Closer to reality...I was sent a survey.

Three choices:
1. Cheapest (Kick the can down the road)..replace fabric roof with new one and continue to debate a new stadium. It would buy the Univ about 10-15 years tops.

2. Hard Roof on Dome (fixed or retractable). Bump out walls, add more of everything but seating. I would expect capacity to decrease by 3-5k for FB. A/C would be installed...Dome would probably merge with Archbold gym. A restaurant and TV control room would be added on the west side. Recruiting lounge??? Adding more suites, loges, etc... This one seems likely. They could work around the seasons and do it over 2-3 years.

3. New stadium at South Campus, downtown, State Fair, Destiny area...

Hard to beat outdoor football.

If you have the money for #3, why would you not do #3? How much could they really improve the dome with #2? And is the price tag worth it? Might be more reasonable to build a completely new stadium.

(05-11-2015 10:28 PM)Marge Schott Wrote:  If you have the money for #3, why would you not do #3? How much could they really improve the dome with #2? And is the price tag worth it? Might be more reasonable to build a completely new stadium.

You think...but politics is involved. Rumor is SU wants the land where the Dome sits for other uses...but would the new stadium be convenient to our lazy, front running students?

Who owns the parking lots west of the dome?

You're looking at it wrong. It's not about your "lazy, front running students". It's about what best positions the program for the future. You build a competitive program - starting with an new, attractive, recruit-enticing stadium - and fans will come out.

Would the "downtown" and/or "Destiny" sites be too inconvenient? It's not like we're talking about moving the dome/stadium all the way across the county like with UMiami. Both seem better than south campus.

What politics?

Minnesota's 50,000+ stadium cost $290M.

Yes they own the lots west of the stadium....I tailgate there. Destiny would work but they would have to get the train back up running. Politics...our stupid mayor turned off $500M from the state for a retractable roof stadium cuz she wasn't informed first...about building a new stadium downtown. Downtown would need trolleys or buses...but doable. NY politics is insane.

Trolleys or buses? Is there no current public transportation?

Not to high jack your thread, but FSU has a tough decision to make with it's stadium. Basically has to redo 3/4 of it (about $200 million plus) but is not sure it can pull the trigger. If it doesn't, it has to spend MANY millions in upkeep and will just have to wind up redoing the stadium latter.

$$$ is huge issue for FSU right now because of this and basketball facility needs.

(05-12-2015 02:56 AM)Marge Schott Wrote:  Trolleys or buses? Is there no current public transportation?

Ofcourse there is but routes would have to be redone...etc...also it would be a great time to relook at mass transit especially with I-81 through downtown looking at Boulevard, viaduct or tunnel options.

(05-12-2015 05:09 AM)nole Wrote:  Not to high jack your thread, but FSU has a tough decision to make with it's stadium. Basically has to redo 3/4 of it (about $200 million plus) but is not sure it can pull the trigger. If it doesn't, it has to spend MANY millions in upkeep and will just have to wind up redoing the stadium latter.

$$$ is huge issue for FSU right now because of this and basketball facility needs.

Isn't Tally the state capital? Albany never has money issues.

I wouldn't worry too much about the "lazy students", it's the donors and the ones that pay the for the tickets that the University should be thinking about. Invest in a modern, shiny, attractive new stadium, put a good product on the field, the students will suddenly become less lazy.

(05-12-2015 07:35 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(05-12-2015 05:09 AM)nole Wrote:  Not to high jack your thread, but FSU has a tough decision to make with it's stadium. Basically has to redo 3/4 of it (about $200 million plus) but is not sure it can pull the trigger. If it doesn't, it has to spend MANY millions in upkeep and will just have to wind up redoing the stadium latter.

$$$ is huge issue for FSU right now because of this and basketball facility needs.

Isn't Tally the state capital? Albany never has money issues.

Yes, it is. State capital has no impact on FSU and it's facility $$$ needs.

(05-12-2015 07:34 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(05-12-2015 02:56 AM)Marge Schott Wrote:  Trolleys or buses? Is there no current public transportation?

Ofcourse there is but routes would have to be redone...etc...also it would be a great time to relook at mass transit especially with I-81 through downtown looking at Boulevard, viaduct or tunnel options.

This just doesn't make much sense to me. There should already be routes connecting two important destinations, which I assume a really big mall and a well known university are. Are you specifically talking about an SU to Destiny route, or something else?

(05-12-2015 07:35 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(05-12-2015 05:09 AM)nole Wrote:  Not to high jack your thread, but FSU has a tough decision to make with it's stadium. Basically has to redo 3/4 of it (about $200 million plus) but is not sure it can pull the trigger. If it doesn't, it has to spend MANY millions in upkeep and will just have to wind up redoing the stadium latter.

$$$ is huge issue for FSU right now because of this and basketball facility needs.

Isn't Tally the state capital? Albany never has money issues.

The state does not fund college athletics with taxpayer money. It will be paid with bonds and donations.

That said, the situation isn't near as dire as nole makes it seem. They completed ~$10M(?) in upgrades to the civic center before the last season.
(all new seats, new court, new main scoreboard, secondary scoreboards and ribbon boards)
https://exposure.imgix.net/production/ph...uto=format

They've either already or are about to start the first phase of the football renovations which is to cost ~$80M. Some of that money is going to the "upkeep" nole mentioned.
(basically everything from the walkway halfway up will be new)
http://championscampaign.com/wp-content/...15-003.jpg

(the two large glass stairwell/elevator towers that will service the new club seats)
http://championscampaign.com/wp-content/...19-004.jpg

Basketball will have their locker room renovated, but the expansion to the practice facility is likely on hold for a few years. Once the new football club seats have been in place for a few years they'll start design work on the next phase. It's been stated they will likely do one sideline first and then the other, though I think it may be several years between the completion of 1 and the starting of 2. They've already had a study done and they can simply remove the bleacher seating bowl without having to make any changes to the brick building structures surrounding the entire stadium. They'll just tear out the erector set and build anew inside the existing brick facade. I think all 3 phases could take 15 years or so, though.

Marge what is the proposed overall seating capacity going to be? slightly more, about the same or slightly less?

About the mass transit...I was talking about moving folks from Destiny to the University.

I don't like the idea of #2. I think I would either kick the can down the road or build a new stadium.

I'd rather put duck tape on something and then get what I really want when it finally takes a **** than polish the **** just enough to make it hurt the wallet and really just be settling.

Get what you really want. Life's too short.

#3 would be huge for Cuse, and frankly the other 2 options sounds like a colossal waste of time and money. I really hope they have the vision and support to get a new stadium. A revitalized Syracuse would be good for the league.

(05-12-2015 09:51 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  Marge what is the proposed overall seating capacity going to be? slightly more, about the same or slightly less?

About the mass transit...I was talking about moving folks from Destiny to the University.

I'm still not understanding. I've been assuming - for the point of this discussion - that the stadium would be at Destiny. Is there not currently transportation between Destiny and SU?

The capacity will drop. It's not so much that FSU wants a smaller capacity, but what it wants - chairback club seats and the revenue they bring - demands it. I think it's roughly 10,000 seats in that bleacher section and they've designed 6,000-6,500 club seats in its place. So capacity will be ~79,000, though the occasional big game will push attendance ~2,000 higher than capacity like previously.

Since there aren't even conceptual designs for the two sideline sections, I'm not sure how much of those will be converted to chairback as well. I doubt Boosters or the AD have any general idea at the moment, either. I can't imagine doing a UL and being all chairback. We'd lose too much capacity. Unless they can angle the seating and create additional decks, and completely reworking the press/media boxes at the top to create more sitting area and limit the capacity loss. There's also space in the student endzone to add 10,000 bleacher seats. Part of the athletic center that overlooks the stadium would need to be altered to make that work though. And/Or perhaps they complete the horseshoe of suites/boxes running along the top of the stadium, too. No clue. This is a long way off.

(top endzone is the student endzone with the athletic center overlook - kind of looks like WVU's one endzone, bottom endzone is the club seats project endzone)
http://i55.twitgoo.com/25u5nqw.jpg

(05-12-2015 10:48 AM)uofl05 Wrote:  #3 would be huge for Cuse, and frankly the other 2 options sounds like a colossal waste of time and money. I really hope they have the vision and support to get a new stadium. A revitalized Syracuse would be good for the league.

I don't think #1 is a waste of time or money if it allows them to find a suitable site and acquire the funding necessary to build a stadium, and assuming a new roof doesn't cost more than $10-15M. But considering the state was ready to give them the full sum for a stadium last year, they probably don't need the time provided by #1.

I was shocked in my first visit to the Carrier Dome at how crappy it was. I don't know what I was expecting but that certainly was not it.

The campus itself is very attractive. I imagine when the leaves fall that is one of the most beautiful scenes in America. The town was a little rougher than I was expecting but it wasn't horrible. It was a but like downtown South Bend, Indiana - which is also rougher than most realize. The Carrier Dome was really disappointing though. It was hot and uncomfortable and it just felt very, very old and out of date. Again, it was not nearly as bad as Pitt Stadium was in its final days but it definitely needs either a full renovation or to be torn down and replaced altogether. My vote would be for the latter.

Why not play for a few seasons in Buffalo and/or Yankee Stadium for a year or two while SU builds a brand new facility? Sure it would suck to play off campus while they were building the new facility but it would be well worth it in the end. Hoops could barnstorm all over New York state - play some games in Albany, some in Rochester, some in Buffalo, some in Brooklyn, and some in Manhattan. You could even play a game or two in Nassau Coliseum if you wanted to incorporate Long Island. That is not a great permanent solution but it would work just fine for a year or two while you built a state-of-the-art on campus facility.

I'm just a little skeptical that the Dome is salvageable. Even with a LOT of renovation, it would still probably be a middling facility. Just tear down and start anew - you'll be glad you did.

Here is the 'not as dire' situation in factual detail. Deem it dire or not dire.....don't care. Here are the facts per FSU Boosters (Jerry Kutz):


Jerry Kutz
1/23/2015

"You are correct. We are facing $26 million in repairs to the main bowl and you can't just go borrow that money to make those repairs without a revenue source. The club seat project won't fund all of it but it will help. Every project we create is intended to generate revenue to fund the program which benefits all Seminole fans whether they choose to come to games or watch it from home."


"The $26 mill is to replace about 10 percent of the metal plates which are too rusted to repair, to weld a lot of structure, to sandblast the underside and topside to bare metal, do rust abatement, and coat the metal with what is an expensive coating. It is super labor intensive as there's a lot of wiring and delicate stuff underneath that has to be moved before you can sandblast the paint and rust. All the bleachers have to be removed s well to paint top side. Many raw need replacing. We are doing $6 million of the worst part now."


Jerry Kutz
1/31/2015

"Regular maintenance is something that has to be performed every year, it's not something you put off and forget and ignore until it's too late.

I agree with you. There needs to be a maintenance reserve in the athletics budget to keep the stadium healthy and that's a top priority for this administration. Every year you have fundamental work that needs to be done and about every 10 years you have major work that has to be done that is VERY expensive, kind of like replacing the roof on your house. If you do basic maintenance on your roof, you'll get a couple of extra years out of it but once it hits about 20 years old you still have to replace that roof. A metal stadium is the same thing. If you stay on top of it, it will last you longer than if you neglect it but the simple fact is eventually parts of a metal stadium have to be replaced. Doak was built in 1950 so its 64 years old in some parts, so the university has gotten a lot of service from it.

I also think you guys are right about why FSU didn't do the paint job five years ago when it needed it. If you remember (who will forget) the football team started going 6-6 and FSU lost 14,000 season ticket holders in the years right before Jimbo -- that's about $4 million in ticket revenue annually as well as some people withheld Booster contributions -- and the priority to fund the improvements Jimbo felt FSU needed to make to catch up with the competition took precedence and diluted the reserve to do that "replace the roof" maintenance. We wish we had the money to have done the maintenance too but the money wasn't there and I believe it was probably wise to rebuild the football program with what money their was, first, and kick the maintenance can down the road.

We have had multiple contractors and stadium architects give us proposals as to what it will cost to do what is needed to do the major maintenance and to improve the concourses and we have proposals to drop the metal stands and replace them with a state of the art product. Renovating the stands and the concourses will be about $60 million and new stands with better revenue generating capacity would be about $200 million. We have documents that make a compelling case for renovating and documents that make a compelling case for building new. And when we did the club seat design we also thought ahead and have designs that are compatible if we decide to replace the East and West,


The Boosters and Athletics have studied both options. We are exploring funding sources of each; quantifying the differential in on-going maintenance costs, time to complete (both can be done between two football seasons). We have only recently given the President a 30,000 foot brief with information we've compiled. He will want to take a deeper dive into the numbers in the weeks to come but is thoughtfully engaged. We are doing what we have to do right now for the 2015 season but will not invest the big number until we fully vet our ability to fund a state of the art facility that will generate considerably more revenue with mid-level skyboxes, sideline club seats, better concession facilities, etc. It is a priority to vet that right away so we can move decisively. "




FSU has put some lipstick on the pig for it's basketball facility. To REALLY fix it and adjust the seating so it is a decent fant experience, FSU needs to sink another $30-$40 Million. Original costs were double that.....but FSU isn't going to go high end. They may just still with small projects and never make the major changes needed.


Either way, you can expect FSU to spend a large sum of money in the coming years regardless of the direction they go.