(05-17-2017 01:21 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 12:47 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 10:58 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  I think it is a terrific idea. I actually have my own test. I don't hire anyone that doesn't show up to the interview with a wedding ring (show stopper) and I give preference to those that have a social media account with evidence of children (not allowed to ask that question). My experience is those with family obligations are far less likely to cause problems and don't have time to get into petty social schit among coworkers. The only exception is for overseas requirements in which the opposite is true and those with families separating themselves are more likely to quit or get distracted with long distance problems.

FWIW, this opens you up to legal action. Doesn't mean you can't do it in the ways you've described, but there's some risk there if a candidate finds out they've been denied a role for their marriage status or lack of offspring......

Marriage is not a protected class.


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What about citizenship? ....if you are in the USA legally. Marital status is a protected class in many states and probably some cities.

(05-17-2017 02:08 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 01:21 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 12:47 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 10:58 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  I think it is a terrific idea. I actually have my own test. I don't hire anyone that doesn't show up to the interview with a wedding ring (show stopper) and I give preference to those that have a social media account with evidence of children (not allowed to ask that question). My experience is those with family obligations are far less likely to cause problems and don't have time to get into petty social schit among coworkers. The only exception is for overseas requirements in which the opposite is true and those with families separating themselves are more likely to quit or get distracted with long distance problems.

FWIW, this opens you up to legal action. Doesn't mean you can't do it in the ways you've described, but there's some risk there if a candidate finds out they've been denied a role for their marriage status or lack of offspring......

Marriage is not a protected class.


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What about citizenship? ....if you are in the USA legally. Marital status is a protected class in many states and probably some cities.

National origin is a protected class, not citizenship though. Since both citizens and legal residents are able to work in the United States.

Marital status could be a protected class in some states and probably some cities, but not under federal law, which is what the EEOC falls under.

(05-17-2017 01:50 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 01:43 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 11:27 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 11:24 AM)UofMstateU Wrote:  I know of a company that asks the candidate "whats the maximum number of days per month a person should be allowed to call in sick."

You can filter out a lot of future grief with that one.

How is the answer to that not trivially "only up to the number of sick days he/she has accrued" ? Seems like a silly question.

"We thank you for your interest in the position but after much consideration we have decided to pursue other candidates with superior qualifications. We wish you the best in your future endeavors."

Don't forget to promise to keep their resume "on file"

And "Call if the situation changes".

When Ross Perot started EDS, he hired military vets, Mormons and farmers. They were the only groups that understood what it meant to "work."

Anyone who thinks you can test for personality the same way you can test for knowledge is a moron, and a real red flag for me if searching for an employer.

(05-17-2017 03:33 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  Anyone who thinks you can test for personality the same way you can test for knowledge is a moron, and a real red flag for me if searching for an employer.

That might have been the case years ago but the idiocy that is social media can give you a pretty damn good idea. I know that applicants we rejected because we figured they would be trouble based on social media posts that went on to work at other area departments turned out to be trouble. One in particular I recall one of my higher-ups looking at his social media and saying "All I see right here is a future call from the public information officer wanting to know our official comment after his arrest." We rejected him and about a month later he went to work at a department in the Lowstate. He didn't even make out of their rookie academy before he was arrested on an assault charge and fired. Another one who was constantly posting that they were home sick was rejected, went to work for a neighboring department and sure enough if they had accrued a day of sick leave they were home sick. While as a larger department we could have absorbed something like that fairly easy he got hired on at a small fire district on a shift of six suppression personnel so it was constantly causing staffing problems.

(05-17-2017 03:59 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 03:33 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  Anyone who thinks you can test for personality the same way you can test for knowledge is a moron, and a real red flag for me if searching for an employer.

That might have been the case years ago but the idiocy that is social media can give you a pretty damn good idea. I know that applicants we rejected because we figured they would be trouble based on social media posts that went on to work at other area departments turned out to be trouble. One in particular I recall one of my higher-ups looking at his social media and saying "All I see right here is a future call from the public information officer wanting to know our official comment after his arrest." We rejected him and about a month later he went to work at a department in the Lowstate. He didn't even make out of their rookie academy before he was arrested on an assault charge and fired. Another one who was constantly posting that they were home sick was rejected, went to work for a neighboring department and sure enough if they had accrued a day of sick leave they were home sick. While as a larger department we could have absorbed something like that fairly easy he got hired on at a small fire district on a shift of six suppression personnel so it was constantly causing staffing problems.

I'm not talking about that. That actually makes sense, though it worries me because I have a fairly common first and last name and am always scared of what others sharing my name might be doing on social media.

I'm talking about those silly multiple-choice tests employers will administer on site that ask you how many extra-curricular activities you were involved in high school and other things. Those aren't worth the computer bits that they take up on any machine.

(05-17-2017 04:06 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 03:59 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 03:33 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  Anyone who thinks you can test for personality the same way you can test for knowledge is a moron, and a real red flag for me if searching for an employer.

That might have been the case years ago but the idiocy that is social media can give you a pretty damn good idea. I know that applicants we rejected because we figured they would be trouble based on social media posts that went on to work at other area departments turned out to be trouble. One in particular I recall one of my higher-ups looking at his social media and saying "All I see right here is a future call from the public information officer wanting to know our official comment after his arrest." We rejected him and about a month later he went to work at a department in the Lowstate. He didn't even make out of their rookie academy before he was arrested on an assault charge and fired. Another one who was constantly posting that they were home sick was rejected, went to work for a neighboring department and sure enough if they had accrued a day of sick leave they were home sick. While as a larger department we could have absorbed something like that fairly easy he got hired on at a small fire district on a shift of six suppression personnel so it was constantly causing staffing problems.

I'm not talking about that. That actually makes sense, though it worries me because I have a fairly common first and last name and am always scared of what others sharing my name might be doing on social media.

I'm talking about those silly multiple-choice tests employers will administer on site that ask you how many extra-curricular activities you were involved in high school and other things. Those aren't worth the computer bits that they take up on any machine.

We didn't do that, at least not while I was involved in the hiring process.

We would, however, tend to throw in some random, off the wall questions designed to see how an applicant thought on their feet in stressful situations. Like in the middle of asking them about various firefighter techniques ask them what their favorite farm animal was and why.

The snowflakes we have been reading about on the college campuses (and seeing on Youtube) will be failures in the workplace. They will be failures as adults. They will be failures as citizens.

There are no participation trophies in life.

(05-17-2017 10:58 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  I think it is a terrific idea. I actually have my own test. I don't hire anyone that doesn't show up to the interview with a wedding ring (show stopper) and I give preference to those that have a social media account with evidence of children (not allowed to ask that question). My experience is those with family obligations are far less likely to cause problems and don't have time to get into petty social schit among coworkers. The only exception is for overseas requirements in which the opposite is true and those with families separating themselves are more likely to quit or get distracted with long distance problems.

good tip.

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(05-17-2017 01:12 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  . Single and divorced women are the worst, especially if they have kids. If they aren't missing days left and right because little Timmay got a cold, they are showing up for work on Tuesday with no sleep, ruffled hair and wearing the same clothes they had on Monday because they took advantage of the Timmay staying with the baby daddy to spend the night riding the c*ck carousel. They also spend much of the day texting on their cell phones or flirting with their married male coworkers.

amen to all of this.

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(05-17-2017 03:59 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 03:33 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  Anyone who thinks you can test for personality the same way you can test for knowledge is a moron, and a real red flag for me if searching for an employer.

That might have been the case years ago but the idiocy that is social media can give you a pretty damn good idea. I know that applicants we rejected because we figured they would be trouble based on social media posts that went on to work at other area departments turned out to be trouble. One in particular I recall one of my higher-ups looking at his social media and saying "All I see right here is a future call from the public information officer wanting to know our official comment after his arrest." We rejected him and about a month later he went to work at a department in the Lowstate. He didn't even make out of their rookie academy before he was arrested on an assault charge and fired. Another one who was constantly posting that they were home sick was rejected, went to work for a neighboring department and sure enough if they had accrued a day of sick leave they were home sick. While as a larger department we could have absorbed something like that fairly easy he got hired on at a small fire district on a shift of six suppression personnel so it was constantly causing staffing problems.

I had to put my Facebook page on private a couple years ago because I got annoyed with potential employers trolling it. Kept getting questions in the interview process that made it very clear the person had read my Social media.

I treat Facebook very differently than most people, and play a lot of Devils Advocate taking stances different than what I actually believed and getting people to try and see both sides of an argument. Led to some people believing everything I posted were my actual beliefs, and cost me a job or two.

(05-17-2017 04:21 PM)LeFlâneur Wrote:  The snowflakes we have been reading about on the college campuses (and seeing on Youtube) will be failures in the workplace. They will be failures as adults. They will be failures as citizens.

There are no participation trophies in life.

Keep in mind that some Youtubers make pretty good money. If you are patient and know what you are doing, you can actually make a career out of YouTube.

(05-17-2017 10:58 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  I think it is a terrific idea. I actually have my own test. I don't hire anyone that doesn't show up to the interview with a wedding ring (show stopper) and I give preference to those that have a social media account with evidence of children (not allowed to ask that question). My experience is those with family obligations are far less likely to cause problems and don't have time to get into petty social schit among coworkers. The only exception is for overseas requirements in which the opposite is true and those with families separating themselves are more likely to quit or get distracted with long distance problems.

A lot of employers don't think like you.

A lot of them say "oh great, a single and childless person, we can ask them to come on weekends and make long-distance trips to see clients and relocate them whenever we need to relocate someone".

(05-17-2017 05:47 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 10:58 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  I think it is a terrific idea. I actually have my own test. I don't hire anyone that doesn't show up to the interview with a wedding ring (show stopper) and I give preference to those that have a social media account with evidence of children (not allowed to ask that question). My experience is those with family obligations are far less likely to cause problems and don't have time to get into petty social schit among coworkers. The only exception is for overseas requirements in which the opposite is true and those with families separating themselves are more likely to quit or get distracted with long distance problems.

A lot of employers don't think like you.

A lot of them say "oh great, a single and childless person, we can ask them to come on weekends and make long-distance trips to see clients and relocate them whenever we need to relocate someone".

Yup. Last few years I've been traveling for work for a Mothers Day Weekend Event. They know that I'm single and my mom died when I was in college, so our family doesn't get together on Mothers Day. Most everyone else capable of working that weekend is either married, or has family obligations that weekend. I don't.

That being said, I actually enjoy traveling that weekend because it stops a lot of awkward questions. I've found that being single is usually more of a help than a hindrance. Only once do I ever remember a prospective employer making a big deal about by marital status.

(05-17-2017 05:47 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 10:58 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  I think it is a terrific idea. I actually have my own test. I don't hire anyone that doesn't show up to the interview with a wedding ring (show stopper) and I give preference to those that have a social media account with evidence of children (not allowed to ask that question). My experience is those with family obligations are far less likely to cause problems and don't have time to get into petty social schit among coworkers. The only exception is for overseas requirements in which the opposite is true and those with families separating themselves are more likely to quit or get distracted with long distance problems.

A lot of employers don't think like you.

A lot of them say "oh great, a single and childless person, we can ask them to come on weekends and make long-distance trips to see clients and relocate them whenever we need to relocate someone".

Depends on the industry. In construction you are 100% correct. When I was working for a national GC they thought like that. Now I work for an Enginnering company. Not nearly as demanding regarding travel and not having a say in where you have to go.

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(05-17-2017 04:48 PM)smudge12 Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 10:58 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  I actually have my own test. I don't hire anyone that doesn't show up to the interview with a wedding ring (show stopper) and I give preference to those that have a social media account with evidence of children (not allowed to ask that question). My experience is those with family obligations are far less likely to cause problems and don't have time to get into petty social schit among coworkers. The only exception is for overseas requirements in which the opposite is true and those with families separating themselves are more likely to quit or get distracted with long distance problems.

Completely illegal in Virginia:

"The Virginia Human Rights Act makes it illegal for an employer to discriminate on the basis of race, color, religion, national origin, sex, pregnancy, childbirth or related medical conditions, age, marital status or disability (physical or mental)."

http://law.lis.virginia.gov/vacodepopula...ights-act/
http://www.workplacefairness.org/file_VA

if they can prove it.

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(05-17-2017 05:53 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 05:47 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 10:58 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  I think it is a terrific idea. I actually have my own test. I don't hire anyone that doesn't show up to the interview with a wedding ring (show stopper) and I give preference to those that have a social media account with evidence of children (not allowed to ask that question). My experience is those with family obligations are far less likely to cause problems and don't have time to get into petty social schit among coworkers. The only exception is for overseas requirements in which the opposite is true and those with families separating themselves are more likely to quit or get distracted with long distance problems.

A lot of employers don't think like you.

A lot of them say "oh great, a single and childless person, we can ask them to come on weekends and make long-distance trips to see clients and relocate them whenever we need to relocate someone".

Depends on the industry. In construction you are 100% correct. When I was working for a national GC they thought like that. Now I work for an Enginnering company. Not nearly as demanding regarding travel and not having a say in where you have to go.

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I never realized how much of a burden traveling for work is on families till I made friends with a family whose father travels for about 60 percent of the month. I tutor their kids on the side, and you can tell how much that period takes a toll on them when he's out of town.

He's a great father, and traveling is what helps the family make it financially, but boy its tough on them.

(05-17-2017 11:27 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(05-17-2017 11:24 AM)UofMstateU Wrote:  I know of a company that asks the candidate "whats the maximum number of days per month a person should be allowed to call in sick."

You can filter out a lot of future grief with that one.

How is the answer to that not trivially "only up to the number of sick days he/she has accrued" ? Seems like a silly question.

The answer is...i have no idea, i cant remember it ever being something ive had to consider personally.

* unless you are applying to for an HR job.

The vast majority of our travel is to DC, which is 2 hours away and never involves weekends. We enjoy a good work life balance. I'd guess I put in real hours 3-4 weekends per year aside from minor email/text banter. I'd rather have someone more likely to be responsible and that I can develop and pay for training and that will stick around than someone I can burn out that will jump ship.

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