(01-22-2020 09:31 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 09:26 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 09:09 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 09:04 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 08:36 PM)stever20 Wrote:  In this situation though how can you blame Boise at all? MWC promised certain things, and by all looks they haven't followed thru on it- and are threatening to even go further next time....

MWC may have agreed to a **** deal, but it's just that, a deal...

Only if you believe a lawyer's briefs. But that's like believing anything you read in National Enquirer. It may or may not have anything at all to do with reality.

of course you think the deal that Boise signed has an expiration date, which by all measures looks like that's dead wrong, so I'll take that with an utter grain of salt.. Boise got certain rights that CAN NOT be taken away.

You don't seem to understand a basic fact about contract law. You can't force someone to do something. Slavery is not legal in the US. You can only have financial damages.

If the MWC doesn't want to put up with Boise, they can kick them out. And as long as they gave them adequate notice, their share of basketball revenues and conference assets and no exit fee, its hard to see them justifying any significant damages. Or they could all leave the MWC as they left the WAC and leave the MWC to Boise. Maybe a bunch of them go back to the WAC.

You are right that they can kick Boise out.

What they can't do is leave the MWC as they left the WAC. They would lose their G5 spot. Also would lose all of their NCAA tournament money.

What they can't do is keep the structure as is, but change what they agreed to with Boise.

They wouldn’t lose the G5 spot if the MW is dissolved and the new conference take the MW spot.
It may be worth it to the schools they been down the road before when split from the WAC.

Short term loss for long term gain.

If Boise were no longer in the MWC, either by leaving or being removed, would the MWC look to fill just that opening, or expand to 14?

I've heard the MWC wants back into Texas. Would bringing the central timezone back to the MWC create an increase in media value for the conference? If it does, where is the sweat spot? One Texas program, or three?

I know UTEP fans are interested in returning to the MWC, but I don't know where any of other C-USA Texas programs stand. I do think that if the MWC wanted to move to 14 programs taking a block of three C-USA Texas programs might make a lot of sense. Based on how poorly C-USA has been run over the last 6 seasons, I think the MWC could poach from C-USA Texas programs.

Thoughts?

(01-22-2020 10:14 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  If Boise were no longer in the MWC, either by leaving or being removed, would the MWC look to fill just that opening, or expand to 14?

I've heard the MWC wants back into Texas. Would bringing the central timezone back to the MWC create an increase in media value for the conference? If it does, where is the sweat spot? One Texas program, or three?

I know UTEP fans are interested in returning to the MWC, but I don't know where any of other C-USA Texas programs stand. I do think that if the MWC wanted to move to 14 programs taking a block of three C-USA Texas programs might make a lot of sense. Based on how poorly C-USA has been run over the last 6 seasons, I think the MWC could poach from C-USA Texas programs.

Thoughts?

I think they stay at 12 with UTEP but kick out Hawaii and add NSMU. Other then taking lower pay and week zero does Hawaii add anything to the conference? Maybe a random 13th game.

Do the front range schools really pine for UTEP though? If they did you’d think UTEP would be added by now.

(01-22-2020 10:22 PM)46566 Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 10:14 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  If Boise were no longer in the MWC, either by leaving or being removed, would the MWC look to fill just that opening, or expand to 14?

I've heard the MWC wants back into Texas. Would bringing the central timezone back to the MWC create an increase in media value for the conference? If it does, where is the sweat spot? One Texas program, or three?

I know UTEP fans are interested in returning to the MWC, but I don't know where any of other C-USA Texas programs stand. I do think that if the MWC wanted to move to 14 programs taking a block of three C-USA Texas programs might make a lot of sense. Based on how poorly C-USA has been run over the last 6 seasons, I think the MWC could poach from C-USA Texas programs.

Thoughts?

I think they stay at 12 with UTEP but kick out Hawaii and add NSMU. Other then taking lower pay and week zero does Hawaii add anything to the conference? Maybe a random 13th game.

I don't see Hawaii getting the boot. They are a know brand and a football only member. The 13th game for those scheduling Hawaii and the Hawaii Bowl are nice extras for the MWC.

While I don't think Boise will exit the MWC, if they did, staying at 11 wouldn't be a long term option. Even the AAC only got a 2 year waiver.

(01-22-2020 09:31 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 09:26 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 09:09 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 09:04 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 08:36 PM)stever20 Wrote:  In this situation though how can you blame Boise at all? MWC promised certain things, and by all looks they haven't followed thru on it- and are threatening to even go further next time....

MWC may have agreed to a **** deal, but it's just that, a deal...

Only if you believe a lawyer's briefs. But that's like believing anything you read in National Enquirer. It may or may not have anything at all to do with reality.

of course you think the deal that Boise signed has an expiration date, which by all measures looks like that's dead wrong, so I'll take that with an utter grain of salt.. Boise got certain rights that CAN NOT be taken away.

You don't seem to understand a basic fact about contract law. You can't force someone to do something. Slavery is not legal in the US. You can only have financial damages.

If the MWC doesn't want to put up with Boise, they can kick them out. And as long as they gave them adequate notice, their share of basketball revenues and conference assets and no exit fee, its hard to see them justifying any significant damages. Or they could all leave the MWC as they left the WAC and leave the MWC to Boise. Maybe a bunch of them go back to the WAC.

You are right that they can kick Boise out.

What they can't do is leave the MWC as they left the WAC. They would lose their G5 spot. Also would lose all of their NCAA tournament money.

What they can't do is keep the structure as is, but change what they agreed to with Boise.

G5 is negotiated. If a conference loses over half its members, the NCAA money goes to the school that earns it, so they don't really lose it. And they can choose to pool it if they want. They probably keep their NCAA bid whereever they go because of the continuity rules (but I can't say I'm certain of that).

(01-22-2020 10:26 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Do the front range schools really pine for UTEP though? If they did you’d think UTEP would be added by now.

UTEP said no and San Jose State said yes in 2011.

Had UTEP said yes, I wonder what would’ve happened to SJSU. Football only in the Sun Belt like Idaho and NMSU? Independence? Drop to FCS? Basketball and Olympic sports would’ve been a good addition to the Big West. It’s water under the bridge now but it would’ve been interesting what path they were going to choose.

(01-22-2020 10:14 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  If Boise were no longer in the MWC, either by leaving or being removed, would the MWC look to fill just that opening, or expand to 14?

I've heard the MWC wants back into Texas. Would bringing the central timezone back to the MWC create an increase in media value for the conference? If it does, where is the sweat spot? One Texas program, or three?

I know UTEP fans are interested in returning to the MWC, but I don't know where any of other C-USA Texas programs stand. I do think that if the MWC wanted to move to 14 programs taking a block of three C-USA Texas programs might make a lot of sense. Based on how poorly C-USA has been run over the last 6 seasons, I think the MWC could poach from C-USA Texas programs.

Thoughts?

Didn’t UNT rejected the WAC not once but twice when they were in the Sun Belt? The MWC minus Boise (even with them) is literally the WAC that UNT rejected. C-USA West is the best situation for UNT, UTSA and Louisiana Tech. Rice is an AAC West school with a C-USA logo on their field and court while UTEP has history with the Front Range schools. I would say get rid of Judy and maybe things will get better for the conference.

(01-22-2020 10:14 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  If Boise were no longer in the MWC, either by leaving or being removed, would the MWC look to fill just that opening, or expand to 14?

I've heard the MWC wants back into Texas. Would bringing the central timezone back to the MWC create an increase in media value for the conference? If it does, where is the sweat spot? One Texas program, or three?

I know UTEP fans are interested in returning to the MWC, but I don't know where any of other C-USA Texas programs stand. I do think that if the MWC wanted to move to 14 programs taking a block of three C-USA Texas programs might make a lot of sense. Based on how poorly C-USA has been run over the last 6 seasons, I think the MWC could poach from C-USA Texas programs.

Thoughts?

They will ask Fox and CBS what they think. UTEP, North Texas and Rice would be the 3, if they add that many. I suspect they only add 1. North Texas would have a good shot at the 1 slot, but maybe its UTEP. Don't think Rice gets in unless its 3.

Really don't see them taking NMSU unless they do a couple good runs in the NCAA. Football is historically bad and they are already in New Mexico.

(01-23-2020 11:33 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 10:14 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  If Boise were no longer in the MWC, either by leaving or being removed, would the MWC look to fill just that opening, or expand to 14?

I've heard the MWC wants back into Texas. Would bringing the central timezone back to the MWC create an increase in media value for the conference? If it does, where is the sweat spot? One Texas program, or three?

I know UTEP fans are interested in returning to the MWC, but I don't know where any of other C-USA Texas programs stand. I do think that if the MWC wanted to move to 14 programs taking a block of three C-USA Texas programs might make a lot of sense. Based on how poorly C-USA has been run over the last 6 seasons, I think the MWC could poach from C-USA Texas programs.

Thoughts?

They will ask Fox and CBS what they think. UTEP, North Texas and Rice would be the 3, if they add that many. I suspect they only add 1. North Texas would have a good shot at the 1 slot, but maybe its UTEP. Don't think Rice gets in unless its 3.

Really don't see them taking NMSU unless they do a couple good runs in the NCAA. Football is historically bad and they are already in New Mexico.

NMSU would be the easiest option as the MW wouldn’t be raiding CUSA. If WAC switches from NMSU to BSU. There is no loss basically.
No difference in football really between UTEP and NMSU but the Aggies bring a strong basketball product which would be a net gain for the MW.

(01-23-2020 11:52 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  

(01-23-2020 11:33 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 10:14 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  If Boise were no longer in the MWC, either by leaving or being removed, would the MWC look to fill just that opening, or expand to 14?

I've heard the MWC wants back into Texas. Would bringing the central timezone back to the MWC create an increase in media value for the conference? If it does, where is the sweat spot? One Texas program, or three?

I know UTEP fans are interested in returning to the MWC, but I don't know where any of other C-USA Texas programs stand. I do think that if the MWC wanted to move to 14 programs taking a block of three C-USA Texas programs might make a lot of sense. Based on how poorly C-USA has been run over the last 6 seasons, I think the MWC could poach from C-USA Texas programs.

Thoughts?

They will ask Fox and CBS what they think. UTEP, North Texas and Rice would be the 3, if they add that many. I suspect they only add 1. North Texas would have a good shot at the 1 slot, but maybe its UTEP. Don't think Rice gets in unless its 3.

Really don't see them taking NMSU unless they do a couple good runs in the NCAA. Football is historically bad and they are already in New Mexico.

NMSU would be the easiest option as the MW wouldn’t be raiding CUSA. If WAC switches from NMSU to BSU. There is no loss basically.
No difference in football really between UTEP and NMSU but the Aggies bring a strong basketball product which would be a net gain for the MW.

UTEP has a basketball national title and better fan support. When they are successful in football, vastly better fan support. Plus they have a history with the MWC schools. UTEP vs. NMSU and UTEP wins every time.

(01-23-2020 12:09 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-23-2020 11:52 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  

(01-23-2020 11:33 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 10:14 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  If Boise were no longer in the MWC, either by leaving or being removed, would the MWC look to fill just that opening, or expand to 14?

I've heard the MWC wants back into Texas. Would bringing the central timezone back to the MWC create an increase in media value for the conference? If it does, where is the sweat spot? One Texas program, or three?

I know UTEP fans are interested in returning to the MWC, but I don't know where any of other C-USA Texas programs stand. I do think that if the MWC wanted to move to 14 programs taking a block of three C-USA Texas programs might make a lot of sense. Based on how poorly C-USA has been run over the last 6 seasons, I think the MWC could poach from C-USA Texas programs.

Thoughts?

They will ask Fox and CBS what they think. UTEP, North Texas and Rice would be the 3, if they add that many. I suspect they only add 1. North Texas would have a good shot at the 1 slot, but maybe its UTEP. Don't think Rice gets in unless its 3.

Really don't see them taking NMSU unless they do a couple good runs in the NCAA. Football is historically bad and they are already in New Mexico.

NMSU would be the easiest option as the MW wouldn’t be raiding CUSA. If WAC switches from NMSU to BSU. There is no loss basically.
No difference in football really between UTEP and NMSU but the Aggies bring a strong basketball product which would be a net gain for the MW.

UTEP has a basketball national title and better fan support. When they are successful in football, vastly better fan support. Plus they have a history with the MWC schools. UTEP vs. NMSU and UTEP wins every time.

As much as I respect New Mexico State (my father attended New Mexico Highlands University in the 1950s and casually roots for NMSU), I agree with Bullet. UTEP should be the MWC choice over NMSU. But that's just one man's opinion. Others will see it differently.

(01-22-2020 10:00 PM)MWC Tex Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 09:31 PM)stever20 Wrote:  You are right that they can kick Boise out.

What they can't do is leave the MWC as they left the WAC. They would lose their G5 spot. Also would lose all of their NCAA tournament money.

What they can't do is keep the structure as is, but change what they agreed to with Boise.

They wouldn’t lose the G5 spot if the MW is dissolved and the new conference take the MW spot.

Of course they would: it's the MWC that has the continuity that allows the Tourney autobid, it's the MWC that is the party to the CFP contract. The schools walk away from the MWC charter, they walk away from both of those. Whether they could talk the CFP into letting them replace the old MWC, that I don't know, but the Tourney autobid would be gone for eight years.

Quote: It may be worth it to the schools they been down the road before when split from the WAC.

That was under a different system of rules. Pre-2011, continuity was a group of schools playing each other. And pre-CFP, the non-AQ conferences were just the FBS conference that were not automatic qualifiers in the BCS system.

(01-23-2020 12:15 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(01-23-2020 12:09 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-23-2020 11:52 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  

(01-23-2020 11:33 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 10:14 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  If Boise were no longer in the MWC, either by leaving or being removed, would the MWC look to fill just that opening, or expand to 14?

I've heard the MWC wants back into Texas. Would bringing the central timezone back to the MWC create an increase in media value for the conference? If it does, where is the sweat spot? One Texas program, or three?

I know UTEP fans are interested in returning to the MWC, but I don't know where any of other C-USA Texas programs stand. I do think that if the MWC wanted to move to 14 programs taking a block of three C-USA Texas programs might make a lot of sense. Based on how poorly C-USA has been run over the last 6 seasons, I think the MWC could poach from C-USA Texas programs.

Thoughts?

They will ask Fox and CBS what they think. UTEP, North Texas and Rice would be the 3, if they add that many. I suspect they only add 1. North Texas would have a good shot at the 1 slot, but maybe its UTEP. Don't think Rice gets in unless its 3.

Really don't see them taking NMSU unless they do a couple good runs in the NCAA. Football is historically bad and they are already in New Mexico.

NMSU would be the easiest option as the MW wouldn’t be raiding CUSA. If WAC switches from NMSU to BSU. There is no loss basically.
No difference in football really between UTEP and NMSU but the Aggies bring a strong basketball product which would be a net gain for the MW.

UTEP has a basketball national title and better fan support. When they are successful in football, vastly better fan support. Plus they have a history with the MWC schools. UTEP vs. NMSU and UTEP wins every time.

As much as I respect New Mexico State (my father attended New Mexico Highland University in the 1950s and casually roots for NMSU), I agree with Bullet. UTEP should be the MWC choice over NMSU. But that's just one man's opinion. Others will see it differently.

Its been a while, but UTEP also has a number of NCAA titles in Track & Field. They are 2nd behind Arkansas with 7.

(01-23-2020 11:52 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  NMSU would be the easiest option as the MW wouldn’t be raiding CUSA.

That makes it easier to the MWC ... how, exactly?

Easier for NMSU to join, to be sure, ...

... but UTEP would take the invite, so just as easy to offer it to UTEP ... and the MWC would prefer UTEP.

The gift to NMSU is if CUSA uses them to replace UTEP.

If Boise State Left The MWC, Would That Move Impact BYU?
https://kslsports.com/426873/boise-state...-football/

(01-23-2020 12:39 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-23-2020 12:15 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(01-23-2020 12:09 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-23-2020 11:52 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  

(01-23-2020 11:33 AM)bullet Wrote:  They will ask Fox and CBS what they think. UTEP, North Texas and Rice would be the 3, if they add that many. I suspect they only add 1. North Texas would have a good shot at the 1 slot, but maybe its UTEP. Don't think Rice gets in unless its 3.

Really don't see them taking NMSU unless they do a couple good runs in the NCAA. Football is historically bad and they are already in New Mexico.

NMSU would be the easiest option as the MW wouldn’t be raiding CUSA. If WAC switches from NMSU to BSU. There is no loss basically.
No difference in football really between UTEP and NMSU but the Aggies bring a strong basketball product which would be a net gain for the MW.

UTEP has a basketball national title and better fan support. When they are successful in football, vastly better fan support. Plus they have a history with the MWC schools. UTEP vs. NMSU and UTEP wins every time.

As much as I respect New Mexico State (my father attended New Mexico Highland University in the 1950s and casually roots for NMSU), I agree with Bullet. UTEP should be the MWC choice over NMSU. But that's just one man's opinion. Others will see it differently.

Its been a while, but UTEP also has a number of NCAA titles in Track & Field. They are 2nd behind Arkansas with 7.

Good point. That's worth something, no doubt.

(01-23-2020 01:19 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  

(01-23-2020 11:52 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  NMSU would be the easiest option as the MW wouldn’t be raiding CUSA.

That makes it easier to the MWC ... how, exactly?

Easier for NMSU to join, to be sure, ...

... but UTEP would take the invite, so just as easy to offer it to UTEP ... and the MWC would prefer UTEP.

The gift to NMSU is if CUSA uses them to replace UTEP.

Easiest because the MW wouldn’t be seen raiding a conference. NMSU doesn’t have an exit fee.

Besides if the MW took UTEP, CUSA would take Texas St instead and Tx St would love to be in CUSA West.

(01-23-2020 03:38 PM)MWC Tex Wrote:  

(01-23-2020 01:19 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  

(01-23-2020 11:52 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  NMSU would be the easiest option as the MW wouldn’t be raiding CUSA.

That makes it easier to the MWC ... how, exactly?

Easier for NMSU to join, to be sure, ...

... but UTEP would take the invite, so just as easy to offer it to UTEP ... and the MWC would prefer UTEP.

The gift to NMSU is if CUSA uses them to replace UTEP.

Easiest because the MW wouldn’t be seen raiding a conference. NMSU doesn’t have an exit fee.

Besides if the MW took UTEP, CUSA would take Texas St instead and Tx St would love to be in CUSA West.

MWC has never been bashful for raiding a conference.

If Boise does leave, I think Rice and UTEP would be the first looked at. They were, after all, mentioned as expansion candidates a few years ago.

Boise becoming an Independent is interesting because with their track record they can make an argument Independent teams should be included in the “G5” NY6 spot. Independent alliances formed in the past and secured their own referees and bowl bids (Independence and Liberty come to mind). I even remember an article where Notre Dame was the Independent rep at an NCAA meeting of the minds. Boise would have the ability to schedule more P5 teams and create their own media deal.

Just like the music industry with singles, I think we’ll see more Independent teams like the days of yore.