(05-30-2019 03:01 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 01:55 PM)VA49er Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 01:54 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  In a long list of unfortunate events. This tax cut boondoggle will be the most unfortunate part of his presidency.

What was unfortunate about the tax cut? Lots of people I know are getting more money per paycheck now. Why is that a bad thing?

It's not...unless you were one complaining about debt and deficits when the last guy was in office.

But here's the thing, the vast majority of the current debt and deficits are left over from the last guy. Yeah, I know, deficits came down in the last few years of his administration. But that's in part because a lot of things hadn't yet kicked in. In January 2017 (before anything Trump could do would have time to take effect) CBO forecast significant increases in debt and deficit.

See https://www.cbo.gov/system/files/2019-04...lumn_1.pdf

Compared to what they projected, the Trump tax cuts are a decidedly minor factor.

(05-30-2019 03:11 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 03:01 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 01:55 PM)VA49er Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 01:54 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  In a long list of unfortunate events. This tax cut boondoggle will be the most unfortunate part of his presidency.

What was unfortunate about the tax cut? Lots of people I know are getting more money per paycheck now. Why is that a bad thing?

It's not...unless you were one complaining about debt and deficits when the last guy was in office.

But here's the thing, the vast majority of the current debt and deficits are left over from the last guy. Yeah, I know, deficits came down in the last few years of his administration. But that's in part because a lot of things hadn't yet kicked in. In January 2017 (before anything Trump could do would have time to take effect) CBO forecast significant increases in debt and deficit.

See https://www.cbo.gov/system/files/2019-04...lumn_1.pdf

Compared to what they projected, the Trump tax cuts are a decidedly minor factor.

Even after 2+ years of trump? When do you turn the page? And it's not like they are coming down, they're both going up and up and up.

The closer to the top, the more fair the tax. The further down you go, the more irresponsible and immoral the tax is.


Wake me when either of the major parties is even seriously discussing solutions in the top half. I have put a [D] and [R] next to where I feel like the current parties are.

(05-30-2019 03:27 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  The closer to the top, the more fair the tax. The further down you go, the more irresponsible and immoral the tax is.

Code:

Tax Type                    Tax Amount
--------------------------------------------------------------
User Fees                    A modest surplus, spent during downturns
Excise                       Balanced, negligible profit/loss
Sales                        A large surplus
Flat Income                  Small deficit
Progressive Income [D] [R]   Small persistent deficit
VAT                          Large deficit
Tariff [R]                   Large persistent deficit
Capital [D]                  No budget at all [D] [R]

Wake me when either of the major parties is even seriously discussing solutions in the top half. I have put a [D] and [R] next to where I feel like the current parties are.

To paraphrase a famous quote, it's the spending stupid.

(05-30-2019 03:16 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 03:11 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 03:01 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 01:55 PM)VA49er Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 01:54 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  In a long list of unfortunate events. This tax cut boondoggle will be the most unfortunate part of his presidency.

What was unfortunate about the tax cut? Lots of people I know are getting more money per paycheck now. Why is that a bad thing?

It's not...unless you were one complaining about debt and deficits when the last guy was in office.

But here's the thing, the vast majority of the current debt and deficits are left over from the last guy. Yeah, I know, deficits came down in the last few years of his administration. But that's in part because a lot of things hadn't yet kicked in. In January 2017 (before anything Trump could do would have time to take effect) CBO forecast significant increases in debt and deficit.
See https://www.cbo.gov/system/files/2019-04...lumn_1.pdf
Compared to what they projected, the Trump tax cuts are a decidedly minor factor.

Even after 2+ years of trump? When do you turn the page? And it's not like they are coming down, they're both going up and up and up.

Yes, after 2+ years of Trump. WTF was Trump supposed to do about it?

The problem is not what Trump has done, but rather that the primary inherited drivers have not been addressed. The tax cuts are $150 billion per year. The deficit is approaching $1 trillion. That means there's $850 billion from somewhere else. Can you do that math?

(05-30-2019 03:16 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 03:11 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 03:01 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 01:55 PM)VA49er Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 01:54 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  In a long list of unfortunate events. This tax cut boondoggle will be the most unfortunate part of his presidency.

What was unfortunate about the tax cut? Lots of people I know are getting more money per paycheck now. Why is that a bad thing?

It's not...unless you were one complaining about debt and deficits when the last guy was in office.

But here's the thing, the vast majority of the current debt and deficits are left over from the last guy. Yeah, I know, deficits came down in the last few years of his administration. But that's in part because a lot of things hadn't yet kicked in. In January 2017 (before anything Trump could do would have time to take effect) CBO forecast significant increases in debt and deficit.

See https://www.cbo.gov/system/files/2019-04...lumn_1.pdf

Compared to what they projected, the Trump tax cuts are a decidedly minor factor.

Even after 2+ years of trump? When do you turn the page? And it's not like they are coming down, they're both going up and up and up.

The deficit will never come down until both sides get serious about cutting spending and balancing the budget. Until that is addressed we will continue to allow the deficit to spiral out of control. The democrats can only come up with ways to increase spending and the republicans are too gutless to aggressively address spending. Those that propose raising taxes need to bear this in mind. Politicians are great at spending, the more you give them the more they will spend and they will spend it not to benefit the general population but spend it the best way they can to get reelected. Giving them more is a fools errand.

(05-30-2019 01:55 PM)VA49er Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 01:54 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  In a long list of unfortunate events. This tax cut boondoggle will be the most unfortunate part of his presidency.

What was unfortunate about the tax cut? Lots of people I know are getting more money per paycheck now. Why is that a bad thing?

And a LOT of businesses are spending again as well.

Lowering rates and increased/accelerated depreciation, coupled with increased certainty in what they can better expect in day-to-day operations, has opened wallets and budgets.

Anytime more money stays in the pockets of the people that earned it and not being sent to the gaping black hole of unnamed, unaccountable, irresponsible bureaucrats in the marble halls of the bloated DeeCee federal gubment, the better.

But, some folks will find a reason to complain about anything.

(05-30-2019 02:30 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  We will rue that these passed. The tax cuts were just a give away to the 1 percent.

Wow.

Who knew a couple making 100 grand are one-percenters?

Learn something new (and patently false) every day.

(05-30-2019 02:30 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  We will rue that these passed. The tax cuts were just a give away to the 1 percent.

I know I benefitted from it and I am not in the 1%. Also, I think companies are coming back from other countries, but it is a libs nightmare.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

(05-30-2019 03:01 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 01:55 PM)VA49er Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 01:54 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  In a long list of unfortunate events. This tax cut boondoggle will be the most unfortunate part of his presidency.

What was unfortunate about the tax cut? Lots of people I know are getting more money per paycheck now. Why is that a bad thing?

It's not...unless you were one complaining about debt and deficits when the last guy was in office.

Ha!

Lavish, wasteful, decadent spending on vanity projects for the POTUS' winners and losers is a far cry from allowing people to keep more of what they earn so they can spend it on their families.

Come to think of it, we need to see how new construction spending is doing. Always a good indicator of how folks are feeling and what's really going on out there.

I'll do a little digging later this evening.

(05-30-2019 04:16 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 02:30 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  We will rue that these passed. The tax cuts were just a give away to the 1 percent.

Wow.

Who knew a couple making 100 grand are one-percenters?

Learn something new (and patently false) every day.

You could have gave a tax cut to those people not a problem and you know this. The vast majority of it was a give away to the top 1 percent. Like 90% of it. I’ll look for the exact numbers if you question it. It’s sickening.

(05-30-2019 02:30 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  We will rue that these passed. The tax cuts were just a give away to the 1 percent.

Jealous much? That's BS anyway but you don't really care about that. The agenda is always the thing with you guys. If the truth doesn't serve the agenda, ignore the truth and keep repeating the lies until they take on the appearance of the truth.

Here's a novel idea for you democrats, present some serious policy proposals - EC abolishment, lowering the voting age to 16, free this and that are not policy proposals. Orange man bad aint gonna win you an election, especially with the severe lack of personality available among your 24-25 potentials, over which to form a cult of personality like Obama did. Not a one of those leaches has enough star power to motivate the base so they'll end up holding their nose and nominating the very thing they claim to hate, an old, rich, dried up, broke down, cracker headed, white mofo.

What I can't believe is some people believe the stock buybacks only help the 1%. That's asinine thinking and is totally ignorant of the almost $30 TRILLION everyday Americans have invested in retirement accounts, etc.

(05-30-2019 03:38 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 03:16 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 03:11 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 03:01 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-30-2019 01:55 PM)VA49er Wrote:  What was unfortunate about the tax cut? Lots of people I know are getting more money per paycheck now. Why is that a bad thing?

It's not...unless you were one complaining about debt and deficits when the last guy was in office.

But here's the thing, the vast majority of the current debt and deficits are left over from the last guy. Yeah, I know, deficits came down in the last few years of his administration. But that's in part because a lot of things hadn't yet kicked in. In January 2017 (before anything Trump could do would have time to take effect) CBO forecast significant increases in debt and deficit.
See https://www.cbo.gov/system/files/2019-04...lumn_1.pdf
Compared to what they projected, the Trump tax cuts are a decidedly minor factor.

Even after 2+ years of trump? When do you turn the page? And it's not like they are coming down, they're both going up and up and up.

Yes, after 2+ years of Trump. WTF was Trump supposed to do about it?

The problem is not what Trump has done, but rather that the primary inherited drivers have not been addressed. The tax cuts are $150 billion per year. The deficit is approaching $1 trillion. That means there's $850 billion from somewhere else. Can you do that math?

I dunno...address them maybe?

(05-31-2019 08:19 AM)VA49er Wrote:  What I can't believe is some people believe the stock buybacks only help the 1%. That's asinine thinking and is totally ignorant of the almost $30 TRILLION everyday Americans have invested in retirement accounts, etc.

Good thing the market will never go down, ever, AMIRITE?

(05-31-2019 09:17 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-31-2019 08:19 AM)VA49er Wrote:  What I can't believe is some people believe the stock buybacks only help the 1%. That's asinine thinking and is totally ignorant of the almost $30 TRILLION everyday Americans have invested in retirement accounts, etc.

Good thing the market will never go down, ever, AMIRITE?

Not sure what that has to do with anything. Of course the markets can go down, that's why one diversifies one's portfolio. Not sure what you are getting at....

(05-30-2019 02:30 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  We will rue that these passed. The tax cuts were just a give away to the 1 percent.

I'm sick and tired of hearing about the "1 percent". That is nothing more than a slogan used by Democrats much like they use the labels - racist, sexist, anti immigration, etc. - to try to shame a person or group into doing only what the Democrats want.

To put this ludicrous fallacy to rest, my wife is a retired elementary school teacher. I am a retired Defense Department employee. We live on fixed retirement incomes that changes very little if at all from one year to the next. We are hardly members of the so called "1 percent" that the Democrats tout but are firmly among the middle class of Americans. Here is a direct comparison of our taxes prior to and after the Trump Tax changes. Data was provided by the accountant that has been doing our taxes for the last decade or more.

FEDERAL TAX DATA:

2017 Tax Return Data:
Taxes Paid - $8,979
Tax Refund - $1,634
Marginal Tax Rate - 15%
Effective Tax Rate - 14%

2018 Tax Return Data:

Taxes Paid - $7,284
Tax Refund - $1,929
Marginal Tax Rate - 12%
Effective Tax Rate - 11.4%

I didn't include the data, but our Virginia state tax returns which were affected by the new Trump Tax changes were even more beneficial to us than the Federal tax returns were. I didn't include them only because the state income tax requirements differ from state to state.

Bottom line ... to say that the new tax rules don't benefit the majority of the people making up the middle class is factually inaccurate.

(05-31-2019 09:53 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(05-31-2019 09:17 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-31-2019 08:19 AM)VA49er Wrote:  What I can't believe is some people believe the stock buybacks only help the 1%. That's asinine thinking and is totally ignorant of the almost $30 TRILLION everyday Americans have invested in retirement accounts, etc.

Good thing the market will never go down, ever, AMIRITE?

Not sure what that has to do with anything. Of course the markets can go down, that's why one diversifies one's portfolio. Not sure what you are getting at....

The market may be good now and you may be making more return due to the buybacks, but that could change in a year and result in losses to offset the current gains. If you're like me, you're well over a decade from retirement. There's no guarantee any gains I'm making now will be there when it comes time to cash in.

(05-31-2019 03:02 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-31-2019 09:53 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(05-31-2019 09:17 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-31-2019 08:19 AM)VA49er Wrote:  What I can't believe is some people believe the stock buybacks only help the 1%. That's asinine thinking and is totally ignorant of the almost $30 TRILLION everyday Americans have invested in retirement accounts, etc.

Good thing the market will never go down, ever, AMIRITE?

Not sure what that has to do with anything. Of course the markets can go down, that's why one diversifies one's portfolio. Not sure what you are getting at....

The market may be good now and you may be making more return due to the buybacks, but that could change in a year and result in losses to offset the current gains. If you're like me, you're well over a decade from retirement. There's no guarantee any gains I'm making now will be there when it comes time to cash in.

So your solution is to hand all of your money and healthcare over to the government, where you can be guaranteed it wont be there when you need it.

(05-31-2019 03:09 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(05-31-2019 03:02 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-31-2019 09:53 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(05-31-2019 09:17 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(05-31-2019 08:19 AM)VA49er Wrote:  What I can't believe is some people believe the stock buybacks only help the 1%. That's asinine thinking and is totally ignorant of the almost $30 TRILLION everyday Americans have invested in retirement accounts, etc.

Good thing the market will never go down, ever, AMIRITE?

Not sure what that has to do with anything. Of course the markets can go down, that's why one diversifies one's portfolio. Not sure what you are getting at....

The market may be good now and you may be making more return due to the buybacks, but that could change in a year and result in losses to offset the current gains. If you're like me, you're well over a decade from retirement. There's no guarantee any gains I'm making now will be there when it comes time to cash in.

So your solution is to hand all of your money and healthcare over to the government, where you can be guaranteed it wont be there when you need it.

Said no one ever.