Looks like there are confirmed discussions of an ACC pac12 merger. Most interesting there was discussion of trimming the fat...

https://www.si.com/college/2022/09/22/un...ealignment

(09-23-2022 09:47 AM)LeeNobody Wrote:  Looks like there are confirmed discussions of an ACC pac12 merger. Most interesting there was discussion of trimming the fat...

https://www.si.com/college/2022/09/22/un...ealignment

Sounds like NC is more interested in increasing the ACC media payout than the idea of an SEC invite...

Interesting that this would come from a school who everyone assumes is a lock for the SEC or B1G....

(09-23-2022 09:50 AM)Skyhawk Wrote:  

(09-23-2022 09:47 AM)LeeNobody Wrote:  Looks like there are confirmed discussions of an ACC pac12 merger. Most interesting there was discussion of trimming the fat...

https://www.si.com/college/2022/09/22/un...ealignment

Sounds like NC is more interested in increasing the ACC media payout than the idea of an SEC invite...

I don't get that sense from this article, IMO if the possibility exists that some ACC teams would be left out then ESPN brokering a deal that puts the most valuable schools in the SEC while leaving the left overs stronger is viable

(09-23-2022 09:47 AM)LeeNobody Wrote:  Looks like there are confirmed discussions of an ACC pac12 merger. Most interesting there was discussion of trimming the fat...

https://www.si.com/college/2022/09/22/un...ealignment

Pac 12 or Big 12 while implying it could be a new conference with elements from all 3.

"“...Should we explore a partnership with the Big 12 or Pac 12[?]” UNC athletic director Bubba Cunningham texted university chancellor Kevin Guskiewicz.

“We could have a super conference both athletically and academically,” Guskiewicz responded. “Probably would need to be called the Atlantic-Pacific Athletic Conference (APAC). Maybe that’s crazy, but if it would get us a better TV deal, it may be worth considering,” he continued.

“We need to think about what outcomes we want? What are our priorities? Do we want to maintain all teams in the ACC? Is this a new league?..."

(09-23-2022 09:50 AM)Skyhawk Wrote:  

(09-23-2022 09:47 AM)LeeNobody Wrote:  Looks like there are confirmed discussions of an ACC pac12 merger. Most interesting there was discussion of trimming the fat...

https://www.si.com/college/2022/09/22/un...ealignment

Sounds like NC is more interested in increasing the ACC media payout than the idea of an SEC invite...

One can be done now, the other can't.

I actually don't think that the ACC taking Pac-12 schools is crazy at all (e.g. if the Big Ten expanded with more Pac-12 schools, think of if the Four Corners schools plus, say, Kansas and TCU went to a new 20-team ACC).

However, in reading the actual Raleigh News & Observer article that's linked in that SI post, the thread title isn't accurate. The article stated that the ACC kicked around the idea of a partnership between the Pac-12 OR Big 12.

I also find it interesting in terms of the tone of the report referring to UNC-ND (happening this weekend) being a potential Big Ten conference game in the future and pointing to how UNC fits the institutional profile of the Big Ten. Nothing about whether the UNC would want to join the SEC (not even a throwaway speculative reference such as "Maybe UNC eventually needs to decide to be in one of the two powers of the Big Ten or SEC"). I'm not saying that the report is saying that UNC *wants* to join the Big Ten, but it's just an interesting tone considering that this whole story is being based on the text messages via FOIA and a separate direct interview with the UNC AD.

North! South! Coasts!

(09-23-2022 10:08 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  I actually don't think that the ACC taking Pac-12 schools is crazy at all (e.g. if the Big Ten expanded with more Pac-12 schools, think of if the Four Corners schools plus, say, Kansas and TCU went to a new 20-team ACC).

However, in reading the actual Raleigh News & Observer article that's linked in that SI post, the thread title isn't accurate. The article stated that the ACC kicked around the idea of a partnership between the Pac-12 OR Big 12.

I also find it interesting in terms of the tone of the report referring to UNC-ND (happening this weekend) being a potential Big Ten conference game in the future and pointing to how UNC fits the institutional profile of the Big Ten. Nothing about whether the UNC would want to join the SEC (not even a throwaway speculative reference). I'm not saying that the report is saying that UNC *wants* to join the Big Ten, but it's just an interesting tone considering that this whole story is being based on the text messages via FOIA and a separate direct interview with the UNC AD.

Well there is that pesky thing called contracts. Why would ESPN tear up a good deal? I just don't see any way ESPN opens up the ACC contract and gives enough of a raise to justify someone like California to travel across the country to play softball. There is nothing the least bit logical about that. With a USC? Well that is a different matter. But 6 of the Pac 10 are commodities, 2 are a little less than commodities and Oregon and Washington aren't that much better than commodities.

(09-23-2022 09:47 AM)LeeNobody Wrote:  Looks like there are confirmed discussions of an ACC pac12 merger. Most interesting there was discussion of trimming the fat...

https://www.si.com/college/2022/09/22/un...ealignment

The comments from the AD make sense, media payouts are definitely a priority. Some form of merger with the PAC (or B12) addresses the hurdle of opening TV negotiations.

The Chancellor’s suggestion about identifying programs/partners from within the ACC would not work given the GOR. For the next 14 years, all ACC programs are included in all ventures.

You drop the dead weights:

East: UNC NCSU Duke/Miami UVa Clemson FSU VaTech GaTech
West: PAC 10 minus OSU/WSU (MWC)

Big 12 adds UL Pitt

WF Duke/Miami BC Cuse join AAC

(09-23-2022 10:15 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-23-2022 10:08 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  I actually don't think that the ACC taking Pac-12 schools is crazy at all (e.g. if the Big Ten expanded with more Pac-12 schools, think of if the Four Corners schools plus, say, Kansas and TCU went to a new 20-team ACC).

However, in reading the actual Raleigh News & Observer article that's linked in that SI post, the thread title isn't accurate. The article stated that the ACC kicked around the idea of a partnership between the Pac-12 OR Big 12.

I also find it interesting in terms of the tone of the report referring to UNC-ND (happening this weekend) being a potential Big Ten conference game in the future and pointing to how UNC fits the institutional profile of the Big Ten. Nothing about whether the UNC would want to join the SEC (not even a throwaway speculative reference). I'm not saying that the report is saying that UNC *wants* to join the Big Ten, but it's just an interesting tone considering that this whole story is being based on the text messages via FOIA and a separate direct interview with the UNC AD.

Well there is that pesky thing called contracts. Why would ESPN tear up a good deal? I just don't see any way ESPN opens up the ACC contract and gives enough of a raise to justify someone like California to travel across the country to play softball. There is nothing the least bit logical about that. With a USC? Well that is a different matter. But 6 of the Pac 10 are commodities, 2 are a little less than commodities and Oregon and Washington aren't that much better than commodities.

Of course - it has to make more revenue. Maybe it adds value to the ACC Network... or maybe it doesn't.

Now, believe it or not with me saying this considering the debates on this forum lately, it's actually a situation where the "P3" vision of JRsec could come to fruition in some form. Granted, it would NOT be in the form of ACC schools moving anywhere, but rather the most valuable schools left in the Big 12 and Pac-12 joining the ACC. There aren't any significant legal restrictions on the ACC adding Big 12 and/or Pac-12 schools to the league (unlike the ACC GOR holding ACC schools back from defecting to the Big Ten or SEC) - it's truly all based on economics alone.

To be sure, I agree that all of the economics have to work. Any expansion has to be worth it to the league in and of itself for its own media deals - it can't be based on a hypothetical increase in CFP money (as everyone is going to be getting that if they just stay as-is).

Not surprising that UNC's first choice would be to maintain their fiefdom in the ACC in some fashion, as they basically run it with the aid of UVA and Duke. UNC, like Texas, prefers being the big fish in a small pond. But the powers that be in Chapel Hill aren't stupid and like Texas, they will eject if that pond continues to dry up and shrink compared to the big lakes stocked with massive predators in the B1G and SEC.

(09-23-2022 10:20 AM)RUScarlets Wrote:  You drop the dead weights:

East: UNC NCSU Duke/Miami UVa Clemson FSU VaTech GaTech
West: PAC 10 minus OSU/WSU (MWC)

Big 12 adds UL Pitt

WF Duke/Miami BC Cuse join AAC

Rutgers will be renewing its heated rivalries with Princeton and Colgate before the Canes and the Dookies end up in Conference Aresco

(09-23-2022 09:50 AM)Skyhawk Wrote:  

(09-23-2022 09:47 AM)LeeNobody Wrote:  Looks like there are confirmed discussions of an ACC pac12 merger. Most interesting there was discussion of trimming the fat...

https://www.si.com/college/2022/09/22/un...ealignment

Sounds like NC is more interested in increasing the ACC media payout than the idea of an SEC invite...

Under the SEC your bottom of the pecking order and have less influence

(09-23-2022 10:32 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(09-23-2022 10:20 AM)RUScarlets Wrote:  You drop the dead weights:

East: UNC NCSU Duke/Miami UVa Clemson FSU VaTech GaTech
West: PAC 10 minus OSU/WSU (MWC)

Big 12 adds UL Pitt

WF Duke/Miami BC Cuse join AAC

Rutgers will be renewing its heated rivalries with Princeton and Colgate before the Canes and the Dookies end up in Conference Aresco

You love Aresco. Imagine the renewed rivalries of Miami USF/FAU. Then a blockbuster that is WF ECU. That's a conference to be proud of all things Aresco related.

(09-23-2022 10:20 AM)RUScarlets Wrote:  WF Duke/Miami BC Cuse join AAC

Wake, Duke, and Syracuse could go independent in football and give the Big East a call for everything else.

BC can rot.

(09-23-2022 10:26 AM)Gamenole Wrote:  Not surprising that UNC's first choice would be to maintain their fiefdom in the ACC in some fashion, as they basically run it with the aid of UVA and Duke. UNC, like Texas, prefers being the big fish in a small pond. But the powers that be in Chapel Hill aren't stupid and like Texas, they will eject if that pond continues to dry up and shrink compared to the big lakes stocked with massive predators in the B1G and SEC.

Crazy thing is if UNC-CH's administration and big boosters really tried — i.e. provided the necessary resources and support — than the Tar Heels could be a Top 10ish-type football program on a consistent basis.

Iconic brand, large fan base in a state loaded with football talent ... the ingredients are right there to win and win big.

If UNC's leadership will dive into the shark-infested waters of the SEC — where it's eat or be eaten — and go all-in on hiring a big-time coach to build off Mack's recruiting success, I believe the sky is the limit.

Get the feeling that if UNC goes the B1G route, then it'll be more of the one foot in, one foot out approach that has led to zero conference championships since 1980

So the TLDR is the people connected to UNC's athletics department are exactly like the posters on this board. All we need is someone asking whether UN -Omaha or Oral Roberts University makes a better land bridge to Stanford or If the UCSB Gauchos carry their market and all of the realignment speculation boxes would be checked.

(09-23-2022 10:26 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  Of course - it has to make more revenue. Maybe it adds value to the ACC Network... or maybe it doesn't.

Now, believe it or not with me saying this considering the debates on this forum lately, it's actually a situation where the "P3" vision of JRsec could come to fruition in some form. Granted, it would NOT be in the form of ACC schools moving anywhere, but rather the most valuable schools left in the Big 12 and Pac-12 joining the ACC. There aren't any significant legal restrictions on the ACC adding Big 12 and/or Pac-12 schools to the league (unlike the ACC GOR holding ACC schools back from defecting to the Big Ten or SEC) - it's truly all based on economics alone.
....

If we're going to see a merger at the next-tier level, this strikes me as one of the most likely ways it comes about. The ACC has resources the PAC and B12 schools can really use right now: profitable network, media exposure, and stable (for the next 12 years or so) membership. The presence of Notre Dame is helpful with all of these.

Now that we know more about the future design of the CFP, I suspect there will be less pressure now to achieve a merger at this 'P3' level. But we'll see. As you note, it all comes down to how the numbers look on spreadsheets in Charlotte.