There's not a lot to add to what has been said other, I hope I not repeating contents of earlier posts, Coach C wanted her team to play tough opponents early on as past of a learning process for her young team. The freshmen in particular and the team in general have to learn to play better particularly on the defensive end including positioning for grabbing and controlling rebounds. This is literally learning on the job which, hopefully, will pay off in January and beyond.

(12-07-2013 09:24 PM)Dwight Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 06:25 PM)flying dutchman Wrote:  Horrible loss

Ditto. This is not the same team that nearly beat Purdue. Our offense seemed entirely geared toward creating three-point opportunities. Many of our threes were taken with a hand in the face. With the new rules resulting in fouls on all contact, I'd like to see us be more assertive offensively. Reed-Lewis was making me cringe at times today, but at least she's aggressive taking the ball to the hoop. I'm a loyal fan, and I am still very excited about Rocket women's basketball, but let's not sugar-coat this horrible loss. In the Cullop era, we have never lost at home to a team as bad as Valparaiso. I think the team's expectations are much higher than what we saw today.

I will say one positive thing. The players worked hard, as they always do. But they played poorly, and I didn't like the game plan.

What you have to remember is that of the nine players that UT dressed for the game today FIVE are true freshman and their play is likely to be inconsistent to some extent until they gain more experience. As you may or may not recall, during the early part of last season I raised a concern that young players were not seeing any floor time (which offended a number of the "true" fans who just couldn't understand why anyone would "criticize" such a wonderful program) but as I pointed out at that time if the new players did NOT get experience then, there was going to a lot of on-the-job training this year when they would have to be thrown into the fire untested by necessity which is not always a pretty sight. In retrospect Coach Cullop probably had a pretty good reason to not give that group too much floor time and there was probably a good reason why they all transferred out of the program after the season ended----but that makes this team even more dependent on the first year recruits.

OTOH I noticed that for a while in the first half of the game today there were 4 freshmen on the court with Nelly and yet the level of performance did not noticeably suffer. Sure freshmen are going to make mistakes and will probably lose some games they should not lose, but that is just part of the price of on-the-job-training when they have not had the luxury of gaining the necessary experience by being slowly and smoothly integrated little by little into the game in the presence of more experienced players who can initially assume more of the responsibility for the game.

Remember that this isn't last year (or next year) and expectations are not that high, so just relax and enjoy the games and don't get overly concerned about the W-L record. There are going to be ups and downs but how they play by season's end is going to be the only measuring stick that really matters.

(12-07-2013 10:28 PM)NewMex RocketFan Wrote:  There's not a lot to add to what has been said other, I hope I not repeating contents of earlier posts, Coach C wanted her team to play tough opponents early on as past of a learning process for her young team. The freshmen in particular and the team in general have to learn to play better particularly on the defensive end including positioning for grabbing and controlling rebounds. This is literally learning on the job which, hopefully, will pay off in January and beyond.

One other issue. Inma and Dola have to be major MAC stars if the team is going to be successful. Inma has been a consistent force on the boards but her offense has not. She has had 3 "off games" offensively. She is 1 for 20 in 3 point shooting. Looks to me like she is having trouble with the burden of being the best player. Maybe putting too much pressure on herself instead of relaxing and letting her substantial talent work it way on the court.

Dola is very up and down offensively. Same as last year. But last year there were other players to take up the slack. I am not sure there is much she can about it. Doesn't really have good judgment on shot selection and tends to hurry her shots. That is just who she is. What is more disconcerting with Dola is her defense. There is a growing number of opponents who are putting up big scoring numbers against the Rockets. In the past Dola would be on them one-on-one and contain them. Is not happening this year. Is this a function of reduced mobility or a wider use of the zone defense. Either way Dola seems to me this year to be another good player but not the standout which the Rockets need for success. So in my opinion the team at end of season will be a factor in the MAC only if Inma and Dola are major offensive forces, regardless how much the freshman improve between game 8 and game 24.

Am I the only one that thinks the Valpo girl traveled on the game winning shot?

(12-08-2013 12:07 AM)toledobrad Wrote:  Am I the only one that thinks the Valpo girl traveled on the game winning shot?

I'd have to see a replay but it looked like she grabbed the board, and went right back up. I was at the far end of the court, though.

(12-08-2013 12:07 AM)toledobrad Wrote:  Am I the only one that thinks the Valpo girl traveled on the game winning shot?

From my perch up in the East Stands I definitely thought she traveled.

(12-08-2013 12:12 AM)H2Oville Rocket Wrote:  

(12-08-2013 12:07 AM)toledobrad Wrote:  Am I the only one that thinks the Valpo girl traveled on the game winning shot?

I'd have to see a replay but it looked like she grabbed the board, and went right back up. I was at the far end of the court, though.

I was watching on BCSn and it looked liked she grabbed the board, then hop back a step before shooting.

I'm sure the ref who was 3 feet away had the best angle...

(12-07-2013 11:03 PM)rocketfan70 Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 10:28 PM)NewMex RocketFan Wrote:  There's not a lot to add to what has been said other, I hope I not repeating contents of earlier posts, Coach C wanted her team to play tough opponents early on as past of a learning process for her young team. The freshmen in particular and the team in general have to learn to play better particularly on the defensive end including positioning for grabbing and controlling rebounds. This is literally learning on the job which, hopefully, will pay off in January and beyond.

One other issue. Inma and Dola have to be major MAC stars if the team is going to be successful. Inma has been a consistent force on the boards but her offense has not. She has had 3 "off games" offensively. She is 1 for 20 in 3 point shooting. Looks to me like she is having trouble with the burden of being the best player. Maybe putting too much pressure on herself instead of relaxing and letting her substantial talent work it way on the court.

Dola is very up and down offensively. Same as last year. But last year there were other players to take up the slack. I am not sure there is much she can about it. Doesn't really have good judgment on shot selection and tends to hurry her shots. That is just who she is. What is more disconcerting with Dola is her defense. There is a growing number of opponents who are putting up big scoring numbers against the Rockets. In the past Dola would be on them one-on-one and contain them. Is not happening this year. Is this a function of reduced mobility or a wider use of the zone defense. Either way Dola seems to me this year to be another good player but not the standout which the Rockets need for success. So in my opinion the team at end of season will be a factor in the MAC only if Inma and Dola are major offensive forces, regardless how much the freshman improve between game 8 and game 24.

I don't Andola is moving around quite as well this year. She is playing injured. An injured Andola is better than none. She can still steal and make plays. Overall this is a team with a lot of new faces playing together and there will be growing pains. It will be an up and down season period. However, the versatility of team overall is better. A lot more players can drive down the lane than in the past.

(12-07-2013 09:24 PM)Dwight Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 06:25 PM)flying dutchman Wrote:  Horrible loss

Ditto. This is not the same team that nearly beat Purdue. Our offense seemed entirely geared toward creating three-point opportunities. Many of our threes were taken with a hand in the face. With the new rules resulting in fouls on all contact, I'd like to see us be more assertive offensively. Reed-Lewis was making me cringe at times today, but at least she's aggressive taking the ball to the hoop. I'm a loyal fan, and I am still very excited about Rocket women's basketball, but let's not sugar-coat this horrible loss. In the Cullop era, we have never lost at home to a team as bad as Valparaiso. I think the team's expectations are much higher than what we saw today.

I will say one positive thing. The players worked hard, as they always do. But they played poorly, and I didn't like the game plan.

That's because most of this team was hurt against Purdue and sitting on the bench. The goal right now is not necessarily to win, but get a group of newer faces playing well by MAC competition time.

Game plan:

A win against Valpo would have probably looked good in the end of year, who gets invited, tally.

If the MAC were a conference to get two or three invites, I would see the value of playing to develop players, getting experience across the board. With only one invite, do you put wins over development and keep the top players in? Is this something Coach C has to consider when deciding who to play during the year? Or are all eggs in the win MACC basket, which would place development over early wins?

(12-08-2013 07:56 AM)eastisbest Wrote:  Game plan:

A win against Valpo would have probably looked good in the end of year, who gets invited, tally.

If the MAC were a conference to get two or three invites, I would see the value of playing to develop players, getting experience across the board. With only one invite, do you put wins over development and keep the top players in? Is this something Coach C has to consider when deciding who to play during the year? Or are all eggs in the win MACC basket, which would place development over early wins?

MACC Basket

Probably true. An OOC win-out wouldn't convince the committees UT should get an invite, even though we're hosting. MACC or bust!

(12-08-2013 07:56 AM)eastisbest Wrote:  Game plan:

A win against Valpo would have probably looked good in the end of year, who gets invited, tally.

If the MAC were a conference to get two or three invites, I would see the value of playing to develop players, getting experience across the board. With only one invite, do you put wins over development and keep the top players in? Is this something Coach C has to consider when deciding who to play during the year? Or are all eggs in the win MACC basket, which would place development over early wins?

I don't understand your point. When 5 of your 9 players dressed for the game are freshmen, there is NO choice to be made between "winning" and "development". You play who you have and hope for a win. Besides in order to receive an invitation to the NCAA tournament a MAC coach has no choice whatsoever but to win the conference tourney----early wins are not enough to get an invitation. Remember last year that outstanding W-L record totally failed to get the Lady Rockets into the NCAA Tourney.


To repeat, if you are NOT in a power conference, you have no "choice of baskets"----winning your conference championship is essentially your ONLY way of getting to the NCAA tourney.

Last year when a number of people were still hoping for a UT invite to the NCAA tourney even after that fatal loss to CMU in Cleveland, I actually went back and checked a previous year or so of invites for men and women and found that 31 (as I recall) "automatic" invites went to the conference (tournament) champions leaving a total of 33 that were "at large" invitations. Something like 31 of these 33 at large bids went to members of the ten or so top tier "major" conferences while the remaining 2 bids were distributed to two teams from among the other 20 or so "mid-major" conferences. If your team was not in one of the top tier conferences and you did not win you conference championship and if you conference commissioner was not on the selection committee that year, you had a ZERO chance of being selected as an "at large" team.

The pre-conference should always be about player (and team) development and a win or loss to a 1-7 VALPO team was definitely never going to be a factor in getting or not getting an NCAA invitation at year's end----only winning the MAC tournament will get you in.

I expect this team to greatly improve as the season progresses, and be in a position to make some noise in the MAC tourney; however, unlike last year, it is totally unrealistic to expect them to get to the NCAA this year----they are probably at least a year away from being able to seriously compete for any tourney title and even then (as we saw last year) nothing is ever guaranteed.

Agreed, T-Town. My expectations for this season of Lady Rockets basketball have not been high, not out of spite but out of reality. This is a team that should be better by the end of the season and NEXT season my expectations will increase, which I think is realistic. I will not be surprised nor despondent if this team falls a bit short of a winning record this season. Conversely my expectations are much higher for the men's bball team this season, as they were for football. As others have said, it really is about how realistic our expectations are as fans when it comes to deciding whether or not we are happy with any seasons outcome. Volleyball for example ended on a sour note but had a season that certainly exceeded my expectations and made me proud to be a Rocket.

(12-08-2013 10:12 AM)T-Town Wrote:  

(12-08-2013 07:56 AM)eastisbest Wrote:  Game plan:

A win against Valpo would have probably looked good in the end of year, who gets invited, tally.

If the MAC were a conference to get two or three invites, I would see the value of playing to develop players, getting experience across the board. With only one invite, do you put wins over development and keep the top players in? Is this something Coach C has to consider when deciding who to play during the year? Or are all eggs in the win MACC basket, which would place development over early wins?

I don't understand your point. When 5 of your 9 players dressed for the game are freshmen, there is NO choice to be made between "winning" and "development". You play who you have and hope for a win. Besides in order to receive an invitation to the NCAA tournament a MAC coach has no choice whatsoever but to win the conference tourney----early wins are not enough to get an invitation. Remember last year that outstanding W-L record totally failed to get the Lady Rockets into the NCAA Tourney.


To repeat, if you are NOT in a power conference, you have no "choice of baskets"----winning your conference championship is essentially your ONLY way of getting to the NCAA tourney.

Last year when a number of people were still hoping for a UT invite to the NCAA tourney even after that fatal loss to CMU in Cleveland, I actually went back and checked a previous year or so of invites for men and women and found that 31 (as I recall) "automatic" invites went to the conference (tournament) champions leaving a total of 33 that were "at large" invitations. Something like 31 of these 33 at large bids went to members of the ten or so top tier "major" conferences while the remaining 2 bids were distributed to two teams from among the other 20 or so "mid-major" conferences. If your team was not in one of the top tier conferences and you did not win you conference championship and if you conference commissioner was not on the selection committee that year, you had a ZERO chance of being selected as an "at large" team.

The pre-conference should always be about player (and team) development and a win or loss to a 1-7 VALPO team was definitely never going to be a factor in getting or not getting an NCAA invitation at year's end----only winning the MAC tournament will get you in.

I expect this team to greatly improve as the season progresses, and be in a position to make some noise in the MAC tourney; however, unlike last year, it is totally unrealistic to expect them to get to the NCAA this year----they are probably at least a year away from being able to seriously compete for any tourney title and even then (as we saw last year) nothing is ever guaranteed.

I didn't make a point. I asked a question (for opinions). I also didn't realize that playing freshmen wasn't an option, so that answers pretty clearly the game plan: development versus wins. No choice to be had.

(12-08-2013 12:53 PM)eastisbest Wrote:  I didn't make a point. I asked a question (for opinions). I also didn't realize that playing freshmen wasn't an option, so that answers pretty clearly the game plan: development versus wins. No choice to be had.

Sorry, I somehow missed that you were asking a question (although there were certainly enough question marks in the post to provide a clue as to your intent).

Since we almost certainly won't be playing in the NCAA tournament this year, the real question is whether we can get an NIT invite. So far, the answer seems to be no, but maybe if we get everyone healthy and start playing more consistently . . .

Unfortunately, hosting the NCAA tourney may interfere with hosting NIT games.

They do look at wins and losses for seeding in tourny.

(12-08-2013 05:25 PM)Dwight Wrote:  Since we almost certainly won't be playing in the NCAA tournament this year, the real question is whether we can get an NIT invite. So far, the answer seems to be no, but maybe if we get everyone healthy and start playing more consistently . . .

Unfortunately, hosting the NCAA tourney may interfere with hosting NIT games.

You've already ruled them out of the MAC tourney? No chance against CMU?