(09-01-2016 09:42 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 09:16 AM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  And further cement the B12 as the weakest conference and harm its chances the playoff each year.... Sure.

What does that matter to Texas or Oklahoma? If they go undefeated, or 1-loss, they're in the playoffs regardless of who they play. It's the Baylors and TCUs of the world that have to worry about conference legitimacy.

Because only the top 4 ranked teams get in. I can in more years than not see an undefeated B12 with wins over Tulane, Rice, Kansas, Iowa State, and 1-2 patsies getting passed over and maxing out at a ranking pre-bowls at 5-8.

Strength of schedule is a factor.

(09-01-2016 08:24 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  What if the Big 12 pulls a big 12 and adds a combination of teams out of left field...

If, say, the Big 12 adds:

• Tulane
• Rice
• Air Force Academy
• Colorado State
  

What then? If the Big 12 is looking for academic adds, and teams that won't get in the way of Oklahoma or Texas getting into the Playoffs, I could legitimately see this happening... not to mention, these teams expand the footprint while still being in the footprint.

You are right... This is completely insane.

(09-01-2016 09:51 AM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 09:42 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 09:16 AM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  And further cement the B12 as the weakest conference and harm its chances the playoff each year.... Sure.

What does that matter to Texas or Oklahoma? If they go undefeated, or 1-loss, they're in the playoffs regardless of who they play. It's the Baylors and TCUs of the world that have to worry about conference legitimacy.

Because only the top 4 ranked teams get in. I can in more years than not see an undefeated B12 with wins over Tulane, Rice, Kansas, Iowa State, and 1-2 patsies getting passed over and maxing out at a ranking pre-bowls at 5-8.

Strength of schedule is a factor.

I don't doubt that, but it's less of a factor for the P5, and even more so for the blue-blooded programs of the P5.

Just look at 2015 Oklahoma and 2014 Baylor. Only major difference is Oklahoma beat a (then) ranked Tennessee, and Baylor loaded up their OOC with a whole lot of nothing, and even then Baylor almost got in.

(09-01-2016 09:51 AM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 09:42 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 09:16 AM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  And further cement the B12 as the weakest conference and harm its chances the playoff each year.... Sure.

What does that matter to Texas or Oklahoma? If they go undefeated, or 1-loss, they're in the playoffs regardless of who they play. It's the Baylors and TCUs of the world that have to worry about conference legitimacy.

Because only the top 4 ranked teams get in. I can in more years than not see an undefeated B12 with wins over Tulane, Rice, Kansas, Iowa State, and 1-2 patsies getting passed over and maxing out at a ranking pre-bowls at 5-8.

Strength of schedule is a factor.

Nonsense.

Right now the Big XII plays a 9 game conf schedule. So they play every team-- good or bad.

So lets say it goes to 14 with Tulane, Rice, Airforce and CSU. Now its split into divisions, so there are only 8 conf games, with only 2 out of division. And with the division split, as long as it is balanced with rivalries protected (now allowed) you won't play every team every year. Lets say OU is undefeated. Again they have OOC wins against Akron, Tulsa and a good Tennessee team, and lets say Nebraska.

Their conference schedule includes wins against Top 10 Baylor and OK st, Top 25 TCU, Top 25 WVU, and Texas, but also Iowa State, Colorado St, and Tulane.

They are in. Because that is 1 win better than they were in 2015. When they played the exact same schedule-- except they actually lost to Texas in 2015, played Kansas instead of Tulane (Tulane had a better record), Kansas State instead of CSU (a wash last year) and Texas Tech instead of Nebraska (another wash).

(09-01-2016 08:46 AM)Chappy Wrote:  My "left field" B12 scenario is UConn and BYU football only. UConn moves all other sports to Big East.

This would be an incredibly stupid move on the part of the B12, therefore I believe it could happen.

(09-01-2016 10:10 AM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 09:51 AM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 09:42 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 09:16 AM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  And further cement the B12 as the weakest conference and harm its chances the playoff each year.... Sure.

What does that matter to Texas or Oklahoma? If they go undefeated, or 1-loss, they're in the playoffs regardless of who they play. It's the Baylors and TCUs of the world that have to worry about conference legitimacy.

Because only the top 4 ranked teams get in. I can in more years than not see an undefeated B12 with wins over Tulane, Rice, Kansas, Iowa State, and 1-2 patsies getting passed over and maxing out at a ranking pre-bowls at 5-8.

Strength of schedule is a factor.

Nonsense.

Right now the Big XII plays a 9 game conf schedule. So they play every team-- good or bad.

And they are considered the weakest P5 conference NOW! Go right ahead add schools with no pulse in FB (and little else to offer) and see how they land.....

You fail to disprove this.

(09-01-2016 10:10 AM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  Nonsense.

Right now the Big XII plays a 9 game conf schedule. So they play every team-- good or bad.

So lets say it goes to 14 with Tulane, Rice, Airforce and CSU. Now its split into divisions, so there are only 8 conf games, with only 2 out of division. And with the division split, as long as it is balanced with rivalries protected (now allowed) you won't play every team every year. Lets say OU is undefeated. Again they have OOC wins against Akron, Tulsa and a good Tennessee team, and lets say Nebraska.

Their conference schedule includes wins against Top 10 Baylor and OK st, Top 25 TCU, Top 25 WVU, and Texas, but also Iowa State, Colorado St, and Tulane.

They are in. Because that is 1 win better than they were in 2015. When they played the exact same schedule-- except they actually lost to Texas in 2015, played Kansas instead of Tulane (Tulane had a better record), Kansas State instead of CSU (a wash last year) and Texas Tech instead of Nebraska (another wash).

To further expand (on and did I touch a sensitive subject?....):

Let's play your hypothetical out..... The B12 adds Tulane, Rice, Air Force and CSU.

North: Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, CSU, Air Force
South: UT, Texas Tech, Baylor, TCU, Rice, Tulane, WVU

Oklahoma is undefeated heading into the B12 championship game with wins over an OOC patsy (maybe 2), Kansas, Iowa State, Rice or Tulane, and Colorado State. That's at least two and up to 5 games that only hurt their SOS.

For example in a round robin where Oklahoma did make the playoffs they only had to play Kansas (0-12), Iowa State (3-9) and 2 other "average" teams but considered solid wins over UT and K-State. They barely made the playoff with this lineup. Oklahoma was #7 heading into the week 11 of the rankings and it took wins over #4 Baylor, #11 TCU, and #9 Oklahoma State in the last three weeks to secure a playoff spot.

(09-01-2016 10:32 AM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 10:10 AM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  Nonsense.

Right now the Big XII plays a 9 game conf schedule. So they play every team-- good or bad.

So lets say it goes to 14 with Tulane, Rice, Airforce and CSU. Now its split into divisions, so there are only 8 conf games, with only 2 out of division. And with the division split, as long as it is balanced with rivalries protected (now allowed) you won't play every team every year. Lets say OU is undefeated. Again they have OOC wins against Akron, Tulsa and a good Tennessee team, and lets say Nebraska.

Their conference schedule includes wins against Top 10 Baylor and OK st, Top 25 TCU, Top 25 WVU, and Texas, but also Iowa State, Colorado St, and Tulane.

They are in. Because that is 1 win better than they were in 2015. When they played the exact same schedule-- except they actually lost to Texas in 2015, played Kansas instead of Tulane (Tulane had a better record), Kansas State instead of CSU (a wash last year) and Texas Tech instead of Nebraska (another wash).

To further expand (on and did I touch a sensitive subject?....):

Let's play your hypothetical out..... The B12 adds Tulane, Rice, Air Force and CSU.

North: Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, CSU, Air Force
South: UT, Texas Tech, Baylor, TCU, Rice, Tulane, WVU

Oklahoma is undefeated heading into the B12 championship game with wins over an OOC patsy (maybe 2), Kansas, Iowa State, Rice or Tulane, and Colorado State. That's at least two and up to 5 games that only hurt their SOS.

For example in a round robin where Oklahoma did make the playoffs they only had to play Kansas (0-12), Iowa State (3-9) and 2 other "average" teams but considered solid wins over UT and K-State. They barely made the playoff with this lineup. Oklahoma was #7 heading into the week 11 of the rankings and it took wins over #4 Baylor, #11 TCU, and #9 Oklahoma State in the last three weeks to secure a playoff spot.

And that was a 1 loss OU team. Texas had a losing record that year, and they lost to a team with a losing record.

And they were still in.

11-1 with wins over ranked teams is good enough if your name is OU. It doesn't matter if they got wins 9, 10, and 11 from the likes of Kansas and Iowa State.

Right now they play a schedule with 3 "bad" teams in conference out of a 9 game schedule plus two "bad" OOC games out of three. That isn't any worse from a SOS perspective than playing 3 "bad" teams in conference out of an 8 game schedule plus two "bad" OOC games out of 4.

CSU doesn't hurt SOS. They were even ranked for a time last year. Same can be said for Air-Force. Rice and Tulane will have a had time adjusting. But they are both objectively better than Kansas right now-- maybe even Iowa State.

Does it hurt Ohio State that they play Maryland or Rutgers on top of Purdue, IU, etc? No, it does not.

This is bad concern trolling.

(09-01-2016 08:24 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  What if the Big 12 pulls a big 12 and adds a combination of teams out of left field...

If, say, the Big 12 adds:

• Tulane
• Rice
• Air Force Academy
• Colorado State
  

What then? If the Big 12 is looking for academic adds, and teams that won't get in the way of Oklahoma or Texas getting into the Playoffs, I could legitimately see this happening... not to mention, these teams expand the footprint while still being in the footprint.

The OP title is correct: Crazy

(09-01-2016 10:50 AM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 10:32 AM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  Oklahoma was #7 heading into the week 11 of the rankings and it took wins over #4 Baylor, #11 TCU, and #9 Oklahoma State in the last three weeks to secure a playoff spot.

And that was a 1 loss OU team. Texas had a losing record that year, and they lost to a team with a losing record.

And they were still in.

And if they played more scrubs in FB they would have a bigger hill to climb. Also the Sooners would not have a run of #4, #11, and #9 to jump from #7 to #4 late in the year because those same scrubs would be playing the other schools.

Man Tulane fan is sensitive........ When you have a pulse in any sport other than baseball give me a call.

(09-01-2016 10:50 AM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  And that was a 1 loss OU team. Texas had a losing record that year, and they lost to a team with a losing record.

And they were still in.

Oh I know Texas sucked last year but like it or not a loss to Texas stings a lot less than a loss to a Rice.

(09-01-2016 10:50 AM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  11-1 with wins over ranked teams is good enough if your name is OU. It doesn't matter if they got wins 9, 10, and 11 from the likes of Kansas and Iowa State.

It is good enough to get into the Top 10 maybe Top 5 but you have to be in the Top 4 of the PLAYOFF RANKINGS to get in the playoffs. The AP and Coaches polls are only part of the formula. They absolutely consider SOS.

(09-01-2016 10:50 AM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  Right now they play a schedule with 3 "bad" teams in conference out of a 9 game schedule plus two "bad" OOC games out of three. That isn't any worse from a SOS perspective than playing 3 "bad" teams in conference out of an 8 game schedule plus two "bad" OOC games out of 4.

Ok I can say that is a fair argument but that only strengthens my point because those numbers would only increase in the OP proposal.

(09-01-2016 10:50 AM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  CSU doesn't hurt SOS. They were even ranked for a time last year. Same can be said for Air-Force. Rice and Tulane will have a had time adjusting. But they are both objectively better than Kansas right now-- maybe even Iowa State.

CSU spent 0 weeks ranked last year..... Try again.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_NCAA_...l_rankings

(09-01-2016 10:50 AM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  Does it hurt Ohio State that they play Maryland or Rutgers on top of Purdue, IU, etc? No, it does not.

This is bad concern trolling.

If more than a third of their slate was sub .500 (and perennial under .500) teams then yes.

(09-01-2016 11:14 AM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 10:50 AM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 10:32 AM)GO Coogs GO!!! Wrote:  Oklahoma was #7 heading into the week 11 of the rankings and it took wins over #4 Baylor, #11 TCU, and #9 Oklahoma State in the last three weeks to secure a playoff spot.

And that was a 1 loss OU team. Texas had a losing record that year, and they lost to a team with a losing record.

And they were still in.

And if they played more scrubs in FB they would have a bigger hill to climb. Also the Sooners would not have a run of #4, #11, and #9 to jump from #7 to #4 late in the year because those same scrubs would be playing the other schools.

Man Tulane fan is sensitive........ When you have a pulse in any sport other than baseball give me a call.

You keep repeating yourself, but you haven't demonstrated why or how there would be more "scrubs" in an 8 team conference schedule with protected cross division rivalries than a 9 game round robin schedule with only 3 OOC and no championship game.

A third of OU's schedule was sub .500 in 2015. Tulsa, Texas, Kansas State, Kansas, Iowa State.

Try again.

(09-01-2016 08:46 AM)Chappy Wrote:  My "left field" B12 scenario is UConn and BYU football only. UConn moves all other sports to Big East.

Why in the world would any conference want Uconn football only? The only reason you take Uconn is for their basketball team.

Excuse me, it was 2014.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_NCAA_...l_rankings

Also, OU willingly scheduling a home and home with Tulane starting in 2017 sort of blows this whole "they are schedule toxic stay away" bs out of the water....

(09-01-2016 10:52 AM)fishpro1098 Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 08:24 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  What if the Big 12 pulls a big 12 and adds a combination of teams out of left field...

If, say, the Big 12 adds:

• Tulane
• Rice
• Air Force Academy
• Colorado State
  

What then? If the Big 12 is looking for academic adds, and teams that won't get in the way of Oklahoma or Texas getting into the Playoffs, I could legitimately see this happening... not to mention, these teams expand the footprint while still being in the footprint.

The OP title is correct: Crazy

My thoughts exactly & it would insure the B12 virtually never gets in the nat'l playoffs with a 1-loss team because the new schools would be such a drain on the SOS.

(09-01-2016 12:02 PM)First Mate Wrote:  

(09-01-2016 08:46 AM)Chappy Wrote:  My "left field" B12 scenario is UConn and BYU football only. UConn moves all other sports to Big East.

Why in the world would any conference want Uconn football only? The only reason you take Uconn is for their basketball team.

1. If it's obvious, it's not out of left field.

2. Because this is the Big 12 we're talking about.

3. UConn football, while young, does have a BCS appearance and a history in a power conference.

4a. Travel for football is less of an issue than travel in all the other sports, 4b and you divide the NCAA money fewer ways if you just add football schools.

5. Presidents are making this decision, and they probably would rather see their schools associating with UConn than Memphis or Houston or Cincinnati even.

(09-01-2016 12:01 PM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  A third of OU's schedule was sub .500 in 2015. Tulsa, Texas, Kansas State, Kansas, Iowa State.

Try again.

Can you read? I said more than a third.............. Man you have to be dense.

Ok let me dilute this to its simplest terms to get it to your level. Using an ACC say Clemson's schedule (since they have 14) and substituting the in conference games only lets see how that would look......

WK1 Woffard
WK2 Appalachian State
WK3 Baylor (in place of Louisville)
WK4 Notre Dame
WK5 Kansas State (in place of Georgia Tech)
WK6 Colorado State (in place of Boston College)
WK7 Air Force (in place of Miami)
WK8 Iowa State (in place of NC State)
WK9 Texas (in place of Florida State)
WK10 Kansas (in place of Syracuse)
WK11 Oklahoma State (in place of Wake Forest)
WK12 Texas (in place of South Carolina)

We can all agree Notre Dame is strong but Appalachian State (good) and Woffard (bad) aren't going to cut it. You are basically counting on Notre Dame level opponent OOC every year to be in the discussion and you better win that game.

As for +/- in the new B12 conference it's at least a -2 over what Clemson played last year and again this is a best case with a solid Baylor and avoiding Tulane or Rice.

Again more often than not a B12 with that lineup would be excluded only delusional fans like you think otherwise.

And I am not even getting into the schedule that the South winner would play that they would play in the championship game.....

(09-01-2016 12:04 PM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  Also, OU willingly scheduling a home and home with Tulane starting in 2017 sort of blows this whole "they are schedule toxic stay away" bs out of the water....

Being an OOC patsy and someone you are relying on to bolster your conference are two different things.

It's a shame I have to explain that to you.