CSNbbs

What I saw last night on my TV (so glad I didn't go) was a team that no longer believes it can win with its current offensive scheme.

Bloomgren has had "success" at other places? Where has he been the head coach? Being an assistant (not even a true coordinator) has little to do with being a head coach. Rice took someone who, essentially, was an assistant department head, and made him the CEO. To date, he has failed to show any significant improvement, in spite of significant dollars being spent to support his efforts.

For those keeping score, his record is 7-26 (.212), while in Bailiff's final 33 games, Rice was 7-26. If Bloomgren finishes this season, he will have had 42 games as head coach. To do better than Bailiff's final 42 games, Rice must go 7-2 over the final 9 games.

Well, preseason is over. Now the games count.

(09-19-2021 10:11 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: [ -> ]Well, preseason is over. Now the games count.

TSU doesn't count unless we lose.

I have traditionally been slow to want to change coaches. In general, this is because I don’t believe in the auto mechanic approach to coaching - if the vehicle isn’t working right, pull out a part, replace it, and see if that fixes the problem.

But I have reached the final stage in record time this time.

(09-19-2021 10:12 AM)mebehutchi Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:11 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: [ -> ]Well, preseason is over. Now the games count.

TSU doesn't count unless we lose.

ESPN is giving the Owls a 98.1% chance of defeating TSU. I wondering if they watched the games vs UH and UT?

(09-19-2021 09:43 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: [ -> ]Alternate history:
Suppose Toad had taken that new DE with him, that Casey guy. Bailiff doesn’t win 10 in 2008, and is fired in 2010.
We would now be on our second coach since Bailiff, and of course we would have hit pay dirt both times and be winning, big and often. We would be a leader in the realignment derby.
Maybe our troubles are due to Toad not recognizing/poaching talent.

You can play out alternative universe scenarios all you want. The problem seems to me to be pretty straightforward. We have hired a succession of "square pegs in round holes" football coaches, and you can't win at Rice that way. You can win at a P5 that way, because you can recruit those round pegs. It would appear that we haven't had anyone on our coach hiring committees who has understood that dynamic.

Rice isn't going to get the big, strong offensive linemen who can pancake defenders and create gaping holes through which we can "pound the rock." Rice can't recruit strong-armed and accurate pocket passers who can drop back and fire a bullet to pick up third and 8 when the running game gets stuffed. The supply of both runs out long before the P5s have taken all they want.

We do seem to be able to recruit running backs and receivers, which is a decent start. We can get the QB who is a stud in HS but the P5s say, "Come here and you can play safety," when he really wants to play QB (my guess is that JoVoni fits into that category). We can do what Fred Goldsmith did and recruit second tier (3 star, not 4-5 star) defensive linemen and move those who are not athletic enough to play defense over to the other side of the ball (they will be smaller, but still more athletic, than typical o-linemen). So we need a scheme that works with running QBs and mobile, athletic linemen. That's not "pound the rock." The running QB can be another Bert Emanuel, at best. People forget that Andre Ware was a triple option QB in HS that Yeoman recruited to run the veer. The o-line can pass protect or run the blocking schemes necessary for Ken's triple. Combine the passing game that Dinger designed for Bert with the running game that Ken's best teams had, and you have something that can move the ball effectively against most anybody short of the NFL.

The further good news about that approach is that we are recruiting athletes who can play on either side of the ball. Worst case, if a QB doesn't pan out we end up with a safety who could play for a P5.

If I were on a coach hiring committee for Rice, I'd have one question for every applicant. Assume the best you can recruit is HS stud QBs that the P5 want to move to safety, and smaller, quicker d-linemen that you can move to O if they can't play D, then how do you plan to put together an offense? I doubt that either David Bailiff or Mike Bloomgren would have had a good answer for that question.

I think Ruowls would be able to answer it very well. You take that receiving corps and turn it into an even greater strength that not only can nobody cover, but they know how to create easy throws for your QB. From there, the rest falls into place.

(09-19-2021 10:15 AM)Tomball Owl Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:12 AM)mebehutchi Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:11 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: [ -> ]Well, preseason is over. Now the games count.

TSU doesn't count unless we lose.

ESPN is giving the Owls a 98.1% chance of defeating TSU. I wondering if they watched the games vs UH and UT?

Massey projects 1 easy win (TSU 95%), and 3 toss-up games (North Texas 52%, UTEP 50%, Southern Miss 49%), with the rest being losses.

(09-19-2021 10:12 AM)mebehutchi Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:11 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: [ -> ]Well, preseason is over. Now the games count.

TSU doesn't count unless we lose.

It counts toward the six to make a bowl.

Most people were expecting us to be 0-3 in this stretch, yet now starts the mission to win 6 of the last nine - the second season.

(09-19-2021 10:32 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:12 AM)mebehutchi Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:11 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: [ -> ]Well, preseason is over. Now the games count.

TSU doesn't count unless we lose.

It counts toward the six to make a bowl.

Most people were expecting us to be 0-3 in this stretch, yet now starts the mission to win 6 of the last nine - the second season.

The back-to-back road games at UTSA and at UAB are almost certain losses. Can Rice go 6-1 in their other games?

(09-19-2021 10:35 AM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:32 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:12 AM)mebehutchi Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:11 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: [ -> ]Well, preseason is over. Now the games count.

TSU doesn't count unless we lose.

It counts toward the six to make a bowl.

Most people were expecting us to be 0-3 in this stretch, yet now starts the mission to win 6 of the last nine - the second season.

The back-to-back road games at UTSA and at UAB are almost certain losses. Can Rice go 6-1 in their other games?

At the least. With C-USA’s crappy bowl relationships, 6-6 can certainly leave us on the outside looking in.

(09-19-2021 10:35 AM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:32 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:12 AM)mebehutchi Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:11 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: [ -> ]Well, preseason is over. Now the games count.

TSU doesn't count unless we lose.

It counts toward the six to make a bowl.

Most people were expecting us to be 0-3 in this stretch, yet now starts the mission to win 6 of the last nine - the second season.

The back-to-back road games at UTSA and at UAB are almost certain losses. Can Rice go 6-1 in their other games?

That’s why they play the games.

When Rice was 1-5 in the 2006 season, I wonder what the odds were of going 6-0 and going to a bowl?

In any case, few people expected better than a 0-3 start, and many think(thought?) a bowl is(was?) possible.

Put it another way: what do you think the team goals are at this point?

I have no idea what Bloom is doing in practice or saying in the locker room, but these performances are bizarre. It reminds me of his first season when we beat PV, legit competed against Houston and Hawaii, then fell off a cliff. How do we hang with Arkansas for 3.5 quarters, then don't even show up against (relatively) mediocre UH and UT teams? It's mind-bottling.

Prior to the season I was "bowl game or bust." While a bowl game is still possible (and I pretty much expected an 0-3 start), I feel like the only way we salvage this season is by canning Bloom now, and letting the coordinators run the show. I usually don't see a point in firing a coach mid-season, but this is an exception. Maybe I'm overreacting/being fickle, and we end the season 9-3 after running the table in CUSA, but...probably not lol.

I liked the hire initially, and I have no doubt that Bloom has a football acumen and knows more about the game than I ever will. Still, I've watched his teams for 3+ seasons and it's obvious that this isn't working out.

(09-19-2021 10:45 AM)BSWBRice Wrote: [ -> ]I have no idea what Bloom is doing in practice or saying in the locker room, but these performances are bizarre. It reminds me of his first season when we beat PV, legit competed against Houston and Hawaii, then fell off a cliff. How do we hang with Arkansas for 3.5 quarters, then don't even show up against (relatively) mediocre UH and UT teams? It's mind-bottling.

Prior to the season I was "bowl game or bust." While a bowl game is still possible (and I pretty much expected an 0-3 start), I feel like the only way we salvage this season is by canning Bloom now, and letting the coordinators run the show. I usually don't see a point in firing a coach mid-season, but this is an exception. Maybe I'm overreacting/being fickle, and we end the season 9-3 after running the table in CUSA, but...probably not lol.

I liked the hire initially, and I have no doubt that Bloom has a football acumen and knows more about the game than I ever will. Still, I've watched his teams for 3+ seasons and it's obvious that this isn't working out.

I think all coaches and everybody that posts here know more about the game than I do. That’s why I go with the W’s. I don’t know or care about the intended results of putting a back in motion or a safety blitz - I only care about the actual results.

Actual results are poor.

(09-19-2021 10:20 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote: [ -> ].
If I were on a coach hiring committee for Rice, I'd have one question for every applicant. Assume the best you can recruit is HS stud QBs that the P5 want to move to safety, and smaller, quicker d-linemen that you can move to O if they can't play D, then how do you plan to put together an offense? I doubt that either David Bailiff or Mike Bloomgren would have had a good answer for that question.

The one question I would ask is - if you cannot recruit the players to fit your plan/scheme, what adjustments will you make? If they answer is “I am certain I can find the players to make my plan work” then I move on to the next person on the list.

(09-19-2021 09:57 AM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote: [ -> ]Rice took someone who, essentially, was an assistant department head, and made him the CEO. To date, he has failed to show any significant improvement, in spite of significant dollars being spent to support his efforts.

In a vacuum, this quote could either be about Dr K or Bloom.

(09-19-2021 01:11 PM)westsidewolf1989 Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 09:57 AM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote: [ -> ]Rice took someone who, essentially, was an assistant department head, and made him the CEO. To date, he has failed to show any significant improvement, in spite of significant dollars being spent to support his efforts.

In a vacuum, this quote could either be about Dr K or Bloom.

Amen.

(09-19-2021 10:45 AM)BSWBRice Wrote: [ -> ]I have no idea what Bloom is doing in practice or saying in the locker room, but these performances are bizarre. It reminds me of his first season when we beat PV, legit competed against Houston and Hawaii, then fell off a cliff. How do we hang with Arkansas for 3.5 quarters, then don't even show up against (relatively) mediocre UH and UT teams? It's mind-bottling.

Prior to the season I was "bowl game or bust." While a bowl game is still possible (and I pretty much expected an 0-3 start), I feel like the only way we salvage this season is by canning Bloom now, and letting the coordinators run the show. I usually don't see a point in firing a coach mid-season, but this is an exception. Maybe I'm overreacting/being fickle, and we end the season 9-3 after running the table in CUSA, but...probably not lol.

I liked the hire initially, and I have no doubt that Bloom has a football acumen and knows more about the game than I ever will. Still, I've watched his teams for 3+ seasons and it's obvious that this isn't working out.

I’m with you. Despite who hired him, I had high hopes for Bloomgren. I particularly like what he’s been able to do in broadening the recruiting scope. And I think defensively our coaches have shown signs of their aptitude. Special teams at one time was a strength under Lembo, although that has now gone in the toilet with a horrible kicker, getting punts blocked, etc. He seems to talk the right talk about academics and campus life, etc.

While I never really believed his Stanford offense would succeed here, I thought Bloomgren would learn from losing so much his first few years and adapt to a more modernized pro offense (look at an actual NFL offense these days and let me know if you think it looks anything like what we are running). Getting a new OC this year gave me hope. I really hoped Bloomgren would realize his shortcomings and just hand over the keys to the new OC and get out of his own way.

Instead, he seems to have doubled down. He seems just as or even more involved in the playcalling on the sideline. And we look as wannabe 2009 Stanford-ish as ever. Our offense is incredibly predictable—and predictably incredibly horrible. Lining up and plowing into the strength of the defense play after play is madness.

At this point I’m left no choice other than to decide that he’s incapable of learning and needs to go. The DC should be promoted to head coach right now, with Tuiasasopo handed the keys to the offense. Maybe then we could semi salvage this season—which right now looks like 2 or 3 wins max.

(09-19-2021 05:56 PM)RiceFootball2K5 Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:45 AM)BSWBRice Wrote: [ -> ]I have no idea what Bloom is doing in practice or saying in the locker room, but these performances are bizarre. It reminds me of his first season when we beat PV, legit competed against Houston and Hawaii, then fell off a cliff. How do we hang with Arkansas for 3.5 quarters, then don't even show up against (relatively) mediocre UH and UT teams? It's mind-bottling.

Prior to the season I was "bowl game or bust." While a bowl game is still possible (and I pretty much expected an 0-3 start), I feel like the only way we salvage this season is by canning Bloom now, and letting the coordinators run the show. I usually don't see a point in firing a coach mid-season, but this is an exception. Maybe I'm overreacting/being fickle, and we end the season 9-3 after running the table in CUSA, but...probably not lol.

I liked the hire initially, and I have no doubt that Bloom has a football acumen and knows more about the game than I ever will. Still, I've watched his teams for 3+ seasons and it's obvious that this isn't working out.

I’m with you. Despite who hired him, I had high hopes for Bloomgren. I particularly like what he’s been able to do in broadening the recruiting scope. And I think defensively our coaches have shown signs of their aptitude. Special teams at one time was a strength under Lembo, although that has now gone in the toilet with a horrible kicker, getting punts blocked, etc. He seems to talk the right talk about academics and campus life, etc.

While I never really believed his Stanford offense would succeed here, I thought Bloomgren would learn from losing so much his first few years and adapt to a more modernized pro offense (look at an actual NFL offense these days and let me know if you think it looks anything like what we are running). Getting a new OC this year gave me hope. I really hoped Bloomgren would realize his shortcomings and just hand over the keys to the new OC and get out of his own way.

Instead, he seems to have doubled down. He seems just as or even more involved in the playcalling on the sideline. And we look as wannabe 2009 Stanford-ish as ever. Our offense is incredibly predictable—and predictably incredibly horrible. Lining up and plowing into the strength of the defense play after play is madness.

At this point I’m left no choice other than to decide that he’s incapable of learning and needs to go. The DC should be promoted to head coach right now, with Tuiasasopo handed the keys to the offense. Maybe then we could semi salvage this season—which right now looks like 2 or 3 wins max.

We won’t play anyone better than Arkansas or Texas. Let us see how this all plays out. Every defense the rest of the way will look and be slower and weaker.

(09-19-2021 06:51 PM)bigowlsfan Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 05:56 PM)RiceFootball2K5 Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-19-2021 10:45 AM)BSWBRice Wrote: [ -> ]I have no idea what Bloom is doing in practice or saying in the locker room, but these performances are bizarre. It reminds me of his first season when we beat PV, legit competed against Houston and Hawaii, then fell off a cliff. How do we hang with Arkansas for 3.5 quarters, then don't even show up against (relatively) mediocre UH and UT teams? It's mind-bottling.

Prior to the season I was "bowl game or bust." While a bowl game is still possible (and I pretty much expected an 0-3 start), I feel like the only way we salvage this season is by canning Bloom now, and letting the coordinators run the show. I usually don't see a point in firing a coach mid-season, but this is an exception. Maybe I'm overreacting/being fickle, and we end the season 9-3 after running the table in CUSA, but...probably not lol.

I liked the hire initially, and I have no doubt that Bloom has a football acumen and knows more about the game than I ever will. Still, I've watched his teams for 3+ seasons and it's obvious that this isn't working out.

I’m with you. Despite who hired him, I had high hopes for Bloomgren. I particularly like what he’s been able to do in broadening the recruiting scope. And I think defensively our coaches have shown signs of their aptitude. Special teams at one time was a strength under Lembo, although that has now gone in the toilet with a horrible kicker, getting punts blocked, etc. He seems to talk the right talk about academics and campus life, etc.

While I never really believed his Stanford offense would succeed here, I thought Bloomgren would learn from losing so much his first few years and adapt to a more modernized pro offense (look at an actual NFL offense these days and let me know if you think it looks anything like what we are running). Getting a new OC this year gave me hope. I really hoped Bloomgren would realize his shortcomings and just hand over the keys to the new OC and get out of his own way.

Instead, he seems to have doubled down. He seems just as or even more involved in the playcalling on the sideline. And we look as wannabe 2009 Stanford-ish as ever. Our offense is incredibly predictable—and predictably incredibly horrible. Lining up and plowing into the strength of the defense play after play is madness.

At this point I’m left no choice other than to decide that he’s incapable of learning and needs to go. The DC should be promoted to head coach right now, with Tuiasasopo handed the keys to the offense. Maybe then we could semi salvage this season—which right now looks like 2 or 3 wins max.

We won’t play anyone better than Arkansas or Texas. Let us see how this all plays out. Every defense the rest of the way will look and be slower and weaker.

I’m worried we’ll claim improvement when we beat awful teams like TSU and USM.