The unofficial online home for fans of the Western Michigan University Broncos. Part of Collegiate Sports Nation (CSN).

(10-08-2017 11:04 AM)BroncoPhilly Wrote:  

(10-08-2017 11:01 AM)Stampede your face!! Wrote:  

(10-08-2017 10:37 AM)BroncoJim Wrote:  How much of an impact does Sanders lack of experience at the FBS level - both as a coach and a player - have on the inconsistent and, at times, poor play of the DB's? Is he out of his depth, or is his lack of experience at this level not that big of a deal?

I don't think it's a big deal. Before yesterday, I think we would have said that our secondary is a strength of this football team. Maybe the best position group. Buffalo hit 2 big plays right away, both on miscommunications between corners and safety. Then all of a sudden you start second guessing.

I think our secondary will be fine. I just think they got beat early, lost confidence and got no help from their defensive front seven.

I am less worried about our secondary than I am our defensive line who are getting hit with injury and weren't our best group to begin with.

Thank God we picked up Steven Clark, he was stellar again yesterday. Think where we would be without him this season.

Yeah. We are going to have to play at least one true freshman as it is. Not good. Daniel Jackson might have to be moved back inside.

The problem with hiring a third of Cubit's staff is that he hired a third of Cubit's staff. These hires should have been disallowed.

(10-07-2017 08:36 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  Wasn't it 35 all after regulation? Not saying they played well but still.

31 all at the end of regulation.

(10-08-2017 07:55 PM)wingsenforcer Wrote:  The problem with hiring a third of Cubit's staff is that he hired a third of Cubit's staff. These hires should have been disallowed.

You do understand that Western Michigan is not a destination school for assistant coaches. It pays well by MAC standards, but it's mostly a resume builder. Fact is we are fortunate to get these guys. By your logic, we shouldn't hire John Harbaugh because he was part of the Harbaugh staff at Western.

You guys act as if we never won a game under Cubit, even though he had several excellent seasons.

Don't get like the Chip fans who think only championships matter, even though they've predominately been a losing program for the last 20 years. There is no Ohio State of the MAC and there never will be. It's a pretty level playing field. Getting quality assistants is as much about who you know as it is who you are. That said we got an Air Force Academy Coach to leave for a lateral move. We got a coach to leave another MAC school in a lateral move. And we got a guy with a head coaching gig to leave. Some because they liked Lester, the school, and the community.

This guilt by association crap is ridiculous. Should we dump our Penn State coach because he worked with Perv Sandusky. Yeah, I didn't think so.

We cut Bill Cubit loose to move the program in a different direction. We did that with Fleck. Now that he's moved on, we need to continue in that same direction.

Moving in that same direction includes the assistant coaches too. I'm not here to say championships are the only thing that matter.

Like him or not, P.J. Fleck established a higher standard for this program and none of what Bill Cubit and his assistants put on the field meets that standard.

(10-08-2017 09:02 PM)wingsenforcer Wrote:  We cut Bill Cubit loose to move the program in a different direction. We did that with Fleck. Now that he's moved on, we need to continue in that same direction.

Moving in that same direction includes the assistant coaches too. I'm not here to say championships are the only thing that matter.

Like him or not, P.J. Fleck established a higher standard for this program and none of what Bill Cubit and his assistants put on the field meets that standard.

Right, that's why Putnam is working for the worst D1 program in America, because he came from PJs program and was so highly coveted?

You act as if when a low paying assistant job is available there's a pool of highly skilled coaching geniuses clamouring to be here. You're living in fantasy land.

(10-08-2017 08:58 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  You do understand that Western Michigan is not a destination school for assistant coaches. It pays well by MAC standards, but it's mostly a resume builder. Fact is we are fortunate to get these guys. By your logic, we shouldn't hire John Harbaugh because he was part of the Harbaugh staff at Western.

“Fortunate to get these guys”?? lol.... Half of them have already been here. As far as Lester, name another D1 school that hires him as HC if WMU doesn’t. I’ll wait...

Sorry but going 13-1 and making a cotton bowl appearance and having a pool of donors willing to pay $2-$3+ million for the right guy DOES sort of put us in good company among the G5’s.

(10-08-2017 10:11 AM)Stampede your face!! Wrote:  

(10-08-2017 08:58 AM)MajorHoople Wrote:  

(10-07-2017 09:49 PM)Stampede your face!! Wrote:  Shouldn't it be Daoust?

He was hired first. They are listed as Co-DCs.

Which I've always thought is a bad idea.

Yes it is a bad idea. Lester should have hired Duggan to be defensive coordinator. He has actually been successful in the position at the D1 level.

This is going to be an issue going forward. Is Lester going to be capable of making the changes to his staff that will be needed.

My point was that having Co-Coordinators is a bad idea, not Daoust as DC.

Lester had a couple weeks to assemble a staff because Fleck wanted Cotton Bowl on his resume. That's the truth let it be known. If Fleck leaves after the Conference championship game, which is the norm, Lester gets two months to fill the positions. If we had lost to Ohio at Ford Field Fleck would have been on that jet the next morning. The Fleck effect continues at Waldo almost a year later.

On top of that if WMU upsets Wisconsin is Fleck still Minny bound? Another discussion.

(10-08-2017 08:58 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-08-2017 07:55 PM)wingsenforcer Wrote:  The problem with hiring a third of Cubit's staff is that he hired a third of Cubit's staff. These hires should have been disallowed.

You do understand that Western Michigan is not a destination school for assistant coaches. It pays well by MAC standards, but it's mostly a resume builder. Fact is we are fortunate to get these guys. By your logic, we shouldn't hire John Harbaugh because he was part of the Harbaugh staff at Western.

You guys act as if we never won a game under Cubit, even though he had several excellent seasons.

Don't get like the Chip fans who think only championships matter, even though they've predominately been a losing program for the last 20 years. There is no Ohio State of the MAC and there never will be. It's a pretty level playing field. Getting quality assistants is as much about who you know as it is who you are. That said we got an Air Force Academy Coach to leave for a lateral move. We got a coach to leave another MAC school in a lateral move. And we got a guy with a head coaching gig to leave. Some because they liked Lester, the school, and the community.

This guilt by association crap is ridiculous. Should we dump our Penn State coach because he worked with Perv Sandusky. Yeah, I didn't think so.

If your program is not in the championship chase come November, it has not been a successful season. If your program loses to its arch-rival, and is not in the championship chase come November it has been a bad season.

Bill Cubit's teams were never in the championship chase come November and inexcusably lost 5 consecutive games to CMU (not sure how you can forgive and forget that, Chipdip2), other than Bill is a likable gentleman.

Ultimately, you play to compete for championships and beat your rival. He did neither.

That said, I agree the "guilt by association crap is ridiculous."

WMU is 2-0 in the MAC and has beaten CMU three straight. If the Broncos are out of contention before CMU comes to town on 11/1, then LOSES to CMU, then there is plenty of reason to whine. Not now, however.

(10-09-2017 08:52 AM)GullLake Wrote:  

(10-08-2017 08:58 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-08-2017 07:55 PM)wingsenforcer Wrote:  The problem with hiring a third of Cubit's staff is that he hired a third of Cubit's staff. These hires should have been disallowed.

You do understand that Western Michigan is not a destination school for assistant coaches. It pays well by MAC standards, but it's mostly a resume builder. Fact is we are fortunate to get these guys. By your logic, we shouldn't hire John Harbaugh because he was part of the Harbaugh staff at Western.

You guys act as if we never won a game under Cubit, even though he had several excellent seasons.

Don't get like the Chip fans who think only championships matter, even though they've predominately been a losing program for the last 20 years. There is no Ohio State of the MAC and there never will be. It's a pretty level playing field. Getting quality assistants is as much about who you know as it is who you are. That said we got an Air Force Academy Coach to leave for a lateral move. We got a coach to leave another MAC school in a lateral move. And we got a guy with a head coaching gig to leave. Some because they liked Lester, the school, and the community.

This guilt by association crap is ridiculous. Should we dump our Penn State coach because he worked with Perv Sandusky. Yeah, I didn't think so.

If your program is not in the championship chase come November, it has not been a successful season. If your program loses to its arch-rival, and is not in the championship chase come November it has been a bad season.

Bill Cubit's teams were never in the championship chase come November and inexcusably lost 5 consecutive games to CMU (not sure how you can forgive and forget that, Chipdip2), other than Bill is a likable gentleman.

Ultimately, you play to compete for championships and beat your rival. He did neither.

That said, I agree the "guilt by association crap is ridiculous."

WMU is 2-0 in the MAC and has beaten CMU three straight. If the Broncos are out of contention before CMU comes to town on 11/1, then LOSES to CMU, then there is plenty of reason to whine. Not now, however.

First of all, cubit was in championship contention several times in November, just didn't get over the hump. It sucks that he lost to CMU so many times as well but CMU then was like niu during pj's reign. How did pj do against niu when he was here?

(10-09-2017 12:24 PM)Bronc33 Wrote:  

(10-09-2017 08:52 AM)GullLake Wrote:  

(10-08-2017 08:58 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-08-2017 07:55 PM)wingsenforcer Wrote:  The problem with hiring a third of Cubit's staff is that he hired a third of Cubit's staff. These hires should have been disallowed.

You do understand that Western Michigan is not a destination school for assistant coaches. It pays well by MAC standards, but it's mostly a resume builder. Fact is we are fortunate to get these guys. By your logic, we shouldn't hire John Harbaugh because he was part of the Harbaugh staff at Western.

You guys act as if we never won a game under Cubit, even though he had several excellent seasons.

Don't get like the Chip fans who think only championships matter, even though they've predominately been a losing program for the last 20 years. There is no Ohio State of the MAC and there never will be. It's a pretty level playing field. Getting quality assistants is as much about who you know as it is who you are. That said we got an Air Force Academy Coach to leave for a lateral move. We got a coach to leave another MAC school in a lateral move. And we got a guy with a head coaching gig to leave. Some because they liked Lester, the school, and the community.

This guilt by association crap is ridiculous. Should we dump our Penn State coach because he worked with Perv Sandusky. Yeah, I didn't think so.

If your program is not in the championship chase come November, it has not been a successful season. If your program loses to its arch-rival, and is not in the championship chase come November it has been a bad season.

Bill Cubit's teams were never in the championship chase come November and inexcusably lost 5 consecutive games to CMU (not sure how you can forgive and forget that, Chipdip2), other than Bill is a likable gentleman.

Ultimately, you play to compete for championships and beat your rival. He did neither.

That said, I agree the "guilt by association crap is ridiculous."

WMU is 2-0 in the MAC and has beaten CMU three straight. If the Broncos are out of contention before CMU comes to town on 11/1, then LOSES to CMU, then there is plenty of reason to whine. Not now, however.

First of all, cubit was in championship contention several times in November, just didn't get over the hump. It sucks that he lost to CMU so many times as well but CMU then was like niu during pj's reign. How did pj do against niu when he was here?

Unfortunately, no, Cubit's teams were NOT in championship contention in November. Unless, maybe, you are thinking about 2008 and the loss at Ball State. Technically, that would be correct, I suppose, however, WMU had already lost badly to CMU in Mount Pleasant (to its 2nd string QB) so the Broncos were all but out of the equation. That was another "meh" 3rd place finish for Cubit's Broncos which had too much talent for such mediocrity.

The 2006 choke-job loss (that still pizzes me off) to CMU was in October, giving the division championship to CMU. If only Cubit had played a QB other than his son that season, maybe he wouldn't have lost twice to Brian Kelly (the International Bowl vs. Cincinnati was a disaster).

Football teams don't play just to reach the "hump." They play to get over it. Despite his flaws & quirks, PJ got WMU over it and beat NIU 45-30 during last season's championship run.

Had Cubit somehow won a championship, while getting owned by CMU, I could forgive him for having a losing record to the Chippewas. But he didn't. Results matter and banners aren't hung when you finish 3rd or 4th.

Pleased WMU is now the defending MAC Champion with three game winning streak vs. CMU. WMU no longer stands for "We're Mediocre U."

We're going to be fighting the Bill Cubit battle here for a long time, it seems.

My only real gripe against him was he wasn't the most results-oriented Head Coach. Smart man, really knew his X's and O's. Loyal to a fault to his assistant coaches and players and that came back to bite him.

We were weak up-front on most Cubit Offensive Teams. The OL Coach wasn't getting the job done (wasn't his name Voth or something like that?). We had attrition in that sector during his tenure. You can't run the ball if you don't have the bulls up front and if you can't run the ball in the MAC you're not going to win championships. Cubit needed to fire someone, he didn't.

I wish him only the best, he'd make a great OC in a big program.

I like that others can help me make my points. Fleck changed the expectations of the alumni, boosters, and fanbase and having Cubit assistants back is irritating, especially when you stood in the cold, driving rain expecting a Tim Hiller coronation, but were instead treated to an uninspiring loss to Ball State.

(10-09-2017 05:03 PM)BroncoPhilly Wrote:  We were weak up-front on most Cubit Offensive Teams. The OL Coach wasn't getting the job done (wasn't his name Voth or something like that?). We had attrition in that sector during his tenure. You can't run the ball if you don't have the bulls up front and if you can't run the ball in the MAC you're not going to win championships. Cubit needed to fire someone, he didn't.

(10-09-2017 12:54 PM)GullLake Wrote:  The 2006 choke-job loss (that still pizzes me off) to CMU was in October, giving the division championship to CMU. If only Cubit had played a QB other than his son that season, maybe he wouldn't have lost twice to Brian Kelly (the International Bowl vs. Cincinnati was a disaster).

Football teams don't play just to reach the "hump." They play to get over it. Despite his flaws & quirks, PJ got WMU over it and beat NIU 45-30 during last season's championship run.

Had Cubit somehow won a championship, while getting owned by CMU, I could forgive him for having a losing record to the Chippewas. But he didn't. Results matter and banners aren't hung when you finish 3rd or 4th.

(10-09-2017 06:04 PM)wingsenforcer Wrote:  I like that others can help me make my points. Fleck changed the expectations of the alumni, boosters, and fanbase and having Cubit assistants back is irritating, especially when you stood in the cold, driving rain expecting a Tim Hiller coronation, but were instead treated to an uninspiring loss to Ball State.

(10-09-2017 05:03 PM)BroncoPhilly Wrote:  We were weak up-front on most Cubit Offensive Teams. The OL Coach wasn't getting the job done (wasn't his name Voth or something like that?). We had attrition in that sector during his tenure. You can't run the ball if you don't have the bulls up front and if you can't run the ball in the MAC you're not going to win championships. Cubit needed to fire someone, he didn't.

(10-09-2017 12:54 PM)GullLake Wrote:  The 2006 choke-job loss (that still pizzes me off) to CMU was in October, giving the division championship to CMU. If only Cubit had played a QB other than his son that season, maybe he wouldn't have lost twice to Brian Kelly (the International Bowl vs. Cincinnati was a disaster).

Football teams don't play just to reach the "hump." They play to get over it. Despite his flaws & quirks, PJ got WMU over it and beat NIU 45-30 during last season's championship run.

Had Cubit somehow won a championship, while getting owned by CMU, I could forgive him for having a losing record to the Chippewas. But he didn't. Results matter and banners aren't hung when you finish 3rd or 4th.

Awww you poor dear. That must have been awful for you.

Was it equally as awful when Fleck left your school in a lurch, resigned overnight with no goodbye and flipped 11 or so three star recruits to Minny or was that ok with you?

(10-09-2017 06:11 PM)ChicagoMan Wrote:  

(10-09-2017 06:04 PM)wingsenforcer Wrote:  I like that others can help me make my points. Fleck changed the expectations of the alumni, boosters, and fanbase and having Cubit assistants back is irritating, especially when you stood in the cold, driving rain expecting a Tim Hiller coronation, but were instead treated to an uninspiring loss to Ball State.

(10-09-2017 05:03 PM)BroncoPhilly Wrote:  We were weak up-front on most Cubit Offensive Teams. The OL Coach wasn't getting the job done (wasn't his name Voth or something like that?). We had attrition in that sector during his tenure. You can't run the ball if you don't have the bulls up front and if you can't run the ball in the MAC you're not going to win championships. Cubit needed to fire someone, he didn't.

(10-09-2017 12:54 PM)GullLake Wrote:  The 2006 choke-job loss (that still pizzes me off) to CMU was in October, giving the division championship to CMU. If only Cubit had played a QB other than his son that season, maybe he wouldn't have lost twice to Brian Kelly (the International Bowl vs. Cincinnati was a disaster).

Football teams don't play just to reach the "hump." They play to get over it. Despite his flaws & quirks, PJ got WMU over it and beat NIU 45-30 during last season's championship run.

Had Cubit somehow won a championship, while getting owned by CMU, I could forgive him for having a losing record to the Chippewas. But he didn't. Results matter and banners aren't hung when you finish 3rd or 4th.

Awww you poor dear. That must have been awful for you.

Was it equally as awful when Fleck left your school in a lurch, resigned overnight with no goodbye and flipped 11 or so three star recruits to Minny or was that ok with you?

Fleck could be banging their daughter and some of these Flecktards would still be swooning over his "magical season."

Lol. Wonder who this guy could possibly be.

(10-09-2017 06:17 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(10-09-2017 06:11 PM)ChicagoMan Wrote:  

(10-09-2017 06:04 PM)wingsenforcer Wrote:  I like that others can help me make my points. Fleck changed the expectations of the alumni, boosters, and fanbase and having Cubit assistants back is irritating, especially when you stood in the cold, driving rain expecting a Tim Hiller coronation, but were instead treated to an uninspiring loss to Ball State.

(10-09-2017 05:03 PM)BroncoPhilly Wrote:  We were weak up-front on most Cubit Offensive Teams. The OL Coach wasn't getting the job done (wasn't his name Voth or something like that?). We had attrition in that sector during his tenure. You can't run the ball if you don't have the bulls up front and if you can't run the ball in the MAC you're not going to win championships. Cubit needed to fire someone, he didn't.

(10-09-2017 12:54 PM)GullLake Wrote:  The 2006 choke-job loss (that still pizzes me off) to CMU was in October, giving the division championship to CMU. If only Cubit had played a QB other than his son that season, maybe he wouldn't have lost twice to Brian Kelly (the International Bowl vs. Cincinnati was a disaster).

Football teams don't play just to reach the "hump." They play to get over it. Despite his flaws & quirks, PJ got WMU over it and beat NIU 45-30 during last season's championship run.

Had Cubit somehow won a championship, while getting owned by CMU, I could forgive him for having a losing record to the Chippewas. But he didn't. Results matter and banners aren't hung when you finish 3rd or 4th.

Awww you poor dear. That must have been awful for you.

Was it equally as awful when Fleck left your school in a lurch, resigned overnight with no goodbye and flipped 11 or so three star recruits to Minny or was that ok with you?

Fleck could be banging their daughter and some of these Flecktards would still be swooning over his "magical season."

Daughter? You sure? But yeah, I get your point.

(10-09-2017 06:18 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  Lol. Wonder who this guy could possibly be.

It's ChipDip, I read his social media accounts.