B12 had, I think not sure, 3 teams headed to a BCS goal with that BCS bowl cranking out the designated national champion....but lost in the B12 Conference Championship game.

Temperature here is 7 degrees this morning with below zero wind chill. I cannot get sick for the holidays so will watch tv today by the fireplace in my nice recliner with kitty cat sleeping on my lap. When I was young, I would probably have gone to the game but, as the years add up, you have to use discretion.

Edited to add following:
A post on the CUSA board reminded of Houston losing to Southern Miss and costing the Cougars the Sugar Bowl.

It is a game that can cost them but it is also a game that can solidify a position. It goes both ways. It does no good to focus solely on one side of the coin. The coin flips both ways.

I give the Big 12 credit for trying to counter the power of the conference championship games that the other conferences have by pushing back their major teams' last games to that same week. That way they are visible and talked about by the press that week.

The biggest strength of the conference championship game is that it gives your two top teams a chance to be on the big stage before all the votes are cast and computer rankings calculated.

It is a risk that comes with great reward.

(12-07-2013 10:15 AM)He1nousOne Wrote:  It is a game that can cost them but it is also a game that can solidify a position. It goes both ways. It does no good to focus solely on one side of the coin. The coin flips both ways.

I give the Big 12 credit for trying to counter the power of the conference championship games that the other conferences have by pushing back their major teams' last games to that same week. That way they are visible and talked about by the press that week.

The biggest strength of the conference championship game is that it gives your two top teams a chance to be on the big stage before all the votes are cast and computer rankings calculated.

It is a risk that comes with great reward.

That's what I'm thinking. The lack of a championship game allows the Big12 runner up to possibly end the season with a victory. Thats not possible in any conference with a CCG. In a conference with a CCG the runner up ALWAYS ends the season with a loss. Much easier to place two teams in the playoff or access bowls with no CCG.

(12-07-2013 10:22 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 10:15 AM)He1nousOne Wrote:  It is a game that can cost them but it is also a game that can solidify a position. It goes both ways. It does no good to focus solely on one side of the coin. The coin flips both ways.

I give the Big 12 credit for trying to counter the power of the conference championship games that the other conferences have by pushing back their major teams' last games to that same week. That way they are visible and talked about by the press that week.

The biggest strength of the conference championship game is that it gives your two top teams a chance to be on the big stage before all the votes are cast and computer rankings calculated.

It is a risk that comes with great reward.

That's what I'm thinking. The lack of a championship game allows the Big12 runner up to possibly end the season with a victory. Thats not possible in any conference with a CCG. In a conference with a CCG the runner up ALWAYS ends the season with a loss. Much easier to place two teams in the playoff or access bowls with no CCG.

What if Oklahoma State loses and Baylor loses? That is definitely possible. If that happens and this was a year of having the four team playoff, the Big 12 would likely have zero participation.

So you see, nothing is assured. The situation is far too dynamic to predict. In a four team playoff, I think the Conference Championships will definitely give an edge to their victors due to the Committee. When we move to an 8 team playoff then that could change things.

One thing that I do think I can guarantee is that every season will have a life of it's own in this regard. You really cant predict how it will unfold. You can only set up the system and then let the competition play itself out.

(12-07-2013 10:22 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 10:15 AM)He1nousOne Wrote:  It is a game that can cost them but it is also a game that can solidify a position. It goes both ways. It does no good to focus solely on one side of the coin. The coin flips both ways.

I give the Big 12 credit for trying to counter the power of the conference championship games that the other conferences have by pushing back their major teams' last games to that same week. That way they are visible and talked about by the press that week.

The biggest strength of the conference championship game is that it gives your two top teams a chance to be on the big stage before all the votes are cast and computer rankings calculated.

It is a risk that comes with great reward.

That's what I'm thinking. The lack of a championship game allows the Big12 runner up to possibly end the season with a victory. Thats not possible in any conference with a CCG. In a conference with a CCG the runner up ALWAYS ends the season with a loss. Much easier to place two teams in the playoff or access bowls with no CCG.

I am guessing this is the inside thinking of B12 officials, with the 4 game national playoff plus the 4 BCS bowls with one BCS spot reserved for NonBCS team.

For Texas and OU, play the game early in the season to give time to recover in the polls.

(12-07-2013 09:59 AM)Tallgrass Wrote:  B12 had, I think not sure, 3 teams headed to a BCS goal with that BCS bowl cranking out the designated national champion....but lost in the B12 Conference Championship game.

CCG is a two-edged sword, it can help or hurt in getting to the BCS title game or a BCS bowl, depending on whether you win or lose it. But it isn't inherently good or bad.

(12-07-2013 11:18 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 09:59 AM)Tallgrass Wrote:  B12 had, I think not sure, 3 teams headed to a BCS goal with that BCS bowl cranking out the designated national champion....but lost in the B12 Conference Championship game.

CCG is a two-edged sword, it can help or hurt in getting to the BCS title game or a BCS bowl, depending on whether you win or lose it. But it isn't inherently good or bad.

Name one time it has helped a conference get a team in. I don't think you can. It has switched teams (Florida over Alabama 2008 for example) but I don't think it has ever gotten a conference a slot it didn't have before. And it has cost the Big 12 3 times, nearly 5.

(12-07-2013 11:24 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:18 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 09:59 AM)Tallgrass Wrote:  B12 had, I think not sure, 3 teams headed to a BCS goal with that BCS bowl cranking out the designated national champion....but lost in the B12 Conference Championship game.

CCG is a two-edged sword, it can help or hurt in getting to the BCS title game or a BCS bowl, depending on whether you win or lose it. But it isn't inherently good or bad.

Name one time it has helped a conference get a team in. I don't think you can. It has switched teams (Florida over Alabama 2008 for example) but I don't think it has ever gotten a conference a slot it didn't have before. And it has cost the Big 12 3 times, nearly 5.

If the SEC doesn't have a championship game, LSU doesn't play in the 2003 title game over USC and probably not the 2007 one either. Florida definitely doesn't make the 2006 game over Michigan.

The NIU lost cost the MAC schools about $800K/ea.

(12-07-2013 11:28 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:24 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:18 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 09:59 AM)Tallgrass Wrote:  B12 had, I think not sure, 3 teams headed to a BCS goal with that BCS bowl cranking out the designated national champion....but lost in the B12 Conference Championship game.

CCG is a two-edged sword, it can help or hurt in getting to the BCS title game or a BCS bowl, depending on whether you win or lose it. But it isn't inherently good or bad.

Name one time it has helped a conference get a team in. I don't think you can. It has switched teams (Florida over Alabama 2008 for example) but I don't think it has ever gotten a conference a slot it didn't have before. And it has cost the Big 12 3 times, nearly 5.

If the SEC doesn't have a championship game, LSU doesn't play in the 2003 title game over USC and probably not the 2007 one either. Florida definitely doesn't make the 2006 game over Michigan.

Good point about 2003. But the fix was in for LSU in 2007. They kept losing and kept getting put back at #1. Pollsters wanted to justify their preseason predictions. Their win over TN wasn't especially impressive (unlike 2003).

2006 is arguable, but I don't think they were inclined to give Michigan a rematch against Ohio St. unlike in 2011. Hard to explain why the ESPN talking heads made exactly the opposite arguments they had made in 2006 (some of the same people).

LSU got in 2007 because they blew out Va Tech 48-3. You couldn't put VT in ahead of them.

(12-07-2013 11:24 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:18 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 09:59 AM)Tallgrass Wrote:  B12 had, I think not sure, 3 teams headed to a BCS goal with that BCS bowl cranking out the designated national champion....but lost in the B12 Conference Championship game.

CCG is a two-edged sword, it can help or hurt in getting to the BCS title game or a BCS bowl, depending on whether you win or lose it. But it isn't inherently good or bad.

Name one time it has helped a conference get a team in. I don't think you can. It has switched teams (Florida over Alabama 2008 for example) but I don't think it has ever gotten a conference a slot it didn't have before. And it has cost the Big 12 3 times, nearly 5.

There are no guaranteed safe days in life, ever. It is the fear of losing out that keeps the Big 12 from being all it can and should be. Avoiding risk / reward situations in life relegates those who make such decisions to an inferior position against those who opt for both the risk and the reward. And furthermore no general of any army has ever won a war by opting out of risky moves. They weigh the risk and choose the time and place of battle, but they do not avoid the confrontation. It is this very mindset that hamstrings your conference. Football is an aggressive land acquisition game. You can't instill confidence in your players by robbing them of their natural aggressiveness and teaching them to avoid risk.

(12-07-2013 11:35 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:28 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:24 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:18 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 09:59 AM)Tallgrass Wrote:  B12 had, I think not sure, 3 teams headed to a BCS goal with that BCS bowl cranking out the designated national champion....but lost in the B12 Conference Championship game.

CCG is a two-edged sword, it can help or hurt in getting to the BCS title game or a BCS bowl, depending on whether you win or lose it. But it isn't inherently good or bad.

Name one time it has helped a conference get a team in. I don't think you can. It has switched teams (Florida over Alabama 2008 for example) but I don't think it has ever gotten a conference a slot it didn't have before. And it has cost the Big 12 3 times, nearly 5.

If the SEC doesn't have a championship game, LSU doesn't play in the 2003 title game over USC and probably not the 2007 one either. Florida definitely doesn't make the 2006 game over Michigan.

Good point about 2003. But the fix was in for LSU in 2007. They kept losing and kept getting put back at #1. Pollsters wanted to justify their preseason predictions. Their win over TN wasn't especially impressive (unlike 2003).

2006 is arguable, but I don't think they were inclined to give Michigan a rematch against Ohio St. unlike in 2011. Hard to explain why the ESPN talking heads made exactly the opposite arguments they had made in 2006 (some of the same people).

Your revisionism and burnt orange colored glasses are unbelievable with one exception, it should have been Oklahoma State and L.S.U. in 2011. However the rational then was that Alabama's loss to L.S.U. in a close game, was better than Oklahoma State's loss to Iowa State. What I believed should have been taken into consideration was the tragedy of the plane crash involving members of the coaching family at Oklahoma State.

(12-07-2013 11:24 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:18 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 09:59 AM)Tallgrass Wrote:  B12 had, I think not sure, 3 teams headed to a BCS goal with that BCS bowl cranking out the designated national champion....but lost in the B12 Conference Championship game.

CCG is a two-edged sword, it can help or hurt in getting to the BCS title game or a BCS bowl, depending on whether you win or lose it. But it isn't inherently good or bad.

Name one time it has helped a conference get a team in. I don't think you can. It has switched teams (Florida over Alabama 2008 for example) but I don't think it has ever gotten a conference a slot it didn't have before. And it has cost the Big 12 3 times, nearly 5.

NIU last year.

(12-07-2013 01:41 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:24 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:18 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 09:59 AM)Tallgrass Wrote:  B12 had, I think not sure, 3 teams headed to a BCS goal with that BCS bowl cranking out the designated national champion....but lost in the B12 Conference Championship game.

CCG is a two-edged sword, it can help or hurt in getting to the BCS title game or a BCS bowl, depending on whether you win or lose it. But it isn't inherently good or bad.

Name one time it has helped a conference get a team in. I don't think you can. It has switched teams (Florida over Alabama 2008 for example) but I don't think it has ever gotten a conference a slot it didn't have before. And it has cost the Big 12 3 times, nearly 5.

NIU last year.

The way things fell out, the MAC did. If Kent St had won, they would have been in.

(12-07-2013 11:35 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:28 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:24 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:18 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 09:59 AM)Tallgrass Wrote:  B12 had, I think not sure, 3 teams headed to a BCS goal with that BCS bowl cranking out the designated national champion....but lost in the B12 Conference Championship game.

CCG is a two-edged sword, it can help or hurt in getting to the BCS title game or a BCS bowl, depending on whether you win or lose it. But it isn't inherently good or bad.

Name one time it has helped a conference get a team in. I don't think you can. It has switched teams (Florida over Alabama 2008 for example) but I don't think it has ever gotten a conference a slot it didn't have before. And it has cost the Big 12 3 times, nearly 5.

If the SEC doesn't have a championship game, LSU doesn't play in the 2003 title game over USC and probably not the 2007 one either. Florida definitely doesn't make the 2006 game over Michigan.

Good point about 2003. But the fix was in for LSU in 2007. They kept losing and kept getting put back at #1. Pollsters wanted to justify their preseason predictions. Their win over TN wasn't especially impressive (unlike 2003).

2006 is arguable, but I don't think they were inclined to give Michigan a rematch against Ohio St. unlike in 2011. Hard to explain why the ESPN talking heads made exactly the opposite arguments they had made in 2006 (some of the same people).

I don't think 2006 is arguable. Florida barely beat out Michigan for #2, and without the win in the SEC title game over #8 Arkansas, they would have been much weaker in the computers and minds of voters.

In the new world of the committee selecting playoff teams, conference championships will definitely matter. They will most likely put more weight on teams winning conference championships than those that don't.

(12-07-2013 12:41 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:35 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:28 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:24 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-07-2013 11:18 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  CCG is a two-edged sword, it can help or hurt in getting to the BCS title game or a BCS bowl, depending on whether you win or lose it. But it isn't inherently good or bad.

Name one time it has helped a conference get a team in. I don't think you can. It has switched teams (Florida over Alabama 2008 for example) but I don't think it has ever gotten a conference a slot it didn't have before. And it has cost the Big 12 3 times, nearly 5.

If the SEC doesn't have a championship game, LSU doesn't play in the 2003 title game over USC and probably not the 2007 one either. Florida definitely doesn't make the 2006 game over Michigan.

Good point about 2003. But the fix was in for LSU in 2007. They kept losing and kept getting put back at #1. Pollsters wanted to justify their preseason predictions. Their win over TN wasn't especially impressive (unlike 2003).

2006 is arguable, but I don't think they were inclined to give Michigan a rematch against Ohio St. unlike in 2011. Hard to explain why the ESPN talking heads made exactly the opposite arguments they had made in 2006 (some of the same people).

Your revisionism and burnt orange colored glasses are unbelievable with one exception, it should have been Oklahoma State and L.S.U. in 2011. However the rational then was that Alabama's loss to L.S.U. in a close game, was better than Oklahoma State's loss to Iowa State. What I believed should have been taken into consideration was the tragedy of the plane crash involving members of the coaching family at Oklahoma State.

Are you disagreeing with something or just being disagreeable?

In any event, who said the Big 12 didn't have a conference championship game?

Hook 'em!

(12-07-2013 02:20 PM)jaminandjachin Wrote:  In the new world of the committee selecting playoff teams, conference championships will definitely matter. They will most likely put more weight on teams winning conference championships than those that don't.

I don't think so. They just said conference champions would have priority- not conference champions who played in a CCG. The only plus would be the boost in the SOS most times(though at times, that's been mitigated as well).