(11-17-2016 10:33 AM)JustAnotherAustinOwl Wrote: (11-16-2016 12:01 AM)Rick Gerlach Wrote: Maybe I just think too much.
That probably applies to everyone who posts here. :-)
I'm responding generally to the role of Islamophobia in Trump's campaign, not necessarily to a specific post or question.
Early on Trump repeated his story of having seen thousands of Muslims in New Jersey celebrating on 9/11, a claim which had already been thoroughly debunked. (He insisted on doubling down on it, saying he saw it, remembered it, and had "the world's best memory" - worrisome in its own right, but not the main point here.) There is only one reason to further a lie like this - to stoke anger and hatred.
There were other things, condemned by his own party in some cases - the Muslim ban for example. Quite often the things he said were inaccurate and misleading, like suggesting there was no screening for refugees. And of course attacking the Khan family.
The best example is in the town hall debate - a Muslim American woman said she was concerned about rising anti-Muslim feelings. Trump's answer was basically, well Muslims should stop aiding the enemy and cooperate with authorities, then citing another thoroughly debunked falsehood about Muslims knowing about the San Bernadino shooter and not reporting on it.
I don't know if Trump knew these things were both lies or if he actually believed them, but in either case he is spreading falsehoods to generate hate and anger against a minority group. That is not OK, and one of the many reasons I am still struggling to understand how so many people could vote for him.
I agree that a lot of what Trump said/says is full of it, and as posted earlier, I didn't vote for any of the main party candidates.
My personal belief is that Trump doesn't pre-plan much of his public speaking. I think when he says something (usually) that he honestly believes it to be true, at least at the minute he's speaking. That doesn't make what he says correct mind you, but I know a number of people like that.
On the Myer's-Briggs personality-type indicator scale they are strongly F versus T. That is they are more apt to focus on Feeling, rather than Truth.
I knew someone who had a habit of contradicting himself and it infuriated another friend who basically stated that he was a bald-faced liar. What he didn't understand was that the actual words weren't what the other person remembered about things he had said in the past, what mattered to him was his 'intent' and how be 'felt' about the interaction.
(You can sometimes see this on this Board in the regular sports-topic forum by the way)
To a lot of us, words and their meaning matter. My posts are generally long, specifically because I want to make sure I'm not misunderstood and that my words actively reflect what I mean.
Trusting that everyone else is trying to apply that same standard is probably a mistake, at least unless you know them well enough to say it's at least a strong tendency.
In Trump's case, I think there is ample evidence that he often is simply 'winging' it. I doubt that he consciously is intending to lie or falsely present information, at least not 100% of the time. He believes what he is saying, he just may not literally mean everything he says.
Or in Seinfeld terms, as George Costanza gave this advice to Jerry who was about to undergo a polygraph test to determine whether he was lying about his TV viewing habits (to a police officer he was dating):
"Jerry, the only bit of advice I can give you . . . . It's not a lie if you really believe it."
It's all in the way a person sees the world.
That doesn't change the fact that Trump has spit out a lot of whoppers over the last year or so. I just don't think he 'thinks/vetts' about what he's saying, and therefore, not everything he says necessarily has (so much) malicious intent behind it. It may tell you something about what he 'believes' or 'fears' or 'feels'. But the specific details about what he's saying, not so much.
Or to refer to another personal experience, a friend of mine was talking to the father of another mutual friend. That mutual friend had a tendency to regale folks with stories day and night. He's a good guy and quite entertaining.
My friend told our mutual friend's father, "When I'm talking with 'Mutual Friend X', I always remember to divide by 2."
Our mutual friend's father replied, "I find it works better if you divide by 4."
I think we all know people like that. We generally don't expect them to be presidential candidates.
Thanks for responding by the way.
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Presidential Horse Race Thread
