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Know your American history...The Sons of Liberty, a group dedicated to protecting the rights of colonists against English oppression, convened at the Green Dragon Tavern in Boston and ignited the most infamous act of rebellion in history — the American revolution.

"But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."

"And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor."

Funny thing... the southern States did the same thing in 1861, yet they are viewed as racist, wrong, and misguided.

Victors write the books, huh?

(02-09-2015 11:56 AM)Montgomery Blazer Wrote:  Funny thing... the southern States did the same thing in 1861, yet they are viewed as racist, wrong, and misguided.

Victors write the books, huh?

derp, derp, derp

(02-09-2015 11:56 AM)Montgomery Blazer Wrote:  Funny thing... the southern States did the same thing in 1861, yet they are viewed as racist, wrong, and misguided.

Victors write the books, huh?

The difference is, those guys were fighting for the right to subjugate other human beings.

Anyway...this would be my name for a bar in Southside.

(02-09-2015 06:12 PM)Smaug Wrote:  

(02-09-2015 11:56 AM)Montgomery Blazer Wrote:  Funny thing... the southern States did the same thing in 1861, yet they are viewed as racist, wrong, and misguided.

Victors write the books, huh?

The difference is, those guys were fighting for the right to subjugate other human beings.

To be fair, Lincoln only "freed the slaves" in the Confederacy. Slavery remained legal in Kentucky, Missouri, Delaware, Maryland, and West Virginia. Slavery was not ended in the USA until after Lincoln's death. The Emancipation Proclamation only applied to areas in the Confederacy--not to slavery in the United States itself.

The last flag in North America under which slavery was legal was Old Glory.

(02-09-2015 06:28 PM)Agent Orange Sauce Wrote:  Anyway...this would be my name for a bar in Southside.

Blazer gear only, no Confederate/Bammer flags? I would drink there.

(02-09-2015 06:46 PM)58-56 Wrote:  

(02-09-2015 06:28 PM)Agent Orange Sauce Wrote:  Anyway...this would be my name for a bar in Southside.

Blazer gear only, no Confederate/Bammer flags? I would drink there.

(02-09-2015 06:43 PM)Blazeramo Wrote:  

(02-09-2015 06:12 PM)Smaug Wrote:  

(02-09-2015 11:56 AM)Montgomery Blazer Wrote:  Funny thing... the southern States did the same thing in 1861, yet they are viewed as racist, wrong, and misguided.

Victors write the books, huh?

The difference is, those guys were fighting for the right to subjugate other human beings.

To be fair, Lincoln only "freed the slaves" in the Confederacy. Slavery remained legal in Kentucky, Missouri, Delaware, Maryland, and West Virginia. Slavery was not ended in the USA until after Lincoln's death. The Emancipation Proclamation only applied to areas in the Confederacy--not to slavery in the United States itself.

The last flag in North America under which slavery was legal was Old Glory.

Pick that nit.

(02-09-2015 06:52 PM)Smaug Wrote:  

(02-09-2015 06:43 PM)Blazeramo Wrote:  

(02-09-2015 06:12 PM)Smaug Wrote:  

(02-09-2015 11:56 AM)Montgomery Blazer Wrote:  Funny thing... the southern States did the same thing in 1861, yet they are viewed as racist, wrong, and misguided.

Victors write the books, huh?

The difference is, those guys were fighting for the right to subjugate other human beings.

To be fair, Lincoln only "freed the slaves" in the Confederacy. Slavery remained legal in Kentucky, Missouri, Delaware, Maryland, and West Virginia. Slavery was not ended in the USA until after Lincoln's death. The Emancipation Proclamation only applied to areas in the Confederacy--not to slavery in the United States itself.

The last flag in North America under which slavery was legal was Old Glory.

Pick that nit.

Just wanted to make sure you knew. It's amazing how many people don't realize that slavery in the US continued after the Civil War was over.

(02-09-2015 06:43 PM)Blazeramo Wrote:  

(02-09-2015 06:12 PM)Smaug Wrote:  

(02-09-2015 11:56 AM)Montgomery Blazer Wrote:  Funny thing... the southern States did the same thing in 1861, yet they are viewed as racist, wrong, and misguided.

Victors write the books, huh?

The difference is, those guys were fighting for the right to subjugate other human beings.

To be fair, Lincoln only "freed the slaves" in the Confederacy. Slavery remained legal in Kentucky, Missouri, Delaware, Maryland, and West Virginia. Slavery was not ended in the USA until after Lincoln's death. The Emancipation Proclamation only applied to areas in the Confederacy--not to slavery in the United States itself.

The last flag in North America under which slavery was legal was Old Glory.

Correct, which was enacted under Lincoln's presidential war powers against 10 states in rebellion, and which is why Lincoln whole-heartedly supported the 13th amendment. But, I suppose [Lincoln's] support of the 13th amendment was purely anti-Confederacy? Oh, and Lincoln's death was not of natural causes, (I believe we all know the political sympathies of one JW Booth) so it's not as if the enactment of the 13th amendment was "years" after his death, either.

It is well known that Lincoln was anti-slavery, but he was also a political pragmatist. Lincoln understood that no outspoken abolitionist would EVER be elected. However, Lincoln was not shy about his position on slavery and spoke openly against slavery on multiple occasions, the most famous of which was his Peoria Speech, delivered in response to his archrival, Stephen Douglas. Lincoln, was angered by a bill introduced and forced through congress by Douglas, which later was known as the Kansas-Nebraska Act, and repealed the Missouri Compromise of 1820, allowing much of the Midwest to be opened to the expansion of slavery. Outraged, Lincoln scheduled three public speeches in the fall of 1854, in response to Douglas' proposed bill. During the famously long Peoria Speech, Lincoln laid out his protestations of Douglas' bill and outlined his moral, economic, political, and legal arguments against slavery. Hence, the famous Emancipation Proclamation and eventually, 13th Amendment to the Constitution were proclaimed and supported by him. But, I suppose that since James Mitchell Ashley introduced the 13th amendment, Lincoln shouldn't be credited for that either?
So, now we all know...

This one's on me, guys.

I let that nitwit bait me into this derail.

(02-09-2015 09:59 PM)Smaug Wrote:  This one's on me, guys.

I let that nitwit bait me into this derail.

Yeah... Me, too. But, I am an unabashed pro-Lincoln dude. We in our family have been raised with tons of Lincoln history: He is/was my first cousin, 9 generations removed. Born in none other than (hint, hint) Hodgen's Mill, KY- now known as Hodgenville, KY.

Since we're off-topic, anyone know which county in Alabama didn't sign Alabama's ordinance of secession?

Winston.

This bar with no Bammer gear, no Confederate flags, snooty imported beer and gelato. It has to have gelato, too. When does it open?

Yep, the "Free state of Winston," aka Republic of Winston: See the Incident at Looney's Tavern.

I can hear my late father now, "You ever find yourself in Winston County, don't you start no fights. Thems some mean ones up there!"

(02-09-2015 10:19 PM)58-56 Wrote:  Winston.

This bar with no Bammer gear, no Confederate flags, snooty imported beer and gelato. It has to have gelato, too. When does it open?

No gelato, but a lotta rebel Scotch.

(02-09-2015 06:28 PM)Agent Orange Sauce Wrote:  Anyway...this would be my name for a bar in Southside.

I'll to that! There would be nothing but UAB decorum all over the (bleeping) place!