CSNbbs

Which Tulane Season was better?

1998 Tulane
12-0
Final Ranking AP/Coaches #7
Liberty Bowl Champion defeating BYU
C-USA Champion
Number of weeks in the Top25: 9
Defeated Rival Southern Miss

or

2022 Tulane
12-2
Current Ranking AP # 14 / Coaches #17
NY6 Cotton Bowl Champion defeating #8 USC
AAC Champion
Number of weeks in the Top25: 7
Lost to Rival Southern Miss

2022 Tulane but only because they had the opportunity to show it in the bowl game. USC (11-2 entering the Cotton Bowl) was on the verge of a CFP appearance had they beaten Utah. BYU was 9-4 entering the Liberty Bowl.

(01-03-2023 10:44 AM)ArmoredUpKnight Wrote: [ -> ]Which Tulane Season was better?

1998 Tulane
12-0
Final Ranking AP/Coaches #7
Liberty Bowl Champion defeating BYU
C-USA Champion
Number of weeks in the Top25: 9
Defeated Rival Southern Miss

or

2022 Tulane
12-2
Current Ranking AP # 14 / Coaches #17
NY6 Cotton Bowl Champion defeating #8 USC
AAC Champion
Number of weeks in the Top25: 7
Lost to Rival Southern Miss

You should add to the 2022 Tulane resume -- defeated the Big XII Champion, Kansas State in Manhattan.


But this is a good question. I will lean to 2022. My Cardinals lost a close one in the Super Dome that year. That Green Wave team was very good.

I'd say 2022 Tulane. Both were impressive, but 1998 Tulane defeated nobody who was then a member of a power conference aside from Rutgers, who was still in their hapless pre-Schiano years and went 5-6 in 1998 -

W 12/31/1998 Brigham Young (UT) 41-27 Memphis, TN Liberty Bowl
W 11/26/1998 Louisiana Tech 63-30 New Orleans, LA
W 11/21/1998 Houston (TX) 48-20 New Orleans, LA
W 11/14/1998 Army (NY) 49-35 West Point, NY
W 11/7/1998 Memphis (TN) 41-31 Memphis, TN
W 10/31/1998 Louisiana-Lafayette 72-20 New Orleans, LA
W 10/24/1998 Rutgers (NJ) 52-24 New Brunswick, NJ
W 10/17/1998 Louisville (KY) 28-22 New Orleans, LA
W 10/3/1998 Southern Mississippi 21-7 New Orleans, LA
W 9/26/1998 Navy (MD) 42-24 New Orleans, LA
W 9/12/1998 SMU 31-21 Dallas, TX
W 9/5/1998 Cincinnati (OH) 52-34 Cincinnati, OH

2022 Tulane, despite losing two games, defeated both the Big XII champion on the road and the PAC 12 runner-up while posting one of, if not the greatest, turnarounds from the prior season (2-10 in 2021) -

W 1/2/2023 Southern Cal 46-45 Arlington, TX Cotton Bowl
W 12/3/2022 Central Florida 45-28 New Orleans, LA American Athletic Championship
W 11/25/2022 Cincinnati (OH) 27-24 Cincinnati, OH
W 11/17/2022 SMU 59-24 New Orleans, LA
L 11/12/2022 Central Florida 31-38 New Orleans, LA
W 11/5/2022 Tulsa (OK) 27-13 Tulsa, OK
W 10/22/2022 Memphis (TN) 38-28 New Orleans, LA
W 10/15/2022 South Florida 45-31 Tampa, FL
W 10/8/2022 East Carolina 24-9 New Orleans, LA
W 9/30/2022 Houston (TX) 27-24 Houston, TX
L 9/24/2022 Southern MS 24-27 New Orleans, LA
W 9/17/2022 Kansas St. 17-10 Manhattan, KS
W 9/10/2022 Alcorn St. (MS) 52-0 New Orleans, LA
W 9/3/2022 Massachusetts 42-10 New Orleans, LA

I think 2022 Tulane is way better, because unlike the 1998 team, this team proved itself against top OOC competition - a win over the Big 12 champ and a major bowl win over the PAC runner-up.

Of the teams played by 1998 Tulane, eight of the twelve had losing records, and no team had a better record than 7-5, save for 9-4 BYU.

Season you say 1998. You can't erase two losses, including one to Southern Miss. Bowl game you say 2022.

I'm more impressed by the 2022 season than the 1998 one, but I think 1998 was more impactful and influential on the college-level landscape. "Inconveniences" like Tulane, TCU, Utah, Boise State, Hawaii, etc. certainly didn't help the BCS model.

I'll also give respect to the name recognition on the 1998 schedule, even if those teams weren't up to anything great that season (or surrounding ones). More impressive than the 2006 Boise State and 2007 Hawaii schedules for sure based on that name-basis.

(01-03-2023 11:06 AM)Gamenole Wrote: [ -> ]I'd say 2022 Tulane. Both were impressive, but 1998 Tulane defeated nobody who was then a member of a power conference aside from Rutgers, who was still in their hapless pre-Schiano years and went 5-6 in 1998 -

W 12/31/1998 Brigham Young (UT) 41-27 Memphis, TN Liberty Bowl
W 11/26/1998 Louisiana Tech 63-30 New Orleans, LA
W 11/21/1998 Houston (TX) 48-20 New Orleans, LA
W 11/14/1998 Army (NY) 49-35 West Point, NY
W 11/7/1998 Memphis (TN) 41-31 Memphis, TN
W 10/31/1998 Louisiana-Lafayette 72-20 New Orleans, LA
W 10/24/1998 Rutgers (NJ) 52-24 New Brunswick, NJ
W 10/17/1998 Louisville (KY) 28-22 New Orleans, LA
W 10/3/1998 Southern Mississippi 21-7 New Orleans, LA
W 9/26/1998 Navy (MD) 42-24 New Orleans, LA
W 9/12/1998 SMU 31-21 Dallas, TX
W 9/5/1998 Cincinnati (OH) 52-34 Cincinnati, OH

2022 Tulane, despite losing two games, defeated both the Big XII champion on the road and the PAC 12 runner-up while posting one of, if not the greatest, turnarounds from the prior season (2-10 in 2021) -

W 1/2/2023 Southern Cal 46-45 Arlington, TX Cotton Bowl
W 12/3/2022 Central Florida 45-28 New Orleans, LA American Athletic Championship
W 11/25/2022 Cincinnati (OH) 27-24 Cincinnati, OH
W 11/17/2022 SMU 59-24 New Orleans, LA
L 11/12/2022 Central Florida 31-38 New Orleans, LA
W 11/5/2022 Tulsa (OK) 27-13 Tulsa, OK
W 10/22/2022 Memphis (TN) 38-28 New Orleans, LA
W 10/15/2022 South Florida 45-31 Tampa, FL
W 10/8/2022 East Carolina 24-9 New Orleans, LA
W 9/30/2022 Houston (TX) 27-24 Houston, TX
L 9/24/2022 Southern MS 24-27 New Orleans, LA
W 9/17/2022 Kansas St. 17-10 Manhattan, KS
W 9/10/2022 Alcorn St. (MS) 52-0 New Orleans, LA
W 9/3/2022 Massachusetts 42-10 New Orleans, LA

Despite different conferences, CUSA 1.0 instead of AAC, had 5 of the same opponents, Cincinnati, Memphis, Houston, SMU and USM.

P5 teams struggle in the access game. Say what you want, but it's true. Clearly there is a motivational issue, a subtle one at that. It has to do with details and consistent effort. It only takes a certain subset of players to not be mentally locked in 100%, but only 80-90% for the P5 team to not perform consistently all game at their standards.

This is why I always take the G5 team in such games. It's a huge game for them, while it's something of a bogey prize for the P5 team, who got the short straw in the draw of the 11 P5 schools. That has a psychological effect.

But when they shift to a 12 school playoff, 6+6, then not only will the G5 school draw a higher ranked opponent, they will be playing in a game that really matters to the other school, which will likely result in a defeat and by some margin for the G5 school. This is a change in the result I expect we'll see in the next CFP format going forward. The psychology will have flipped.

I recall the 1998 Tulane undefeated team very well. That was a very cohesive team. As I posted previously, that Green Wave squad could have beaten most (if not all) teams ranked No. 6 and below in the final polls for that year. The quarterback, Shaun King, was big time. Well coached team that played with focus, confidence and good team chemistry. Though the schedule was modest in many respects, it is VERY difficult to go undefeated for a full college football season. That accomplishment alone is worth props.

But this year's Tulane team seemed considerable bigger and stronger than the squad of 1998. The Wave had some meat on its defensive and offensive lines — size that simply was seemingly lacking on that 1998 squad. And this year's team beat two top 20 teams (USC and KSU).

Edge: 2022 Tulane team

(01-03-2023 12:59 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: [ -> ]P5 teams struggle in the access game. Say what you want, but it's true. Clearly there is a motivational issue, a subtle one at that. It has to do with details and consistent effort. It only takes a certain subset of players to not be mentally locked in 100%, but only 80-90% for the P5 team to not perform consistently all game at their standards.

This is why I always take the G5 team in such games. It's a huge game for them, while it's something of a bogey prize for the P5 team, who got the short straw in the draw of the 11 P5 schools. That has a psychological effect.

But when they shift to a 12 school playoff, 6+6, then not only will the G5 school draw a higher ranked opponent, they will be playing in a game that really matters to the other school, which will likely result in a defeat and by some margin for the G5 school. This is a change in the result I expect we'll see in the next CFP format going forward. The psychology will have flipped.

The G5 is very possibly going to struggle with the future format. Agree.

(01-03-2023 12:48 PM)bullet Wrote: [ -> ]Despite different conferences, CUSA 1.0 instead of AAC, had 5 of the same opponents, Cincinnati, Memphis, Houston, SMU and USM.

The AAC was built from CUSA. Only Temple, Wichita State, and Navy didn't originate in CUSA.

The Big East/AAC has pulled a total of 18 full-member schools from CUSA (* = moved/moving on to other conferences):

2005 (5): Cincinnati*, DePaul*, Louisville*, Marquette*, South Florida
2013 (4): Central Florida*, Houston*, Memphis, SMU
2014 (3): East Carolina, Tulane, Tulsa
2023 (6): Charlotte, FAU, North Texas, Rice, UAB, UTSA

1998. Undefeated was rare then as it is now. Everyone was gunning for them.

(01-03-2023 02:57 PM)Claw Wrote: [ -> ]1998. Undefeated was rare then as it is now. Everyone was gunning for them.

... but the thing was, the teams that were gunning for them were armed with pop-guns. The schedule as atrocious.

2022. Conference realignment and the way the playoffs are set up are now even more biased towards P5 schools. On top of that the AAC in its current rendition is more difficult than CUSA was back then.

Tulane really shocked everyone this year. Just like with those past Boise State and UCF amazing seasons, would be interesting to have seen how they would have fared in an 8 or 12 team playoff.

(01-03-2023 02:59 PM)quo vadis Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-03-2023 02:57 PM)Claw Wrote: [ -> ]1998. Undefeated was rare then as it is now. Everyone was gunning for them.

... but the thing was, the teams that were gunning for them were armed with pop-guns. The schedule as atrocious.

Ok. I'll give. The schedule itself didn't look that bad, but then I went and looked at the records of the teams that year. OMG. It's bad. Real bad.

(01-03-2023 02:59 PM)quo vadis Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-03-2023 02:57 PM)Claw Wrote: [ -> ]1998. Undefeated was rare then as it is now. Everyone was gunning for them.

... but the thing was, the teams that were gunning for them were armed with pop-guns. The schedule as atrocious.

You can't lose to your rival and call it a better season.

Losing to a 7-6 Southern Miss will always be a blackeye on the 2022 season.




I expect 2022 Tulane's final rankings to be Top10 but not higher than the #7 ranking the 2018 team received.

Undefeated season just mean more

I’d say 2022 may be the better team, but undefeated is still more impressive, even with the easier schedule. It is tough. Whoever is ranked higher in the AP, tie to the recent team.

2022 Tulane by a lot. They beat the big 12 champ and pac runner up, and they won the Cotton Bowl for their first Major Bowl victory in 87 years. This years team was special, full credit to them for a job well done.

The 2022 team's loss to Southern Miss sticks out like a sore thumb, but the win at K-State and the Cotton Bowl win over USC make up for it.