(03-03-2017 04:12 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  so KXL is about 1/2 to 2/3 complete. 75% of the pipe is under contract , in production or in place. so what do you think this quote means?

http://www.platts.com/latest-news/metals...n-21038087

Quote:"We have cleared the way for the construction of the Keystone and Dakota Access pipelines -- thereby creating tens of thousands of jobs -- and I've issued a new directive that new American pipelines be made with American steel," Trump said.

NEW pipelines... NEW.

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Your post is a perfect example of what I've talked about elsewhere, specifically that those on the left are wasting a tremendous amount of emotional energy trying to find something, ANYTHING, to fault Trump for.

In the end we all know what it means.....basically, Trump's kicking their asses.

and poof! LazyTom disappears.

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(03-03-2017 03:46 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  Problem is that apparently the contracts were all in place. KXL is a private project being built by a Canadian owned company so they are not beholden to any buy America clause. That said, I hope that Trump can negotiate something.

Gotcha, as long as American products are competitive that project will have American steel/pipe. USA manufactures sell more steel to Canadian companies that anyone else.

(03-03-2017 05:05 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  and poof! LazyTom disappears.

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He lost again, Trump Winning!

(03-03-2017 04:12 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  so KXL is about 1/2 to 2/3 complete. 75% of the pipe is under contract , in production or in place. so what do you think this quote means?

http://www.platts.com/latest-news/metals...n-21038087

Quote:"We have cleared the way for the construction of the Keystone and Dakota Access pipelines -- thereby creating tens of thousands of jobs -- and I've issued a new directive that new American pipelines be made with American steel," Trump said.

NEW pipelines... NEW.

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Wait....you are saying that Lazytom got all hysterical and bent out of shape over absolutely nothing?

Nag nag nag...not winning voters

best advice I can give LazyTom - stop being a stereotype.

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Keystone Pipeline = no oil for Americans

Trump sold us out to a business owned by Canadians.

(03-03-2017 03:28 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  DJT wants to build a pipeline to allow a FLOOD of cheap Canadian production undercut American producers

Canadian Oil is not a product, it's the raw material that we will process down here.

You have a solid point about the exemption but you continue to go "full retard*" with anything regarding trump.

* - I'm not implying you're retarded, I'm using the expression from Tropic Thunder.

...and I've issued a new directive that new American pipelines be made with American steel," Trump said.

Um, let me see. I think it says "NEW" American pipelines. Keystone is not new by a long stretch and the pipes for the project are still sitting there waiting to be installed. Pipelines that HAD ALREADY BEEN BOUGHT.

Next thing you know Tommy will cry for a congressional investigation. HE LIED, HE LIED, HE LIED!

(03-03-2017 05:05 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  and poof! LazyTom disappears.

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And poof, Lazytom had something to do.

I stand by my assertion that Keystone XL won't bring any net jobs to the US. Just allow a flood of heretonow trapped Canadian production flood through our country where it will be put on ships for China. It will undercut American producers. And now, we aren't even going to get jobs from the construction.

(03-03-2017 07:55 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 05:05 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  and poof! LazyTom disappears.

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And poof, Lazytom had something to do.

I stand by my assertion that Keystone XL won't bring any net jobs to the US.

You could have asserted that without starting this thread of lies.

and do you mean "net" jobs or "new" jobs?

Quote:Just allow a flood of heretonow trapped Canadian production flood through our country where it will be put on ships for China. It will undercut American producers. And now, we aren't even going to get jobs from the construction.

I dont think you understand how any of this works.

(03-03-2017 09:09 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 07:55 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 05:05 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  and poof! LazyTom disappears.

Sent from my SM-J700T using CSNbbs mobile app

And poof, Lazytom had something to do.

I stand by my assertion that Keystone XL won't bring any net jobs to the US.

You could have asserted that without starting this thread of lies.

and do you mean "net" jobs or "new" jobs?

Quote:Just allow a flood of heretonow trapped Canadian production flood through our country where it will be put on ships for China. It will undercut American producers. And now, we aren't even going to get jobs from the construction.

I dont think you understand how any of this works.

Yea, I have no understanding of how energy pricing works, supply and demand considerations involving Canadian oil/natural gas. I know nothing about TransCanada. I also know nothing about the impact of switching costs/considerations between different fuel sources, including coal. I also know nothing about US refining capacity and import sourcing in order to reexport.

Look, this stupid pipeline is going to cost jobs. American production jobs. It will replace those jobs with Canadian production jobs. Currently our refiners either purchase oil from outside the USA or inside the USA to refine, and then either send these refined products to domestic or international markets. Due to a global refining shortage (but not one in the USA), we do refine for others. This does provide jobs, but know this....current Texas refining utilization is 93 percent in Texas Gulf Coast refineries. Any new product is just either going to get shipped unrefined overseas or it will simply displace oil from somewhere else. Either way, few new jobs. BTW, the national refining capacity utilization...is 91 percent.

This pipeline was not sold as a way to substitute Canadian oil for Colombian Oil.....It was sold on jobs.

And yes, there's a lot of Canadian oil, especially oil sand production, that isn't price competitive with US production, but......there's a lot of cheap Canadian oil too. And they wouldn't be building the pipe to lose money on the barrels shipped.

And I don't see where the job creation is going to come from. I do know where the job losses are going to come from.

This whole pipeline was cynically sold as somehow providing jobs to Americans. Net net, this is a loser for everyone in this country except the pipeline owner and their investors.

(03-03-2017 10:47 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 09:09 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 07:55 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 05:05 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  and poof! LazyTom disappears.

Sent from my SM-J700T using CSNbbs mobile app

And poof, Lazytom had something to do.

I stand by my assertion that Keystone XL won't bring any net jobs to the US.

You could have asserted that without starting this thread of lies.

and do you mean "net" jobs or "new" jobs?

Quote:Just allow a flood of heretonow trapped Canadian production flood through our country where it will be put on ships for China. It will undercut American producers. And now, we aren't even going to get jobs from the construction.

I dont think you understand how any of this works.

Yea, I have no understanding of how energy pricing works, supply and demand considerations involving Canadian oil/natural gas. I know nothing about TransCanada. I also know nothing about the impact of switching costs/considerations between different fuel sources, including coal. I also know nothing about US refining capacity and import sourcing in order to reexport.

Look, this stupid pipeline is going to cost jobs. American production jobs. It will replace those jobs with Canadian production jobs. Currently our refiners either purchase oil from outside the USA or inside the USA to refine, and then either send these refined products to domestic or international markets. Due to a global refining shortage (but not one in the USA), we do refine for others. This does provide jobs, but know this....current Texas refining utilization is 93 percent in Texas Gulf Coast refineries. Any new product is just either going to get shipped unrefined overseas or it will simply displace oil from somewhere else. Either way, few new jobs. BTW, the national refining capacity utilization...is 91 percent.

This pipeline was not sold as a way to substitute Canadian oil for Colombian Oil.....It was sold on jobs.

And yes, there's a lot of Canadian oil, especially oil sand production, that isn't price competitive with US production, but......there's a lot of cheap Canadian oil too. And they wouldn't be building the pipe to lose money on the barrels shipped.

And I don't see where the job creation is going to come from. I do know where the job losses are going to come from.

This whole pipeline was cynically sold as somehow providing jobs to Americans. Net net, this is a loser for everyone in this country except the pipeline owner and their investors.

So, job creators!

Maybe they'll buy a yacht or build a mansion in Houston or even eat some sammiches at the South Dakota Subway.

jobs, jobs, jobs.

(03-04-2017 02:11 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 10:47 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 09:09 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 07:55 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 05:05 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  and poof! LazyTom disappears.

Sent from my SM-J700T using CSNbbs mobile app

And poof, Lazytom had something to do.

I stand by my assertion that Keystone XL won't bring any net jobs to the US.

You could have asserted that without starting this thread of lies.

and do you mean "net" jobs or "new" jobs?

Quote:Just allow a flood of heretonow trapped Canadian production flood through our country where it will be put on ships for China. It will undercut American producers. And now, we aren't even going to get jobs from the construction.

I dont think you understand how any of this works.

Yea, I have no understanding of how energy pricing works, supply and demand considerations involving Canadian oil/natural gas. I know nothing about TransCanada. I also know nothing about the impact of switching costs/considerations between different fuel sources, including coal. I also know nothing about US refining capacity and import sourcing in order to reexport.

Look, this stupid pipeline is going to cost jobs. American production jobs. It will replace those jobs with Canadian production jobs. Currently our refiners either purchase oil from outside the USA or inside the USA to refine, and then either send these refined products to domestic or international markets. Due to a global refining shortage (but not one in the USA), we do refine for others. This does provide jobs, but know this....current Texas refining utilization is 93 percent in Texas Gulf Coast refineries. Any new product is just either going to get shipped unrefined overseas or it will simply displace oil from somewhere else. Either way, few new jobs. BTW, the national refining capacity utilization...is 91 percent.

This pipeline was not sold as a way to substitute Canadian oil for Colombian Oil.....It was sold on jobs.

And yes, there's a lot of Canadian oil, especially oil sand production, that isn't price competitive with US production, but......there's a lot of cheap Canadian oil too. And they wouldn't be building the pipe to lose money on the barrels shipped.

And I don't see where the job creation is going to come from. I do know where the job losses are going to come from.

This whole pipeline was cynically sold as somehow providing jobs to Americans. Net net, this is a loser for everyone in this country except the pipeline owner and their investors.

So, job creators!

Maybe they'll buy a yacht or build a mansion in Houston or even eat some sammiches at the South Dakota Subway.

jobs, jobs, jobs.

The mansions will use Trump... American Steel. That I can tell you.

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk

(03-03-2017 03:28 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  DJT wants to build a pipeline to allow a FLOOD of cheap Canadian production undercut American producers

Uh, I could be wrong, but isn't a significant percentage of the oil to be sent via Keystone from Canadian oilsands? If so, it's anything but cheap Canadian production.

And btw, that statement of yours is a YUGE stretch to find something to whine about.

(03-04-2017 07:35 AM)TechRocks Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 03:28 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  DJT wants to build a pipeline to allow a FLOOD of cheap Canadian production undercut American producers

Uh, I could be wrong, but isn't a significant percentage of the oil to be sent via Keystone from Canadian oilsands? If so, it's anything but cheap Canadian production.

And btw, that statement of yours is a YUGE stretch to find something to whine about.

correct. their wages are also higher.

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(03-04-2017 07:09 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(03-04-2017 02:11 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 10:47 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 09:09 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 07:55 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  And poof, Lazytom had something to do.

I stand by my assertion that Keystone XL won't bring any net jobs to the US.

You could have asserted that without starting this thread of lies.

and do you mean "net" jobs or "new" jobs?

Quote:Just allow a flood of heretonow trapped Canadian production flood through our country where it will be put on ships for China. It will undercut American producers. And now, we aren't even going to get jobs from the construction.

I dont think you understand how any of this works.

Yea, I have no understanding of how energy pricing works, supply and demand considerations involving Canadian oil/natural gas. I know nothing about TransCanada. I also know nothing about the impact of switching costs/considerations between different fuel sources, including coal. I also know nothing about US refining capacity and import sourcing in order to reexport.

Look, this stupid pipeline is going to cost jobs. American production jobs. It will replace those jobs with Canadian production jobs. Currently our refiners either purchase oil from outside the USA or inside the USA to refine, and then either send these refined products to domestic or international markets. Due to a global refining shortage (but not one in the USA), we do refine for others. This does provide jobs, but know this....current Texas refining utilization is 93 percent in Texas Gulf Coast refineries. Any new product is just either going to get shipped unrefined overseas or it will simply displace oil from somewhere else. Either way, few new jobs. BTW, the national refining capacity utilization...is 91 percent.

This pipeline was not sold as a way to substitute Canadian oil for Colombian Oil.....It was sold on jobs.

And yes, there's a lot of Canadian oil, especially oil sand production, that isn't price competitive with US production, but......there's a lot of cheap Canadian oil too. And they wouldn't be building the pipe to lose money on the barrels shipped.

And I don't see where the job creation is going to come from. I do know where the job losses are going to come from.

This whole pipeline was cynically sold as somehow providing jobs to Americans. Net net, this is a loser for everyone in this country except the pipeline owner and their investors.

So, job creators!

Maybe they'll buy a yacht or build a mansion in Houston or even eat some sammiches at the South Dakota Subway.

jobs, jobs, jobs.

The mansions will use Trump... American Steel. That I can tell you.

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk

Not any more than they do now. They'll use the most competitive steel and yacht builders. I can promise you the last thing on most people's minds when they build a McMansion or buy a jet is ..... does this builder use American inputs?

(03-04-2017 07:35 AM)TechRocks Wrote:  

(03-03-2017 03:28 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  DJT wants to build a pipeline to allow a FLOOD of cheap Canadian production undercut American producers

Uh, I could be wrong, but isn't a significant percentage of the oil to be sent via Keystone from Canadian oilsands? If so, it's anything but cheap Canadian production.

And btw, that statement of yours is a YUGE stretch to find something to whine about.

The environmentalists claim that the Keystone XL pipeline will be used to move oilsand production to the USA. They argue that oilsand production is really bad for the environment. And they're correct (and I don't oppose oil production)

But that's not my reason to oppose Keystone XL.

Remember there's a difference between the 'cost' of production once you've already invested in it, and the cost of production before any investment is sunk. And average cost doesn't account for the fact that some of that oil sand production isn't as expensive as the largest areas. TransCanada isn't going to invest in a pipeline that will increase their losses. They're willing to spend billions on their ability to compete with American production.

But the oil sand argument isn't really relevant to an American production worker. Will the pipe increase supply? Yes. Will that oil decrease prices for American producers? Yep. Will that impact staffing and investment in American oil production? Yep.

Will that lower oil price mean lower prices for American consumers for gasoline? Maybe not. In an environment where refining capacity is running at close to 100 percent, its just as likely that the refiners simply take the difference as profits. Remember, we now allow American refiners to use their excess capacity to import oil and produce gasoline for export purposes. Additional oil might equal lower prices for American producers without a discernable reduction in prices for American consumers.

----

This stupid pipeline can't be justified as a job creator in the USA.

The Buy American Act is primarily used on projects that have federal funding. Typically you cannot buy products from banned countries unless that's the only place you can buy it. The other caveat is if during the manufacturing process if 51%or more is done in the US it meets Buy American.