(11-23-2018 03:51 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(11-23-2018 03:20 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  I already told you above what should have been done. And again, this is not partisan. Many Republicans agree with me.
FFS, even places like Turkey get it...why the hell can't we?
Turkey Slams Trump's 'Comical' Statement Backing Saudi Arabia Alliance Despite Khashoggi Murder

Trying to decipher exactly what you want, it appears that you wanted a statement denouncing what happened, and you were not happy that we waited until after the CIA opined. So are you saying we should have denounced before we knew what happened? Or are you just saying, "Orange man bad," no matter what happened? At least you are more reasonable than some of the suggestions I've seen. One friend of mine posted on Facebook te morning after calling for essentials a declaration of war. At least you are not as Trump-deranged as that.

As far as Turkey, if you know anything about the Turkey-Saudi relationship, you know that Turkey was going to denounce it no matter what.

I don't like Trump's statement. I really don't like linking it to money, because there was no reason to do that. I'd prefer a statement that simply said we decry murder in any event, but this one is not our circus, not our monkeys, and we trust the Saudis and Turks to resolve it.

If you've read what I posted in this thread previously, this is pretty much exactly what I've said the whole time.

And no, I did not expect a statement before the CIA report...that being said, it was pretty much a given from very early on who directed this.

(11-26-2018 08:40 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(11-23-2018 03:51 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(11-23-2018 03:20 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  I already told you above what should have been done. And again, this is not partisan. Many Republicans agree with me.
FFS, even places like Turkey get it...why the hell can't we?
Turkey Slams Trump's 'Comical' Statement Backing Saudi Arabia Alliance Despite Khashoggi Murder

Trying to decipher exactly what you want, it appears that you wanted a statement denouncing what happened, and you were not happy that we waited until after the CIA opined. So are you saying we should have denounced before we knew what happened? Or are you just saying, "Orange man bad," no matter what happened? At least you are more reasonable than some of the suggestions I've seen. One friend of mine posted on Facebook te morning after calling for essentials a declaration of war. At least you are not as Trump-deranged as that.
As far as Turkey, if you know anything about the Turkey-Saudi relationship, you know that Turkey was going to denounce it no matter what.
I don't like Trump's statement. I really don't like linking it to money, because there was no reason to do that. I'd prefer a statement that simply said we decry murder in any event, but this one is not our circus, not our monkeys, and we trust the Saudis and Turks to resolve it.

If you've read what I posted in this thread previously, this is pretty much exactly what I've said the whole time.
And no, I did not expect a statement before the CIA report...that being said, it was pretty much a given from very early on who directed this.

You, yes, but no matter how much it pains me to say it (j/k), you are far more reasonable than the average left winger. I'm sure you admit that there were many calls that were absolute unhinged craziness.

I have a well-educated (M.D.) and supposedly quite intelligent friend in Fairhope (maybe enough said) who was on Facebook the next day demanding that we recall our ambassador and expel the Saudi ambassador--the last steps before breaking off diplomatic relations altogether, which is in turn the last step before a declaration of war. And all that before we had any hard facts. So two steps away from a declaration of war based upon no facts. Yes, my friend, you are much more reasonable than that.

(11-26-2018 08:40 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(11-23-2018 03:51 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  I don't like Trump's statement. I really don't like linking it to money, because there was no reason to do that. I'd prefer a statement that simply said we decry murder in any event, but this one is not our circus, not our monkeys, and we trust the Saudis and Turks to resolve it.

If you've read what I posted in this thread previously, this is pretty much exactly what I've said the whole time.

And no, I did not expect a statement before the CIA report...that being said, it was pretty much a given from very early on who directed this.

But you GOT one before the CIA report... I recall Trump talking about a clumsy cover-up of a horrible even that never should have happened.

and because it's not our circus nor monkeys... such trivialities and parsing of words are meaningless to anyone not merely spending their time looking for something to be upset about. This whole thread acts as if the Turkish people are sitting around JUST HOPING that the president of a nation thousands of miles away will choose the right words.... and that such a choice of words will have ANY bearing on a) their lives or b) the outcomes.

Not saying this is the case here... but I'd rather have someone who speaks clumsily but does the right thing than someone who speaks perfectly and doesn't. The better question is whether or not we are using our relationship with Saudi to press them to help protect our relationship with Turkey... which is NOT something we would likely do in public... and while it may not sound good, it is a FACT that unless we're willing to risk losing our best ally in the region (on a variety of matters) then 'it is what it is'. Democrats may not like hearing it, but it's true.

Why do we hate a President telling us what we've all known for decades?

The left, especially with Trump... assumes that words are always backed up by actions. Without debating whom, history shows that 'what they say in public' and 'what they do in private' are often opposites.

Basically, our policy to Saudi Arabia hasn't changed, except no more shaking the finger at delinquent government purely for show. Nothing to see here.

(11-26-2018 10:36 AM)EigenEagle Wrote:  Basically, our policy to Saudi Arabia hasn't changed, except no more shaking the finger at delinquent government purely for show. Nothing to see here.

Well he did shake his finger. He just didn't jump up and down and stomp his feet.

(11-26-2018 10:43 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(11-26-2018 10:36 AM)EigenEagle Wrote:  Basically, our policy to Saudi Arabia hasn't changed, except no more shaking the finger at delinquent government purely for show. Nothing to see here.

Well he did shake his finger. He just didn't jump up and down and stomp his feet.

but the problem for the left seems to be that he admitted that shaking his finger (which others have done before and nothing more) is all that will happen.

I recall the left screaming about us taking on Saud after 9/11 so what did they do when they took congress? Nothing. When they took the white house? Nothing.

All sorts of smoke but never any fire.

It is what it is.

And yes... Europe is more dependent upon coal and imported oil than we are BY FAR (as a percentage) despite massive investment in alternatives... so they can thank Trump as well for not escalating the issue.

Thank you (left) for once again throwing such a fit over something that Trump did that I initially agreed with you on that I now think he did the right thing.

This administration is a ******* clown show.

(11-27-2018 04:27 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  This administration is a ******* clown show.

It isn't the business of the USA dude. So Bolton listens then what? Why are leftists so fascinated with this.

(11-27-2018 04:27 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  This administration is a ******* clown show.

What would he learn from it?

What would you learn from it?

What could I possible learn from it that I don't already know?

Yes, even if translated. What?

(11-27-2018 04:27 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  This administration is a ******* clown show.

Seems an entirely appropriate answer. Maybe the reporters should ask a follow up question like have your read a translated transcript of the recordings or been briefed on the contents of the recording. Faux outrage over nothing.

(11-27-2018 04:52 PM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(11-27-2018 04:27 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  This administration is a ******* clown show.

Seems an entirely appropriate answer. Maybe the reporters should ask a follow up question like have your read a translated transcript of the recordings or been briefed on the contents of the recording. Faux outrage over nothing.

Of course he has been. So have you, so have I if one pays attention to the daily news, TV, print, radio etc. Not a "briefing" per se for us, but certainly enough to know pretty definitively what took place.

More faux OUTRAGE!!! from the perpetual outrage machine.