(11-03-2015 05:19 PM)MJG Wrote:  

(11-03-2015 10:34 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  No, BSU won't go Indy. They'll put the sports into the WAC because the Big West will make them pay $1 million/year just to be part of the conference on top of any regular dues.

BSU though, isn't a dumb as BYU to go Indy. They wouldn't get to an Access bowl without being in a conference and that matters a lot to every school, except BYU apparently.

Say BYU or any independent besides ND gets Access to the Access bowl in the future.
Then the MWC demands even revenue sharing in the TV contract.
The UNLV AD has already complained and AF and CSU received none of the performance money despite good years.

Could you see Boise trying it then?

Don't bother arguing against the scenario I don't think it will happen.

The MW has changed the terms of the Bonus structure now to where it is pooled and distributed more evenly, even though BSU gets there cut still. The western teams complained enough to have the terms changed.
http://www.rgj.com/story/sports/college/.../74767046/

You have to answer a poll to get the article.

(11-03-2015 12:22 PM)solohawks Wrote:  If the G5 California Schools ever got creative (Fresno, SDSU, SJSU) I wonder how much more money they could get for pooling their football TV rights and moving all other sports to the Big West. SDSU was all about the Big East/West combo and who could blame them. Their most profitable sport in the most profitable situation and their non revenue sports in the most travel friendly conference possible. I doubt the MWC would let them have a deal like Hawaii, but I wonder if the three of them did it together if they could make independence work.

There is NO way the Big West will ever go for that. There wouldn't be any more stability as those three don't really want to go back and they would always have a foot out the door. Plus all we would hear are complaints that their basketball is allegedly going to be hurt - A bunch of BS by the way, but I digress.

Your proposal won't work without a Boise, Nevada, UNLV or even Utah State. The conference needs another presence outside the state, not three more Cal States to reinforce the bus league stereotype. The Big West might be better off killing the WAC with Seattle and Grand Canyon and making a play for NMSU.

(11-03-2015 03:35 PM)HarmonOliphantOberlanderDevine Wrote:  Because of BYU's independence, they have one of the most diverse schedules in the nation. As a college football fan, I love it. More independents please.

I agree.

Independence gives you the ability to schedule a lot of interesting match-ups that a G5 league just couldn't offer.

(11-03-2015 12:56 PM)YNot Wrote:  It's interesting to think about whether the MWC made a mistake by gutting the WAC. Before, the WAC was third class status behind the PAC and MWC. Now, most of the schools that were in that third tier have been elevated to the second tier (SJSU and Utah St. as main beneficiaries). So, there really isn't a third tier in the West.

What if the MWC had expanded to add Texas-region schools and fewer WAC schools?

I may have my timelines wrong, but the MWC could have picked up Boise St. and Fresno St. - and then gone to Houston, SMU, Tulsa, and UTEP, instead of the WAC. This may have helped the MWC to have more national relevance today because of the broader footprint - that would still cover California and the Mountain West states, but also Texas and Oklahoma (SJSU, Utah St., Nevada, and Hawaii don't really 'deliver' any tremendous market share not already within the MWC market).

MWC WEST: SDSU, Fresno, UNLV, Boise St., CSU, Wyoming
MWC EAST: Houston, SMU, Tulsa, UTEP, New Mexico, Air Force

The WAC would be: Hawaii, SJSU, Nevada, Idaho, Utah St., NMSU, and perhaps UTSA and Texas St. or N. Texas

You bring up an important point.

I really think the MWC damaged itself by taking in so many WAC schools. The league was better when it was an 8 school league of solid programs who had enough room on the schedule to play some P5 opponents.

I don't think Boise would have a bad time with independence. They would get more P5 match-ups which would lead to greater exposure. That is the name of the game. You have to play decent opponents and you have to beat them more often than not. That's how programs go from G5 to P5.

(11-03-2015 12:38 PM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  The only schools that are independent are those to whom regional exposure means almost nothing. ND, BYU, and Army all desire national exposure due to their unique missions. And in the case of BYU, they seek to proselytize nationally.

Along these lines, the only other schools who might benefit from going indy are those who recruit students on a national level - namely Navy, Air Force, and top academic schools like Duke, Stanford, Northwestern, and Vandy.

You could argue that other religious schools like TCU, SMU, Wake, Tulsa, and Baylor might use their exposure to proselytize like BYU, but to my knowledge the religious character of those institutions is less prominent than at BYU.

Wake Forest is a non-sectarian private school ... AFAIU, Wake Forest Baptist Medical Center is not because WF is Baptist, but because they cooperated with Baptists to form the Medical Center. And while Tulsa is affiliated with the Presbyterians, the Wikipedia Machine says that it was formed by a merger from a previous Presbyterian college with an effort to start a Methodist college in Tulsa, so I don't reckon they are as directly controlled by the Presbyterian Church either.

The religious character is definitely less at TCU, which may have one or more people on their board from the Church of Christ to look after the money that the Church has put into the University, but is not governed by the CoC. Nor at SMU, where it means there is a University Chaplain and such, but AFAIU, the Methodist Episcopal Church is not as strong a force in running SMU as the Church of LDS elders are in running BYU.

Even if it was a strong at Baylor, Baylor is associated with the Baptist General Convention of Texas, so they would still have a primarily regional focus (even though the BGCT cooperates with Southern Baptists for overseas missions and such).

So, yes, its a select group of even religious affiliated schools that have more strongly national as opposed to regional missions.

(11-03-2015 10:56 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  

(11-03-2015 12:22 PM)solohawks Wrote:  If the G5 California Schools ever got creative (Fresno, SDSU, SJSU) I wonder how much more money they could get for pooling their football TV rights and moving all other sports to the Big West. SDSU was all about the Big East/West combo and who could blame them. Their most profitable sport in the most profitable situation and their non revenue sports in the most travel friendly conference possible. I doubt the MWC would let them have a deal like Hawaii, but I wonder if the three of them did it together if they could make independence work.

There is NO way the Big West will ever go for that. There wouldn't be any more stability as those three don't really want to go back and they would always have a foot out the door. Plus all we would hear are complaints that their basketball is allegedly going to be hurt - A bunch of BS by the way, but I digress.

Your proposal won't work without a Boise, Nevada, UNLV or even Utah State. The conference needs another presence outside the state, not three more Cal States to reinforce the bus league stereotype. The Big West might be better off killing the WAC with Seattle and Grand Canyon and making a play for NMSU.

Big west was excited about welcoming sdsu back into the fold. I dont see why they would not want the other big cal state schools too. Why does the big west need a presence in Nevada or Idaho? How would that help

(11-03-2015 11:33 PM)solohawks Wrote:  Big west was excited about welcoming sdsu back into the fold. I dont see why they would not want the other big cal state schools too. Why does the big west need a presence in Nevada or Idaho? How would that help

The BW commissioner would sell his soul to get San Diego, San Jose and Fresno State all back in the fold. He has also said the goal is 10 California members (currently there are eight). Re-adding SDSU, Fresno and San Jose increases that number to 11 and at some point, enough is enough - even for him. The conference needs to shed its bus league reputation and three more California schools only strengthens it. And no exposure outside the state except for Hawaii. Not enough.

San Jose State is the weakest link of the three. They are a mess right now in basketball and was 0-28 vs D1 opponents a year ago. One NCAA bid in 20 years and four winning seasons in 30. As long as they are determined to make football work, basketball will always be viewed as secondary. Doesn't matter that they are located in one of the largest markets in the country, or that they are a natural travel partner for UC Davis. Right now SJSU will only drag a conference down. They haven't shown any signs of changing that.

The conference needs a presence in Nevada either because UC Davis is all by themselves up north and Reno addresses that issue, or because it's Las Vegas and they are a game changer nationally. Nevada and UNLV would both improve and increase the amount of regional exposure and UNLV would bring in extra national exposure.

As for Boise, they have some cash flowing from football and an improving basketball profile. Plus they can also team up with Seattle University and give the BW a nice presence in the Pacific Northwest.

Answering the OP:

No. Boise would not go independent in football IF it meant giving up their sweetheart ESPN tv deal. They would also have a difficult time finding a good home for basketball.

(11-03-2015 10:18 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  If so, would the WCC pick them up for olympic sports?