(06-18-2014 09:29 AM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(06-17-2014 09:24 PM)450bench Wrote:  As you guys know, this is all a formality. It's been a done deal for weeks. They played it well with the AAU schedule and now it's winding down. He'll be here. None of the other schools matter, that's just background noise. It's a done deal and has been.
Josh deserves some credit for the way he's handled the entire deal. Smart. The guy deserves credit when he indeed deserves it.

Josh has his faults, but you can't say he isn't smart. Too stubborn sometimes, but still, smart. He has handled it perfectly so far.

Can you survive at this high level without being stubborn?

(06-18-2014 12:04 PM)tigerex Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 09:29 AM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(06-17-2014 09:24 PM)450bench Wrote:  As you guys know, this is all a formality. It's been a done deal for weeks. They played it well with the AAU schedule and now it's winding down. He'll be here. None of the other schools matter, that's just background noise. It's a done deal and has been.
Josh deserves some credit for the way he's handled the entire deal. Smart. The guy deserves credit when he indeed deserves it.

Josh has his faults, but you can't say he isn't smart. Too stubborn sometimes, but still, smart. He has handled it perfectly so far.

Can you survive at this high level without being stubborn?

If you're right it's a blessing, but if you're wrong it's a curse. I think he is smart enough to learn from mistakes made being stubborn, so in the end it's a blessing.

(06-18-2014 12:13 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:04 PM)tigerex Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 09:29 AM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(06-17-2014 09:24 PM)450bench Wrote:  As you guys know, this is all a formality. It's been a done deal for weeks. They played it well with the AAU schedule and now it's winding down. He'll be here. None of the other schools matter, that's just background noise. It's a done deal and has been.
Josh deserves some credit for the way he's handled the entire deal. Smart. The guy deserves credit when he indeed deserves it.

Josh has his faults, but you can't say he isn't smart. Too stubborn sometimes, but still, smart. He has handled it perfectly so far.

Can you survive at this high level without being stubborn?

If you're right it's a blessing, but if you're wrong it's a curse. I think he is smart enough to learn from mistakes made being stubborn, so in the end it's a blessing.

Two coaches I had deep respect for had this trait. Cost them both their jobs. One was Coach Larry Finch. The other was Coach David Cutcliffe while he was at Ole Miss. It cost them dearly but they knew if they compromised on the field success would be cheapened. I am not insinuating anything toward Coach Pastner, just have those thoughts in the back of my mind.

(06-18-2014 12:16 PM)tigerex Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:13 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:04 PM)tigerex Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 09:29 AM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(06-17-2014 09:24 PM)450bench Wrote:  As you guys know, this is all a formality. It's been a done deal for weeks. They played it well with the AAU schedule and now it's winding down. He'll be here. None of the other schools matter, that's just background noise. It's a done deal and has been.
Josh deserves some credit for the way he's handled the entire deal. Smart. The guy deserves credit when he indeed deserves it.

Josh has his faults, but you can't say he isn't smart. Too stubborn sometimes, but still, smart. He has handled it perfectly so far.

Can you survive at this high level without being stubborn?

If you're right it's a blessing, but if you're wrong it's a curse. I think he is smart enough to learn from mistakes made being stubborn, so in the end it's a blessing.

Two coaches I had deep respect for had this trait. Cost them both their jobs. One was Coach Larry Finch. The other was Coach David Cutcliffe while he was at Ole Miss. It cost them dearly but they knew if they comprised on the field success would be cheapened. I am not insinuating anything toward Coach Pastner, just have those thoughts in the back of my mind.

Larry got us to an Elite Eight and Sweet 16...Josh could do worse.

(06-18-2014 12:16 PM)tigerex Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:13 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:04 PM)tigerex Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 09:29 AM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(06-17-2014 09:24 PM)450bench Wrote:  As you guys know, this is all a formality. It's been a done deal for weeks. They played it well with the AAU schedule and now it's winding down. He'll be here. None of the other schools matter, that's just background noise. It's a done deal and has been.
Josh deserves some credit for the way he's handled the entire deal. Smart. The guy deserves credit when he indeed deserves it.

Josh has his faults, but you can't say he isn't smart. Too stubborn sometimes, but still, smart. He has handled it perfectly so far.

Can you survive at this high level without being stubborn?

If you're right it's a blessing, but if you're wrong it's a curse. I think he is smart enough to learn from mistakes made being stubborn, so in the end it's a blessing.

Two coaches I had deep respect for had this trait. Cost them both their jobs. One was Coach Larry Finch. The other was Coach David Cutcliffe while he was at Ole Miss. It cost them dearly but they knew if they comprised on the field success would be cheapened. I am not insinuating anything toward Coach Pastner, just have those thoughts in the back of my mind.

Sure, I agree that being stubborn to the point of self-defeat is a flaw and can cost you everything. The trick is knowing when to cut your losses.

(06-18-2014 12:19 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:16 PM)tigerex Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:13 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:04 PM)tigerex Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 09:29 AM)TigerBill Wrote:  Josh has his faults, but you can't say he isn't smart. Too stubborn sometimes, but still, smart. He has handled it perfectly so far.

Can you survive at this high level without being stubborn?

If you're right it's a blessing, but if you're wrong it's a curse. I think he is smart enough to learn from mistakes made being stubborn, so in the end it's a blessing.

Two coaches I had deep respect for had this trait. Cost them both their jobs. One was Coach Larry Finch. The other was Coach David Cutcliffe while he was at Ole Miss. It cost them dearly but they knew if they comprised on the field success would be cheapened. I am not insinuating anything toward Coach Pastner, just have those thoughts in the back of my mind.

Larry got us to an Elite Eight and Sweet 16...Josh could do worse.

Larry was underrated as a coach.

(06-18-2014 12:29 PM)Mick Light Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:19 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:16 PM)tigerex Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:13 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:04 PM)tigerex Wrote:  Can you survive at this high level without being stubborn?

If you're right it's a blessing, but if you're wrong it's a curse. I think he is smart enough to learn from mistakes made being stubborn, so in the end it's a blessing.

Two coaches I had deep respect for had this trait. Cost them both their jobs. One was Coach Larry Finch. The other was Coach David Cutcliffe while he was at Ole Miss. It cost them dearly but they knew if they comprised on the field success would be cheapened. I am not insinuating anything toward Coach Pastner, just have those thoughts in the back of my mind.

Larry got us to an Elite Eight and Sweet 16...Josh could do worse.

Larry was underrated as a coach.

Larry was never fully appreciated here. People were constantly on his back criticizing him for everything under the Sun. National people would comment that they were baffled at the heavy criticism leveled at Larry

(06-17-2014 08:58 PM)BigTigerMike Wrote:  

(06-17-2014 08:33 PM)TigerBo Wrote:  

(06-17-2014 08:05 PM)snowtiger Wrote:  

(06-17-2014 07:42 PM)tigeriron Wrote:  what's the hurry?

yeah...

Where's the fire? What's the hurry about?

If someone offers him twice the pay do we match?

Someone has already offered probably more than what Memphis is going to pay in the end. He wants to come to memphis

(06-18-2014 01:12 PM)BigTigerMike Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:29 PM)Mick Light Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:19 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:16 PM)tigerex Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:13 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  If you're right it's a blessing, but if you're wrong it's a curse. I think he is smart enough to learn from mistakes made being stubborn, so in the end it's a blessing.

Two coaches I had deep respect for had this trait. Cost them both their jobs. One was Coach Larry Finch. The other was Coach David Cutcliffe while he was at Ole Miss. It cost them dearly but they knew if they comprised on the field success would be cheapened. I am not insinuating anything toward Coach Pastner, just have those thoughts in the back of my mind.

Larry got us to an Elite Eight and Sweet 16...Josh could do worse.

Larry was underrated as a coach.

Larry was never fully appreciated here. People were constantly on his back criticizing him for everything under the Sun. National people would comment that they were baffled at the heavy criticism leveled at Larry

Same with Josh.

(06-18-2014 01:12 PM)BigTigerMike Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:29 PM)Mick Light Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:19 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:16 PM)tigerex Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:13 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  If you're right it's a blessing, but if you're wrong it's a curse. I think he is smart enough to learn from mistakes made being stubborn, so in the end it's a blessing.

Two coaches I had deep respect for had this trait. Cost them both their jobs. One was Coach Larry Finch. The other was Coach David Cutcliffe while he was at Ole Miss. It cost them dearly but they knew if they comprised on the field success would be cheapened. I am not insinuating anything toward Coach Pastner, just have those thoughts in the back of my mind.

Larry got us to an Elite Eight and Sweet 16...Josh could do worse.

Larry was underrated as a coach.

Larry was never fully appreciated here. People were constantly on his back criticizing him for everything under the Sun. National people would comment that they were baffled at the heavy criticism leveled at Larry

Agree. Finch was an excellent floor coach & a high IQ player prior to that. I played with Finch in summer ball, against him in high school & he was a tough competitor, demanding a lot from himself & others on the court. He had an excellent rapport with players & he was a genuine guy. IMO what Larry lacked was good PR skills among "important" boosters & he wasn't as effective as he needed to be recruiting outside of the Memphis area.

(06-18-2014 12:29 PM)Mick Light Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:19 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:16 PM)tigerex Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:13 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:04 PM)tigerex Wrote:  Can you survive at this high level without being stubborn?

If you're right it's a blessing, but if you're wrong it's a curse. I think he is smart enough to learn from mistakes made being stubborn, so in the end it's a blessing.

Two coaches I had deep respect for had this trait. Cost them both their jobs. One was Coach Larry Finch. The other was Coach David Cutcliffe while he was at Ole Miss. It cost them dearly but they knew if they comprised on the field success would be cheapened. I am not insinuating anything toward Coach Pastner, just have those thoughts in the back of my mind.

Larry got us to an Elite Eight and Sweet 16...Josh could do worse.

Larry was underrated as a coach.

Particularly in the first half of his run.

I though he faded as a coach (or possible as a figurehead) by the mid 90's.

But as a floor coach was VERY underrated in the early years. Easily one of the top 3 floor coaches in the conference.

His speech seemed to slur more in the final years so perhaps his health was a bigger issue there than we realized back then. Of course, he had his first stoke within a couple years of being fired.

I thought his first team was his best team.

(06-18-2014 04:53 PM)Mick Light Wrote:  I thought his first team was his best team.

Me too. A very good unit. Shame they were saddled with probation not of Finch's doing.

(06-18-2014 03:52 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:29 PM)Mick Light Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:19 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:16 PM)tigerex Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:13 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  If you're right it's a blessing, but if you're wrong it's a curse. I think he is smart enough to learn from mistakes made being stubborn, so in the end it's a blessing.

Two coaches I had deep respect for had this trait. Cost them both their jobs. One was Coach Larry Finch. The other was Coach David Cutcliffe while he was at Ole Miss. It cost them dearly but they knew if they comprised on the field success would be cheapened. I am not insinuating anything toward Coach Pastner, just have those thoughts in the back of my mind.

Larry got us to an Elite Eight and Sweet 16...Josh could do worse.

Larry was underrated as a coach.

Particularly in the first half of his run.

I though he faded as a coach (or possible as a figurehead) by the mid 90's.

But as a floor coach was VERY underrated in the early years. Easily one of the top 3 floor coaches in the conference.

His speech seemed to slur more in the final years so perhaps his health was a bigger issue there than we realized back then. Of course, he had his first stoke within a couple years of being fired.

Completely disagree. We had two occasions of being injected with ridiculous levels of talent during Finch's tenure. From 1987 to 1991, we were on a steady decline to mediocrity. By the end of the time, we were first round NIT flameouts, even with having EP and several talented players around him. Finch was lucky to have the best player in Memphis history AND his nephew happened to be the 2nd rated PF out of high school. After Penny left and Vaughn was injured, we were back to mediocre until we reloaded with a huge recruiting class that matured and added L.Wright. After they left we were again dropping to mediocrity

(06-18-2014 05:44 PM)alcalde Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 03:52 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:29 PM)Mick Light Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:19 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:16 PM)tigerex Wrote:  Two coaches I had deep respect for had this trait. Cost them both their jobs. One was Coach Larry Finch. The other was Coach David Cutcliffe while he was at Ole Miss. It cost them dearly but they knew if they comprised on the field success would be cheapened. I am not insinuating anything toward Coach Pastner, just have those thoughts in the back of my mind.

Larry got us to an Elite Eight and Sweet 16...Josh could do worse.

Larry was underrated as a coach.

Particularly in the first half of his run.

I though he faded as a coach (or possible as a figurehead) by the mid 90's.

But as a floor coach was VERY underrated in the early years. Easily one of the top 3 floor coaches in the conference.

His speech seemed to slur more in the final years so perhaps his health was a bigger issue there than we realized back then. Of course, he had his first stoke within a couple years of being fired.

Completely disagree. We had two occasions of being injected with ridiculous levels of talent during Finch's tenure. From 1987 to 1991, we were on a steady decline to mediocrity. By the end of the time, we were first round NIT flameouts, even with having EP and several talented players around him. Finch was lucky to have the best player in Memphis history AND his nephew happened to be the 2nd rated PF out of high school. After Penny left and Vaughn was injured, we were back to mediocre until we reloaded with a huge recruiting class that matured and added L.Wright. After they left we were again dropping to mediocrity

Okay, let's see if I have this correct. When the team plays poorly, it's the coach's fault, and when the team plays well, it's because the coach got lucky with great recruits who fell in his lap? Got it.

That seems to be a common theme around here, lol.

(06-17-2014 08:33 PM)TigerBo Wrote:  

(06-17-2014 08:05 PM)snowtiger Wrote:  

(06-17-2014 07:42 PM)tigeriron Wrote:  what's the hurry?

yeah...

Where's the fire? What's the hurry about?

If someone offers him twice the pay do we match?

Not going to have anyone match.

(06-18-2014 07:11 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 05:44 PM)alcalde Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 03:52 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:29 PM)Mick Light Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:19 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  Larry got us to an Elite Eight and Sweet 16...Josh could do worse.

Larry was underrated as a coach.

Particularly in the first half of his run.

I though he faded as a coach (or possible as a figurehead) by the mid 90's.

But as a floor coach was VERY underrated in the early years. Easily one of the top 3 floor coaches in the conference.

His speech seemed to slur more in the final years so perhaps his health was a bigger issue there than we realized back then. Of course, he had his first stoke within a couple years of being fired.

Completely disagree. We had two occasions of being injected with ridiculous levels of talent during Finch's tenure. From 1987 to 1991, we were on a steady decline to mediocrity. By the end of the time, we were first round NIT flameouts, even with having EP and several talented players around him. Finch was lucky to have the best player in Memphis history AND his nephew happened to be the 2nd rated PF out of high school. After Penny left and Vaughn was injured, we were back to mediocre until we reloaded with a huge recruiting class that matured and added L.Wright. After they left we were again dropping to mediocrity

Okay, let's see if I have this correct. When the team plays poorly, it's the coach's fault, and when the team plays well, it's because the coach got lucky with great recruits who fell in his lap? Got it.

That seems to be a common theme around here, lol.

yup

(06-18-2014 07:11 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 05:44 PM)alcalde Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 03:52 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:29 PM)Mick Light Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:19 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  Larry got us to an Elite Eight and Sweet 16...Josh could do worse.

Larry was underrated as a coach.

Particularly in the first half of his run.

I though he faded as a coach (or possible as a figurehead) by the mid 90's.

But as a floor coach was VERY underrated in the early years. Easily one of the top 3 floor coaches in the conference.

His speech seemed to slur more in the final years so perhaps his health was a bigger issue there than we realized back then. Of course, he had his first stoke within a couple years of being fired.

Completely disagree. We had two occasions of being injected with ridiculous levels of talent during Finch's tenure. From 1987 to 1991, we were on a steady decline to mediocrity. By the end of the time, we were first round NIT flameouts, even with having EP and several talented players around him. Finch was lucky to have the best player in Memphis history AND his nephew happened to be the 2nd rated PF out of high school. After Penny left and Vaughn was injured, we were back to mediocre until we reloaded with a huge recruiting class that matured and added L.Wright. After they left we were again dropping to mediocrity

Okay, let's see if I have this correct. When the team plays poorly, it's the coach's fault, and when the team plays well, it's because the coach got lucky with great recruits who fell in his lap? Got it.

That seems to be a common theme around here, lol.

Players are better off without a coach, right?

(06-18-2014 07:11 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 05:44 PM)alcalde Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 03:52 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:29 PM)Mick Light Wrote:  

(06-18-2014 12:19 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  Larry got us to an Elite Eight and Sweet 16...Josh could do worse.

Larry was underrated as a coach.

Particularly in the first half of his run.

I though he faded as a coach (or possible as a figurehead) by the mid 90's.

But as a floor coach was VERY underrated in the early years. Easily one of the top 3 floor coaches in the conference.

His speech seemed to slur more in the final years so perhaps his health was a bigger issue there than we realized back then. Of course, he had his first stoke within a couple years of being fired.

Completely disagree. We had two occasions of being injected with ridiculous levels of talent during Finch's tenure. From 1987 to 1991, we were on a steady decline to mediocrity. By the end of the time, we were first round NIT flameouts, even with having EP and several talented players around him. Finch was lucky to have the best player in Memphis history AND his nephew happened to be the 2nd rated PF out of high school. After Penny left and Vaughn was injured, we were back to mediocre until we reloaded with a huge recruiting class that matured and added L.Wright. After they left we were again dropping to mediocrity

Okay, let's see if I have this correct. When the team plays poorly, it's the coach's fault, and when the team plays well, it's because the coach got lucky with great recruits who fell in his lap? Got it.

That seems to be a common theme around here, lol.

No kidding. You have this theme synthesized down to a few simple sentences. It's like a very poorly written fugue theme that repeats. I'm more fascinated by the repetition than the theme. lol

Losing Gray/Alexander 5 games into Larry's 2nd season was such a huge setback for really 3 years until Penny arrived. I tend to believe that had the whole agent thing not happened that Finch would have had far more success before our Elite 8 run with Penny. If memory serves me, we went to 2 NCAAs and a NIT in those years after, and I think we were a 8/9 seed in at least one of those NCAA years (losing 2nd round to #1 seed Purdue). Kids didn't go pro after a sophomore or even junior years back then. So chances were we would have had both of those guys for 2 of the 3 years, and possibly Gray for all 3.

That's about the same as if Cal would have lost CDR and Dorsey 5 games into 2006-07 after that first Elite 8 run. Think about that for just a moment. Now consider that Larry, in a tougher conference, still managed to get us to postseason all 3 years while playing with frontcourts consisting of Bailey, Mundt, Horne, Spiva and the like. It wasn't the level of success we had become used to with the Lee years, but for many coaches a situation like Gray/Alexander would have been a deathblow.