Didn’t see any mention of Xavier in the comparison. They’re still part of the Big East, right? If you just compare the last 5 years, BE has 5.6 bids per year. AAC has 3. Just there, the difference is obvious.

(06-26-2019 06:34 PM)spenser Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:23 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:07 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I think this is a mistake on UConn. Going to the Big East is a downgrade.

It's not. It just isn't. Even if it was a lateral move (which it isn't) it's still an upgrade because of the historical/geographic connections and the tournament. People just don't like the idea of a school where football isn't the driving force.

It is a big downgrade. The Big East is Villanova and 9 Atlantic 10 level basketball schools at this point. Cincinnati, Houston, Temple, and Memphis will be a better group than anything Big East has going forward and Wichita State, UCF, and SMU have shown to be better than the middle of Big East.

All those teams UCONN remembers playing are gone beside Nova and Georgetown.

Every single Big East team made a post season tournament this year. All but DePaul made the NCAA or NIT

A good deal for the BE. Will it be so great with UConn and the football program? I am happy for the move in BB, but the football is another issue. It reads like the UConn fans, in general, will be happy which is all that matters..

(06-26-2019 08:10 PM)TDenverFan Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:34 PM)spenser Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:23 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:07 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I think this is a mistake on UConn. Going to the Big East is a downgrade.

It's not. It just isn't. Even if it was a lateral move (which it isn't) it's still an upgrade because of the historical/geographic connections and the tournament. People just don't like the idea of a school where football isn't the driving force.

It is a big downgrade. The Big East is Villanova and 9 Atlantic 10 level basketball schools at this point. Cincinnati, Houston, Temple, and Memphis will be a better group than anything Big East has going forward and Wichita State, UCF, and SMU have shown to be better than the middle of Big East.

All those teams UCONN remembers playing are gone beside Nova and Georgetown.

Every single Big East team made a post season tournament this year. All but DePaul made the NCAA or NIT

They were a 2 bid conference, got a 3rd team on BS. The old school NE NYC playground ball to a scholly is long gone. SMU or Hosuton in better positioned recruiting Nigerian Americans in Texas than the 10 thousand DI programs in the NE.

(06-26-2019 08:24 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 08:10 PM)TDenverFan Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:34 PM)spenser Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:23 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:07 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I think this is a mistake on UConn. Going to the Big East is a downgrade.

It's not. It just isn't. Even if it was a lateral move (which it isn't) it's still an upgrade because of the historical/geographic connections and the tournament. People just don't like the idea of a school where football isn't the driving force.

It is a big downgrade. The Big East is Villanova and 9 Atlantic 10 level basketball schools at this point. Cincinnati, Houston, Temple, and Memphis will be a better group than anything Big East has going forward and Wichita State, UCF, and SMU have shown to be better than the middle of Big East.

All those teams UCONN remembers playing are gone beside Nova and Georgetown.

Every single Big East team made a post season tournament this year. All but DePaul made the NCAA or NIT

They were a 2 bid conference, got a 3rd team on BS. The old school NE NYC playground ball to a scholly is long gone. SMU or Hosuton in better positioned recruiting Nigerian Americans in Texas than the 10 thousand DI programs in the NE.

Got 4 teams in last year.

(06-26-2019 07:50 PM)PicksUp Wrote:  Didn’t see any mention of Xavier in the comparison. They’re still part of the Big East, right? If you just compare the last 5 years, BE has 5.6 bids per year. AAC has 3. Just there, the difference is obvious.

I listed X's Sweet 16s, I counted their tournament apperances.

(06-26-2019 08:24 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 08:10 PM)TDenverFan Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:34 PM)spenser Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:23 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:07 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I think this is a mistake on UConn. Going to the Big East is a downgrade.

It's not. It just isn't. Even if it was a lateral move (which it isn't) it's still an upgrade because of the historical/geographic connections and the tournament. People just don't like the idea of a school where football isn't the driving force.

It is a big downgrade. The Big East is Villanova and 9 Atlantic 10 level basketball schools at this point. Cincinnati, Houston, Temple, and Memphis will be a better group than anything Big East has going forward and Wichita State, UCF, and SMU have shown to be better than the middle of Big East.

All those teams UCONN remembers playing are gone beside Nova and Georgetown.

Every single Big East team made a post season tournament this year. All but DePaul made the NCAA or NIT

They were a 2 bid conference, got a 3rd team on BS. The old school NE NYC playground ball to a scholly is long gone. SMU or Hosuton in better positioned recruiting Nigerian Americans in Texas than the 10 thousand DI programs in the NE.

Can you name one Nigerian-American or Nigerian on either roster?

(06-26-2019 03:30 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  JUST HOOK IT TO MY VEINS!

EDIT 1.

Quote:Following the Execution Date, the University shall immediately take steps and all other actions to facilitate withdrawal from the AAC in accordance with the
governing documents of all varsity sports sponsored by the Conference on terms acceptable to the University as soon as practical, but in no event later than June 30, 2022 (the Withdrawal) and
(ii) comply in all respects with any of the University's other agreements or enforceable obligations that relate to such Withdrawal. It is understood that if the University has not joined the Conference and begun participation as a full member by July 1, 2022, this Agreement shall be terminable by
the Conference under Section 11(a)(ii).

So UConn might be joining in 2020-21, or 2021-22, or 2022-23. So I can stop feverishly filling notebooks with plans for indy schedules for 2020.

EDIT 2.
SEction 11 ©. If UConn "does a TCU" and joins a P5 before their Entrance Date, they pay the Big East $30M.

Quote: The University acknowledges and agrees that in the event this
Agreement is terminated by the Conference pursuant to Section ll(a)(ii), vi or
at any time prior to the Entrance Date or the University otherwise refuses, is unable or otherwise fails to join the Conference on the Entrance Date for any reason whatsoever (each of and a ?Triggering Event?), the Conference and the other Members will suffer substantial damages, the amount of which is dif?cult to predict and cannot be measured with precision. Accordingly, upon the occurrence of any Triggering Event, then, in addition to the Conference?s right to retain any amount previously paid by the University hereunder, and without limiting any other right or remedy that may be available to the Conference hereunder, the University shall pay to the Conference, as liquidated damages and not as a penalty, and as a genuine and reasonable pre-estimate of the actual damages that would likely be suffered by the Conference under such circumstances, an amount in cash equal to $30,000,000 (?Liquidated Damages?) on the date of the Triggering Event. Payment of the Liquidated Damages will be made in full satisfaction of all of the University?s obligations to the Conference as a result of the termination of this Agreement; provided, that in addition to the Liquidated Damages, the Conference shall continue to have the - right to recover from the University any Losses for which the University has agreed to reimburse the Conference Reirnbursees under Section 9 above that arise from or relate to any third party claim.

After reading the contract—I have to admit to one other surprise at the very end. After all the whining and gnashing of teeth over the loss of the income from SNY broadcasts of UConn Women’s Basketball—-it appears from my reading that UConn signed over the rights to ALL club and varsity sports events (including midnight madness) to the Big East. The only thing they retained as best I can tell is local radio rights. The media rights section appears at the very end of the contract. If that’s the case, the only extra money UConn will get from SNY is from a possible football deal.

(06-26-2019 06:39 PM)MWC Tex Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:23 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:07 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I think this is a mistake on UConn. Going to the Big East is a downgrade.

It's not. It just isn't. Even if it was a lateral move (which it isn't) it's still an upgrade because of the historical/geographic connections and the tournament. People just don't like the idea of a school where football isn't the driving force.

They are moving to a Power conference in basketball. It just now is more powerful with UConn in it.

Less powerful, four of the last five years...

Massey Composite
2019 BE Avg = 67, UConn finished 108
2018 BE Avg = 52, UConn finished 152
2017 BE Avg = 63, UConn finished 102
2016 BE Avg = 73, UConn finished 29
2015 BE Avg = 63, UConn finished 76

Here's an update on the UConn to Big East story - we now have access to the contract ..Thanks Hokie Mark...
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/...tract.html

From Hokie Marks Blog:

Some comments on this document:

Confirms that UConn's exit from the AAC requires "27 months prior written notice of withdrawal and a payment of $10 million."


The Big East considers UConn a flight risk as long as they maintain an FBS football program, so the put a special exit fee provision in their contract with the Huskies: if UConn withdraws from the Big East in the first 6 years, they would owe a $30 millioin exit fee (or the current standard exit fee if that is greater). If they withdraw in years 7 through 9, the exit fee is at least $15 million, and in year 10 the fee drops to $10 million. After that, UConn would be subject to the same exit fee as the rest of the conference.

The official entrance date for UConn joining the Big East is "as soon as practical, but in no event later than June 30, 2022". Furthermore, "if the University has not joined the [Big East] Conference and begun participation as a full member by July 1, 2022, this Agreement shall be terminable by the Conference..."

There's a bunch of legalese and mumbo-jumbo after that, but I doubt most of you are all that interested - you just want to know (a) when it all goes down, and (b) how much is it going to cost them.

[side note: I thought it was interesting that the Big East is described in this document as "a Delaware nonprofit corporation". For one thing, I thought it was based in Rhode Island. Furthermore, the Big East doesn't have any teams actually located in Delaware!]

Link
https://accfootballrx.blogspot.com/2019/...62719.html

So will UCONN play in the AAC until 1 July 2022?? My guess it depends if BYU or Army is willing to come to the AAC...We shall see!

(06-26-2019 08:59 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 08:24 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 08:10 PM)TDenverFan Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:34 PM)spenser Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:23 PM)Bogg Wrote:  It's not. It just isn't. Even if it was a lateral move (which it isn't) it's still an upgrade because of the historical/geographic connections and the tournament. People just don't like the idea of a school where football isn't the driving force.

It is a big downgrade. The Big East is Villanova and 9 Atlantic 10 level basketball schools at this point. Cincinnati, Houston, Temple, and Memphis will be a better group than anything Big East has going forward and Wichita State, UCF, and SMU have shown to be better than the middle of Big East.

All those teams UCONN remembers playing are gone beside Nova and Georgetown.

Every single Big East team made a post season tournament this year. All but DePaul made the NCAA or NIT

They were a 2 bid conference, got a 3rd team on BS. The old school NE NYC playground ball to a scholly is long gone. SMU or Hosuton in better positioned recruiting Nigerian Americans in Texas than the 10 thousand DI programs in the NE.

Can you name one Nigerian-American or Nigerian on either roster?

Tongue and cheek. Most people know there is a large Nigerian community in Texas and those guys, and girls, play sports. I think the 2018 Women's Nigerian Olympic bobsled team were all Houston grads. They were not even born in Nigeria LOL.

Great find. UConn has two choices, neither of which is constrained by its agreement with the Big East.

First, it can notify the AAC of its intent to leave in 27 months, which would put them on schedule to move to the Big East effective October 1, 2021 and play the 2021-22 school year in the Big East. This is the approach Syracuse took when leaving the Big East. Under this "Syracuse approach," UConn could then seek to negotiate early withdrawal to move to the Big East for the 2020-21 school year. Clearly there is some amount that the AAC would accept. Syracuse paid an incremental $5 million to leave one year earlier than provided in the notice. This would also give UConn the chance to negotiate to remain in the AAC in football for the 2020 season, which would be the default under the 27 month notice.

Second, UConn could notify the AAC that it is leaving on July 1 or September 1, 2020 in breach of the notice requirement. This is the approach that West Virginia took when it withdrew from the Big East. This would force the AAC to sue UConn for damages for violating the notice provisions. This approach would probably put UConn in better negotiating position with respect to any incremental exit fee over and above the base $10 million. Unlike West Virginia back in 2011, UConn leaving early would probably not do much harm to the AAC, particularly if UConn offered to remain in the conference for football for the 2020 season. However, it would give UConn less leverage in negotiations with the AAC to play football in the AAC in 2020. UConn needs to know pretty quickly whether it needs to build an independent 2020 football schedule.

I expect we'll find out within the next week, possibly even today, as the notice of withdrawal will pretty much spell out which option UConn has selected.

(06-27-2019 07:40 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  Here's an update on the UConn to Big East story - we now have access to the contract ..Thanks Hokie Mark...
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/...tract.html

Umm, what do you think I meant by the thread title? The contract is linked in the first post.

Quote:From Hokie Marks Blog:

Some comments on this document:

[quote][side note: I thought it was interesting that the Big East is described in this document as "a Delaware nonprofit corporation". For one thing, I thought it was based in Rhode Island. Furthermore, the Big East doesn't have any teams actually located in Delaware!]

The old Big East HQ was in Providence, it's now The American's HQ, until the lease runs out and they move HQ to Dallas. When we started in 2013, our HQ was some offices we subletted from our bigshot Manhattan law firm, I think we've moved into our own swanky NYC digs since then, but I'm not sure.

Everybody incorporates in Delaware because of the Delaware incorporation laws.

Quote:So will UCONN play in the AAC until 1 July 2022?? My guess it depends if BYU or Army is willing to come to the AAC...We shall see!

It's on UConn to negotiate their way out of the AAC. We'd love to have them for 2020-21, but if that's not feasible than 2021-22 or at the latest 2022-23.

Let's see, 27 months from June 26 2019...12 months is June 26 2020, 24 months is June 26 2021, 27 months is September 26 2021.

Realistically, I'd expect July 1, 2021 as UConn's Entrance Date. That gives the AAC 12 full months to figure out who #12 is, or if they need a #12, and gives UConn 2 years to try to put together an indy schedule, or to backfill whoever the AAC takes from CUSA/MAC/MWC. If the AAC tries to hold to 27 months vs 24 months, that's a lawsuit on pretty favorable terrain. 24 months is ample time to get your ducks in a row.

(06-27-2019 07:40 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  The official entrance date for UConn joining the Big East is "as soon as practical, but in no event later than June 30, 2022". Furthermore, "if the University has not joined the [Big East] Conference and begun participation as a full member by July 1, 2022, this Agreement shall be terminable by the Conference..."

So will UCONN play in the AAC until 1 July 2022?? My guess it depends if BYU or Army is willing to come to the AAC...We shall see!

The reason the Big East gave UConn until June 30, 2022 to join is two fold.

First, conference membership is determined on that date for the following school year. So with a 27-month notice requirement, UConn can't join the BE on Sept 1, 2021 for the 2021-22 school year. In other words, if full notice is given the AAC, then 2022-23 is the earliest school year UConn can join the BE, and June 30, 2022 is the last date UConn can join for that school year.

Second, UConn has a football problem, and may need to stay in the American two and perhaps three years while it readies for life as an independent or makes other arrangements. They can't stay in the American as football-only, so all their sports might stay 2 or 3 years.

In all likelihood, UConn and the AAC will negotiate an earlier release date than the full three years. But it's still up in the air whether UConn will spend one lame duck year in the AAC or two.

(06-27-2019 07:55 AM)orangefan Wrote:  Great find. UConn has two choices, neither of which is constrained by its agreement with the Big East.

First, it can notify the AAC of its intent to leave in 27 months, which would put them on schedule to move to the Big East effective October 1, 2021 and play the 2021-22 school year in the Big East. This is the approach Syracuse took when leaving the Big East. Under this "Syracuse approach," UConn could then seek to negotiate early withdrawal to move to the Big East for the 2020-21 school year. Clearly there is some amount that the AAC would accept. Syracuse paid an incremental $5 million to leave one year earlier than provided in the notice. This would also give UConn the chance to negotiate to remain in the AAC in football for the 2020 season, which would be the default under the 27 month notice.

Second, UConn could notify the AAC that it is leaving on July 1 or September 1, 2020 in breach of the notice requirement. This is the approach that West Virginia took when it withdrew from the Big East. This would force the AAC to sue UConn for damages for violating the notice provisions. This approach would probably put UConn in better negotiating position with respect to any incremental exit fee over and above the base $10 million. Unlike West Virginia back in 2011, UConn leaving early would probably not do much harm to the AAC, particularly if UConn offered to remain in the conference for football for the 2020 season. However, it would give UConn less leverage in negotiations with the AAC to play football in the AAC in 2020. UConn needs to know pretty quickly whether it needs to build an independent 2020 football schedule.

I expect we'll find out within the next week, possibly even today, as the notice of withdrawal will pretty much spell out which option UConn has selected.

where you are as of July 1 governs where you are for that school year.

(06-26-2019 07:22 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:34 PM)spenser Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:23 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:07 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I think this is a mistake on UConn. Going to the Big East is a downgrade.

It's not. It just isn't. Even if it was a lateral move (which it isn't) it's still an upgrade because of the historical/geographic connections and the tournament. People just don't like the idea of a school where football isn't the driving force.

It is a big downgrade. The Big East is Villanova and 9 Atlantic 10 level basketball schools at this point. Cincinnati, Houston, Temple, and Memphis will be a better group than anything Big East has going forward and Wichita State, UCF, and SMU have shown to be better than the middle of Big East.

All those teams UCONN remembers playing are gone beside Nova and Georgetown.

So you want to do this.

Okay, let's do this. Limit to the last 20 years, so we're not talking about Ewing and Mullin and Hakeem and Ron Artest etc. And let's compare each group without UConn.

National Championships: Villanova's got 2. AAC zero.
Final Fours. 4 schools with 7 (Nova 3, Butler 2, Georgetown, Marquette) vs 2 (Wichita, Memphis).
Sweet Sixteens 5 schools with 24 (Nova 6, GT 2, Marquette 4, X 7, Butler 5) vs 6 schools with 12 (Memphis 4, Cinci 2, Wichita 3, Temple 1, Houston 1, Tulsa 1)
NCAA Tournament Big East 96 appearances, AAC 55.

Schools with 10+ NCAA's in the last 20 years Villanova, Marquette, Creighton vs Memphis, Cincinnati
Schools with 5+ NCAA's in the last 20 years Everybody but Depaul vs Memphis, Cinci, Temple, Wichita.

Without UConn, your lineup does not compare to ours. That's why we the C7 left. And that's why UConn left.

just to quibble, Xavier has 10+ NCAA's in the past twenty years, as does butler. either way these are just UC fans upset about xavier being in the big east and uc staring down cusa 2.0

(06-29-2019 01:30 AM)scoscox Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 07:22 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:34 PM)spenser Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:23 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:07 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I think this is a mistake on UConn. Going to the Big East is a downgrade.

It's not. It just isn't. Even if it was a lateral move (which it isn't) it's still an upgrade because of the historical/geographic connections and the tournament. People just don't like the idea of a school where football isn't the driving force.

It is a big downgrade. The Big East is Villanova and 9 Atlantic 10 level basketball schools at this point. Cincinnati, Houston, Temple, and Memphis will be a better group than anything Big East has going forward and Wichita State, UCF, and SMU have shown to be better than the middle of Big East.

All those teams UCONN remembers playing are gone beside Nova and Georgetown.

So you want to do this.

Okay, let's do this. Limit to the last 20 years, so we're not talking about Ewing and Mullin and Hakeem and Ron Artest etc. And let's compare each group without UConn.

National Championships: Villanova's got 2. AAC zero.
Final Fours. 4 schools with 7 (Nova 3, Butler 2, Georgetown, Marquette) vs 2 (Wichita, Memphis).
Sweet Sixteens 5 schools with 24 (Nova 6, GT 2, Marquette 4, X 7, Butler 5) vs 6 schools with 12 (Memphis 4, Cinci 2, Wichita 3, Temple 1, Houston 1, Tulsa 1)
NCAA Tournament Big East 96 appearances, AAC 55.

Schools with 10+ NCAA's in the last 20 years Villanova, Marquette, Creighton vs Memphis, Cincinnati
Schools with 5+ NCAA's in the last 20 years Everybody but Depaul vs Memphis, Cinci, Temple, Wichita.

Without UConn, your lineup does not compare to ours. That's why we the C7 left. And that's why UConn left.

just to quibble, Xavier has 10+ NCAA's in the past twenty years, as does butler. either way these are just UC fans upset about xavier being in the big east and uc staring down cusa 2.0

Yeah, that's in the notes in my Angry Notebook, don't know how I missed it in the post. but yeah, he got me mad.

(06-26-2019 06:23 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:07 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I think this is a mistake on UConn. Going to the Big East is a downgrade.

It's not. It just isn't. Even if it was a lateral move (which it isn't) it's still an upgrade because of the historical/geographic connections and the tournament. People just don't like the idea of a school where football isn't the driving force.

Its an upgrade in basketball with historic rivalries, but it will kill the football program and any chance UConn had of making the P5. But if UConn is happy with that, thats fine.

(06-29-2019 01:41 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:23 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:07 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I think this is a mistake on UConn. Going to the Big East is a downgrade.

It's not. It just isn't. Even if it was a lateral move (which it isn't) it's still an upgrade because of the historical/geographic connections and the tournament. People just don't like the idea of a school where football isn't the driving force.

Its an upgrade in basketball with historic rivalries, but it will kill the football program and any chance UConn had of making the P5. But if UConn is happy with that, thats fine.

Football was already a wreck in the AAC. They can go 3 and 9 just fine as an independent, and you'll stop seeing the kind of football-first/basketball-first resentment between the fans driven by accommodating football at all costs.

(06-29-2019 01:41 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:23 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(06-26-2019 06:07 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I think this is a mistake on UConn. Going to the Big East is a downgrade.

It's not. It just isn't. Even if it was a lateral move (which it isn't) it's still an upgrade because of the historical/geographic connections and the tournament. People just don't like the idea of a school where football isn't the driving force.

Its an upgrade in basketball with historic rivalries, but it will kill the football program and any chance UConn had of making the P5. But if UConn is happy with that, thats fine.

Yep it's an upgrade across the board for them as long as they are ok with basically killing football. My guess is they are but won't say that publicly. They've locked themselves into a power basketball conference permanently now, which is certainly a good thing and obviously the most important thing for them long term. Even if you are of the belief that moving from the AAC to the Big East in hoops isn't much of an upgrade they are going to be stable while the AAC just by it's very nature probably never will be. I know ECU would happily kill off its basketball program completely if they could get themselves into a power football conference, so how can I really say I don't get it from the other side? UCONN has the ability to lock in a permanent strong home for the sports that matter to them, and the only thing they have to do is kill off a sport they are bad at and don't really care about.