This isn't a doomsday post, just an observation.

Jayson Tatum eliminated Memphis from his list today. I'm not all that surprised given his long list of suitors. But it does make me wonder if Josh is losing his "touch" when it comes to recruiting the best of the best (not including Memphis kids). In his first 3 years he was signing guys like Will Barton and Shaq from outside of the city and it seemed like we were at least on the short list for a number of other top non-local prospects, but a lot can change in 3-5 years.

My concern is that maybe the "shine" has worn off. He was getting a lot of hype early on, but it seems like we're starting to struggle with landing top recruits if they aren't from Memphis. The good thing is...the city of Memphis is loaded in the near future so that shouldn't be too big of a problem, but in the coming years...if the city's talent pool isn't as deep, are we going to see more recruiting classes like this past year's? I know Memphis, pre-Cal, has never reeled in top 10 guys from out of the city on a consistent basis so maybe I should just get my mind right...and hope Memphis keeps churning out 5-star kids.

Josh's calling card, at least at this point in his career, has been his ability to recruit. IF that starts to slip...IF this past year's class is an indicator of things to come when the city doesn't produce, then that's a scary sign IMO.

Well then...

(09-01-2014 01:11 PM)HometownTiger Wrote:  This isn't a doomsday post, just an observation.

Jayson Tatum eliminated Memphis from his list today. I'm not all that surprised given his long list of suitors. But it does make me wonder if Josh is losing his "touch" when it comes to recruiting the best of the best (not including Memphis kids). In his first 3 years he was signing guys like Will Barton and Shaq from outside of the city and it seemed like we were at least on the short list for a number of other top non-local prospects, but a lot can change in 3-5 years.

My concern is that maybe the "shine" has worn off. He was getting a lot of hype early on, but it seems like we're starting to struggle with landing top recruits if they aren't from Memphis. The good thing is...the city of Memphis is loaded in the near future so that shouldn't be too big of a problem, but in the coming years...if the city's talent pool isn't as deep, are we going to see more recruiting classes like this past year's? I know Memphis, pre-Cal, has never reeled in top 10 guys from out of the city on a consistent basis so maybe I should just get my mind right...and hope Memphis keeps churning out 5-star kids.

Josh's calling card, at least at this point in his career, has been his ability to recruit. IF that starts to slip...IF this past year's class is an indicator of things to come when the city doesn't produce, then that's a scary sign IMO.

Reasonable observations.

Why would a national recruit come to Memphis?

We're not going to consistently get top 10 guys from outside Memphis to come here, although Kuran was also a nice get at the time. That doesn't mean any shine has worn off or that Josh can't recruit. If the Lawsons turn out to be really good and Josh can pepper them with a few good national players, everything will be fine.

(09-01-2014 01:11 PM)HometownTiger Wrote:  This isn't a doomsday post, just an observation.

Jayson Tatum eliminated Memphis from his list today. I'm not all that surprised given his long list of suitors. But it does make me wonder if Josh is losing his "touch" when it comes to recruiting the best of the best (not including Memphis kids). In his first 3 years he was signing guys like Will Barton and Shaq from outside of the city and it seemed like we were at least on the short list for a number of other top non-local prospects, but a lot can change in 3-5 years.

My concern is that maybe the "shine" has worn off. He was getting a lot of hype early on, but it seems like we're starting to struggle with landing top recruits if they aren't from Memphis. The good thing is...the city of Memphis is loaded in the near future so that shouldn't be too big of a problem, but in the coming years...if the city's talent pool isn't as deep, are we going to see more recruiting classes like this past year's? I know Memphis, pre-Cal, has never reeled in top 10 guys from out of the city on a consistent basis so maybe I should just get my mind right...and hope Memphis keeps churning out 5-star kids.

Josh's calling card, at least at this point in his career, has been his ability to recruit. IF that starts to slip...IF this past year's class is an indicator of things to come when the city doesn't produce, then that's a scary sign IMO.

I think the fact that he has been depending on going after "risky" transfers and jucos in recent years tells me he has slipped for the top flight prospects. I suspect there is a lot of negative recruiting going on that hurts Pastner with top tier national top prospects. Until he wins big, improves as a bench coach and goes deep in the NCAA tournament with some kind of consistency he really is going into those recruiting wars with a watergun. Energy and positive attitude will only go so far and this many years into his career he hasn't shown anything that would attract a top national prospect to come. At this point he has to rely on local kids to keep the nostrils above water level, which I don't think is a good thing if we are truly trying to consider ourselves to be a national program.

The 'pain train' is coming. This thread is way too civil so far considering the OP.

(09-01-2014 01:24 PM)JTS Wrote:  Reasonable observations.

Why would a national recruit come to Memphis?

Well for starters, we are plastered all over the ESPN networks all season long now.

You get serious national exposure.

Plus we are typically a top 25 program, typically play a strong scheduled and are a virtual lock for the NCAA tourney most years. And our teams generally are pretty talented and exciting.

Oh yeah, we play in an NBA arena, are top 10 nationally in attendance and have one of the most rabid fan bases in the NCAA's.

(09-01-2014 03:54 PM)GAmogul Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 01:11 PM)HometownTiger Wrote:  This isn't a doomsday post, just an observation.

Jayson Tatum eliminated Memphis from his list today. I'm not all that surprised given his long list of suitors. But it does make me wonder if Josh is losing his "touch" when it comes to recruiting the best of the best (not including Memphis kids). In his first 3 years he was signing guys like Will Barton and Shaq from outside of the city and it seemed like we were at least on the short list for a number of other top non-local prospects, but a lot can change in 3-5 years.

My concern is that maybe the "shine" has worn off. He was getting a lot of hype early on, but it seems like we're starting to struggle with landing top recruits if they aren't from Memphis. The good thing is...the city of Memphis is loaded in the near future so that shouldn't be too big of a problem, but in the coming years...if the city's talent pool isn't as deep, are we going to see more recruiting classes like this past year's? I know Memphis, pre-Cal, has never reeled in top 10 guys from out of the city on a consistent basis so maybe I should just get my mind right...and hope Memphis keeps churning out 5-star kids.

Josh's calling card, at least at this point in his career, has been his ability to recruit. IF that starts to slip...IF this past year's class is an indicator of things to come when the city doesn't produce, then that's a scary sign IMO.

I suspect there is a lot of negative recruiting going on that hurts Pastner with top tier national top prospects.

Negative recruiting happens if you're Josh or Jim Calhoun. Every coach has to fight against that. The best way to combat that is winning and/or putting kids in the league. Opposing coaches can say whatever they want, but when you are making runs in March kids want to be a part of that. When you're putting kids in the pros, they want to be a part of that. So far, we've struggled in those 2 areas under Josh. I do think that could change within the next few years, FWIW.

Well i said Jayson Tatum was a UK lock along with his Best Bud Harry Giles who is top 4 as well....that hasn't changed and we were actually Never in that race, Despite what some what others to believe....I do not expect Skal to be a Tiger when the smoke clears and that my opinion....On the Flip side of things we are getting Nick and that should tell you all you need to know....We will get ours, We are getting the Lawsons, and they are really good....Question is now, can we get some National outside Memphis Kids convinced to join them.....time will tell.....The World Is Ours Memphis....

(09-01-2014 04:43 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 01:24 PM)JTS Wrote:  Reasonable observations.

Why would a national recruit come to Memphis?

Well for starters, we are plastered all over the ESPN networks all season long now.

You get serious national exposure.

Plus we are typically a top 25 program, typically play a strong scheduled and are a virtual lock for the NCAA tourney most years. And our teams generally are pretty talented and exciting.

Oh yeah, we play in an NBA arena, are top 10 nationally in attendance and have one of the most rabid fan bases in the NCAA's.

The blue bloods are plastered all over ESPN as well.

I do not believe that we have finished the in the top 25 during Pastner's tenure.

(09-01-2014 07:55 PM)JTS Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 04:43 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 01:24 PM)JTS Wrote:  Reasonable observations.

Why would a national recruit come to Memphis?

Well for starters, we are plastered all over the ESPN networks all season long now.

You get serious national exposure.

Plus we are typically a top 25 program, typically play a strong scheduled and are a virtual lock for the NCAA tourney most years. And our teams generally are pretty talented and exciting.

Oh yeah, we play in an NBA arena, are top 10 nationally in attendance and have one of the most rabid fan bases in the NCAA's.

The blue bloods are plastered all over ESPN as well.

I do not believe that we have finished the in the top 25 during Pastner's tenure.

We have, it doesn't really matter though.

Memphis was No. 19 when the Tigers faced Michigan State in the 2013 NCAA Tournament

(09-01-2014 08:27 PM)MemphisCanes Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 07:55 PM)JTS Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 04:43 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 01:24 PM)JTS Wrote:  Reasonable observations.

Why would a national recruit come to Memphis?

Well for starters, we are plastered all over the ESPN networks all season long now.

You get serious national exposure.

Plus we are typically a top 25 program, typically play a strong scheduled and are a virtual lock for the NCAA tourney most years. And our teams generally are pretty talented and exciting.

Oh yeah, we play in an NBA arena, are top 10 nationally in attendance and have one of the most rabid fan bases in the NCAA's.

The blue bloods are plastered all over ESPN as well.

I do not believe that we have finished the in the top 25 during Pastner's tenure.

We have, it doesn't really matter though.

The final poll? You are correct, 18 in the final USA today poll two years ago.

I'm not a Josh guy, but he's not losing his touch with respect to recruiting, IMO. Not at all. I think he's actually finding his niche. He may be on the radar for some big names and some will cross him off, for whatever reason, and then he'll move on to others. I think these coaches know when they have a real prospect and know when a prospect is a shot in the dark.
It's a bump in the road.

(09-01-2014 09:23 PM)JTS Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 08:27 PM)MemphisCanes Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 07:55 PM)JTS Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 04:43 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 01:24 PM)JTS Wrote:  Reasonable observations.

Why would a national recruit come to Memphis?

Well for starters, we are plastered all over the ESPN networks all season long now.

You get serious national exposure.

Plus we are typically a top 25 program, typically play a strong scheduled and are a virtual lock for the NCAA tourney most years. And our teams generally are pretty talented and exciting.

Oh yeah, we play in an NBA arena, are top 10 nationally in attendance and have one of the most rabid fan bases in the NCAA's.

The blue bloods are plastered all over ESPN as well.

I do not believe that we have finished the in the top 25 during Pastner's tenure.

We have, it doesn't really matter though.

The final poll? You are correct, 18 in the final USA today poll two years ago.

And ESPN ranked us as one of the top 25 programs of the modern era. It's not really or always about 'last year'.

I believe Wilbur has Memphis ranked the No. 1 program in the nation, even above KY.

Wilbur was an idiot savant.

(09-01-2014 11:38 PM)georgiatiger Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 09:23 PM)JTS Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 08:27 PM)MemphisCanes Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 07:55 PM)JTS Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 04:43 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  Well for starters, we are plastered all over the ESPN networks all season long now.

You get serious national exposure.

Plus we are typically a top 25 program, typically play a strong scheduled and are a virtual lock for the NCAA tourney most years. And our teams generally are pretty talented and exciting.

Oh yeah, we play in an NBA arena, are top 10 nationally in attendance and have one of the most rabid fan bases in the NCAA's.

The blue bloods are plastered all over ESPN as well.

I do not believe that we have finished the in the top 25 during Pastner's tenure.

We have, it doesn't really matter though.

The final poll? You are correct, 18 in the final USA today poll two years ago.

And ESPN ranked us as one of the top 25 programs of the modern era. It's not really or always about 'last year'.

Honestly for kids outside of Memphis it is not about Memphis it is about the coach. So it IS about Pastners career and not about Memphis' past success.

(09-01-2014 03:54 PM)GAmogul Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 01:11 PM)HometownTiger Wrote:  This isn't a doomsday post, just an observation.

Jayson Tatum eliminated Memphis from his list today. I'm not all that surprised given his long list of suitors. But it does make me wonder if Josh is losing his "touch" when it comes to recruiting the best of the best (not including Memphis kids). In his first 3 years he was signing guys like Will Barton and Shaq from outside of the city and it seemed like we were at least on the short list for a number of other top non-local prospects, but a lot can change in 3-5 years.

My concern is that maybe the "shine" has worn off. He was getting a lot of hype early on, but it seems like we're starting to struggle with landing top recruits if they aren't from Memphis. The good thing is...the city of Memphis is loaded in the near future so that shouldn't be too big of a problem, but in the coming years...if the city's talent pool isn't as deep, are we going to see more recruiting classes like this past year's? I know Memphis, pre-Cal, has never reeled in top 10 guys from out of the city on a consistent basis so maybe I should just get my mind right...and hope Memphis keeps churning out 5-star kids.

Josh's calling card, at least at this point in his career, has been his ability to recruit. IF that starts to slip...IF this past year's class is an indicator of things to come when the city doesn't produce, then that's a scary sign IMO.

I think the fact that he has been depending on going after "risky" transfers and jucos in recent years tells me he has slipped for the top flight prospects. I suspect there is a lot of negative recruiting going on that hurts Pastner with top tier national top prospects. Until he wins big, improves as a bench coach and goes deep in the NCAA tournament with some kind of consistency he really is going into those recruiting wars with a watergun. Energy and positive attitude will only go so far and this many years into his career he hasn't shown anything that would attract a top national prospect to come. At this point he has to rely on local kids to keep the nostrils above water level, which I don't think is a good thing if we are truly trying to consider ourselves to be a national program.

Spot on

(09-01-2014 11:31 PM)450bench Wrote:  I'm not a Josh guy, but he's not losing his touch with respect to recruiting, IMO. Not at all. I think he's actually finding his niche. He may be on the radar for some big names and some will cross him off, for whatever reason, and then he'll move on to others. I think these coaches know when they have a real prospect and know when a prospect is a shot in the dark.
It's a bump in the road.

450 bringing the truth.