I think GT is a great school but I don’t see P2 value. They are solidly part of the M2.

(03-19-2024 03:41 PM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 03:30 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I think GT adds very little value (no offense to our illustrious web host). I’d put the ratio of UGA fans to GT fans within the state around 4:1.

They don’t give the SEC anything they don’t already have and they don’t give the Big 10 enough of the state to make the move justifiable.

4 to 1?

You ever been south of the Ohio River?

I'd say 20-1 would be more like it (although Tech's fan base would gradually increase if the Jackets returned to the SEC and at least held their own for a few years)

GT is a diaspora like WVU. Metropolitan Atlanta only needs so many nuclear engineers. The explosion of enrollment at the distance learning center and satellite campuses only exaggerates that. If you're looking for a thick large area of GT fans you won't find it. But you will find a constant surprisingly high number anywhere engineering, manufacturing, and IT is going on. Greenville, Spartanburg, Raleigh, Nashville, Denver, Chicago, the Bay Area, LA, Indianapolis, DC, Charleston. Like WV fans you see them in all kinds of places that aren't the home state.

I will say much of the shade comes from the Geoff Collins historic error. It wasn't that long ago GT was winning NY6 games, beating Dabo, beating UGA, and finishing Top 10.

GT's enrollment is now larger than UGA's. Future employment and education delivery trends will only enhance that.

If you want to see GT at its ceiling, go back to the Homer Rice days. That is what alignment between the GTAA and The Hill and strong leadership at President and AD looks like. Since Homer Rice left, GT has only checked one of those boxes, usually President being the most glaring deficiency. They have the right President. They seem to have the right AD now. And the current $2b GT capital campaign is a holding hands walking together between GT and the GTAA: it will fully endow all athletic scholarships. That is a game changer for the ledger at the GTAA. Plans for Bobby Dodd Stadium in the upcoming campus master plan as well.

GT has a much higher fan base ceiling than most realize. I still remember when the Citrus Bowl was gold with just a sliver of Husker red. Reunited in SEC/SOCON2.0, GT fans may even go back to buying sections of tickets on Jordan Hare to cheer Auburn against Georgia. :)

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(03-19-2024 02:57 PM)goofus Wrote:  Well, we saw what happened to Cal and Stanford, who we all thought were slam dunks for P2 memberships 10 years ago. Actually I take that back. Nobody was talking about P2 10 years ago.

But that does not mean GT is not valued. It still has a lot of things going for it.

#33 national academic ranking in US News
#2 university in a large growing southern state and also located in a large metro TV market.
Long history of FBS football with average attendence of 43k

That should be enough for the Big 12 if the ACC ever collapses. Just not good enough for the P2.

Yeah, all of their benefits have nothing to do with athletics.

(03-19-2024 04:34 PM)otown Wrote:  GT is a shoe in to the Big 12 if the P2 don't pick them up. The only hang up will be whether to prefer to stay in a rump ACC and enrich themselves in exits fees/GOR settlements or not.

Why on earth would the Big 12 add Georgia Tech before Cal or Stanford?

Stanford would be a significantly better option that Georgia Tech.

Big 12 is their new pie in the sky.

(03-19-2024 06:59 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 04:34 PM)otown Wrote:  GT is a shoe in to the Big 12 if the P2 don't pick them up. The only hang up will be whether to prefer to stay in a rump ACC and enrich themselves in exits fees/GOR settlements or not.

Why on earth would the Big 12 add Georgia Tech before Cal or Stanford?

Stanford would be a significantly better option that Georgia Tech.

Location location and location…

(03-19-2024 06:59 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 04:34 PM)otown Wrote:  GT is a shoe in to the Big 12 if the P2 don't pick them up. The only hang up will be whether to prefer to stay in a rump ACC and enrich themselves in exits fees/GOR settlements or not.

Why on earth would the Big 12 add Georgia Tech before Cal or Stanford?

Stanford would be a significantly better option that Georgia Tech.

Not at all - if the Big 12 has to pick one for some reason it would be GT. SF isn’t prized by the B12

(03-19-2024 04:33 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  What get's over looked is when the ACC split into divisions, by doing so the ACC split up FSU and GT. Those games were great, they were close and had some spectacular endings, the games sold out and were often on prime time.

Absolutely, one more thing the ACC screwed up. Took away our nearest geographic rival in the conference and one of the few ACC schools that could provide an annual "meaningful game" in conference to go along with Clemson and Miami.

(03-19-2024 07:59 PM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 04:33 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  What get's over looked is when the ACC split into divisions, by doing so the ACC split up FSU and GT. Those games were great, they were close and had some spectacular endings, the games sold out and were often on prime time.

Absolutely, one more thing the ACC screwed up. Took away our nearest geographic rival in the conference and one of the few ACC schools that could provide an annual "meaningful game" in conference to go along with Clemson and Miami.

A divisional split like this would have looked much better and satisfied UMd as well:

FSU - Miami
Clem - UMd
GT - UVA
Wake - Duke
NCSU - UNC
BC - VT

The one minor problem was that GT vs Duke was sort of a thing. I don't know if this was insisted on keeping or if there was another factor in play. It was one of several stupid things the ACC should have done differently.

(03-19-2024 02:39 PM)BraveKnight Wrote:  Even a few years ago, it seemed like Georgia Tech would be a candidate for the B10 if anything happened. Now it doesn’t even seem like the B12 would want them in an ACC collapse scenario. The question is, what is Georgia Tech’s current value to any power conference? How has it declined over the years if at all?

IMO, if the ACC collapses, GT will be reduced to coming hat-in-hand to the nB12, maybe making a call on UCF's athletics department, hoping and begging for an invitation.

And because IIRC Georgia Tech did schedule games with you guys when you were G5 and needed the help, you might look kindly on them and say something nice about them in an nB12 meeting.

But I don't think they have any value to the P2 at all.

Just MO.

They’ll form a magnolia league

(03-19-2024 07:21 PM)RUScarlets Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 06:59 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 04:34 PM)otown Wrote:  GT is a shoe in to the Big 12 if the P2 don't pick them up. The only hang up will be whether to prefer to stay in a rump ACC and enrich themselves in exits fees/GOR settlements or not.

Why on earth would the Big 12 add Georgia Tech before Cal or Stanford?

Stanford would be a significantly better option that Georgia Tech.

Location location and location…

As someone who visits Atlanta at least once every two months. You would not even know Georgia Tech was in Atlanta unless you accidently stumbled upon the campus. Georgia Tech alums aren't even Georgia Tech fans for the most part.

FYI, I have another post where I predict them getting in over Stanford but I think Stanford is a better addition. the SF Bay even with it's little support of college football yields more than Atlanta which is dominated by UGA. On top of that Stanford despite how much I give them **** is an amazing school and athletic program.

(03-19-2024 06:16 PM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 04:29 PM)BraveKnight Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 03:58 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 02:39 PM)BraveKnight Wrote:  Even a few years ago, it seemed like Georgia Tech would be a candidate for the B10 if anything happened. Now it doesn’t even seem like the B12 would want them in an ACC collapse scenario. The question is, what is Georgia Tech’s current value to any power conference? How has it declined over the years if at all?

GT brings enough for the Big 12 to add them.

- great geography, adds an entire region and slots in nicely with UCF, WVU and Cincy
- easy travel, ala SMU in the ACC, due to Atlanta's hub status
- long history of football enthusiasm and success
- more elite Academics, further solidifying a weakness of the league

Football attendance has been lackluster the past few years, but that's likely due to a poor on-field product and an ascendant UGA rather than a long term lack of enthusiasm among fans.

GT would get measured against the rest of the ACC that don't go to the P2. Would they make the top 4 of that group? Would the Yormarks take 6 or even 8 from the ACC? I'm not sure, but they might, and if GT is in the 6-8 range I think that the networks would happily pay for the move. It's also possible that they decide that they'd rather remain with Calford, Duke, WF, etc etc than join a Truck Stop Convention. They've already made that choice once when they left the SEC, they might make it again by NOT leaving the ACC.

So...um, GT is in limbo right now, and they'll continue to be in limbo for years. Once all of the P2 moves become clear, they'll start to get more clarity on their next destination.

But is the B12 going to take more than 4 schools? I’d imagine they’d just take NC State, Virginia Tech, Louisville, and Pitt at this point. I’d say Georgia Tech is probably lumped in with Duke in the B12’s priority list at this point, from what I’ve seen.

I would prefer Georgia Tech or Syracuse over Pitt.

They're roughly equal as football programs. All three schools face the challenge of severe fan apathy for their formerly great football programs.

But Syracuse brings an elite basketball program and Georgia Tech brings the #1 or #2 recruiting region in the country. Also, as pretty as Pittsburgh is, Pitt brings the worst market of the three.

Further, Pitt's campus is landlocked and its student population has been maxed out at a pretty low level for a public school (under 30k) for a long, long time.

If , the SEC & the B1G merge as has been talked about for awhile, the B1G could access Atlanta through UGA. That would then make the market point for GT meaningless, IMO. Piitsburgh actually does bring something to the table for the B1G: an all-sports rivalry with PSU.

GT has value to be sure. In 2012, the GT president turned down an invite in hand to the Big Ten. It was likely the second dumbest decision in GT Athletics history.
Number 1 was leaving the SEC
Number 3 was financing a stadium expansion with zero funding in place and not paying down any principal for 20 plus years.

GT is not going to waste money on lawsuits and will seek to return to competitiveness in the ACC for as long as the conference is afloat. Who knows what College football is in 3036. I imagine Clemson's and FSU's lawsuits are more donor rallying symbols than anything else. The arguments don't really stand up to legal muster.

I think GT will find a way to remain at the top of the sport. They are one of the few that can say they have survived worse.

(03-19-2024 07:24 PM)Section 200 Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 06:59 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 04:34 PM)otown Wrote:  GT is a shoe in to the Big 12 if the P2 don't pick them up. The only hang up will be whether to prefer to stay in a rump ACC and enrich themselves in exits fees/GOR settlements or not.

Why on earth would the Big 12 add Georgia Tech before Cal or Stanford?

Stanford would be a significantly better option that Georgia Tech.

Not at all - if the Big 12 has to pick one for some reason it would be GT. SF isn’t prized by the B12

The B12 would take Stanford or a significant chunk of the B12 would join the ACC.

I still say turning the B1G down without any Southern partner was wise. The nearest road game is Bloomington, IN. That's not good for the long term health of the fan base. Give GT someone, anyone, closer as a partner. The more the better.

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(03-19-2024 07:59 PM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 04:33 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  What get's over looked is when the ACC split into divisions, by doing so the ACC split up FSU and GT. Those games were great, they were close and had some spectacular endings, the games sold out and were often on prime time.

Absolutely, one more thing the ACC screwed up. Took away our nearest geographic rival in the conference and one of the few ACC schools that could provide an annual "meaningful game" in conference to go along with Clemson and Miami.

Right. Like how the FSU brass went out of their way to request Syracuse as a yearly game?

They just wanted to play Clemson more than y’all. Get over it.

(03-19-2024 07:20 PM)RUScarlets Wrote:  Big 12 is their new pie in the sky.

Riiiiiggt and Central Florida their new rival

(03-20-2024 03:40 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 07:59 PM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 04:33 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  What get's over looked is when the ACC split into divisions, by doing so the ACC split up FSU and GT. Those games were great, they were close and had some spectacular endings, the games sold out and were often on prime time.

Absolutely, one more thing the ACC screwed up. Took away our nearest geographic rival in the conference and one of the few ACC schools that could provide an annual "meaningful game" in conference to go along with Clemson and Miami.

Right. Like how the FSU brass went out of their way to request Syracuse as a yearly game?

They just wanted to play Clemson more than y’all. Get over it.

Why couldn't GT play both Clemson & FSU more??

(03-20-2024 04:21 PM)DawgNBama Wrote:  

(03-20-2024 03:40 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 07:59 PM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(03-19-2024 04:33 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  What get's over looked is when the ACC split into divisions, by doing so the ACC split up FSU and GT. Those games were great, they were close and had some spectacular endings, the games sold out and were often on prime time.

Absolutely, one more thing the ACC screwed up. Took away our nearest geographic rival in the conference and one of the few ACC schools that could provide an annual "meaningful game" in conference to go along with Clemson and Miami.

Right. Like how the FSU brass went out of their way to request Syracuse as a yearly game?

They just wanted to play Clemson more than y’all. Get over it.

Why couldn't GT play both Clemson & FSU more??

Could have if GT was in the Atlantic division. The AD at FSU was very complimentary of SU, I thought the annual game was "solid".