While Obama and the west are dithering and leaderless, Putin just keeps on moving and outmaneuvering Obama. Maybe Obama can find a way to back out of this and save face.

Quote:Crimea residents to decide their Russian or Ukrainian future on March 16
06.03.2014 | Source:
Pravda.Ru

The Supreme Council of the Crimea has set the date for the referendum about the status of the autonomous republic for March 16th, Crimean Vice Prime Minister Rustam Temirgaleiv told reporters.

There will be two questions on the referendum. "The first one is - do you support the incorporation of the Crimea into the Russian Federation. The second one is - do you support the retrieval of the Constitution of the Crimea from 1992," the official said.

According to the text of the Constitution of the Crimea from 1992, the republic is a part of Ukraine and regulates its relations with Ukraine on the bases of agreements.

Such an action would be illegal by Ukrainian law, and thus international law. I wonder if anybody will push that point, or just let it go in the face of the inability to do much about it?

(03-06-2014 11:24 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  Such an action would be illegal by Ukrainian law, and thus international law. I wonder if anybody will push that point, or just let it go in the face of the inability to do much about it?

The later. Does anyone really give a damn about this?

(03-06-2014 11:24 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  Such an action would be illegal by Ukrainian law, and thus international law. I wonder if anybody will push that point, or just let it go in the face of the inability to do much about it?

HOD, you don't really "wonder" which one it will be, do you?

(03-06-2014 11:24 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  Such an action would be illegal by Ukrainian law, and thus international law. I wonder if anybody will push that point, or just let it go in the face of the inability to do much about it?

Obama will come out and proclaim "The Crimean people have spoken", then turn to an aid and say "What time is my tee time?"

(03-06-2014 11:26 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:24 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  Such an action would be illegal by Ukrainian law, and thus international law. I wonder if anybody will push that point, or just let it go in the face of the inability to do much about it?

The later. Does anyone really give a damn about this?

Gotta go with this. One month ago it's doubtful if 10% of Americans, hell 5%, could have found Crimea on a map.

(03-06-2014 11:29 AM)Crebman Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:24 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  Such an action would be illegal by Ukrainian law, and thus international law. I wonder if anybody will push that point, or just let it go in the face of the inability to do much about it?

Obama will come out and proclaim "The Crimean people have spoken", then turn to an aid and say "What time is my tee time?"

Good. More time on the course means less time to Fck up.

Obama has nothing to do with this. I find it amazingly transparent that anyone would try to hang this on him.

(03-06-2014 11:31 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:29 AM)Crebman Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:24 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  Such an action would be illegal by Ukrainian law, and thus international law. I wonder if anybody will push that point, or just let it go in the face of the inability to do much about it?

Obama will come out and proclaim "The Crimean people have spoken", then turn to an aid and say "What time is my tee time?"

Good. More time on the course means less time to Fck up.

True that.

(03-06-2014 11:31 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:29 AM)Crebman Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:24 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  Such an action would be illegal by Ukrainian law, and thus international law. I wonder if anybody will push that point, or just let it go in the face of the inability to do much about it?

Obama will come out and proclaim "The Crimean people have spoken", then turn to an aid and say "What time is my tee time?"

Good. More time on the course means less time to Fck up.

Two great responses in a row!

(03-06-2014 11:41 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  Obama has nothing to do with this. I find it amazingly transparent that anyone would try to hang this on him.

Obama is exactly the reason why this is happening. I thought his talking diplomacy would stop Iran's nuclear program and now stop Putin.

It is just more America's fault as Obama's. Obama is governing just as he promised he would. He told us he was weak, wanted open dialogue with Iran and terrorists and, along with his media lap dogs, mocked those who brought up the Ukraine hypothetical. We got exactly what we voted for.

(03-06-2014 11:50 AM)pharaoh0 Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:41 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  Obama has nothing to do with this. I find it amazingly transparent that anyone would try to hang this on him.

Obama is exactly the reason why this is happening. I thought his talking diplomacy would stop Iran's nuclear program and now stop Putin.

If you thought that then.........

(03-06-2014 11:55 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:50 AM)pharaoh0 Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:41 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  Obama has nothing to do with this. I find it amazingly transparent that anyone would try to hang this on him.

Obama is exactly the reason why this is happening. I thought his talking diplomacy would stop Iran's nuclear program and now stop Putin.

If you thought that then.........

Obama isn't my hero. I knew he would make a horrible president in 2006.

(03-06-2014 11:22 AM)pharaoh0 Wrote:  While Obama and the west are dithering and leaderless, Putin just keeps on moving and outmaneuvering Obama. Maybe Obama can find a way to back out of this and save face.

Quote:Crimea residents to decide their Russian or Ukrainian future on March 16
06.03.2014 | Source:
Pravda.Ru

The Supreme Council of the Crimea has set the date for the referendum about the status of the autonomous republic for March 16th, Crimean Vice Prime Minister Rustam Temirgaleiv told reporters.

There will be two questions on the referendum. "The first one is - do you support the incorporation of the Crimea into the Russian Federation. The second one is - do you support the retrieval of the Constitution of the Crimea from 1992," the official said.

According to the text of the Constitution of the Crimea from 1992, the republic is a part of Ukraine and regulates its relations with Ukraine on the bases of agreements.

This ain't on Obama. I know you all hate him, but this is on Merkel and the Brits. He's going strong and willing to hit with sanctions. The Germans and the Brits want to appease. And Turkey is out to lunch.

Here's what to expect

1) Russia will have sham vote. It will show that they want Anschluss
2) No one will recognize the Crimea as a legitimate part of Russia

Here's what SHOULD happen

1) A total quarantine on any airplane or ship touching Crimea without express approval of the Kiev government. That means if S7 or Aeroflot flies a commercial flight into Simferol, then that tail will not be allowed in the EU. This, along with an obvious border closure to the Ukraine, would strangle the Crimean economy, which is completely dependent upon tourism. Do the Europeans have the balls to do it? Doubtful.

2) A Ukrainian default on Russian loans until its property is restored. This can be done without Germany's approval.

3) Ukrainian signing a bilateral military agreement with Ukraine for a naval base in Odessa and an airforce base in Eastern Ukraine. This would cause Russia to throw a severe fit. Not NATO. Just the US. Again, this would allow the US to act without Germany.

4) Include in the US sanctions GERMAN firms with large Russian positions. Make Germany choose between doing business with Putin or the US. This would be a very bold move, but would send a strong signal to Merkel to climb on board.

5) Work with the Eastern European nations that want strong action to form a new alliance, complimentary to NATO that doesn't have Germany or the UK in it. Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland, Ukraine, Georgia would join immediately. Slovakia and Romania would also be interested. This alliance should have two goals. One is military and the other is to encourage complete energy independence from Russia through the building of LNG terminals in Poland, the Baltic states and Romania. We could loan these nations the money to build them too. This wouldn't show immediate results but would bear fruit in a 6 month to 1 year timeframe.

----------------

We aren't going to invade over this. But I think the US needs a different set of allies in Eastern Europe.

(03-06-2014 12:27 PM)pharaoh0 Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:55 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:50 AM)pharaoh0 Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:41 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  Obama has nothing to do with this. I find it amazingly transparent that anyone would try to hang this on him.

Obama is exactly the reason why this is happening. I thought his talking diplomacy would stop Iran's nuclear program and now stop Putin.

If you thought that then.........

Obama isn't my hero. I knew he would make a horrible president in 2006.

That is a matter of opinion and you are entitled to that. Pointing to what is happening in the Ukraine however and saying that it is happening because of Obama is a bit of a stretch though don't you think?

(03-06-2014 12:46 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 12:27 PM)pharaoh0 Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:55 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:50 AM)pharaoh0 Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:41 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  Obama has nothing to do with this. I find it amazingly transparent that anyone would try to hang this on him.

Obama is exactly the reason why this is happening. I thought his talking diplomacy would stop Iran's nuclear program and now stop Putin.

If you thought that then.........

Obama isn't my hero. I knew he would make a horrible president in 2006.

That is a matter of opinion and you are entitled to that. Pointing to what is happening in the Ukraine however and saying that it is happening because of Obama is a bit of a stretch though don't you think?

This has nothing to do with Obama. It has more to do with Putin, and internal Russian politics.

(03-06-2014 11:29 AM)Crebman Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:24 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  Such an action would be illegal by Ukrainian law, and thus international law. I wonder if anybody will push that point, or just let it go in the face of the inability to do much about it?

Obama will come out and proclaim "The Crimean people have spoken", then turn to an aid and say "What time is my tee tea time?"

Minor altercations made...

This is the fault of Europe and Obama both. They are naive and don't want to believe the world is not on the road to utopia.

Crimea will be Russia. The West will not be able to be united because of Russian energy. Crimea will be annexed. Europe and US will run around in circles waving their hands...then they will "reset" until the next one.

(03-06-2014 12:46 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 12:27 PM)pharaoh0 Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:55 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:50 AM)pharaoh0 Wrote:  

(03-06-2014 11:41 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  Obama has nothing to do with this. I find it amazingly transparent that anyone would try to hang this on him.

Obama is exactly the reason why this is happening. I thought his talking diplomacy would stop Iran's nuclear program and now stop Putin.

If you thought that then.........

Obama isn't my hero. I knew he would make a horrible president in 2006.

That is a matter of opinion and you are entitled to that. Pointing to what is happening in the Ukraine however and saying that it is happening because of Obama is a bit of a stretch though don't you think?

Ever watch MSNBC or listen to yourself?