(11-23-2015 01:23 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 01:17 PM)HuskieJohn Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 01:03 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 01:01 PM)The Frisky Biscuit Wrote:  Ha, Milwaukee? Chicago doesn't even care about NIU.

Chicago doesn't care about Illinois or NU. The big thing with Chicago though, is that it is a massive media market that would greatly benefit a conference like the Big 12 in # of TV sets with your product available, that's huge. Plus the Chicago market has tons of Big 12 alums that would flood to Huskie Stadium every single week.

That doesn't matter unless the B12 has a network of their own. Right now the only B12 team we would be helping it Texas with the LHN.

I know B12 leadership has mentioned there are no plans for a network, but if they want to remain a viable relevant p5, they are going to have to.

Not to mention they still don't have a conference championship game! Way behind the other P5s.

(11-23-2015 12:56 PM)badmoonrising13 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 12:43 PM)huskiealum03 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 10:20 AM)HuskieBowWow Wrote:  It's a catch-22. NIU is never going to be P5 drawing 15,000 fans a game. NIU cannot draw more fans unless they are a perceived to be a major team, i.e. P5. It's a perception problem.

The sooner we all resign ourselves to this reality, the less angst there will be on this board.

agreed. i once thought that there was a legitimate chance to grow NIU into a national powerhouse, and possibly move on up. but despite our winning records, attendance has declined. we are a looooonnnng way from even sniffing a major conference bid. i've personally disagreed with some of the gameday experience changes (tailgate lots, ticket/parking prices, weekday games), that i feel have been short sighted and come at expense of true long term fan growth. I am not surprised that support has grown weaker over the years. But, the Ath. Dept. has their own priorities, so i quit really caring about 'how to get attendance up', when a lot of issues have been self inflicted. The gameday experience has really gone mediocre over the years, and really does not deserve better support, IMO.

Obviously Frazier disagrees with you because the video he released a couple months ago makes it pretty clear that he will take us there eventually. And if he leaves the next guy better have the same goal and take us there with the same determination and enthusiasm.

thats fine that he disagrees with me. Thats why i stopped caring about 'how to get NIU there'. Thats his job. My job is to enjoy the product as i see fit. If i feel parking or tickets cost too much or the gameday atmosphere sucks, i won't go to the games. Attendance is not my problem to deal with. Its his. As much as i love NIU football, ultimately its a commodity in the Chicago scene of pro, semi-pro, and minor league sports.

(11-23-2015 12:43 PM)huskiealum03 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 10:20 AM)HuskieBowWow Wrote:  It's a catch-22. NIU is never going to be P5 drawing 15,000 fans a game. NIU cannot draw more fans unless they are a perceived to be a major team, i.e. P5. It's a perception problem.

The sooner we all resign ourselves to this reality, the less angst there will be on this board.

agreed. i once thought that there was a legitimate chance to grow NIU into a national powerhouse, and possibly move on up. but despite our winning records, attendance has declined. we are a looooonnnng way from even sniffing a major conference bid. i've personally disagreed with some of the gameday experience changes (tailgate lots, ticket/parking prices, weekday games), that i feel have been short sighted and come at expense of true long term fan growth. I am not surprised that support has grown weaker over the years. But, the Ath. Dept. has their own priorities, so i quit really caring about 'how to get attendance up', when a lot of issues have been self inflicted. The gameday experience has really gone mediocre over the years, and really does not deserve better support, IMO.

Other then the forced weekday game by the MAC Conference(tv deal), which isn't something NIU has control over, what are your problems with the rest? Curious more than anything..

I thought The Yard was a huge improvement.

I park in the same tailgate lot every year, because I like the people and don't want to be on the East Side

Ticket and parking prices I feel are fair relative to the area, sure single game tickets are high, but I like that as a season ticket holder it gives my tickets more value.

(11-23-2015 01:46 PM)cartershaw Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 12:43 PM)huskiealum03 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 10:20 AM)HuskieBowWow Wrote:  It's a catch-22. NIU is never going to be P5 drawing 15,000 fans a game. NIU cannot draw more fans unless they are a perceived to be a major team, i.e. P5. It's a perception problem.

The sooner we all resign ourselves to this reality, the less angst there will be on this board.

agreed. i once thought that there was a legitimate chance to grow NIU into a national powerhouse, and possibly move on up. but despite our winning records, attendance has declined. we are a looooonnnng way from even sniffing a major conference bid. i've personally disagreed with some of the gameday experience changes (tailgate lots, ticket/parking prices, weekday games), that i feel have been short sighted and come at expense of true long term fan growth. I am not surprised that support has grown weaker over the years. But, the Ath. Dept. has their own priorities, so i quit really caring about 'how to get attendance up', when a lot of issues have been self inflicted. The gameday experience has really gone mediocre over the years, and really does not deserve better support, IMO.

Other then the forced weekday game by the MAC Conference(tv deal), which isn't something NIU has control over, what are your problems with the rest? Curious more than anything..

I thought The Yard was a huge improvement.

I park in the same tailgate lot every year, because I like the people and don't want to be on the East Side

Ticket and parking prices I feel are fair relative to the area, sure single game tickets are high, but I like that as a season ticket holder it gives my tickets more value.

Tailgating: i am talking about way back in 2003-04 when NIU basically eradicated student side tailgating on the east side and spread it thin to the convocation center. Others have said similar things in the past, but tailgating pre 2004 was amazing for students. pack in the cars tight and have a blast. Now? both 'main' tailgating lots are so sparcely populated that the experience lost the sense of community and fun atmosphere

Parking Prices: I know NIU needs to make its money. however, seeing how little used the tailgating areas are (and some people simply use it for parking), i feel that parking prices are too much considering supply and demand.

Ticket prices: again, the stadium is hardly full. to me ticket prices do not reflect the supply and demand. Yes, i get that the entertainment value is 'reasonable' relative to other sports options, but they really should be lower independent of NIU's financial calculators.

i cant comment about the on-site gameday amenities (IE dog pound). i have no use for them. When i go to games with friends, we tailgate, then we go to the game. thats it...

I do like that they sell beer on the west side though. its a nice incremental improvement, but it doesn't necessarily help grow the long term.

I have always been of the position of catering to the students. Thats where your long term growth lies. I don't care about improving atmosphere for me. I know what the atmosphere was like when i was a student, and what it is now.

(11-23-2015 09:45 AM)huskiealum03 Wrote:  I imagine internally Frazier rolls his eyes everytime an armchair AD comes up to him with some 'ideas' on how to get NIU to another level.

I don't need to go any further on this thread. Perfectly said.

If it was June, just to entertain myself, maybe. Not in late November.

(11-23-2015 12:56 PM)badmoonrising13 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 12:43 PM)huskiealum03 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 10:20 AM)HuskieBowWow Wrote:  It's a catch-22. NIU is never going to be P5 drawing 15,000 fans a game. NIU cannot draw more fans unless they are a perceived to be a major team, i.e. P5. It's a perception problem.

The sooner we all resign ourselves to this reality, the less angst there will be on this board.

agreed. i once thought that there was a legitimate chance to grow NIU into a national powerhouse, and possibly move on up. but despite our winning records, attendance has declined. we are a looooonnnng way from even sniffing a major conference bid. i've personally disagreed with some of the gameday experience changes (tailgate lots, ticket/parking prices, weekday games), that i feel have been short sighted and come at expense of true long term fan growth. I am not surprised that support has grown weaker over the years. But, the Ath. Dept. has their own priorities, so i quit really caring about 'how to get attendance up', when a lot of issues have been self inflicted. The gameday experience has really gone mediocre over the years, and really does not deserve better support, IMO.

Obviously Frazier disagrees with you because the video he released a couple months ago makes it pretty clear that he will take us there eventually. And if he leaves the next guy better have the same goal and take us there with the same determination and enthusiasm.

I think if anybody could do it, it would be Frazier. It's a worthy goal but it's not realistic as long as our schedule consists of MAC teams. He would have to be as slick as a used car salesman to get the AAC or other top G5 conference to invite us. Even at that, there is no guarantee that attendance is boosted to any great degree and still a long way from getting to P5.

alum03 is right. The atmosphere in 2003-2004 was great and unfortunately it's been pretty much garbage since then.

(11-23-2015 02:23 PM)armour248 Wrote:  alum03 is right. The atmosphere in 2003-2004 was great and unfortunately it's been pretty much garbage since then.

Home attendance is so dominated by the schedule, I think NIU returns to that 2003-2005 period shortly once the BYUs, Marylands, Utahs, and Boston Colleges return to Huskie Stadium. Those opponents will cause people to buy up season tickets by the bushels, even despite the weeknight games.

(11-23-2015 02:30 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 02:23 PM)armour248 Wrote:  alum03 is right. The atmosphere in 2003-2004 was great and unfortunately it's been pretty much garbage since then.

Home attendance is so dominated by the schedule, I think NIU returns to that 2003-2005 period shortly once the BYUs, Marylands, Utahs, and Boston Colleges return to Huskie Stadium. Those opponents will cause people to buy up season tickets by the bushels, even despite the weeknight games.

I'd even go back to 2002.. my final year as a master's student.. the Wake and BG games were electric..and the schedule of Maryland / Iowa State was just incredible in 2003... it's a shame the heavens didn't completely align that year and we could have had BG / Toledo at home... even with the injuries, may have been enough to an undefeated season...

(11-23-2015 12:57 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 10:20 AM)HuskieBowWow Wrote:  It's a catch-22. NIU is never going to be P5 drawing 15,000 fans a game. NIU cannot draw more fans unless they are a perceived to be a major team, i.e. P5. It's a perception problem.

The sooner we all resign ourselves to this reality, the less angst there will be on this board.

It is the ultimate dilemma for sure, the combination of opposing fans crammed into the Chicago market and the broad base of NIU fans would guarantee filling Huskie Stadium every day if playing in the Big 12. But you are right its a catch 22. It is important for NIU to remain relatively successful over the next 2 to 3 years because the schedule factor will start to kick in. NIU can average 25k a game when people start to jump on season tickets because they want to see Maryland, BYU, Utah, etc. Just have to keep the ball rolling over the next few years. Next year is huge, all common sense would say WMU should win the MAC, if NIU can break through next year again, I think it would be a nice bridge to keep fan interest going until the big P5's start coming to Huskie Stadium the following years.

you have us averaging 100+% capacity in a few years????

(11-23-2015 01:54 PM)huskiealum03 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 01:46 PM)cartershaw Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 12:43 PM)huskiealum03 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 10:20 AM)HuskieBowWow Wrote:  It's a catch-22. NIU is never going to be P5 drawing 15,000 fans a game. NIU cannot draw more fans unless they are a perceived to be a major team, i.e. P5. It's a perception problem.

The sooner we all resign ourselves to this reality, the less angst there will be on this board.

agreed. i once thought that there was a legitimate chance to grow NIU into a national powerhouse, and possibly move on up. but despite our winning records, attendance has declined. we are a looooonnnng way from even sniffing a major conference bid. i've personally disagreed with some of the gameday experience changes (tailgate lots, ticket/parking prices, weekday games), that i feel have been short sighted and come at expense of true long term fan growth. I am not surprised that support has grown weaker over the years. But, the Ath. Dept. has their own priorities, so i quit really caring about 'how to get attendance up', when a lot of issues have been self inflicted. The gameday experience has really gone mediocre over the years, and really does not deserve better support, IMO.

Other then the forced weekday game by the MAC Conference(tv deal), which isn't something NIU has control over, what are your problems with the rest? Curious more than anything..

I thought The Yard was a huge improvement.

I park in the same tailgate lot every year, because I like the people and don't want to be on the East Side

Ticket and parking prices I feel are fair relative to the area, sure single game tickets are high, but I like that as a season ticket holder it gives my tickets more value.

Tailgating: i am talking about way back in 2003-04 when NIU basically eradicated student side tailgating on the east side and spread it thin to the convocation center. Others have said similar things in the past, but tailgating pre 2004 was amazing for students. pack in the cars tight and have a blast. Now? both 'main' tailgating lots are so sparcely populated that the experience lost the sense of community and fun atmosphere

Parking Prices: I know NIU needs to make its money. however, seeing how little used the tailgating areas are (and some people simply use it for parking), i feel that parking prices are too much considering supply and demand.

Ticket prices: again, the stadium is hardly full. to me ticket prices do not reflect the supply and demand. Yes, i get that the entertainment value is 'reasonable' relative to other sports options, but they really should be lower independent of NIU's financial calculators.

MAC schools have tried to lower the ticket prices to near 0 to get more to show up and it didn't really help.

What they found is people who will pay $20 dollar homecoming tickets for 4 people can be easily pushed up to paying $30 or $40 for those tickets. The core fanbase has the money for it. This pricing pushes fans into Family Packs that boost season ticket sale numbers.

I was able to sell my Marshall tickets on the secondary market with a face of $40 dollars for $25 a piece and recouped half of my price of a season Family Pack in just one game.

Some of the pricing I see at other MAC schools where its $40 dollars in one section and $20 in another undercuts season ticket sales. At Ohio the single game tickets are all one price but season tickets have varying prices.

Parking at Ohio is very limited around the stadium. That is how we can justify $750 dollar contribution lots. Everything stadium/parking is setup boutique.

I think ticket prices DO reflect supply and demand. The ultimate goal of a ticket price isn't really to maximize attendance - its to maximize revenue.

(11-23-2015 12:43 PM)huskiealum03 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 10:20 AM)HuskieBowWow Wrote:  It's a catch-22. NIU is never going to be P5 drawing 15,000 fans a game. NIU cannot draw more fans unless they are a perceived to be a major team, i.e. P5. It's a perception problem.

The sooner we all resign ourselves to this reality, the less angst there will be on this board.

agreed. i once thought that there was a legitimate chance to grow NIU into a national powerhouse, and possibly move on up. but despite our winning records, attendance has declined. we are a looooonnnng way from even sniffing a major conference bid. i've personally disagreed with some of the gameday experience changes (tailgate lots, ticket/parking prices, weekday games), that i feel have been short sighted and come at expense of true long term fan growth. I am not surprised that support has grown weaker over the years. But, the Ath. Dept. has their own priorities, so i quit really caring about 'how to get attendance up', when a lot of issues have been self inflicted. The gameday experience has really gone mediocre over the years, and really does not deserve better support, IMO.

There isn't a middle tier to college football that is between the mid major and the power school where a school where a school can build up the program.

1985
Power Conference/Major Independent
WAC/Minor Independent
MAC/Big West

2005
P5/Notre Dame
G5/Minor Independent

The good thing is the MAC is pushed up to the level of the MWC, AAC ect. in how its viewed. The rungs up to the big time P5 though mostly are removed. Brand will always be an issue for some of the MAC but for NIU the sky is the limit.

(11-23-2015 01:54 PM)huskiealum03 Wrote:  Tailgating: i am talking about way back in 2003-04 when NIU basically eradicated student side tailgating on the east side and spread it thin to the convocation center. Others have said similar things in the past, but tailgating pre 2004 was amazing for students. pack in the cars tight and have a blast. Now? both 'main' tailgating lots are so sparcely populated that the experience lost the sense of community and fun atmosphere

People keep saying this but its just not true. The reason that tailgating atmosphere in the East lot was drastically reduced was because in 2003 it was open to the general public, first come first serve.

Now 2/3 of it is a reserved parking spot for donors which 50% don't even show up for all the Saturday games.

The other 1/3 is for the students yet they don't even fill it up even though a season parking pass for them is only $30ea. Since 2010 I have not seen the students come close to filling up their section of the East side.


The Convo tailgating atmosphere is great for the Saturday games.

Quote:Parking Prices: I know NIU needs to make its money. however, seeing how little used the tailgating areas are (and some people simply use it for parking), i feel that parking prices are too much considering supply and demand.

Athletics does need to package the open parking spots in the East lot but most of those spots are sold. Its just that the donors are not coming to the games for some reason.

If they want to pay $1000+ just to park and walk over to the HAF tent then that is fine by me.

Quote:Ticket prices: again, the stadium is hardly full. to me ticket prices do not reflect the supply and demand. Yes, i get that the entertainment value is 'reasonable' relative to other sports options, but they really should be lower independent of NIU's financial calculators.

They needed to start the summer off with the HyVee $20 tickets instead of this last minuet, internet only but can barely find the link method that they started the season with. They really needed to go with the "Tickets as low as $20" to give the mindset of affordavility Other then that I think everything since then has been fine.

As a season ticket holder I approve of the 2 MACtion games for $30 promo and the final home game for $14. I dont see how anyone who has an issue with these other than they should sell the 2 MACtion games for $30 to begin with. Get people to commit earlier.

Quote:i cant comment about the on-site gameday amenities (IE dog pound). i have no use for them. When i go to games with friends, we tailgate, then we go to the game. thats it...

I do like that they sell beer on the west side though. its a nice incremental improvement, but it doesn't necessarily help grow the long term.

I have always been of the position of catering to the students. Thats where your long term growth lies. I don't care about improving atmosphere for me. I know what the atmosphere was like when i was a student, and what it is now.

Do you mean "The Yard"?

Selling beer on the East side next year would help. Hope they figure out a plan to make it safe.

(11-23-2015 03:21 PM)niuguy Wrote:  I think ticket prices DO reflect supply and demand. The ultimate goal of a ticket price isn't really to maximize attendance - its to maximize revenue.

you are correct.

all i know is that 12 years after i have graduated, this messageboard is still having the same tired discussion of Attendance and ambitious moves to bigger conferences. call me jaded, but i feel like i have seen a lot of bandaids to big problems and shots to the foot over the years to really feel like some move to 'the big time' is nothing more than a pipedream, and that winning does not 'cure all'.

feel free to disagree with me..thats why its a messageboard.

Add Craft beer to the End Zone Club.

(11-23-2015 03:37 PM)huskie1stdown Wrote:  Add Craft beer to the End Zone Club.

They did or you are suggesting it?

(11-23-2015 03:35 PM)HuskieJohn Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 01:54 PM)huskiealum03 Wrote:  Tailgating: i am talking about way back in 2003-04 when NIU basically eradicated student side tailgating on the east side and spread it thin to the convocation center. Others have said similar things in the past, but tailgating pre 2004 was amazing for students. pack in the cars tight and have a blast. Now? both 'main' tailgating lots are so sparcely populated that the experience lost the sense of community and fun atmosphere

People keep saying this but its just not true. The reason that tailgating atmosphere in the East lot was drastically reduced was because in 2003 it was open to the general public, first come first serve.

Now 2/3 of it is a reserved parking spot for donors which 50% don't even show up for all the Saturday games.

The other 1/3 is for the students yet they don't even fill it up even though a season parking pass for them is only $30ea. Since 2010 I have not seen the students come close to filling up their section of the East side.


The Convo tailgating atmosphere is great for the Saturday games.

I'm sorry, but if i'm a student who experiences the pre-2004 tailgate, and a student who experiences the convo tailgate in 2015, i'd say that the Convo (for a student mind you) tailgate is a snoozefest. Even as just a general participant in tailgating, its ok...its not that great...just ok.

student participation is a snowball effect. if tailgating is not that impressive, then it won't pull in fringe students. if it is fun for some, word of mouth will spread which will get the next tier, which will get the next tier.

The fact that it was general parking WAS the key to its success. anyone could go there, and wasn't restricted to donors and season parking pass holders. you could just show up, recruit friends on a whim and get a train of cars going. thats the beauty of it. now you block off 2/3rds of the lot to donors who don't show up (which is their right - thats nius fault), and requiring students to pay $30 for a season pass? ehh...not much of a compelling argument for a student to shell out money for something that isn't that impressive in the first place.

seriously, the grass lot used to be jammed pack, with the other alumni center parking lot (before there was an alumni center), and the adjacent streets being jammed. it was a seriously awesome time for a student.

(11-23-2015 03:35 PM)huskiealum03 Wrote:  

(11-23-2015 03:21 PM)niuguy Wrote:  I think ticket prices DO reflect supply and demand. The ultimate goal of a ticket price isn't really to maximize attendance - its to maximize revenue.

you are correct.

all i know is that 12 years after i have graduated, this messageboard is still having the same tired discussion of Attendance and ambitious moves to bigger conferences. call me jaded, but i feel like i have seen a lot of bandaids to big problems and shots to the foot over the years to really feel like some move to 'the big time' is nothing more than a pipedream, and that winning does not 'cure all'.

feel free to disagree with me..thats why its a messageboard.

These discussions have been going on for over 40 years. Robert Brigham thought we should become an independent and the next Notre Dame. That did not work out very well.

I have always been surprised by the low attendance at Huskie Stadium and I have always felt that if we ever do successfully improve our fan base we should move to the Big 12.

However, we are pretty far from that at the current time and the MAC is a pretty good fit for NIU given our similarities to the other schools in the conference.

Honestly I think that the biggest issue for NIU is that it has always been known as a "suit case" college where the students go home on the weekends. It was that way in 1975 and it is still that way in 2015 which is unfortunate

I've said it before, but yes, the great tailgating on the east side was a huge part of the gameday experience and since they killed the general admission they killed the gameday experience. Bring it back! The problem is now they've given this benefit to donors and I'm not sure how you take it back.

Killing east side tailgating continues to be the greatest mistake in NIU football in the last 10 years.