs, chlamydia, or a pregnancy scare. Liberty is "that" girl.

(08-14-2020 11:29 PM)CollegeCard Wrote:  Are you willing to let the no-science clowns that run Liberty ruin the ACC season? Syracuse, Virginia Tech, & NC State all play the Flames. Syracuse plays Clemson 7 days after facing Liberty. You up for that Dabo when Liberty hasn’t tested anyone in two weeks?

“Liberty football coach Hugh Freeze said the program hasn't had a positive test in three weeks. The screenings in the past two weeks haven't necessitated any tests because players are not showing symptoms.”

Hey, we don’t get positives if we don’t get anyone!

The SU-Liberty game is part of a two for one, where Syracuse has already played its game at Liberty and Liberty owes Syracuse two return games. Syracuse does not generate a large enough home gate to pay for guaranty games with G5 opponents on a regular basis. Two for ones are a good way to increase the number of seasons with seven home games without paying a guaranty. That said, Liberty is not an opponent that I am excited to schedule and I believe many SU fans are in agreement. For instance, Liberty has recently had issues with its treatment of Black athletes. Diversity is a significant Value to Syracuse University and has been for almost 100 years. Liberty's issues are simply inconsistent with this Value.

I assumed that the ACC decided to include OOC games in the schedule to maximize our television revenue this year. Liberty was Syracuse's only OOC opponent that didn't cancel, so they were the obvious choice to play. That said, if Syracuse was to cancel, it would not cost Syracuse anything. It would simply surrender one of the home dates that is owed by Liberty. With no fans permitted in New York State, there would be no out of pocket cost. It could cost the ACC some television money, but other schools including ND and BC have suggested they may not fill their vacant OOC slots. Unless Syracuse and others are being compensated for playing the extra game (or ESPN assures the conference that it won't penalize the conference for open OOC dates), I see no reason not to cancel the Liberty game.

Liberty pissing off SU

https://www.syracuse.com/orangefootball/...ssion=true

1. "Diversity is a significant Value to Syracuse University and has been for almost 100 years. Liberty's issues are simply inconsistent with this Value."
2."Liberty has recently had issues with its treatment of Black athletes."
3."The SU-Liberty game is part of a two for one. Two for ones are a good way to increase the number of seasons with seven home games without paying a guaranty."

If #1 and #2 were more important than #3, then Liberty wouldn't be on Syracuse's schedule at all. The rest of your post concerning the cost of cancelling the game seems reasonable, but why the need to inject #1 and #2 into the discussion?

Largely agree with the above and would add:

1) Diversity has become a political football and the dictionary definition is different than the current political zeitgeist definition which is far more unsavory. Define at length what you mean by diversity.

2) That's an explosive charge, what is it referencing?

(08-15-2020 11:23 AM)orangefan Wrote:  

(08-14-2020 11:29 PM)CollegeCard Wrote:  Are you willing to let the no-science clowns that run Liberty ruin the ACC season? Syracuse, Virginia Tech, & NC State all play the Flames. Syracuse plays Clemson 7 days after facing Liberty. You up for that Dabo when Liberty hasn’t tested anyone in two weeks?

“Liberty football coach Hugh Freeze said the program hasn't had a positive test in three weeks. The screenings in the past two weeks haven't necessitated any tests because players are not showing symptoms.”

Hey, we don’t get positives if we don’t get anyone!

The SU-Liberty game is part of a two for one, where Syracuse has already played its game at Liberty and Liberty owes Syracuse two return games. Syracuse does not generate a large enough home gate to pay for guaranty games with G5 opponents on a regular basis. Two for ones are a good way to increase the number of seasons with seven home games without paying a guaranty. That said, Liberty is not an opponent that I am excited to schedule and I believe many SU fans are in agreement. For instance, Liberty has recently had issues with its treatment of Black athletes. Diversity is a significant Value to Syracuse University and has been for almost 100 years. Liberty's issues are simply inconsistent with this Value.

I assumed that the ACC decided to include OOC games in the schedule to maximize our television revenue this year. Liberty was Syracuse's only OOC opponent that didn't cancel, so they were the obvious choice to play. That said, if Syracuse was to cancel, it would not cost Syracuse anything. It would simply surrender one of the home dates that is owed by Liberty. With no fans permitted in New York State, there would be no out of pocket cost. It could cost the ACC some television money, but other schools including ND and BC have suggested they may not fill their vacant OOC slots. Unless Syracuse and others are being compensated for playing the extra game (or ESPN assures the conference that it won't penalize the conference for open OOC dates), I see no reason not to cancel the Liberty game.

If those things are true.......then why did Syracuse schedule the games with Liberty in the first place?
Syracuse greed tops integrity?

(08-16-2020 09:18 AM)XLance Wrote:  If those things are true.......then why did Syracuse schedule the games with Liberty in the first place?
Syracuse greed tops integrity?

Fair question. The recently disclosed issues were not previously known. If your follow up is that we should have suspected, I would agree. Certainly its stance with respect to LGBTQ issues should have represented a real problem prior to any disclosure of the issues faced by black athletes. I think many in the university community were uncomfortable with the initial decision to schedule a series with Liberty for various reasons, which were obviously rejected.

(08-16-2020 08:39 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  Largely agree with the above and would add:

1) Diversity has become a political football and the dictionary definition is different than the current political zeitgeist definition which is far more unsavory. Define at length what you mean by diversity.

2) That's an explosive charge, what is it referencing?

SU's commitment to diversity is evidenced by its long standing practice of creating a highly multicultural student body. In the 1920's, for instance, when many Ivy League schools were adopting restrictions on the number of Jewish students, the Chancellor of Syracuse University took firm public positions opposing such discrimination. Syracuse athletics included black athletes in its football program starting in the 1930's. My experience at Syracuse was being the member of a highly diverse student body. At various times, my dorm neighbors were Black, Asian, Arabic, Jewish, Hispanic, etc. This culture of diversity undoubtedly contributes to the fact that both the first African-American Heisman Trophy winner and first African-American Miss America.

(08-16-2020 09:43 AM)orangefan Wrote:  SU's commitment to diversity is evidenced by its long standing practice of creating a highly multicultural student body. In the 1920's, for instance, when many Ivy League schools were adopting restrictions on the number of Jewish students, the Chancellor of Syracuse University took firm public positions opposing such discrimination. Syracuse athletics included black athletes in its football program starting in the 1930's. My experience at Syracuse was being the member of a highly diverse student body. At various times, my dorm neighbors were Black, Asian, Arabic, Jewish, Hispanic, etc. This culture of diversity undoubtedly contributes to the fact that both the first African-American Heisman Trophy winner and first African-American Miss America.

Is there any ways you can quantify diversity beyond ethnicity and skin color? Are you implying Liberty doesn't have people of differing ethnicity and skin color on campus?

What were the issues Liberty had with black athletes?

(08-16-2020 10:26 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  What were the issues Liberty had with black athletes?

This was not the point of my starting the thread and I’m not looking to get it moved to the No-Spin board, but it is being discussed.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/slate.com/c...sports.amp

(08-16-2020 11:53 AM)CollegeCard Wrote:  

(08-16-2020 10:26 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  What were the issues Liberty had with black athletes?

This was not the point of my starting the thread and I’m not looking to get it moved to the No-Spin board, but it is being discussed.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/slate.com/c...sports.amp

I hope it's something more substantive than one professor's bad joke, fear mongering from Slate over Nigel Farage of all people, and TDS given the charges levied.

(08-16-2020 09:43 AM)orangefan Wrote:  

(08-16-2020 09:18 AM)XLance Wrote:  If those things are true.......then why did Syracuse schedule the games with Liberty in the first place?
Syracuse greed tops integrity?

Fair question. The recently disclosed issues were not previously known. If your follow up is that we should have suspected, I would agree. Certainly its stance with respect to LGBTQ issues should have represented a real problem prior to any disclosure of the issues faced by black athletes. I think many in the university community were uncomfortable with the initial decision to schedule a series with Liberty for various reasons, which were obviously rejected.

(08-16-2020 08:39 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  Largely agree with the above and would add:

1) Diversity has become a political football and the dictionary definition is different than the current political zeitgeist definition which is far more unsavory. Define at length what you mean by diversity.

2) That's an explosive charge, what is it referencing?

SU's commitment to diversity is evidenced by its long standing practice of creating a highly multicultural student body. In the 1920's, for instance, when many Ivy League schools were adopting restrictions on the number of Jewish students, the Chancellor of Syracuse University took firm public positions opposing such discrimination. Syracuse athletics included black athletes in its football program starting in the 1930's. My experience at Syracuse was being the member of a highly diverse student body. At various times, my dorm neighbors were Black, Asian, Arabic, Jewish, Hispanic, etc. This culture of diversity undoubtedly contributes to the fact that both the first African-American Heisman Trophy winner and first African-American Miss America.

We must have a differing view of diversity.
I was under the impression that diversity embraced others that didn't look and think exactly the same.
If you only accept or interact with others that have the same views that you embrace, pretty soon you have created a situation where you have the exact opposite of diversity.

My guess is if Liberty were a Muslim college that you wouldn’t be trying to mock their beliefs.

Why is it acceptable to mock religion on a sports board? Why the sex jokes in reference to someone’s religious beliefs? [/u] Of course ironically as with politics, those that yell “tolerance” are the most intolerant people in the world.

(08-16-2020 12:26 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(08-16-2020 11:53 AM)CollegeCard Wrote:  

(08-16-2020 10:26 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  What were the issues Liberty had with black athletes?

This was not the point of my starting the thread and I’m not looking to get it moved to the No-Spin board, but it is being discussed.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/slate.com/c...sports.amp

I hope it's something more substantive than one professor's bad joke, fear mongering from Slate over Nigel Farage of all people, and TDS given the charges levied.

Its not just one bad joke. You should really read the article that College linked and that you responded to to understand whats going on there.

(08-16-2020 02:55 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  Its not just one bad joke. You should really read the article that College linked and that you responded to to understand whats going on there.

I did. And seeing them pan Liberty for having Nigel Farage speak on campus and then panning Nigel Farage as xenophobic betrayed the author's credibility. Well, what little credibility there is to be found at Slate. I read the whole thing. I found lots of axes to grind and trumped up charges (no pun intended).

(08-16-2020 12:36 PM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-16-2020 09:43 AM)orangefan Wrote:  

(08-16-2020 09:18 AM)XLance Wrote:  If those things are true.......then why did Syracuse schedule the games with Liberty in the first place?
Syracuse greed tops integrity?

Fair question. The recently disclosed issues were not previously known. If your follow up is that we should have suspected, I would agree. Certainly its stance with respect to LGBTQ issues should have represented a real problem prior to any disclosure of the issues faced by black athletes. I think many in the university community were uncomfortable with the initial decision to schedule a series with Liberty for various reasons, which were obviously rejected.

(08-16-2020 08:39 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  Largely agree with the above and would add:

1) Diversity has become a political football and the dictionary definition is different than the current political zeitgeist definition which is far more unsavory. Define at length what you mean by diversity.

2) That's an explosive charge, what is it referencing?

SU's commitment to diversity is evidenced by its long standing practice of creating a highly multicultural student body. In the 1920's, for instance, when many Ivy League schools were adopting restrictions on the number of Jewish students, the Chancellor of Syracuse University took firm public positions opposing such discrimination. Syracuse athletics included black athletes in its football program starting in the 1930's. My experience at Syracuse was being the member of a highly diverse student body. At various times, my dorm neighbors were Black, Asian, Arabic, Jewish, Hispanic, etc. This culture of diversity undoubtedly contributes to the fact that both the first African-American Heisman Trophy winner and first African-American Miss America.

We must have a differing view of diversity.
I was under the impression that diversity embraced others that didn't look and think exactly the same.
If you only accept or interact with others that have the same views that you embrace, pretty soon you have created a situation where you have the exact opposite of diversity.

Others have adequately addressed the recent concerns raised by black athletes regarding Liberty. I have nothing to add beyond what has already been said.

With respect to Liberty's policies towards LGBTQ students, my concern is that Liberty is one of a number of colleges in the country that has requested and been granted an exemption from Title IX so that it may discriminate against LGBTQ students on the basis of sexual orientation. There are many church affiliated colleges in the US, including the vast majority of Catholic colleges in the country, that share Liberty's doctrinal beliefs regarding LGBTQ lifestyles, but which have not requested an exemption so that they may discriminate.

I do not expect Liberty to change its religious view on this issue any more than I expect the Catholic Church to do so, and individuals who hold such views are certainly welcome to be included in the Syracuse University community and schools that hold such views are welcome as part of the larger national academic community. However, schools and individuals that actively choose to discriminate cannot expect to receive similar welcoming attitudes.

(08-16-2020 06:45 PM)orangefan Wrote:  Others have adequately addressed the recent concerns raised by black athletes regarding Liberty. I have nothing to add beyond what has already been said.

(08-16-2020 06:45 PM)orangefan Wrote:  With respect to Liberty's policies towards LGBTQ students, my concern is that Liberty is one of a number of colleges in the country that has requested and been granted an exemption from Title IX so that it may discriminate against LGBTQ students on the basis of sexual orientation.

There are many church affiliated colleges in the US, including the vast majority of Catholic colleges in the country, that share Liberty's doctrinal beliefs regarding LGBTQ lifestyles, but which have not requested an exemption so that they may discriminate.

Title IX is not the only legal bullwork to discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation there is. And you're talking about hypotheticals. It's, as you say, a concern. And then you jump swiftly and immediately in the next paragraph to ... they're using it to discriminate. Well which is it, it can't be both. Is it a concern? Or is it discrimination? Show me your proof if it's discrimination, there should be some. I grew up near Bob Jones where interracial dating was banned well past 2000. It wasn't some grand conspiracy they published that crap policy openly. If Liberty believes in discriminating against non-heterosexual people on a religious basis I'd expect them to proclaim that and not hide from it.

And I'd add that not being subject to Title IX allows Liberty to avoid discrimination against men by eliminating potentially popular men's sports in the name of maintaining Title IX ratio requirements for far less popular and far more revenue losing women's sports. And if we're really concerned about the well being of students on campus regarding Title IX let's pop open the can of worms that is competitive cheerleading being exempt from Title IX explicitly in the law because the feminists who drafted it looked down upon cheerleading. Competitive cheerleading is the number one source of catastrophic injury per capita in collegiate sports. It's the number one source of paralysis injury per capita in collegiate sports. It's the number one source of career ending injury per capita in collegiate sports. You're safer playing full contact football than competitive cheerleading. And because it's exempt colleges don't have to provide the level of medical and mental health services to those athletes before, during, and after their careers that they have to with other athletes. Thanks for helping out those cheerleaders with Title IX, feminists!

(08-16-2020 01:51 PM)Ramblin Wreck Wrote:  My guess is if Liberty were a Muslim college that you wouldn’t be trying to mock their beliefs.

Why is it acceptable to mock religion on a sports board? Why the sex jokes in reference to someone’s religious beliefs? [/u] Of course ironically as with politics, those that yell “tolerance” are the most intolerant people in the world.

Hypocrisy should always be held up for ridicule and jokes. If your religion says the world is flat, or the Earth was created in a single day, or that it's okay to **** your father if it results in a pregnancy, that's something to make fun of, not respect.