(06-24-2019 07:39 AM)stever20 Wrote:  I think it's really funny that folks think this is going to kill the AAC in basketball.. UConn in the last 5 years has made the tourney exactly once. 91-78 in those 5 years with 3 straight losing seasons. Think about this. The only team in the AAC besides UConn that can say that is ECU. Tulane was .500 2 years ago.

If the AAC can add a VCU to replace them, the league on the court will really improve. Mentally it hurts, but realistically it's not a huge loss at all. VCU is 120-53 last 5 years....

I haven't heard anyone say this would 'kill' AAC basketball. But they are losing their most nationally recognized brand. Even if that program has had a rough patch for a couple of year they're still the one people think of in the conference. So it's a blow, not a death-knell. The real disconnect from reality is those who think this is not a big deal, and those who think this makes the AAC somehow stronger.

(06-24-2019 07:44 AM)loki_the_bubba Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 07:39 AM)stever20 Wrote:  I think it's really funny that folks think this is going to kill the AAC in basketball.. UConn in the last 5 years has made the tourney exactly once. 91-78 in those 5 years with 3 straight losing seasons. Think about this. The only team in the AAC besides UConn that can say that is ECU. Tulane was .500 2 years ago.

If the AAC can add a VCU to replace them, the league on the court will really improve. Mentally it hurts, but realistically it's not a huge loss at all. VCU is 120-53 last 5 years....

I haven't heard anyone say this would 'kill' AAC basketball. But they are losing their most nationally recognized brand. Even if that program has had a rough patch for a couple of year they're still the one people think of in the conference. So it's a blow, not a death-knell. The real disconnect from reality is those who think this is not a big deal, and those who think this makes the AAC somehow stronger.

Meh, I'm not so sure about this. Sure this is all thought of by the people who follow CFB/CBB closely, but to be honest most of the people in this country are pretty clueless about who is in the AAC. Hell, I run into people here in Cincinnati who do not even know which conference UC is in.

(06-24-2019 07:44 AM)loki_the_bubba Wrote:  [quote='stever20' pid='16160265' dateline='1561379964']
The real disconnect from reality is those who think this is not a big deal, and those who think this makes the AAC somehow stronger.

Stronger in football. Addition by subtraction. UConn won 11 league games in 6 years. 1.8 per year. Next lowest is 2.3.

Football positive, basketball negative is how it should be viewed.

Hurley recruiting in the Big East is a scary thought.

Will feel good to actually despise someone other than Nova in the conference.

(06-24-2019 07:51 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 07:44 AM)loki_the_bubba Wrote:  [quote='stever20' pid='16160265' dateline='1561379964']
The real disconnect from reality is those who think this is not a big deal, and those who think this makes the AAC somehow stronger.

Stronger in football. Addition by subtraction. UConn won 11 league games in 6 years. 1.8 per year. Next lowest is 2.3.

Football positive, basketball negative is how it should be viewed.

football I don't know how anyone can view it as anything but positive. UConn football absolutly is awful.

Basketball it's a case of what UConn should have been vs what they actually have done. If they get a VCU to replace them, while they can't replace the perception, they can absolutely replace and frankly most likely improve the performance on the coulrt.

(06-24-2019 08:28 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 07:51 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 07:44 AM)loki_the_bubba Wrote:  [quote='stever20' pid='16160265' dateline='1561379964']
The real disconnect from reality is those who think this is not a big deal, and those who think this makes the AAC somehow stronger.

Stronger in football. Addition by subtraction. UConn won 11 league games in 6 years. 1.8 per year. Next lowest is 2.3.

Football positive, basketball negative is how it should be viewed.

football I don't know how anyone can view it as anything but positive. UConn football absolutly is awful.

Basketball it's a case of what UConn should have been vs what they actually have done. If they get a VCU to replace them, while they can't replace the perception, they can absolutely replace and frankly most likely improve the performance on the coulrt.

VCU is going to win a national title?

(06-24-2019 08:32 AM)TheBasketBallOpinion Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 08:28 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 07:51 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 07:44 AM)loki_the_bubba Wrote:  [quote='stever20' pid='16160265' dateline='1561379964']
The real disconnect from reality is those who think this is not a big deal, and those who think this makes the AAC somehow stronger.

Stronger in football. Addition by subtraction. UConn won 11 league games in 6 years. 1.8 per year. Next lowest is 2.3.

Football positive, basketball negative is how it should be viewed.

football I don't know how anyone can view it as anything but positive. UConn football absolutly is awful.

Basketball it's a case of what UConn should have been vs what they actually have done. If they get a VCU to replace them, while they can't replace the perception, they can absolutely replace and frankly most likely improve the performance on the coulrt.

VCU is going to win a national title?

That was 5 years ago. Since then UConn has only gone 91-78 and has 3 straight losing seasons... The AAC doesn't have to replace the UConn of 1999-2014 on the floor. They have to replace what UConn has been the last few years, which has been a frankly bad basketball team(albeit with a ton of injuries).

(06-24-2019 06:30 AM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  

(06-23-2019 10:57 PM)adcorbett Wrote:  Obviously it would rotate. And obviously it would be winning percentages. But as football seasons are often a game of attrition, two teams playing less conference games, can be a big advantage for them. Think how the playoffs emphasized teams who played in a CCG because it’s harder to win 13 games then 12. Now the teams would still have 12 games, but say Cincinnati played only seven conference games, and played a random sunbelt team, for example, in place of conference game 8, that’s probably less wear and tear, and gives them an advantage. Now obviously they could go the opposite way and schedule an extra P5 game, but the mere unevenness is not good for long term sustainability. Just doesn’t work as anything other than a 1-2 year stopgap

Not to mention the first year a team wins the conference only playing seven conference games, im not sure who’d cry foul first: other American members, or other G5 members if they got the NYD bowl slot, playing less conference games than any other conference member. And a rule would be adopted real quick banning it.

Playing one fewer conference game could just as easily mean you avoid a weak in-conference opponent as a strong one, so again, it's not as big a deal as you're making it out to be. I suppose the conference could insist that the teams with 7 games have to schedule an OOC team that's at least as strong as a high-end G5 or low-end P5 team and count that as conference game #8. I'm not sure how you'd measure the strength though. Sagarin? Squishy rule, though -- hard to enforce.

Your hypothesis is certainly possible, but not really likely, considering the trouble many AAC teams have with signing games now with low end P5 schools, without it being on draconian terms (single buy game, or 2 for 1). Then it is even worse because you have to fit it in the window of when you are set to have only seven games, and it is happening once every three years. Forcing the Amercian to find two more OOC games just drives up the price.

I think many of you have forgotten what it was like in the BE, playing only seven games, and how hard it was to find that quality fifth out of conference game, to make up for every other power conference playing 8 conference games, much less having to have at least one during the conference season. And that was before several conferences went to nine conference games. More often than not, that "extra" game likely means scheduling UConn, Liberty, Army, UMass, or NMSU, the indy's who aren't tied up in a conference game. Combine that with everything else, and its no small feet.

Plus, regardless of who the fifth game is, the moment that team wins the conference, the other members will cry foul. And the moment that team wins the NYD bowl slot, the other G5 conferences will cry foul, and rule would be immediately changed.

It is NOT a long term solution.

(06-24-2019 08:36 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 08:32 AM)TheBasketBallOpinion Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 08:28 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 07:51 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 07:44 AM)loki_the_bubba Wrote:  [quote='stever20' pid='16160265' dateline='1561379964']
The real disconnect from reality is those who think this is not a big deal, and those who think this makes the AAC somehow stronger.

Stronger in football. Addition by subtraction. UConn won 11 league games in 6 years. 1.8 per year. Next lowest is 2.3.

Football positive, basketball negative is how it should be viewed.

football I don't know how anyone can view it as anything but positive. UConn football absolutly is awful.

Basketball it's a case of what UConn should have been vs what they actually have done. If they get a VCU to replace them, while they can't replace the perception, they can absolutely replace and frankly most likely improve the4 n performance on the coulrt.

VCU is going to win a national title?

That was 5 years ago. Since then UConn has only gone 91-78 and has 3 straight losing seasons... The AAC doesn't have to replace the UConn of 1999-2014 on the floor. They have to replace what UConn has been the last few years, which has been a frankly bad basketball team(albeit with a ton of injuries).

Steve, you're flailing here. In terms of value to the conference, the perception is what matters most. Tulsa or SMU or Temple is recruiting a kid, a year ago part of the pitch was yeah, you get to go up against UConn, 4 national titles in 15 years UConn. VCU doesn't bring that heat. (No disrespect to VCU, I would have picked them over Creighton for school No. 10, but that's in the past).

(06-24-2019 09:13 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 08:36 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 08:32 AM)TheBasketBallOpinion Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 08:28 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 07:51 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  Stronger in football. Addition by subtraction. UConn won 11 league games in 6 years. 1.8 per year. Next lowest is 2.3.

Football positive, basketball negative is how it should be viewed.

football I don't know how anyone can view it as anything but positive. UConn football absolutly is awful.

Basketball it's a case of what UConn should have been vs what they actually have done. If they get a VCU to replace them, while they can't replace the perception, they can absolutely replace and frankly most likely improve the4 n performance on the coulrt.

VCU is going to win a national title?

That was 5 years ago. Since then UConn has only gone 91-78 and has 3 straight losing seasons... The AAC doesn't have to replace the UConn of 1999-2014 on the floor. They have to replace what UConn has been the last few years, which has been a frankly bad basketball team(albeit with a ton of injuries).

Steve, you're flailing here. In terms of value to the conference, the perception is what matters most. Tulsa or SMU or Temple is recruiting a kid, a year ago part of the pitch was yeah, you get to go up against UConn, 4 national titles in 15 years UConn. VCU doesn't bring that heat. (No disrespect to VCU, I would have picked them over Creighton for school No. 10, but that's in the past).

But perception isn't everything. I mean, I don't think any of Hardaway's recruits were gotten due to getting to play UConn.

Also, the recruiting in the AAC hasn't exactly been great with UConn.

(06-24-2019 07:39 AM)stever20 Wrote:  I think it's really funny that folks think this is going to kill the AAC in basketball.. UConn in the last 5 years has made the tourney exactly once. 91-78 in those 5 years with 3 straight losing seasons. Think about this. The only team in the AAC besides UConn that can say that is ECU. Tulane was .500 2 years ago.

If the AAC can add a VCU to replace them, the league on the court will really improve. Mentally it hurts, but realistically it's not a huge loss at all. VCU is 120-53 last 5 years....

Who is saying that? Nobody i have read.

UConn leaving is indeed a big blow, as UConn is easily the top AAC basketball brand. But AAC basketball will still be competitive without them.

(06-24-2019 09:26 AM)stever20 Wrote:  But perception isn't everything. I mean, I don't think any of Hardaway's recruits were gotten due to getting to play UConn.

Also, the recruiting in the AAC hasn't exactly been great with UConn.

Let's put it like this. Up until a couple of years ago, Miami and Virginia Tech football were about as pedestrian as UConn basketball has been the pastfew years. That in no way, shape, or form, means that if the ACC had lost Miami or Va Tech football, it would be no big deal, or addition by subtraction. Same with the Big Ten and Nebraska. Or for that matter the Big 12 when it lost Texas A&M (well and Colorado, who was really down in the dumps but used ot be very good).

Legacy schools matter.

(06-24-2019 09:27 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 07:39 AM)stever20 Wrote:  I think it's really funny that folks think this is going to kill the AAC in basketball.. UConn in the last 5 years has made the tourney exactly once. 91-78 in those 5 years with 3 straight losing seasons. Think about this. The only team in the AAC besides UConn that can say that is ECU. Tulane was .500 2 years ago.

If the AAC can add a VCU to replace them, the league on the court will really improve. Mentally it hurts, but realistically it's not a huge loss at all. VCU is 120-53 last 5 years....

Who is saying that? Nobody i have read.

UConn leaving is indeed a big blow, as UConn is easily the top AAC basketball brand. But AAC basketball will still be competitive without them.

and that's the most important thing. You don't get in the tournament based on your brand. You get in the tournament based on your performance on the court.

For the AAC, this is a nut-kick in basketball. It’s a blessing in football.

Not complicated.

(06-23-2019 10:20 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(06-22-2019 05:59 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-22-2019 01:10 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Quo, this may come as a surprise to you, but UConn leaving the AAC with what the last few seasons has been tepid basketball and a dumpster fire of football is an unexpected gift to the AAC and apparently ESPN sees it that way since it won't affect their current contract so the pie just got bigger for everyone else with about 9/11ths of a million in exit fees and one less share of the pie.

JR, i bet the ESPN deal gets adjusted if UConn leaves.

I realize lots of people use the word “bet” loosely. Do you actually place bets, with real money (or other collateral) at stake, on the outcomes of different events?

If so, I hope you’ll put your money where your mouth is, so far as the bolded-comment is concerned.

I can see ESPN letting the AAC keep the agreed payouy, if they can add a school ESPN approves of to replace them.

(06-23-2019 10:43 PM)TripleA Wrote:  Quo,

1. It has already been reported that the new AAC deal with ESPN won't change with UConn gone.

By 'won't change' do you mean the remaining schools will get the same per school payout as under the new deal, or more via getting to split UConn's money?

If the latter, please post a link.

(06-24-2019 09:26 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 09:13 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 08:36 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 08:32 AM)TheBasketBallOpinion Wrote:  

(06-24-2019 08:28 AM)stever20 Wrote:  football I don't know how anyone can view it as anything but positive. UConn football absolutly is awful.

Basketball it's a case of what UConn should have been vs what they actually have done. If they get a VCU to replace them, while they can't replace the perception, they can absolutely replace and frankly most likely improve the4 n performance on the coulrt.

VCU is going to win a national title?

That was 5 years ago. Since then UConn has only gone 91-78 and has 3 straight losing seasons... The AAC doesn't have to replace the UConn of 1999-2014 on the floor. They have to replace what UConn has been the last few years, which has been a frankly bad basketball team(albeit with a ton of injuries).

Steve, you're flailing here. In terms of value to the conference, the perception is what matters most. Tulsa or SMU or Temple is recruiting a kid, a year ago part of the pitch was yeah, you get to go up against UConn, 4 national titles in 15 years UConn. VCU doesn't bring that heat. (No disrespect to VCU, I would have picked them over Creighton for school No. 10, but that's in the past).

But perception isn't everything. I mean, I don't think any of Hardaway's recruits were gotten due to getting to play UConn.

Also, the recruiting in the AAC hasn't exactly been great with UConn.

Nothing is everything. And Hardaway's instant revival of Memphis, has more to do with Memphis being Memphis. Most of the AAC ain't Memphis.

(06-23-2019 11:44 PM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(06-23-2019 08:38 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-23-2019 12:42 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(06-22-2019 01:13 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-22-2019 01:10 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Quo, this may come as a surprise to you, but UConn leaving the AAC with what the last few seasons has been tepid basketball and a dumpster fire of football is an unexpected gift to the AAC and apparently ESPN sees it that way since it won't affect their current contract so the pie just got bigger for everyone else with about 9/11ths of a million in exit fees and one less share of the pie. Aresco and the conference have no reason to worry. They'll play Beverly Hillbillies and stand on the porch and wave bye. But they won't say, "Ya'll come back now, hear!"

For USF's sake, i hope you are correct about money.

But in terms of pride and prestige, it is a big blow to the AAC.

No, it isn't. UConn basketball has finished 8th and tied for 9th in the AAC the past 2 seasons, and not above 5th since they unexpectedly won the natty in 2014.

And their football program is arguably the worst in FBS, with not much sign of hope. It is a giant drag on AAC football, which brings in the lion's share of the new TV deal.

Not only that, UConn is far outside the AAC geographic footprint, and has culturally never been a good fit.

Pride and prestige need to leave home and get a paying job.

It is a major blow. Losing any conference member to another non-P would be bad enough, but UConn is the most nationally known and valuable AAC brand. As Adcorbett said, UConn was the big link that made the AAC distinguishable from just another CUSA configuration.

And since pride and prestige is basically what Aresco has tried to build the last 7 years, it is a big thing.

I have been giggling at your silly giddiness all day because " UCONN is the most nationally known brand " in the AAC and the "NBE took them". First off everything that the American has accomplished has been in spite of UCONN and their brand.

First, UConn clearly is the AAC's biggest brand. And it is the only state flagship and has the only P5 level athletic budget. Overall, it is clearly the top AAC institution, that is just a fact. It is considerably better than Memphis, or USF.

And UCOnn winning the men's hoops title is clearly the biggest national achievement by an AAC school. You need to check what you are smoking.

(06-24-2019 09:59 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-23-2019 11:44 PM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(06-23-2019 08:38 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-23-2019 12:42 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(06-22-2019 01:13 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  For USF's sake, i hope you are correct about money.

But in terms of pride and prestige, it is a big blow to the AAC.

No, it isn't. UConn basketball has finished 8th and tied for 9th in the AAC the past 2 seasons, and not above 5th since they unexpectedly won the natty in 2014.

And their football program is arguably the worst in FBS, with not much sign of hope. It is a giant drag on AAC football, which brings in the lion's share of the new TV deal.

Not only that, UConn is far outside the AAC geographic footprint, and has culturally never been a good fit.

Pride and prestige need to leave home and get a paying job.

It is a major blow. Losing any conference member to another non-P would be bad enough, but UConn is the most nationally known and valuable AAC brand. As Adcorbett said, UConn was the big link that made the AAC distinguishable from just another CUSA configuration.

And since pride and prestige is basically what Aresco has tried to build the last 7 years, it is a big thing.

I have been giggling at your silly giddiness all day because " UCONN is the most nationally known brand " in the AAC and the "NBE took them". First off everything that the American has accomplished has been in spite of UCONN and their brand.

First, UConn clearly was the AAC's biggest brand. And it is the only state flagship and has the only P5 level athletic budget. Overall, it was clearly the top AAC institution, that is just a fact. It is considerably better than Memphis, or USF.

And UCOnn winning the men's hoops title is clearly the biggest national achievement by an AAC school. You need to check what you are smoking.

FTFY

Perception doesn't get you to the Final Four, but it's a comfortable salve for those less ambitious programs like many of those in the Mecha Neo Big East