RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 05:45 PM)john01992 Wrote:
(06-20-2014 04:31 PM)10thMountain Wrote: So since there has to be exceptions, who are they?
IMO:
Definitely
Notre Dame
Probably
Oklahoma
Maybe
Virginia Tech
Syracuse
UConn
Nope
Cincy
Boston College
hell yes
notre dame
highly likely
syracuse- being a past AAU, historic rival of a number of b10 schools, and having solid academics, solid athletics/markets, and being in the most sensible state to expand into next, makes them the #2 most likely school IMO to break the aau barrier
has a chance but smaller
boston college- essentially a poor mans version of SU in this situation
^^^^^all three of these schools are a case of solid academics but non research orientated
oklahoma- decent football/market, but unlike all the other schools on this list, they have terrible academics to reaffirm why they are not AAU
no chance
UCONN
Virginia tech
there are far too many reasons to list why these schools will never get an invite and AAU is just one of many.
Actually President David Boren is pushing Oklahoma academics hard to attain AAU status. OU now has more merit scholars than any public University.
Also, the State of Oklahoma maybe a only a decent TV market, but OU is a National Brand that likely turns on more TV sets than most schools, including Big Ten teams and schools with much larger TV markets.
Having said that, I do not think they are a Big10 candidate.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
UConn can attain AAU status, but it can't make itself part of a contiguous state. Only some how getting UBuf into the BIG does that happen. And UBuf is never getting an invite, because it doesn't have a fan base.
Noway does Cuse get in. It is a private, non AAU college. Calling itself NY college team aside, it does not have widespread enough appeal to carry all of NY. Cuse can move the needle in basketball but not in football.
The B10 is going to bide its time and wait for the next opportunity to come along. It went 19 years as an 11 school conference before it saw an opportunity to get a desirable twelth school. It will wait for an opportunity to make another move.
(This post was last modified: 06-20-2014 08:18 PM by mikeinsec127.)
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 08:11 PM)mikeinsec127 Wrote: UConn can attain AAU status, but it can't make itself part of a contiguous state. Only some how getting UBuf into the BIG does that happen. And UBuf is never getting an invite, because it doesn't have a fan base.
Noway does Cuse get in. It is a private, non AAU college. Calling itself NY college team aside, it does not have widespread enough appeal to carry all of NY. Cause can move the needle in basketball but not in football.
The B10 is going to bide its time and wait for the next opportunity to come a.long. It went 19 years as an 11 school conference before it saw an opportunity to get a desirable twelfth school. It will wait for an opportunity to make another move.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 06:12 PM)TerryD Wrote:
(06-20-2014 05:41 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote: Any of those ACC schools, especially any of the other founding members, who tries to follow UMD to the Big Ten is probably going to lose a lot of booster money and season ticket holders.
Delany's full of ****, too. "We're not looking into expansion." Except that they were. They still are. And +million to the one who said they'd open their doors for Notre Dame. That AAU bit is so full of it, too. Two Big Ten schools were on Nebraska's expulsion/review panel who had no problems giving them the boot. MSU wasn't a member of the AAU when it joined the Big Ten, either.
Certainly you are not suggesting that the commissioner of the Big Ten Conference would commit perjury?
Lying under oath in a court of law?
No way!!! :)
He isn't lying. So far, no school has been admitted that hasn't been a member of the AAU upon acceptance into the Big Ten. No institution or business is held to maintaining any such pillars of their existence. They can change that "mandatory" requirement at any time they wish. So it is easy for Delany to make such a statement in order to deflect any unwanted attention that might be rising but that statement doesn't hold the Big Ten now to only taking a school if it is an AAU member should they decide in the future that they wish to do otherwise.
Nice try though Mr. Lawyer. Your Crusade against the Big Ten rambles on.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 07:44 PM)SMUmustangs Wrote:
(06-20-2014 05:45 PM)john01992 Wrote:
(06-20-2014 04:31 PM)10thMountain Wrote: So since there has to be exceptions, who are they?
IMO:
Definitely
Notre Dame
Probably
Oklahoma
Maybe
Virginia Tech
Syracuse
UConn
Nope
Cincy
Boston College
hell yes
notre dame
highly likely
syracuse- being a past AAU, historic rival of a number of b10 schools, and having solid academics, solid athletics/markets, and being in the most sensible state to expand into next, makes them the #2 most likely school IMO to break the aau barrier
has a chance but smaller
boston college- essentially a poor mans version of SU in this situation
^^^^^all three of these schools are a case of solid academics but non research orientated
oklahoma- decent football/market, but unlike all the other schools on this list, they have terrible academics to reaffirm why they are not AAU
no chance
UCONN
Virginia tech
there are far too many reasons to list why these schools will never get an invite and AAU is just one of many.
Actually President David Boren is pushing Oklahoma academics hard to attain AAU status. OU now has more merit scholars than any public University.
Also, the State of Oklahoma maybe a only a decent TV market, but OU is a National Brand that likely turns on more TV sets than most schools, including Big Ten teams and schools with much larger TV markets.
Having said that, I do not think they are a Big10 candidate.
all I am saying is that the other schools have decent academics + no AAU
OU has bad academics + no AAU which makes it a much bigger sticking point than it would be for other schools.
if OU had academics comparable to texas, they would be in the pac14 with OSU. OU simply does not have the academic/football combo to make conferences jump at any opportunity to get them despite having some damn good football.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 08:11 PM)mikeinsec127 Wrote: UConn can attain AAU status, but it can't make itself part of a contiguous state. Only some how getting UBuf into the BIG does that happen. And UBuf is never getting an invite, because it doesn't have a fan base.
Noway does Cuse get in. It is a private, non AAU college. Calling itself NY college team aside, it does not have widespread enough appeal to carry all of NY. Cuse can move the needle in basketball but not in football.
The B10 is going to bide its time and wait for the next opportunity to come along. It went 19 years as an 11 school conference before it saw an opportunity to get a desirable twelth school. It will wait for an opportunity to make another move.
cuse in NYC:
they are too far away to get that hometown team status where they will get decent support regardless of record, but they are close enough to where if they are a quality program, they can quickly pickup a large following.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 05:45 PM)john01992 Wrote:
(06-20-2014 04:31 PM)10thMountain Wrote: So since there has to be exceptions, who are they?
IMO:
Definitely
Notre Dame
Probably
Oklahoma
Maybe
Virginia Tech
Syracuse
UConn
Nope
Cincy
Boston College
hell yes
notre dame
highly likely
syracuse- being a past AAU, historic rival of a number of b10 schools, and having solid academics, solid athletics/markets, and being in the most sensible state to expand into next, makes them the #2 most likely school IMO to break the aau barrier
has a chance but smaller
boston college- essentially a poor mans version of SU in this situation
^^^^^all three of these schools are a case of solid academics but non research orientated
oklahoma- decent football/market, but unlike all the other schools on this list, they have terrible academics to reaffirm why they are not AAU
no chance
UCONN
Virginia tech
there are far too many reasons to list why these schools will never get an invite and AAU is just one of many.
Virginia Tech fits the profile of a Big 10 school much better than UVA does. Large state school, land grant, and high research. If the AAU expands again, VT is very likely to make it in.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 08:21 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:
(06-20-2014 06:12 PM)TerryD Wrote:
(06-20-2014 05:41 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote: Any of those ACC schools, especially any of the other founding members, who tries to follow UMD to the Big Ten is probably going to lose a lot of booster money and season ticket holders.
Delany's full of ****, too. "We're not looking into expansion." Except that they were. They still are. And +million to the one who said they'd open their doors for Notre Dame. That AAU bit is so full of it, too. Two Big Ten schools were on Nebraska's expulsion/review panel who had no problems giving them the boot. MSU wasn't a member of the AAU when it joined the Big Ten, either.
Certainly you are not suggesting that the commissioner of the Big Ten Conference would commit perjury?
Lying under oath in a court of law?
No way!!! :)
He isn't lying. So far, no school has been admitted that hasn't been a member of the AAU upon acceptance into the Big Ten. No institution or business is held to maintaining any such pillars of their existence. They can change that "mandatory" requirement at any time they wish. So it is easy for Delany to make such a statement in order to deflect any unwanted attention that might be rising but that statement doesn't hold the Big Ten now to only taking a school if it is an AAU member should they decide in the future that they wish to do otherwise.
Nice try though Mr. Lawyer. Your Crusade against the Big Ten rambles on.
It was a joke in response to the post above it, but ok.....
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 10:14 PM)4x4hokies Wrote:
(06-20-2014 05:45 PM)john01992 Wrote:
(06-20-2014 04:31 PM)10thMountain Wrote: So since there has to be exceptions, who are they?
IMO:
Definitely
Notre Dame
Probably
Oklahoma
Maybe
Virginia Tech
Syracuse
UConn
Nope
Cincy
Boston College
hell yes
notre dame
highly likely
syracuse- being a past AAU, historic rival of a number of b10 schools, and having solid academics, solid athletics/markets, and being in the most sensible state to expand into next, makes them the #2 most likely school IMO to break the aau barrier
has a chance but smaller
boston college- essentially a poor mans version of SU in this situation
^^^^^all three of these schools are a case of solid academics but non research orientated
oklahoma- decent football/market, but unlike all the other schools on this list, they have terrible academics to reaffirm why they are not AAU
no chance
UCONN
Virginia tech
there are far too many reasons to list why these schools will never get an invite and AAU is just one of many.
Virginia Tech fits the profile of a Big 10 school much better than UVA does. Large state school, land grant, and high research. If the AAU expands again, VT is very likely to make it in.
my issue with vtech:
1. the b10 has the biggest hard on among any conference for flagship status. 11/13 public schools in the B10 are flagships, most of which completely dominate their state with little to no in-state competition. vtech is a huge contradiction to that philosophy....a philosophy in which their last 3 additions fit in with perfectly.
2. It is hard to say how the whole "military college" aspect plays into things. it is definitely not a positive, the only question is wether or not it is a negative.
3. vtech doesn't have the best geographical location within its state. not in the most accessible place within the state nor located near the major population centers.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
The AAU requirement will change as soon as it's convenient for the Big 10 to do so. My feeling is the only reason why it was brought up because it plays into the Big 10's argument that they are an academic consortium first and foremost that just happens to compete against each other in athletics. It's a bs argument that most people see right through but they've committed to it. It's a lot easier to argue against paying athletes and depriving them of certain rights if you're not a athletic conference but an academic consortium.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 10:36 PM)john01992 Wrote:
(06-20-2014 10:14 PM)4x4hokies Wrote:
(06-20-2014 05:45 PM)john01992 Wrote:
(06-20-2014 04:31 PM)10thMountain Wrote: So since there has to be exceptions, who are they?
IMO:
Definitely
Notre Dame
Probably
Oklahoma
Maybe
Virginia Tech
Syracuse
UConn
Nope
Cincy
Boston College
hell yes
notre dame
highly likely
syracuse- being a past AAU, historic rival of a number of b10 schools, and having solid academics, solid athletics/markets, and being in the most sensible state to expand into next, makes them the #2 most likely school IMO to break the aau barrier
has a chance but smaller
boston college- essentially a poor mans version of SU in this situation
^^^^^all three of these schools are a case of solid academics but non research orientated
oklahoma- decent football/market, but unlike all the other schools on this list, they have terrible academics to reaffirm why they are not AAU
no chance
UCONN
Virginia tech
there are far too many reasons to list why these schools will never get an invite and AAU is just one of many.
Virginia Tech fits the profile of a Big 10 school much better than UVA does. Large state school, land grant, and high research. If the AAU expands again, VT is very likely to make it in.
my issue with vtech:
1. the b10 has the biggest hard on among any conference for flagship status. 11/13 public schools in the B10 are flagships, most of which completely dominate their state with little to no in-state competition. vtech is a huge contradiction to that philosophy....a philosophy in which their last 3 additions fit in with perfectly.
2. It is hard to say how the whole "military college" aspect plays into things. it is definitely not a positive, the only question is wether or not it is a negative.
3. vtech doesn't have the best geographical location within its state. not in the most accessible place within the state nor located near the major population centers.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 11:02 PM)prp Wrote: The AAU requirement will change as soon as it's convenient for the Big 10 to do so. My feeling is the only reason why it was brought up because it plays into the Big 10's argument that they are an academic consortium first and foremost that just happens to compete against each other in athletics.
Remember that the argument is primarily being directed by the Presidents to an internal audience inside the Universities ... they do, after all, spend a majority of their time actually being President of their University, and only a minority of the time as effectively voting board member of the athletic conference.
It may be only the two biggest academics snob schools that would automatically vote no to all but a small handful of non-AAU ... but the Presidents of those two academic snob schools are living with their own universities' particular versions of the truce between the sports department and the actual University activities that is in place in all schools with prominent sports teams, and its easier to fight for the conference to go along than it is to fight that battle inside their institutions.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 10:36 PM)john01992 Wrote: 1. the b10 has the biggest hard on among any conference for flagship status. 11/13 public schools in the B10 are flagships, most of which completely dominate their state with little to no in-state competition. vtech is a huge contradiction to that philosophy....a philosophy in which their last 3 additions fit in with perfectly.
Note that Northwestern and the Illini were both founding members (that is, 1896, when the "big conference" was the Ivy League), and Purdue was a founding member while Indiana joined shortly thereafter ... long before the post-GI Bill explosion of US higher education in which the character of the modern Big Ten was formed.
And the Spartans were admitted as a replacement school after Chicago dropped top level competitive sports ... in the early stages of that explosion and so part of the forging of the character of the modern Big Ten.
It was later in the decade that the Spartans joined the Big Ten that the big southern football factory scandals made the headlines, and the CIC was invented to serve as an academic fig-leaf for all of the concessions that to big-time sports that are made at the universities hosting them.
The t-shirt fans may whine, but the Big Ten is going to hold onto its AAU requirement except for a few possible special circumstances schools, such as Notre Dame where academic snob school Michigan would make a concession and not vote no, because holding to their prior blatantly anti-Catholic prejudice is no longer so popular inside their University as it once was.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 11:41 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:
(06-20-2014 11:02 PM)prp Wrote: The AAU requirement will change as soon as it's convenient for the Big 10 to do so. My feeling is the only reason why it was brought up because it plays into the Big 10's argument that they are an academic consortium first and foremost that just happens to compete against each other in athletics.
Remember that the argument is primarily being directed by the Presidents to an internal audience inside the Universities ... they do, after all, spend a majority of their time actually being President of their University, and only a minority of the time as effectively voting board member of the athletic conference.
It may be only the two biggest academics snob schools that would automatically vote no to all but a small handful of non-AAU ... but the Presidents of those two academic snob schools are living with their own universities' particular versions of the truce between the sports department and the actual University activities that is in place in all schools with prominent sports teams, and its easier to fight for the conference to go along than it is to fight that battle inside their institutions.
Which is part of the reason why Presidents are now ready to hand over the reins to the Athletic Directors.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 04:13 PM)Wedge Wrote: Well, duh, anyone would make an exception for a program with the market value of Nebraska or Notre Dame, but that's like saying that a football coach's rules on off-field behavior might have an exception if you are as good as Johnny Manziel or Jameis Winston. If you're not that good, don't expect to get bailed out by the exception.
Yes, but Nebraska wanted in and the Domers didn't (or backed out after the firestorm from alumni/boosters). Frankly, I'm tired of the "but they'd make an exception for X" posts. Does the PAC not have any standards for candidate schools? Of course they have standards. And I admire them for keeping to those standards. I mean, you did turn down Oklahoma (at least that's the story I tend to believe most).
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-21-2014 03:07 AM)Transic_nyc Wrote:
(06-20-2014 04:13 PM)Wedge Wrote: Well, duh, anyone would make an exception for a program with the market value of Nebraska or Notre Dame, but that's like saying that a football coach's rules on off-field behavior might have an exception if you are as good as Johnny Manziel or Jameis Winston. If you're not that good, don't expect to get bailed out by the exception.
Yes, but Nebraska wanted in and the Domers didn't (or backed out after the firestorm from alumni/boosters). Frankly, I'm tired of the "but they'd make an exception for X" posts. Does the PAC not have any standards for candidate schools? Of course they have standards. And I admire them for keeping to those standards. I mean, you did turn down Oklahoma (at least that's the story I tend to believe most).
Well, I didn't turn down anyone. I'm not a Pac-12 president or chancellor. Heh.
But, if you're just going by pure athletic value, leaving aside academics, Nebraska and Oklahoma are roughly equal. The OU/Okla St package application was easy to turn down because adding two new schools from one relatively small state is far less attractive financially than adding OU alone.
Standards? To a point. What would really make the bank accounts overflow is adding UT, obviously, and that's the only way the Pac is ever moving into the central time zone IMO. If UT was willing to join, the Pac would let UT bring up to three "friends" with them, whether or not the "friends" meet anyone's academic standards, solely because of the windfall to be made by adding the Horns. And if UT and OU and KU were all joining, then you could add another three and still make big bucks, again, regardless of who the tagalongs are and whether or not they meet anyone's academic standards. When the prospective cash flow is that huge, money talks and bullshtt walks.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 06:12 PM)BIgCatonProwl Wrote:
(06-20-2014 03:52 PM)10thMountain Wrote: That might be the party line but if ND told them they wanted full membership tommorow, somehow I dont see them telling them "Nope, sorry, AAU only!"
UConn ain't Notre Dame
You're right, UConn wins more National Championships in this era.
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-20-2014 11:56 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:
(06-20-2014 10:36 PM)john01992 Wrote: 1. the b10 has the biggest hard on among any conference for flagship status. 11/13 public schools in the B10 are flagships, most of which completely dominate their state with little to no in-state competition. vtech is a huge contradiction to that philosophy....a philosophy in which their last 3 additions fit in with perfectly.
Note that Northwestern and the Illini were both founding members (that is, 1896, when the "big conference" was the Ivy League), and Purdue was a founding member while Indiana joined shortly thereafter ... long before the post-GI Bill explosion of US higher education in which the character of the modern Big Ten was formed.
And the Spartans were admitted as a replacement school after Chicago dropped top level competitive sports ... in the early stages of that explosion and so part of the forging of the character of the modern Big Ten.
It was later in the decade that the Spartans joined the Big Ten that the big southern football factory scandals made the headlines, and the CIC was invented to serve as an academic fig-leaf for all of the concessions that to big-time sports that are made at the universities hosting them.
The t-shirt fans may whine, but the Big Ten is going to hold onto its AAU requirement except for a few possible special circumstances schools, such as Notre Dame where academic snob school Michigan would make a concession and not vote no, because holding to their prior blatantly anti-Catholic prejudice is no longer so popular inside their University as it once was.
Way, way, way (about 85-90 years) too late for that.....
RE: Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
(06-21-2014 07:38 AM)NestaKnight1 Wrote:
(06-20-2014 06:12 PM)BIgCatonProwl Wrote:
(06-20-2014 03:52 PM)10thMountain Wrote: That might be the party line but if ND told them they wanted full membership tommorow, somehow I dont see them telling them "Nope, sorry, AAU only!"
UConn ain't Notre Dame
You're right, UConn wins more National Championships in this era.
/
Delany puts knife into idea of Uconn to the Big Ten
