CSNbbs

(05-03-2018 10:25 AM)Barrett Wrote: [ -> ](though I, like most here, agree that it's time to have a new coach).

I agree.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzTeLePbB08

(05-03-2018 02:16 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 10:25 AM)Barrett Wrote: [ -> ](though I, like most here, agree that it's time to have a new coach).

I agree.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzTeLePbB08

Do you think our on field performance has been acceptable the last 2 years?

(05-03-2018 03:12 PM)cr11owl Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 02:16 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 10:25 AM)Barrett Wrote: [ -> ](though I, like most here, agree that it's time to have a new coach).

I agree.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzTeLePbB08

Do you think our on field performance has been acceptable the last 2 years?

last year we won our 21st conference title, 16 of 20 silver gloves, and extended the post-season run to 23 years - third among active colleges behind cal-state Fullerton and Florida state and second among active coaches out of some 300 competing d1 programs....we finished second to the eventual national runners-up - LSU - at their field....yeah, I think it acceptable, especially considering everyone else but our coaching staff had given up on this team and tried and continues to try to undermine this program for the last several years....yeah, totally acceptable.

as stated by a former player....any other rice coach doing less should be removed...where does that leave rice athletics?

Losing badly to any team with a pulse but somehow putting 6 wins together against teams ranked 100+ had been considered 'unprecedented success' in other sports

I disagree with but understand those who think it's time to move on... Given what has transpired, I really don't think at this point there is any other course of action (not saying there isn't, but I find it hard to imagine how it plays out well)... but that is part of my frustration, that I feel that we've MADE this happen

If it's Lance, then I don't see why we couldn't have announced it sooner.... and if it's not and we're going to seriously test the waters, I don't see how doing this in 2019 would have been much different from doing it in 2017, other than the fact that we'd be honoring the request of a coach who deserves it

but I'm really done with this

(05-03-2018 03:19 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]as stated by a former player....any other rice coach doing less should be removed...where does that leave rice athletics?

Citing bad decisions and big problems to justify smaller ones isnt a viable strategy to success.. or really anything.

I'd be perfectly fine with removing any Rice coach doing less. I routinely advocate for such.

Coaching is a what have you done for me lately profession. It's one of the reasons Coaches get paid so well

Quote:Losing badly to any team with a pulse but somehow putting 6 wins together against teams ranked 100+ had been considered 'unprecedented success' in other sports

I argued that it was stupid back then and I'll argue that it is stupid now. But just because we were foolish then, doesnt justify bad decisions now.

(05-03-2018 03:42 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:19 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]as stated by a former player....any other rice coach doing less should be removed...where does that leave rice athletics?

Citing bad decisions and big problems to justify smaller ones isnt a viable strategy to success.. or really anything.

I'd be perfectly fine with removing any Rice coach doing less. I routinely advocate for such.

Coaching is a what have you done for me lately profession. It's one of the reasons Coaches get paid so well

Quote:Losing badly to any team with a pulse but somehow putting 6 wins together against teams ranked 100+ had been considered 'unprecedented success' in other sports

I argued that it was stupid back then and I'll argue that it is stupid now. But just because we were foolish then, doesnt justify bad decisions now.

"It's one of the reasons Coaches get paid so well"

seriously? I can speak for one coach who has not been remotely paid what his peers were/are and that he has been expected to beat....seriously? Fortunately, the one coach I can speak for is not driven by money or he would have been out of here years ago.

I repeat:

last year we won our 21st conference title, 16 of 20 silver gloves, and extended the post-season run to 23 years - third among active colleges behind cal-state Fullerton and Florida state and second among active coaches out of some 300 competing d1 programs....we finished second to the eventual national runners-up - LSU - at their field....yeah, I think it acceptable, especially considering everyone else but our coaching staff had given up on this team and tried and continues to try to undermine this program for the last several years....yeah, totally acceptable.

as stated by a former player....any other rice coach doing less should be removed...where does that leave rice athletics?

(05-03-2018 03:47 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:42 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:19 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]as stated by a former player....any other rice coach doing less should be removed...where does that leave rice athletics?

Citing bad decisions and big problems to justify smaller ones isnt a viable strategy to success.. or really anything.

I'd be perfectly fine with removing any Rice coach doing less. I routinely advocate for such.

Coaching is a what have you done for me lately profession. It's one of the reasons Coaches get paid so well

Quote:Losing badly to any team with a pulse but somehow putting 6 wins together against teams ranked 100+ had been considered 'unprecedented success' in other sports

I argued that it was stupid back then and I'll argue that it is stupid now. But just because we were foolish then, doesnt justify bad decisions now.

"It's one of the reasons Coaches get paid so well"

seriously? I can speak for one coach who has not been remotely paid what his peers were/are and that he has been expected to beat....seriously? Fortunately, the one coach I can speak for is not driven by money or he would have been out of here years ago.

That's a decision between that coach and his employer. Point is the market is well paying. And even below market value as you mention is far more than nearly any profession elsewhere.

That's a fact. You may not like it but it's the nature of the industry. If said coach felt he was underpaid, then choosing to remain is a decision of that individual. No matter what Citizens United says, corporations and organizations are not people and do not act as such.

(05-03-2018 03:51 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]I repeat:

last year we won our 21st conference title, 16 of 20 silver gloves, and extended the post-season run to 23 years - third among active colleges behind cal-state Fullerton and Florida state and second among active coaches out of some 300 competing d1 programs....we finished second to the eventual national runners-up - LSU - at their field....yeah, I think it acceptable, especially considering everyone else but our coaching staff had given up on this team and tried and continues to try to undermine this program for the last several years....yeah, totally acceptable.

as stated by a former player....any other rice coach doing less should be removed...where does that leave rice athletics?

We finished 8th? in CUSA last year.... if we somehow make the tournament and win 4 games in a row this year for a repeat I would still consider our level of play subpar. We’ve made so many mental mistake this year I can’t even watch a full game.

Can’t speak for what happened in terms of pay 15 years ago but Coach Graham receives far more compensation than those who have outperformed him in recent years (Scott Berry, Greg Goff/Lane Burroughs) and that is public information from Rice’s tax documents.

(05-03-2018 03:52 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:47 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:42 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:19 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]as stated by a former player....any other rice coach doing less should be removed...where does that leave rice athletics?

Citing bad decisions and big problems to justify smaller ones isnt a viable strategy to success.. or really anything.

I'd be perfectly fine with removing any Rice coach doing less. I routinely advocate for such.

Coaching is a what have you done for me lately profession. It's one of the reasons Coaches get paid so well

Quote:Losing badly to any team with a pulse but somehow putting 6 wins together against teams ranked 100+ had been considered 'unprecedented success' in other sports

I argued that it was stupid back then and I'll argue that it is stupid now. But just because we were foolish then, doesnt justify bad decisions now.

"It's one of the reasons Coaches get paid so well"

seriously? I can speak for one coach who has not been remotely paid what his peers were/are and that he has been expected to beat....seriously? Fortunately, the one coach I can speak for is not driven by money or he would have been out of here years ago.

That's a decision between that coach and his employer. Point is the market is well paying. And even below market value as you mention is far more than nearly any profession elsewhere.

That's a fact. You may not like it but it's the nature of the industry. If said coach felt he was underpaid, then choosing to remain is a decision of that individual. No matter what Citizens United says, corporations and organizations are not people and do not act as such.

you are symbolic of what's wrong with Rice athletics currently...
good luck the rest of the way....

(05-03-2018 03:56 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote: [ -> ]Can’t speak for what happened in terms of pay 15 years ago but Coach Graham receives far more compensation than those who have outperformed him in recent years (Scott Berry, Greg Goff/Lane Burroughs) and that is public information from Rice’s tax documents.

bull****....I have the statements....and good grief they are all coaches at state institutions with lax admission standards and lower price tags meaning a much larger recruiting pool...are you kidding me? that's the best the you got?

(05-03-2018 03:57 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:52 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:47 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:42 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:19 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]as stated by a former player....any other rice coach doing less should be removed...where does that leave rice athletics?

Citing bad decisions and big problems to justify smaller ones isnt a viable strategy to success.. or really anything.

I'd be perfectly fine with removing any Rice coach doing less. I routinely advocate for such.

Coaching is a what have you done for me lately profession. It's one of the reasons Coaches get paid so well

Quote:Losing badly to any team with a pulse but somehow putting 6 wins together against teams ranked 100+ had been considered 'unprecedented success' in other sports

I argued that it was stupid back then and I'll argue that it is stupid now. But just because we were foolish then, doesnt justify bad decisions now.

"It's one of the reasons Coaches get paid so well"

seriously? I can speak for one coach who has not been remotely paid what his peers were/are and that he has been expected to beat....seriously? Fortunately, the one coach I can speak for is not driven by money or he would have been out of here years ago.

That's a decision between that coach and his employer. Point is the market is well paying. And even below market value as you mention is far more than nearly any profession elsewhere.

That's a fact. You may not like it but it's the nature of the industry. If said coach felt he was underpaid, then choosing to remain is a decision of that individual. No matter what Citizens United says, corporations and organizations are not people and do not act as such.

you are symbolic of what's wrong with Rice athletics
good luck the rest of the way....

Oh I am? Ahahahhahaha.

Guess wanting us to not be the idiot department in the whole country makes me the problem now?

(05-03-2018 03:55 PM)cr11owl Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:51 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]I repeat:

last year we won our 21st conference title, 16 of 20 silver gloves, and extended the post-season run to 23 years - third among active colleges behind cal-state Fullerton and Florida state and second among active coaches out of some 300 competing d1 programs....we finished second to the eventual national runners-up - LSU - at their field....yeah, I think it acceptable, especially considering everyone else but our coaching staff had given up on this team and tried and continues to try to undermine this program for the last several years....yeah, totally acceptable.

as stated by a former player....any other rice coach doing less should be removed...where does that leave rice athletics?

We finished 8th? in CUSA last year.... if we somehow make the tournament and win 4 games in a row this year for a repeat I would still consider our level of play subpar. We’ve made so many mental mistake this year I can’t even watch a full game.

We won the tournament last year...our 21st conference title...we extended our post-season run for the 23rd year - 3rd longest run behind CalState Fullerton and Florida State...2nd longest run for a active coach...We finished second to LSU, at LSU, who finished second in the college World Series. If you can't watch a full game, don't. You want to downplay what our team did last year, I won't allow it any longer.

(05-03-2018 04:00 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:57 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:52 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:47 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:42 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]Citing bad decisions and big problems to justify smaller ones isnt a viable strategy to success.. or really anything.

I'd be perfectly fine with removing any Rice coach doing less. I routinely advocate for such.

Coaching is a what have you done for me lately profession. It's one of the reasons Coaches get paid so well


I argued that it was stupid back then and I'll argue that it is stupid now. But just because we were foolish then, doesnt justify bad decisions now.

"It's one of the reasons Coaches get paid so well"

seriously? I can speak for one coach who has not been remotely paid what his peers were/are and that he has been expected to beat....seriously? Fortunately, the one coach I can speak for is not driven by money or he would have been out of here years ago.

That's a decision between that coach and his employer. Point is the market is well paying. And even below market value as you mention is far more than nearly any profession elsewhere.

That's a fact. You may not like it but it's the nature of the industry. If said coach felt he was underpaid, then choosing to remain is a decision of that individual. No matter what Citizens United says, corporations and organizations are not people and do not act as such.

you are symbolic of what's wrong with Rice athletics
good luck the rest of the way....

Oh I am? Ahahahhahaha.

Guess wanting us to not be the idiot department in the whole country makes me the problem now?

you've been a symptom of the problem for a long time....good-bye

(05-03-2018 04:06 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 04:00 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:57 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:52 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:47 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]"It's one of the reasons Coaches get paid so well"

seriously? I can speak for one coach who has not been remotely paid what his peers were/are and that he has been expected to beat....seriously? Fortunately, the one coach I can speak for is not driven by money or he would have been out of here years ago.

That's a decision between that coach and his employer. Point is the market is well paying. And even below market value as you mention is far more than nearly any profession elsewhere.

That's a fact. You may not like it but it's the nature of the industry. If said coach felt he was underpaid, then choosing to remain is a decision of that individual. No matter what Citizens United says, corporations and organizations are not people and do not act as such.

you are symbolic of what's wrong with Rice athletics
good luck the rest of the way....

Oh I am? Ahahahhahaha.

Guess wanting us to not be the idiot department in the whole country makes me the problem now?

you've been a symptom of the problem for a long time....good-bye

I'll still be here next year. Good bye or not. Your move.

(05-03-2018 04:07 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 04:06 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 04:00 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:57 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:52 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]That's a decision between that coach and his employer. Point is the market is well paying. And even below market value as you mention is far more than nearly any profession elsewhere.

That's a fact. You may not like it but it's the nature of the industry. If said coach felt he was underpaid, then choosing to remain is a decision of that individual. No matter what Citizens United says, corporations and organizations are not people and do not act as such.

you are symbolic of what's wrong with Rice athletics
good luck the rest of the way....

Oh I am? Ahahahhahaha.

Guess wanting us to not be the idiot department in the whole country makes me the problem now?

you've been a symptom of the problem for a long time....good-bye

I'll still be here next year. Good bye or not. Your move.

we obviously won't and you're on ignore...get your rocks off elsewhere

(05-03-2018 03:42 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]I argued that it was stupid back then and I'll argue that it is stupid now. But just because we were foolish then, doesnt justify bad decisions now.

No. What justifies it is the 20+ years of loyalty and ACTUAL unprecedented success. I understand that bad decisions in the past don't justify them today... I'm simply wondering why the time for us to change our ways is with a man whom most would consider the greatest coach in the history of the University

This COULD have been the exception, and IMO, SHOULD have been.

(05-03-2018 03:56 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote: [ -> ]Can’t speak for what happened in terms of pay 15 years ago but Coach Graham receives far more compensation than those who have outperformed him in recent years (Scott Berry, Greg Goff/Lane Burroughs) and that is public information from Rice’s tax documents.

Isn't that a bit like the aging, but still 'all-pro' guy who restructures his deal to accommodate another star making him grossly underpaid early on, and then arguably grossly overpaid later... and a new guy coming in and acting like the restructuring never took place and the guy is simply overpaid 'now'?

UT and other 'big boy' programs have long strings of coaches who are more overpaid than Wayne because they're being paid NOT to coach. We took advantage of just such a situation when we hired Braun.

(05-03-2018 04:11 PM)skycatcher Wrote: [ -> ]we obviously won't and you're on ignore...get your rocks off elsewhere

For someone who has claimed to ignore or block me like 5 times across multiple accounts, its amazing you still make it a point to come here and be nasty to fans like me.

But hey, whatever legacy you want to leave behind.

(05-03-2018 04:11 PM)Hambone10 Wrote: [ -> ]

(05-03-2018 03:42 PM)Antarius Wrote: [ -> ]I argued that it was stupid back then and I'll argue that it is stupid now. But just because we were foolish then, doesnt justify bad decisions now.

No. What justifies it is the 20+ years of loyalty and ACTUAL unprecedented success. I understand that bad decisions in the past don't justify them today... I'm simply wondering why the time for us to change our ways is with a man whom most would consider the greatest coach in the history of the University

This COULD have been the exception, and IMO, SHOULD have been.

Probably because this is one of those chances where we didn't have a 25(0) with enough money to block the right decision. Bailiff should have been gone long before, but it took an act of congress to make that happen. Maybe that congress isn't there in this case.

What would you do? Wait it out? Till when? Graham is on record saying he wants to coach for several more years... so we keep going?