(08-03-2022 03:15 PM)SouthernMissSNu Wrote:  I’ll bang this drum.

Hold tight until the rest of the dust settles. And then come for ECU and one of Memphis/UAB/LATech

I like it

(08-03-2022 03:19 PM)TroyFootball05 Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 03:06 PM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 03:00 PM)bcp_jmu Wrote:  lock the doors behind us...

Right.... like I'd be good with JSU being FBS if their 3 fans weren't so annoying but SHSU has no business.... sent em back CUSA

Just curious, what's the deal with SHSU? They've been a very good FCS program, right up there with JMU. I've heard they aren't ready on off the field fronts. What's the deal?

The answer is easy as 1, 2, 3.

1) $$$$$ (lack of)

2) Fans (lack of; FB attendance has averaged under 8,000, and this is with an undergraduate enrollment over 18k).

3) Facilities (poor to out and out bad; Football seats 12,000 w/surrounding track. JMU FB team had to dress in a tent prior to the 2020 playoff game. Basketball arena is 50 years old and shows it. Baseball seats 1,100).

As for the notion SHSU has been “right up there with JMU” No.

SHSU (known to JMU fans as “Soft Houston”) has been one of the great pretenders in FCS, running up impressive regular season records in one of the easiest FCS conferences, only to be exposed come the playoffs when they play a legit program on the road. The year SHSU won their NC their inflated regular season record garnered the Bearcats home-field advantage, and SHSU won 4 playoff games by a total of 15 points, the largest margin of victory being 6 points in round one.

Here is SHSU’s playoff record over the last 5 years:

2015 - lost to Jacksonville State 62-10 (semifinals)
2016 - lost to James Madison 65-7 (quarterfinals)
2017 - lost to NDSU 55-13 (semifinals)
2018 - Missed playoffs
2019 - Missed playoffs
2020 - defeated SDSU 23-21 (NC)
2021 - lost Montana State 42-19 (quarterfinals)

The C-USA’s FBS call-up to SHSU would be baffling if it were not for
C-USA’s desperation.

(08-03-2022 04:25 PM)VB Monarch Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 03:15 PM)SouthernMissSNu Wrote:  I’ll bang this drum.

Hold tight until the rest of the dust settles. And then come for ECU and one of Memphis/UAB/LATech

I like it

Yep. That should be the plan.

(08-03-2022 03:41 PM)KickItToScotty Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 03:19 PM)TroyFootball05 Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 03:06 PM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 03:00 PM)bcp_jmu Wrote:  lock the doors behind us...

Right.... like I'd be good with JSU being FBS if their 3 fans weren't so annoying but SHSU has no business.... sent em back CUSA

Just curious, what's the deal with SHSU? They've been a very good FCS program, right up there with JMU. I've heard they aren't ready on off the field fronts. What's the deal?

They haven't been up there with JMU. They've occasionally beat up on a cupcake conference, gotten severely over seeded, and then gotten blown out every year in the playoffs(including 65-7 by JMU) except for the spring season(which should've just been cancelled) when no one could practice normally or play a normal schedule and where top players from top teams transferred so they could play the fall and be ready for the NFL draft. Those things obviously close the gap. Then they got the 1 seed those playoffs and had no visiting locker rooms, visiting teams had to use tents in May in Texas. On top of that they have like two fans and $5 while they play in a stadium that would be pretty sorry for a high school team.

(08-03-2022 04:28 PM)Longhorn Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 03:19 PM)TroyFootball05 Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 03:06 PM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 03:00 PM)bcp_jmu Wrote:  lock the doors behind us...

Right.... like I'd be good with JSU being FBS if their 3 fans weren't so annoying but SHSU has no business.... sent em back CUSA

Just curious, what's the deal with SHSU? They've been a very good FCS program, right up there with JMU. I've heard they aren't ready on off the field fronts. What's the deal?

The answer is easy as 1, 2, 3.

1) $$$$$ (lack of)

2) Fans (lack of; FB attendance has averaged under 8,000, and this is with an undergraduate enrollment over 18k).

3) Facilities (poor to out and out bad; Football seats 12,000 w/surrounding track. JMU FB team had to dress in a tent prior to the 2020 playoff game. Basketball arena is 50 years old and shows it. Baseball seats 1,100).

As for the notion SHSU has been “right up there with JMU” No.

SHSU (known to JMU fans as “Soft Houston”) has been one of the great pretenders in FCS, running up impressive regular season records in one of the easiest FCS conferences, only to be exposed come the playoffs when they play a legit program on the road. The year SHSU won their NC their inflated regular season record garnered the Bearcats home-field advantage, and SHSU won 4 playoff games by a total of 15 points, the largest margin of victory being 6 points in round one.

Here is SHSU’s playoff record over the last 5 years:

2015 - lost to Jacksonville State 62-10 (semifinals)
2016 - lost to James Madison 65-7 (quarterfinals)
2017 - lost to NDSU 55-13 (semifinals)
2018 - Missed playoffs
2019 - Missed playoffs
2020 - defeated SDSU 23-21 (NC)
2021 - lost Montana State 42-19 (quarterfinals)

The C-USA’s FBS call-up to SHSU would be baffling if it were not for
C-USA’s desperation.

Alright. I stand corrected! You guys know way more about FCS than I do. I hadn't realized their conference was that bad and were just getting the benefit of the doubt. I saw their recent NC and some of their records and thought otherwise. Sounds like even JSU will be better that SH in the long run. Glad we got the right FCS program!

(08-03-2022 04:22 PM)bcp_jmu Wrote:  ^ those would be the two...maybe Delaware if they invest

Delaware and Missouri State are the two that came to mind for me as being in our footprint and not being totally impossible that they reach the point of becoming worthy of FBS. Delaware especially has some winning and strong fan support in their history to make a bounce back seem possible with the right coach and investment... Unless we lose some teams though I'd think we'll either be looking to stay at 14 or pick up current FBS programs, not too hard to imagine them becoming FBS material but hard to imagine them being worth going to 16 for.

No Jacksonville State, just no...what kind of moron would even say that?

Forever’s a long time, but looking at the drop-off between JMU & Jacksonville St and then between Jacksonville St and Sam Houston, somebody out there is really going to have to strap a rocket to their hind end if they want to be a viable option in this part of the country within the next 20 years.

Man I hate JMU as much as anyone else but comparing them or drawing parallels to Jackshit state and Shame Houston is just horrible.

JMU is the same as SHSU on the field. Who cares about facilities and fan support? Even if SHSU plays a weak conference they still make FCS playoff runs along with JMU. The JMU whining about SHSU is just....weird.

Also the SBC did not elevated TXST from the FCS. We joined the SBC from the WAC.

(08-03-2022 07:25 PM)slycat Wrote:  JMU is the same as SHSU on the field. Who cares about facilities and fan support? Even if SHSU plays a weak conference they still make FCS playoff runs along with JMU. The JMU whining about SHSU is just....weird.

Also the SBC did not elevated TXST from the FCS. We joined the SBC from the WAC.

Jmu and shsu are not the same on the field lol. Barring the COVID spring season, shsu is a paper tiger. Whereas Jmu was an actual fcs juggernaut. It went:

NDSU
JMU








Everyone else

(08-03-2022 04:00 PM)JoeJag Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 03:48 PM)8993 Wrote:  The fact that there is you could even compare a high school football stadium in the same area as me and the SHSU football stadium is pathetic. SHSU will be a FBS football program next year. I understand why the P5 conferences want to break away when you see what FBS is backfilling with now.

At some point, lock the door and throw away the key.

Capacity 12,593. They're going to need to bring in a lot of portable aluminum stands before the 2023 season.

And a bigger tent.

(08-03-2022 07:36 PM)James Madison Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 07:25 PM)slycat Wrote:  JMU is the same as SHSU on the field. Who cares about facilities and fan support? Even if SHSU plays a weak conference they still make FCS playoff runs along with JMU. The JMU whining about SHSU is just....weird.

Also the SBC did not elevated TXST from the FCS. We joined the SBC from the WAC.

Jmu and shsu are not the same on the field lol. Barring the COVID spring season, shsu is a paper tiger. Whereas Jmu was an actual fcs juggernaut. It went:

NDSU
JMU








Everyone else

In the last decade you have both made three finals, winning one each. Sounds the same to me.

(08-03-2022 07:43 PM)slycat Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 07:36 PM)James Madison Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 07:25 PM)slycat Wrote:  JMU is the same as SHSU on the field. Who cares about facilities and fan support? Even if SHSU plays a weak conference they still make FCS playoff runs along with JMU. The JMU whining about SHSU is just....weird.

Also the SBC did not elevated TXST from the FCS. We joined the SBC from the WAC.

Jmu and shsu are not the same on the field lol. Barring the COVID spring season, shsu is a paper tiger. Whereas Jmu was an actual fcs juggernaut. It went:

NDSU
JMU








Everyone else

In the last decade you have both made three finals, winning one each. Sounds the same to me.

Copying from another poster above.

Here is SHSU’s playoff record over the last 5 years:

2015 - lost to Jacksonville State 62-10 (semifinals)
2016 - lost to James Madison 65-7 (quarterfinals)
2017 - lost to NDSU 55-13 (semifinals)
2018 - Missed playoffs
2019 - Missed playoffs
2020 - defeated SDSU 23-21 (NC)
2021 - lost Montana State 42-19 (quarterfinals)

I can’t remember the last time jmu was absolutely steam rolled by an fcs team. Let alone so consistently

We have not earned this arrogance that we have developed. We were successful in the last two rounds of realignment because we sought out programs that fit culturally, athletically, geographically, and academically. If there are FCS schools who fit and they add value to the conference then I'd absolutely welcome them.

(08-03-2022 07:46 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  We have not earned this arrogance that we have developed. We were successful in the last two rounds of realignment because we sought out programs that fit culturally, athletically, geographically, and academically. If there are FCS schools who fit and they add value to the conference then I'd absolutely welcome them.

I agree, but only to a point.

If it is at all realistic to get a Memphis, UAB, ECU, maybe USF, or some other strong FBS program I'm not thinking of, I think those would have to take precedence over ANYONE in FCS.

We're not above FCS call-ups. We just want to make sure anyone added, adds value, and I think some of those schools I listed would add a whole heck of a lot more value than most any FCS program would.

(08-03-2022 08:00 PM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 07:46 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  We have not earned this arrogance that we have developed. We were successful in the last two rounds of realignment because we sought out programs that fit culturally, athletically, geographically, and academically. If there are FCS schools who fit and they add value to the conference then I'd absolutely welcome them.

I agree, but only to a point.

If it is at all realistic to get a Memphis, UAB, ECU, maybe USF, or some other strong FBS program I'm not thinking of, I think those would have to take precedence over ANYONE in FCS.

We're not above FCS call-ups. We just want to make sure anyone added, adds value, and I think some of those schools I listed would add a whole heck of a lot more value than most any FCS program would.

The only FCS programs worth having are well out of our region so that path no longer makes sense. I think most would be fine with adding NDSU or Montana if they were located in the south. The only options that makes sense reside in the AAC now.

(08-03-2022 07:46 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  We have not earned this arrogance that we have developed. We were successful in the last two rounds of realignment because we sought out programs that fit culturally, athletically, geographically, and academically. If there are FCS schools who fit and they add value to the conference then I'd absolutely welcome them.

And there are none. Eff Delaware and Mizzou State. We need to hold fast and aim higher should the opportunity arise. If it doesn't, then it doesn't.

If you want to water down the FBS and separate it even further in a bad way, then by all means, add more BS (thanks C-OMA) like JSU, SHSU et aL.

(08-03-2022 04:09 PM)8993 Wrote:  

(08-03-2022 03:53 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  I agree the FCS well is dry and we shouldn't add anyone else unless we want NDSU for football-only, but I don't like the implication we've over-used that route. FCS call-ups have elevated this conference.

I agree with this.

Since the FCS/FBS came to be, there have been a few waves of good and bad additions. That first wave in the mid-to-late 80s wasn't anything to write home about. The early-to-mid 90s saw improvement, but the mid-to-late 90s saw major improvements. Then came most of the 2000s, which were... rough. There was another major wave in the 2010s, with the grouping being a wash, with both good and bad moves. Outside of NDSU, we've passed the point where there are quality FCS programs to pull up now. JMU was the last one. Jacksonville State, SHSU, Tarleton State, EKU, Kennesaw State, Chattanooga, none of them move the needle or need a spot on the train.

UTA (1985)
Akron (1986)
Louisiana Tech (1988)
Arkansas State (91)
Nevada (91)
ULM (93)
North Texas (94)
UAB (95)
Boise State (95)
UCF (95)
Marshall (96)
Buffalo (98)
MTSU (98)
UConn (99)
USF (2000)
Troy (2001)
FAU (2004)
FIU (04)
WKU (07)
UMass (11)
USA (11)
UTSA (11)
Texas State (11)
Georgia State (12)
ODU (12)
App State (13)
Georgia Southern (13)
Charlotte (14)
Coastal Carolina (16)
Liberty (17)
JMU (21)
Jacksonville State (22)
SHSU (22)

For football. Charter member in other sports.

I wouldn't have any issues if we added Delaware (to give JMU and ODU an old pal) or Missouri State (to help Arkansas State with geography).

I'd rather have ECU, UAB, and/or UTSA though.

(08-03-2022 07:46 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  We have not earned this arrogance that we have developed. We were successful in the last two rounds of realignment because we sought out programs that fit culturally, athletically, geographically, and academically. If there are FCS schools who fit and they add value to the conference then I'd absolutely welcome them.

You are correct...there shouldn't be any arrogance whatsoever. The Sun Belt did right in adding what they considered valued product over the years and "built them upward" instead of "looking down on them" as they enter the conference, something C-USA and AAC leadership did not do IMHO.

That said, as we fans (and potentially leadership) do discuss possible expansion, I don't think we are developing arrogance, but developing an identity as to who we strive to be in the future. So in the manner of identifying which schools we all think fit the bill, the majority (if not all) FCS schools (including the HBCUs) do not for whatever reason fit the identity the Sun Belt is striving to be for its future.