Val Ackerman said it best "For the Big East this building is home, it's in our DNA, it's who we are" From MSG executive VP Joel Fisher "The Big East is part of the fabric of Madison Square Garden, and Madison Square Garden is part of the fabric of the Big East"

NY Post article:
https://nypost.com/2018/12/09/big-east-f...nt-at-msg/

(12-09-2018 08:15 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 08:00 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 04:06 PM)esayem Wrote:  I think the UConn ship sailed. There’s no reason why they can’t be nationally successful in the American. Do you think the women’s program is going to fall off the map? Ha. Not sure why Ollie didn’t work out; he coached his butt off to win the dance his first year.

Dayton is the obvious choice. They fit the institutional profile and they have a dedicated fan base. Markets don’t matter as much as programs these days.

If there’s a single non-UConn school added, I’ve always believed that it would be SLU. Whether it’s fair or not, they look at Dayton and Xavier as overlapping markets too much.

What about Marquette and DePaul?

Or Seton Hall and St. John's?

Dayton's fan base is worth it.

Uhhhhhhhh

Marquette (Milwaukee) and DePaul (Chicago) are in different markets and different states.

Seton Hall (New Jersey) and St. John's (New York) are also in different markets and different states.

Dayton and Xavier overlap in similar markets within the state of Ohio. It is also possible that Dayton and Cincinnati will merge into one market (for television purposes) in the future. Xavier, from accounts, will likely block them.

However, no one can deny the strength of Dayton's fan base and commitment to men's basketball. I would be in favor of them (after Saint Louis).

(12-09-2018 06:41 PM)Wolfman Wrote:  The city told MSG to move to make way for a modern Penn Station. MSG has less than 5 years on their "special operating permit." They are not negotiating with the city or filed an application to extend their permit. They are not negotiating with anybody else on a lease. Even if they were, I'm not sure they could build a new facility in the ~4 years they remaining. So it looks like MSG won't exist after 2023 anyway.

So the Knicks and Rangers are just gonna fold up operations then?

(12-09-2018 08:44 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 08:15 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 08:00 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 04:06 PM)esayem Wrote:  I think the UConn ship sailed. There’s no reason why they can’t be nationally successful in the American. Do you think the women’s program is going to fall off the map? Ha. Not sure why Ollie didn’t work out; he coached his butt off to win the dance his first year.

Dayton is the obvious choice. They fit the institutional profile and they have a dedicated fan base. Markets don’t matter as much as programs these days.

If there’s a single non-UConn school added, I’ve always believed that it would be SLU. Whether it’s fair or not, they look at Dayton and Xavier as overlapping markets too much.

What about Marquette and DePaul?

Or Seton Hall and St. John's?

Dayton's fan base is worth it.

Uhhhhhhhh

Marquette (Milwaukee) and DePaul (Chicago) are in different markets and different states.

Seton Hall (New Jersey) and St. John's (New York) are also in different markets and different states.

Dayton and Xavier overlap in similar markets within the state of Ohio. It is also possible that Dayton and Cincinnati will merge into one market (for television purposes) in the future. Xavier, from accounts, will likely block them.

However, no one can deny the strength of Dayton's fan base and commitment to men's basketball. I would be in favor of them (after Saint Louis).

Actually Seton Hall is in the NYC market but everyone doubles up on NYC from the NFL to the NHL (Actually they have THREE teams in that market!).

(12-09-2018 07:51 PM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 07:27 PM)Bogg Wrote:  Yea, Manhattan's not going to just stop having a sports arena. They may eventually build a new Garden a few blocks down, but the suit to forcibly evict MSG alone would take out past the expiration of this agreement. The people who know better than people on message boards don't seem worried.

WTF. So does that mean that the extension itself is bogus? What is the Nbe going to do for a new CCG home?

No, Madison Square Garden as we know it will still exist in 10 years. NYC wants to totally rebuild and expand Penn Station, which MSG sits on top of and rents the air it occupies from. 20-30 years from now it's possible a New MSG is built a few blocks down from the current one, but there's always going to be a professional-level sports arena somewhere in midtown.

(12-09-2018 08:15 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 08:00 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 04:06 PM)esayem Wrote:  I think the UConn ship sailed. There’s no reason why they can’t be nationally successful in the American. Do you think the women’s program is going to fall off the map? Ha. Not sure why Ollie didn’t work out; he coached his butt off to win the dance his first year.

Dayton is the obvious choice. They fit the institutional profile and they have a dedicated fan base. Markets don’t matter as much as programs these days.

If there’s a single non-UConn school added, I’ve always believed that it would be SLU. Whether it’s fair or not, they look at Dayton and Xavier as overlapping markets too much.

What about Marquette and DePaul?

Or Seton Hall and St. John's?

Dayton's fan base is worth it.

Marquette and Depaul? They are 100 miles apart. Milwaukee and Chicago are completely different markets. Dayton is 50 miles from X and in the same media market.

(12-09-2018 08:00 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 04:06 PM)esayem Wrote:  I think the UConn ship sailed. There’s no reason why they can’t be nationally successful in the American. Do you think the women’s program is going to fall off the map? Ha. Not sure why Ollie didn’t work out; he coached his butt off to win the dance his first year.

Dayton is the obvious choice. They fit the institutional profile and they have a dedicated fan base. Markets don’t matter as much as programs these days.

If there’s a single non-UConn school added, I’ve always believed that it would be SLU. Whether it’s fair or not, they look at Dayton and Xavier as overlapping markets too much.

I would be surprised if the Big East adds a 6th school in the midwest, given that they have 5 in the northeast corridor and 5 in the midwest now. And there's no sufficiently attractive team (relative to the Big East median) available in the midwest anyway, assuming that X will block Dayton.

(12-09-2018 09:49 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 07:51 PM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 07:27 PM)Bogg Wrote:  Yea, Manhattan's not going to just stop having a sports arena. They may eventually build a new Garden a few blocks down, but the suit to forcibly evict MSG alone would take out past the expiration of this agreement. The people who know better than people on message boards don't seem worried.

WTF. So does that mean that the extension itself is bogus? What is the Nbe going to do for a new CCG home?

No, Madison Square Garden as we know it will still exist in 10 years. NYC wants to totally rebuild and expand Penn Station, which MSG sits on top of and rents the air it occupies from. 20-30 years from now it's possible a New MSG is built a few blocks down from the current one, but there's always going to be a professional-level sports arena somewhere in midtown.

Oh thanks. I like probably lots of other people here had no idea about MSG things. I actually thought it odd after the recent renovations.

Fantastic news as MSG is a major selling point for the conference!

You know ESPN is crying that they couldn't get MSG for the ACC

(12-10-2018 07:05 AM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 09:49 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 07:51 PM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 07:27 PM)Bogg Wrote:  Yea, Manhattan's not going to just stop having a sports arena. They may eventually build a new Garden a few blocks down, but the suit to forcibly evict MSG alone would take out past the expiration of this agreement. The people who know better than people on message boards don't seem worried.

WTF. So does that mean that the extension itself is bogus? What is the Nbe going to do for a new CCG home?

No, Madison Square Garden as we know it will still exist in 10 years. NYC wants to totally rebuild and expand Penn Station, which MSG sits on top of and rents the air it occupies from. 20-30 years from now it's possible a New MSG is built a few blocks down from the current one, but there's always going to be a professional-level sports arena somewhere in midtown.

Oh thanks. I like probably lots of other people here had no idea about MSG things. I actually thought it odd after the recent renovations.

Reasonable. Yea, there's a push in NYC to replace MSG to open more space for the rail station, but it's just that - replace it, not tear it down and leave nothing in its place. Any post about "Anyway, they're going to tear down MSG in 10 years" should be followed with "...and build a brand-new arena to replace it". This goes WAY beyond college basketball tournaments - there's just an ungodly amount of revenue to be made in midtown Manhattan if you've got the premier sports arena there. The Knicks and Rangers aren't moving out to Queens or playing in New Jersey.

(12-10-2018 12:12 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 07:05 AM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 09:49 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 07:51 PM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 07:27 PM)Bogg Wrote:  Yea, Manhattan's not going to just stop having a sports arena. They may eventually build a new Garden a few blocks down, but the suit to forcibly evict MSG alone would take out past the expiration of this agreement. The people who know better than people on message boards don't seem worried.

WTF. So does that mean that the extension itself is bogus? What is the Nbe going to do for a new CCG home?

No, Madison Square Garden as we know it will still exist in 10 years. NYC wants to totally rebuild and expand Penn Station, which MSG sits on top of and rents the air it occupies from. 20-30 years from now it's possible a New MSG is built a few blocks down from the current one, but there's always going to be a professional-level sports arena somewhere in midtown.

Oh thanks. I like probably lots of other people here had no idea about MSG things. I actually thought it odd after the recent renovations.

Reasonable. Yea, there's a push in NYC to replace MSG to open more space for the rail station, but it's just that - replace it, not tear it down and leave nothing in its place. Any post about "Anyway, they're going to tear down MSG in 10 years" should be followed with "...and build a brand-new arena to replace it". This goes WAY beyond college basketball tournaments - there's just an ungodly amount of revenue to be made in midtown Manhattan if you've got the premier sports arena there. The Knicks and Rangers aren't moving out to Queens or playing in New Jersey.

I guess the question would be though real estate. Is there anywhere available where they could put a new arena?

(12-10-2018 12:15 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 12:12 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 07:05 AM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 09:49 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 07:51 PM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  WTF. So does that mean that the extension itself is bogus? What is the Nbe going to do for a new CCG home?

No, Madison Square Garden as we know it will still exist in 10 years. NYC wants to totally rebuild and expand Penn Station, which MSG sits on top of and rents the air it occupies from. 20-30 years from now it's possible a New MSG is built a few blocks down from the current one, but there's always going to be a professional-level sports arena somewhere in midtown.

Oh thanks. I like probably lots of other people here had no idea about MSG things. I actually thought it odd after the recent renovations.

Reasonable. Yea, there's a push in NYC to replace MSG to open more space for the rail station, but it's just that - replace it, not tear it down and leave nothing in its place. Any post about "Anyway, they're going to tear down MSG in 10 years" should be followed with "...and build a brand-new arena to replace it". This goes WAY beyond college basketball tournaments - there's just an ungodly amount of revenue to be made in midtown Manhattan if you've got the premier sports arena there. The Knicks and Rangers aren't moving out to Queens or playing in New Jersey.

I guess the question would be though real estate. Is there anywhere available where they could put a new arena?

I'm not going to type the whole thing out on my phone, but the short answer is yes, they've identified three or four possibilities in the general vicinity of the existing arena. There's also the potential to leave the arena in place. The Wikipedia page for MSG has a synopsis that calls some of them out. Operating Manhattan's premier sports/event facility is the kind of project that gets existing buildings torn down.

Great for the BE, Nova, and G'Town. With the Garden under contract the BE has a solid hold on the NYC - Washington D.C., Philadelphia TV viewing triangle in the NE. Helps with ST. John's and a resurgent Seton Hall in the area too.

(12-10-2018 10:21 AM)TheBasketBallOpinion Wrote:  Fantastic news as MSG is a major selling point for the conference!

You know ESPN is crying that they couldn't get MSG for the ACC

Yep.
Also, UConn is rejoining the big east I’ve heard.

(12-10-2018 12:30 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 12:15 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 12:12 PM)Bogg Wrote:  

(12-10-2018 07:05 AM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(12-09-2018 09:49 PM)Bogg Wrote:  No, Madison Square Garden as we know it will still exist in 10 years. NYC wants to totally rebuild and expand Penn Station, which MSG sits on top of and rents the air it occupies from. 20-30 years from now it's possible a New MSG is built a few blocks down from the current one, but there's always going to be a professional-level sports arena somewhere in midtown.

Oh thanks. I like probably lots of other people here had no idea about MSG things. I actually thought it odd after the recent renovations.

Reasonable. Yea, there's a push in NYC to replace MSG to open more space for the rail station, but it's just that - replace it, not tear it down and leave nothing in its place. Any post about "Anyway, they're going to tear down MSG in 10 years" should be followed with "...and build a brand-new arena to replace it". This goes WAY beyond college basketball tournaments - there's just an ungodly amount of revenue to be made in midtown Manhattan if you've got the premier sports arena there. The Knicks and Rangers aren't moving out to Queens or playing in New Jersey.

I guess the question would be though real estate. Is there anywhere available where they could put a new arena?

I'm not going to type the whole thing out on my phone, but the short answer is yes, they've identified three or four possibilities in the general vicinity of the existing arena. There's also the potential to leave the arena in place. The Wikipedia page for MSG has a synopsis that calls some of them out. Operating Manhattan's premier sports/event facility is the kind of project that gets existing buildings torn down.

The last thing I saw was an article from September 2018. There had been no action by either party.

The city wants MSG vacated so they can upgrade the rail station. I didn't see anything about how long the rail project would take. I don't know that the plan is to tear the existing building down. It is possible part of the existing building could be opened/removed for access. Existing tenants could be relocated for a season or two.

The point is, right now, there is no MSG after 2023.

FWIW, it took just over 3 years to build the current structure in 1964-68. It might be possible to build a comparable building in 4 years.

(12-10-2018 08:43 PM)Wolfman Wrote:  The last thing I saw was an article from September 2018. There had been no action by either party.

The city wants MSG vacated so they can upgrade the rail station. I didn't see anything about how long the rail project would take. I don't know that the plan is to tear the existing building down. It is possible part of the existing building could be opened/removed for access. Existing tenants could be relocated for a season or two.

The point is, right now, there is no MSG after 2023.

FWIW, it took just over 3 years to build the current structure in 1964-68. It might be possible to build a comparable building in 4 years.

Yea, good luck with that. The court battle alone will take you out to 2028.