(07-13-2020 11:22 AM)ausowl Wrote:  

(07-12-2020 06:03 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-12-2020 04:43 PM)ausowl Wrote:  

(07-12-2020 04:20 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-12-2020 04:14 PM)ausowl Wrote:  .

K Harris, T Duckworth, S Rice, E Warren, Baldwin, Bottoms, Raimondo don't strike me as the blood and soil types.

More like the Bolsheviks, IMO. Or maybe the "useful idiots".

OO - I'm going on vacation next week (not to Taos, NM or Colorado, sadly, but all the way to a cabin by the Blanco River with limited wifi). If you could recommend one book that would give me insight as to why Tammy Duckworth, former U.S. Army lieutenant colonel, Tammy Duckworth, K Harris, S Rice or Raimondo are "useful" idiots or a cat's paw for an imagined Bolshevik coup, what book would that be? I'm not going to promise to read the whole book as I have my reading list picked out. But I do promise to buy it and bring it along to dip into.

Book? Just watch the news. The entire party is moving left at breakneck speed. Duckworth, talking about Trump's speech at Mt. Rushmore, was at best uninformed, and at worst an outright liar. Susan Rice - just go back to the five Sunday morning appearances reiterating the video as the cause of Benghazi. I wouldn't trust her to bring me a drink of water. Harris would be the best of the bad bunch for me - I care little for whether she did or did not sleep her way to the top. Not a big deal for me. Raimundo I know little about. What qualifies her other than her last name? There are worse possibilities out there - Abrams for one. I wonder why you didn't list Bottoms, Demings, or some of the others. Whitmer would be a better choice, but apparently she is either too white or too moderate.

But they are all "useful idiots", even Biden, if they help pave the way for the far left to gain power and pass laws, even if they themselves are not the far left. It might be under the guise of compromise, or interior party politics, but they will in the end be no different than the Russian peasants who propelled Lenin to power.

As for surviving a Biden Presidency, I think I can last two years. The doctors say I am doing well. I would feel better if the 47th president was selected on some basis other than sex and ethnicity.

You mention Haley. I would have loved her to have been the 45th President instead of Trump. I would love for her to be the 46th or 47th president.

But the choices are Trump or Biden and the shadow gang behind him. I like a lot of what Trump has done, and I fear the shadow gang. The narrative that was thrust upon us was that Trump was a Russian puppet. I think Biden will be a puppet, and I don't know who is/will be pulling the strings, but I highly doubt they will be centrists.

I have as much or more basis to worry about a Biden win as you do to not worry about it.

wiki link Gina Raimondo

Current Gov of RI, prior to politics, VC - venture capitalist, not Viet Cong. I assume she's invested in making sure private property rights,and capitalism generally, continue for the foreseeable future.

Found that Duckworth interview on CNN - agree it's cringe worthy. Not the polish of a S Rice of K Harris. Haven't seen her enough to know if that was a one off.

Bottoms and Deemings - just not front of mind for me. No particular reason.

The claims she made were in direct contrast to what Trump actually said and to what I saw in the 15 minutes or so I watched the speech. Complete fiction. Like I said, at best uninformed, at worst a liar. I was giving her more credit for her service before that debacle.

Raimundo just went to the top of my list. Probably means she has no chance. But I have been fooled before by a Democrat masquerading as a business person, namely Jimmy Carter.

(07-13-2020 11:22 AM)ausowl Wrote:  wiki link Gina Raimondo
Current Gov of RI, prior to politics, VC - venture capitalist, not Viet Cong. I assume she's invested in making sure private property rights, and capitalism generally, continue for the foreseeable future.

She also clerked for Kimba Wood, so her resume is a bit of a mixed bag. I would not be as certain as you are that her time in the VC world has her that much of a fan of private property rights and capitalism as you seem to be. I have known plenty of VC's who were left of Stalin.

(07-13-2020 12:59 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(07-13-2020 11:22 AM)ausowl Wrote:  wiki link Gina Raimondo
Current Gov of RI, prior to politics, VC - venture capitalist, not Viet Cong. I assume she's invested in making sure private property rights, and capitalism generally, continue for the foreseeable future.

She also clerked for Kimba Wood, so her resume is a bit of a mixed bag.

Some appellate judges are known for purposefully hiring at least one law clerk at any given time who is ideologically opposite to the judge.

(Full disclosure: the judges I personally know of who've done this are all considered conservative, but presumably there are left-leaning judges who do the same. But maybe not!)

(07-11-2020 07:00 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-10-2020 11:15 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-10-2020 09:28 AM)Rice93 Wrote:  

(07-09-2020 03:33 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  The Breathe Act

This is the level of idiocy that makes it impossible for me to support any democrat, no matter how nice he is.

I presume all the democrats here support this - at the least they will vote for people who will support this. But if one of you does not support this, speak up.

A lot to unpack here... please don't equate lack of comments with support.

OK, take your time, but p-lease comment.

As for the rest of you, what is it that BLM says about silence?

Oh yeah

Had enough time yet?

My thanks to Ausowl. A special raspberry to Big.

(07-13-2020 12:05 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-13-2020 11:22 AM)ausowl Wrote:  

(07-12-2020 06:03 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-12-2020 04:43 PM)ausowl Wrote:  

(07-12-2020 04:20 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  More like the Bolsheviks, IMO. Or maybe the "useful idiots".

OO - I'm going on vacation next week (not to Taos, NM or Colorado, sadly, but all the way to a cabin by the Blanco River with limited wifi). If you could recommend one book that would give me insight as to why Tammy Duckworth, former U.S. Army lieutenant colonel, Tammy Duckworth, K Harris, S Rice or Raimondo are "useful" idiots or a cat's paw for an imagined Bolshevik coup, what book would that be? I'm not going to promise to read the whole book as I have my reading list picked out. But I do promise to buy it and bring it along to dip into.

Book? Just watch the news. The entire party is moving left at breakneck speed. Duckworth, talking about Trump's speech at Mt. Rushmore, was at best uninformed, and at worst an outright liar. Susan Rice - just go back to the five Sunday morning appearances reiterating the video as the cause of Benghazi. I wouldn't trust her to bring me a drink of water. Harris would be the best of the bad bunch for me - I care little for whether she did or did not sleep her way to the top. Not a big deal for me. Raimundo I know little about. What qualifies her other than her last name? There are worse possibilities out there - Abrams for one. I wonder why you didn't list Bottoms, Demings, or some of the others. Whitmer would be a better choice, but apparently she is either too white or too moderate.

But they are all "useful idiots", even Biden, if they help pave the way for the far left to gain power and pass laws, even if they themselves are not the far left. It might be under the guise of compromise, or interior party politics, but they will in the end be no different than the Russian peasants who propelled Lenin to power.

As for surviving a Biden Presidency, I think I can last two years. The doctors say I am doing well. I would feel better if the 47th president was selected on some basis other than sex and ethnicity.

You mention Haley. I would have loved her to have been the 45th President instead of Trump. I would love for her to be the 46th or 47th president.

But the choices are Trump or Biden and the shadow gang behind him. I like a lot of what Trump has done, and I fear the shadow gang. The narrative that was thrust upon us was that Trump was a Russian puppet. I think Biden will be a puppet, and I don't know who is/will be pulling the strings, but I highly doubt they will be centrists.

I have as much or more basis to worry about a Biden win as you do to not worry about it.

wiki link Gina Raimondo

Current Gov of RI, prior to politics, VC - venture capitalist, not Viet Cong. I assume she's invested in making sure private property rights,and capitalism generally, continue for the foreseeable future.

Found that Duckworth interview on CNN - agree it's cringe worthy. Not the polish of a S Rice of K Harris. Haven't seen her enough to know if that was a one off.

Bottoms and Deemings - just not front of mind for me. No particular reason.

The claims she made were in direct contrast to what Trump actually said and to what I saw in the 15 minutes or so I watched the speech. Complete fiction. Like I said, at best uninformed, at worst a liar. I was giving her more credit for her service before that debacle.

Raimundo just went to the top of my list. Probably means she has no chance. But I have been fooled before by a Democrat masquerading as a business person, namely Jimmy Carter.

Here is a woman I would like to see on the ballot for VP:

Mace

(07-14-2020 07:57 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-11-2020 07:00 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-10-2020 11:15 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-10-2020 09:28 AM)Rice93 Wrote:  

(07-09-2020 03:33 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  The Breathe Act

This is the level of idiocy that makes it impossible for me to support any democrat, no matter how nice he is.

I presume all the democrats here support this - at the least they will vote for people who will support this. But if one of you does not support this, speak up.

A lot to unpack here... please don't equate lack of comments with support.

OK, take your time, but p-lease comment.

As for the rest of you, what is it that BLM says about silence?

Oh yeah

Had enough time yet?

My thanks to Ausowl. A special raspberry to Big.

Sorry... I keep meaning to complete this assignment but it's a big one. I don't understand what "defund the police" actually means and I just can't bring myself to take the time to do it between my busy work schedule, movie nights with the family, a new hobby that I've started, and the swimming pool calling my name. I need to figure this out so I'll get to it eventually.

(07-14-2020 08:26 AM)Rice93 Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 07:57 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-11-2020 07:00 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-10-2020 11:15 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-10-2020 09:28 AM)Rice93 Wrote:  A lot to unpack here... please don't equate lack of comments with support.

OK, take your time, but p-lease comment.

As for the rest of you, what is it that BLM says about silence?

Oh yeah

Had enough time yet?

My thanks to Ausowl. A special raspberry to Big.

Sorry... I keep meaning to complete this assignment but it's a big one. I don't understand what "defund the police" actually means and I just can't bring myself to take the time to do it between my busy work schedule, movie nights with the family, a new hobby that I've started, and the swimming pool calling my name. I need to figure this out so I'll get to it eventually.

Credit for good intentions.

Good thing you still have a job if you have a pool to maintain.

(07-14-2020 08:26 AM)Rice93 Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 07:57 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-11-2020 07:00 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-10-2020 11:15 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-10-2020 09:28 AM)Rice93 Wrote:  A lot to unpack here... please don't equate lack of comments with support.

OK, take your time, but p-lease comment.

As for the rest of you, what is it that BLM says about silence?

Oh yeah

Had enough time yet?

My thanks to Ausowl. A special raspberry to Big.

Sorry... I keep meaning to complete this assignment but it's a big one. I don't understand what "defund the police" actually means and I just can't bring myself to take the time to do it between my busy work schedule, movie nights with the family, a new hobby that I've started, and the swimming pool calling my name. I need to figure this out so I'll get to it eventually.

I figured it was just you running away from everything but a knee jerk pithy one line rhetorical comment. Which seems to be in vogue.

I guess when you get antsy about Tucker's writer enough to keep responding to yourself about that, that issue overcomes the "very busy work schedule, movie nights with the family, a new hobby that I've started, and the swimming pool calling my name." Amazing that.

(07-14-2020 11:21 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 08:26 AM)Rice93 Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 07:57 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-11-2020 07:00 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-10-2020 11:15 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  OK, take your time, but p-lease comment.

As for the rest of you, what is it that BLM says about silence?

Oh yeah

Had enough time yet?

My thanks to Ausowl. A special raspberry to Big.

Sorry... I keep meaning to complete this assignment but it's a big one. I don't understand what "defund the police" actually means and I just can't bring myself to take the time to do it between my busy work schedule, movie nights with the family, a new hobby that I've started, and the swimming pool calling my name. I need to figure this out so I'll get to it eventually.

I figured it was just you running away from everything but a knee jerk pithy one line rhetorical comment. Which seems to be in vogue.

I guess when you get antsy about Tucker's writer enough to keep responding to yourself about that, that issue overcomes the "very busy work schedule, movie nights with the family, a new hobby that I've started, and the swimming pool calling my name." Amazing that.

Yeah... or I'm just busy and have better things to do.

This defunding the police thing isn't exactly a "gotcha" for me as I am guessing it is something that I would oppose. I'm not running away from this topic. I just don't want to comment on something about which I have zero insight.

Have a nice day.

tolerant progressives

Gonna be a real contest this fall to see who looks worse in front of a microphone...

(07-14-2020 11:32 AM)Rice93 Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 11:21 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 08:26 AM)Rice93 Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 07:57 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-11-2020 07:00 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  Had enough time yet?

My thanks to Ausowl. A special raspberry to Big.

Sorry... I keep meaning to complete this assignment but it's a big one. I don't understand what "defund the police" actually means and I just can't bring myself to take the time to do it between my busy work schedule, movie nights with the family, a new hobby that I've started, and the swimming pool calling my name. I need to figure this out so I'll get to it eventually.

I figured it was just you running away from everything but a knee jerk pithy one line rhetorical comment. Which seems to be in vogue.

I guess when you get antsy about Tucker's writer enough to keep responding to yourself about that, that issue overcomes the "very busy work schedule, movie nights with the family, a new hobby that I've started, and the swimming pool calling my name." Amazing that.

Yeah... or I'm just busy and have better things to do.

This defunding the police thing isn't exactly a "gotcha" for me as I am guessing it is something that I would oppose. I'm not running away from this topic. I just don't want to comment on something about which I have zero insight.

Have a nice day.

Yet when the people you elect and support start doing these things, you wash your hands of the matter by saying "I oppose this".

(07-15-2020 04:43 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 11:32 AM)Rice93 Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 11:21 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 08:26 AM)Rice93 Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 07:57 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  My thanks to Ausowl. A special raspberry to Big.

Sorry... I keep meaning to complete this assignment but it's a big one. I don't understand what "defund the police" actually means and I just can't bring myself to take the time to do it between my busy work schedule, movie nights with the family, a new hobby that I've started, and the swimming pool calling my name. I need to figure this out so I'll get to it eventually.

I figured it was just you running away from everything but a knee jerk pithy one line rhetorical comment. Which seems to be in vogue.

I guess when you get antsy about Tucker's writer enough to keep responding to yourself about that, that issue overcomes the "very busy work schedule, movie nights with the family, a new hobby that I've started, and the swimming pool calling my name." Amazing that.

Yeah... or I'm just busy and have better things to do.

This defunding the police thing isn't exactly a "gotcha" for me as I am guessing it is something that I would oppose. I'm not running away from this topic. I just don't want to comment on something about which I have zero insight.

Have a nice day.

Yet when the people you elect and support start doing these things, you wash your hands of the matter by saying "I oppose this".

Yeah... that's what you have to do when you have a two-party system that has moved to the extremes. Moderates are left out in the cold.

(07-15-2020 09:12 PM)Rice93 Wrote:  

(07-15-2020 04:43 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 11:32 AM)Rice93 Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 11:21 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(07-14-2020 08:26 AM)Rice93 Wrote:  Sorry... I keep meaning to complete this assignment but it's a big one. I don't understand what "defund the police" actually means and I just can't bring myself to take the time to do it between my busy work schedule, movie nights with the family, a new hobby that I've started, and the swimming pool calling my name. I need to figure this out so I'll get to it eventually.

I figured it was just you running away from everything but a knee jerk pithy one line rhetorical comment. Which seems to be in vogue.

I guess when you get antsy about Tucker's writer enough to keep responding to yourself about that, that issue overcomes the "very busy work schedule, movie nights with the family, a new hobby that I've started, and the swimming pool calling my name." Amazing that.

Yeah... or I'm just busy and have better things to do.

This defunding the police thing isn't exactly a "gotcha" for me as I am guessing it is something that I would oppose. I'm not running away from this topic. I just don't want to comment on something about which I have zero insight.

Have a nice day.

Yet when the people you elect and support start doing these things, you wash your hands of the matter by saying "I oppose this".

Yeah... that's what you have to do when you have a two-party system that has moved to the extremes. Moderates are left out in the cold.

Alas, from what I see in social media, the typical lament is "It's too bad the other party has become so extreme."

(07-16-2020 10:18 AM)georgewebb Wrote:  

(07-15-2020 09:12 PM)Rice93 Wrote:  Yeah... that's what you have to do when you have a two-party system that has moved to the extremes. Moderates are left out in the cold.

Alas, from what I see in social media, the typical lament is "It's too bad the other party has become so extreme."

I hate to say it, but I still think the primary system is to blame for a lot of this. I thought it was a great idea to give, "power to the people," but it just hasn't worked well. Back when the party pros picked the candidates in the proverbial, "smoke-filled rooms," the only consideration was electability, because if the other guys won, you weren't going to get the spoils of victory. So the incentive was to pick centrists who could pick up votes from the independents and even the other side. Look at Truman-Dewey, or Ike-Stevenson twice, or Kennedy-Nixon, and they weren't nearly as far apart on issues as today's candidates are.

With primaries, the extreme wings of both parties are the people who show up and vote in disproportionate numbers. So to win the primaries, you have to go extreme. I don't know what the solution might be, but I do see the problem.

And 93, you're no moderate. I know the republicans look extreme to you, but if the democrats do as well, then they have really gone off the deep end.

(07-16-2020 11:13 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(07-16-2020 10:18 AM)georgewebb Wrote:  

(07-15-2020 09:12 PM)Rice93 Wrote:  Yeah... that's what you have to do when you have a two-party system that has moved to the extremes. Moderates are left out in the cold.

Alas, from what I see in social media, the typical lament is "It's too bad the other party has become so extreme."

I hate to say it, but I still think the primary system is to blame for a lot of this. I thought it was a great idea to give, "power to the people," but it just hasn't worked well. Back when the party pros picked the candidates in the proverbial, "smoke-filled rooms," the only consideration was electability, because if the other guys won, you weren't going to get the spoils of victory. So the incentive was to pick centrists who could pick up votes from the independents and even the other side. Look at Truman-Dewey, or Ike-Stevenson twice, or Kennedy-Nixon, and they weren't nearly as far apart on issues as today's candidates are.

With primaries, the extreme wings of both parties are the people who show up and vote in disproportionate numbers. So to win the primaries, you have to go extreme. I don't know what the solution might be, but I do see the problem.

And 93, you're no moderate. I know the republicans look extreme to you, but if the democrats do as well, then they have really gone off the deep end.

I'm pretty moderate on quite a few issues, actually. Probably the ones where I am farther left are the ones that I comment on.

You probably don't see me commenting on, for example, tax policy.

(07-16-2020 11:13 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(07-16-2020 10:18 AM)georgewebb Wrote:  

(07-15-2020 09:12 PM)Rice93 Wrote:  Yeah... that's what you have to do when you have a two-party system that has moved to the extremes. Moderates are left out in the cold.

Alas, from what I see in social media, the typical lament is "It's too bad the other party has become so extreme."

I hate to say it, but I still think the primary system is to blame for a lot of this. I thought it was a great idea to give, "power to the people," but it just hasn't worked well. Back when the party pros picked the candidates in the proverbial, "smoke-filled rooms," the only consideration was electability, because if the other guys won, you weren't going to get the spoils of victory. So the incentive was to pick centrists who could pick up votes from the independents and even the other side. Look at Truman-Dewey, or Ike-Stevenson twice, or Kennedy-Nixon, and they weren't nearly as far apart on issues as today's candidates are.

Indeed, an astonishing feature of the Kennedy-Nixon debates (for those who actually watch or listen to them, rather than than just accepting the received wisdom about Kennedy's charisma) is how nearly identical the candidates' positions were -- and in particular, how staunchly anti-Communist they both were, especially with respect to Red China.

The popular press forgets just how hawkish Kennedy was.

(07-16-2020 01:17 PM)Rice93 Wrote:  I'm pretty moderate on quite a few issues, actually. Probably the ones where I am farther left are the ones that I comment on.
You probably don't see me commenting on, for example, tax policy.

Moderate on some issues and far left on others is not moderate. Left on some issues and right on others could average out to moderate. But moderate on some and left on others averages out to left.

Just for information, what are your basic thoughts on tax policy?

(07-16-2020 01:27 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(07-16-2020 01:17 PM)Rice93 Wrote:  I'm pretty moderate on quite a few issues, actually. Probably the ones where I am farther left are the ones that I comment on.
You probably don't see me commenting on, for example, tax policy.

Moderate on some issues and far left on others is not moderate. Left on some issues and right on others could average out to moderate. But moderate on some and left on others averages out to left.

Just for information, what are your basic thoughts on tax policy?

I fall much more on the side of people who work hard and earn a good living should not be taken to the woodshed by the IRS than the Bernie Sanders (Sanders’es? Sanders’s? Help, George!) of the world.

*edit* If it helps clarify my position... my picks for Dem nominee were Klobacher or Buttigieg.

(07-16-2020 01:32 PM)Rice93 Wrote:  

(07-16-2020 01:27 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(07-16-2020 01:17 PM)Rice93 Wrote:  I'm pretty moderate on quite a few issues, actually. Probably the ones where I am farther left are the ones that I comment on.
You probably don't see me commenting on, for example, tax policy.

Moderate on some issues and far left on others is not moderate. Left on some issues and right on others could average out to moderate. But moderate on some and left on others averages out to left.

Just for information, what are your basic thoughts on tax policy?

I fall much more on the side of people who work hard and earn a good living should not be taken to the woodshed by the IRS than the Bernie Sanders (Sanders’es? Sanders’s? Help, George!) of the world.

*edit* If it helps clarify my position... my picks for Dem nominee were Klobacher or Buttigieg.

Well, if that kind of stuff makes anybody feel better, my picks for Republican nominee were Nikki Haley and Tim Scott.

Actually, the same two were my picks for Democratic nominee, too.

In a perfect world we would have to choose, Haley v. Scott.

But we are left with Trump vs. the marionette. There is no way we will get a centrist.