I just can't buy anything out of this. Long term could the Big 12 end up raided and then greatly demoted? Sure. Could I realistically see the other 4 conferences dividing up the Big 12 now? No way on this planet. The benefits of 4 conferences vs. 5 are greatly over-stated, the conferences would face difficult divisional discussions again, and most the schools don't provide enough value to warrant the hassle at this point (outside the conference getting Texas).

(06-30-2015 10:35 PM)ohio1317 Wrote:  I just can't buy anything out of this. Long term could the Big 12 end up raided and then greatly demoted? Sure. Could I realistically see the other 4 conferences dividing up the Big 12 now? No way on this planet. The benefits of 4 conferences vs. 5 are greatly over-stated, the conferences would face difficult divisional discussions again, and most the schools don't provide enough value to warrant the hassle at this point (outside the conference getting Texas).

Hey, a realignment tweet about Oklahoma and Texas is the Tetra Min of the College Sports and Realignment forum/aquarium. I mean what better timing really? Greece could default, Puerto Rico could take the dollar down a peg or two, we are in the dead period, so a tweet about the imminent demise of a P5 conference creates a posting feeding frenzy.

I've toured around tonight and it has done the same on pretty much all boards. So please since we agree that the economy is the real issue and that it helped to drive realignment as a social phenomenon, let's just sit back and enjoy the show. Lighten up! You have the natty this year so enjoy those who want to feel like they have a hand in reshaping the college football world by their opinions since in the real world nobody asks us diddly about what we think. Therein lies the allure of realignment talk. It is the Gordian knot of our age and has more permutations to it than Rubik's Cube. Besides, the really fun part is this is exactly the time of the year and kinds of info leaks that started it all before.

(06-30-2015 10:14 PM)Okielite Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 09:54 PM)bluesox Wrote:  I could see where all the other p5 leagues could be involved with the big 12 dissolving. Yet, i can't really see them agreeing to who goes where, i.e. the pac 12 being happy with the leftovers. Maybe just go:

SEC: OU, Ok state
Pac 12: Texas, Tex Tech, Baylor, TCU
ACC: WVU
Big 10: KU, Kan State or Iowa state

B1G- OU, KU, Rice, UConn/Houston
ACC- UT Partial, Cinci, WVU/ISU
SEC- TT, OSU, KSU, ISU/WVU.
PAC- forms a scheduling agreement and purchases the content from a newly formed conference they played a role in forming. Essentially they want in the Central time zone and in Texas but won't add these schools for a variety of reasons. SMU, TCU, Baylor, Houston, Rice, BYU, Boise, and UNLV.

We are being played and laughed at but it will happen. The Texoma 4 will end up in the SEC and the tears will be joyous.

I can't wait to welcome Crimson, Gator, Rebels and Tiger fans of either color to Lubbock.

Can you put A&M in the east?

(06-30-2015 10:22 PM)owl at the moon Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 09:15 PM)JRsec Wrote:  8. Both Cowherd and Finebaum work for ESPN. I would think this rumor has some merit. The Mouse has been at work behind the scenes for a while now.

That doesn't make the rumor true. But your point makes sense. Perhaps the intent is to one again spell apparent doom for the Big12 (before it gets dramatically "saved" again).

I wonder what SportsCenter ratings look like when realignment buzz is afoot.

ESPN wants this to happen. The threat of Oklahoma in the SEC should nothing happen until the GoR runs out is quite a threat. It also provides cover fire for Oklahoma because it makes it seem like them going to The Big Ten is a compromise for them.

(06-30-2015 11:06 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 10:22 PM)owl at the moon Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 09:15 PM)JRsec Wrote:  8. Both Cowherd and Finebaum work for ESPN. I would think this rumor has some merit. The Mouse has been at work behind the scenes for a while now.

That doesn't make the rumor true. But your point makes sense. Perhaps the intent is to one again spell apparent doom for the Big12 (before it gets dramatically "saved" again).

I wonder what SportsCenter ratings look like when realignment buzz is afoot.

ESPN wants this to happen. The threat of Oklahoma in the SEC should nothing happen until the GoR runs out is quite a threat. It also provides cover fire for Oklahoma because it makes it seem like them going to The Big Ten is a compromise for them.

If it plays out with the angle you described it is the leverage I spoke to you about pertaining to getting the ACC to play ball with regards to building their football profile and entails the SEC getting into the Virginia and North Carolina markets at which point we wouldn't care if the Sooners went to the Big 10. With the SECN and those two markets we are talking 45 million per school payout. We'll move to 40 next year now that the overhead has been paid for start up. Those two markets make ESPN and the SEC a pile of money without costing the ACC anything but duplicate market schools. If the ACC gains a network through the compromise and adds gravitas those remaining in the ACC are all better off. And those who departed will still be making more than they would have staying in their old conference home. We'll see. But if the old ACC powers say nyet. Then OU to the SEC will happen.

Oklahoma really can't have Oklahoma St. AND Texas in different conferences.

And I don't see Texas wanting to separate from OU. They've already separated from their other past big rivals-Arkansas, Houston and A&M.

And I don't see any other conference cooperating if it means Texas and OU go to the same place. If its the Big 10 or SEC, every other conference will do their best to sabotage it.

(06-30-2015 10:35 PM)ohio1317 Wrote:  I just can't buy anything out of this. Long term could the Big 12 end up raided and then greatly demoted? Sure. Could I realistically see the other 4 conferences dividing up the Big 12 now? No way on this planet. The benefits of 4 conferences vs. 5 are greatly over-stated, the conferences would face difficult divisional discussions again, and most the schools don't provide enough value to warrant the hassle at this point (outside the conference getting Texas).

I don't know. I think there is something here. Not to mention I think there is plenty of value outside of TX, OK, and KS. Let's take Baylor for example. Athletics are thriving, their stadium and fans growing, with great academics. aTm may not want to share their SEC market with the Longhorns but would the Bears not be tolerable? Not to mention the perfect private school foil for Vanderbilt in the east? The same could be said for Texas Tech and to a lesser degree TCU. Not that TCU isn't a great school, it just doesn't have the SEC feel.
I agree with others though. TX and OK would be the SEC's top choices by far. Not even close. I agree that Texas is the wild card, but I honestly cannot invision a scenario where OK would choose a B1G offer over the SEC. If the BIG 12 is imploding the one thing you can bet on is the SEC gets OK, the B1G gets KS, and WV ends up in ACC to make up for MD. The rest is anybody's guess.

(06-30-2015 11:16 PM)bullet Wrote:  Oklahoma really can't have Oklahoma St. AND Texas in different conferences.

And I don't see Texas wanting to separate from OU. They've already separated from their other past big rivals-Arkansas, Houston and A&M.

And I don't see any other conference cooperating if it means Texas and OU go to the same place. If its the Big 10 or SEC, every other conference will do their best to sabotage it.

Bullet having them in different conferences is the best solution for Oklahoma, not the worst. All of the coaches who give talking points about the future of college football (Alvarez, Saban, Miles, and a few others) have stated that eventually we will be playing an all P4 schedule. When that time comes expect 9 conference games to be the norm and 1 game against a rival in a different conference, per conference to be permitted for those who have rivals elsewhere, and rotating games against schools from the other conferences for those who do not have rivals in those conferences. Such moves will permit Tech to continue to play Georgia, but regrettably not Auburn since both are in the SEC. But if OSU is in one conference and Texas another, and Oklahoma in yet a third then they could still schedule and play one another. The problem for Texas would be having OU and A&M in the same conference. There's the issue should the renewal of the rivalry ever occur.

(06-30-2015 11:32 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 11:16 PM)bullet Wrote:  Oklahoma really can't have Oklahoma St. AND Texas in different conferences.

And I don't see Texas wanting to separate from OU. They've already separated from their other past big rivals-Arkansas, Houston and A&M.

And I don't see any other conference cooperating if it means Texas and OU go to the same place. If its the Big 10 or SEC, every other conference will do their best to sabotage it.

Bullet having them in different conferences is the best solution for Oklahoma, not the worst. All of the coaches who give talking points about the future of college football (Alvarez, Saban, Miles, and a few others) have stated that eventually we will be playing an all P4 schedule. When that time comes expect 9 conference games to be the norm and 1 game against a rival in a different conference, per conference to be permitted for those who have rivals elsewhere, and rotating games against schools from the other conferences for those who do not have rivals in those conferences. Such moves will permit Tech to continue to play Georgia, but regrettably not Auburn since both are in the SEC. But if OSU is in one conference and Texas another, and Oklahoma in yet a third then they could still schedule and play one another. The problem for Texas would be having OU and A&M in the same conference. There's the issue should the renewal of the rivalry ever occur.

The bold part is exactly what a Longhorn said to me over on the Oklahoma board.

Kind of need Texas to be on board with the overall plan in order for it to happen and they are very obstinate.

(06-30-2015 11:34 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 11:32 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 11:16 PM)bullet Wrote:  Oklahoma really can't have Oklahoma St. AND Texas in different conferences.

And I don't see Texas wanting to separate from OU. They've already separated from their other past big rivals-Arkansas, Houston and A&M.

And I don't see any other conference cooperating if it means Texas and OU go to the same place. If its the Big 10 or SEC, every other conference will do their best to sabotage it.

Bullet having them in different conferences is the best solution for Oklahoma, not the worst. All of the coaches who give talking points about the future of college football (Alvarez, Saban, Miles, and a few others) have stated that eventually we will be playing an all P4 schedule. When that time comes expect 9 conference games to be the norm and 1 game against a rival in a different conference, per conference to be permitted for those who have rivals elsewhere, and rotating games against schools from the other conferences for those who do not have rivals in those conferences. Such moves will permit Tech to continue to play Georgia, but regrettably not Auburn since both are in the SEC. But if OSU is in one conference and Texas another, and Oklahoma in yet a third then they could still schedule and play one another. The problem for Texas would be having OU and A&M in the same conference. There's the issue should the renewal of the rivalry ever occur.

The bold part is exactly what a Longhorn said to me over on the Oklahoma board.

Kind of need Texas to be on board with the overall plan in order for it to happen and they are very obstinate.

I think the OU crowd seems to think that by moving to the SEC first that they will call Texas's bluff and the Horns will throw in with the SEC as well. There are many old rivals to play now in the SEC and those games would all be must see for Texas home crowds. So I can see the temptation. What I don't buy about the tweet is Texas to the PAC and here's why. Unless ESPN gets a piece of the PACN they won't use their property to enhance the value of the PACN. They would rather multiply their content by placing the Horns in either the ACC or SEC should the Big 12 dissolve. So unless FOX and ESPN have bought equal shares of the PACN I don't see Texas heading West. If the SEC lands them both the semblance of balance among the P schools of college football will be lost. The SEC's content advantage and brand advantage could not be overcome. So I foresee ESPN not wanting to destabilize what they see as the need for 4 competitive regions for the maximizing of national interest and therefore advertising rates. That is why I have long held the brokering of the properties theory that I have put forth. If the Big 12 is divided up nobody is getting two brands. If the PAC insists on private ownership of their network they aren't expanding, at least not with brands.

Therefore Texas to the ACC with friends is an option whether in full or as an independent. If the SEC gets the markets they want out of that then OU and KU could head to the Big 10 with no negative repercussions for ESPN. There would at least be a balance between the three remaining conferences of the East. If Texas goes West because the PAC sells out to the networks and takes friends with them there then a lack of balance in the East will be difficult but not quite lethal to the ACC. If N.D. joins them in full then balance could be approximated. If Texas heads West then OU to the SEC is likely and KU to the Big 10 as well. West Virginia will go to the ACC. Then the SEC and Big 10 will each take a 16th and we rest. The Big 10 and SEC stay within spitting distance of each other and the ACC has an improved but distant third status, which they would be content with as long as they were stable.

Those are the likeliest permutations that I see. We'll have to wait and see how it breaks to have an inkling of how it plays out from there. The PAC selling a part of their network will signal the truth or falseness of this rumor.

(06-30-2015 06:44 PM)dayooper Wrote:  Paul Finebaum
Paul Finebaum – Verified account ‏@finebaum

According to @ESPN_Colin "The Big 5 in CFB is ready to be the Big 4... BigXII will evaporate, Oklahoma is SEC bound & the Pac12 wants Texas"
3:01 PM - 30 Jun 2015


Thoughts?

Finebaum is a tool for SEC. He would love to see the SEC as the only power conference, and the others disappear.

(06-30-2015 11:16 PM)bullet Wrote:  Oklahoma really can't have Oklahoma St. AND Texas in different conferences.

And I don't see Texas wanting to separate from OU. They've already separated from their other past big rivals-Arkansas, Houston and A&M.

And I don't see any other conference cooperating if it means Texas and OU go to the same place. If its the Big 10 or SEC, every other conference will do their best to sabotage it.

It could be a ploy as well to force Texas to give up the Longhorn Network, and bring a Big 12 Network.

(07-01-2015 12:37 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 11:16 PM)bullet Wrote:  Oklahoma really can't have Oklahoma St. AND Texas in different conferences.

And I don't see Texas wanting to separate from OU. They've already separated from their other past big rivals-Arkansas, Houston and A&M.

And I don't see any other conference cooperating if it means Texas and OU go to the same place. If its the Big 10 or SEC, every other conference will do their best to sabotage it.

If it is a ploy to bring in a conference network, that would probably favor expansion as expansion would increase the footprint.

It could be a ploy as well to force Texas to give up the Longhorn Network, and bring a Big 12 Network.

There are two programs, UT and OU, that would individually increase the per school value to any P5 conference. There are 8 schools that would individually decrease the per school value of any P5 conference. For as long as the GoR is intact, the BigXII will persist UNLESS a P5 conference figures out that it can increase per school revenue by bundling some of those 8 schools.

Really, it's only a question of whether or not the PAC or ACC can monetize those additions. Unless TCU, Baylor, ISU and KSU can deliver DTV, it's probably a no go for the PAC. The only small possibility I can see is if getting into Texas and the central time zone with schools like Baylor, TCU, KSU, ISU, and an Indy arrangement with UT would be enough to tip the scale for the ACC network.

Considering he's citing Colin Cowherd, who in 2010 proclaimed to the world UConn would be the 12th member of the B1G, I wouldn't put much stock in this.

(06-30-2015 11:06 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 10:22 PM)owl at the moon Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 09:15 PM)JRsec Wrote:  8. Both Cowherd and Finebaum work for ESPN. I would think this rumor has some merit. The Mouse has been at work behind the scenes for a while now.

That doesn't make the rumor true. But your point makes sense. Perhaps the intent is to one again spell apparent doom for the Big12 (before it gets dramatically "saved" again).

I wonder what SportsCenter ratings look like when realignment buzz is afoot.

ESPN wants this to happen. The threat of Oklahoma in the SEC should nothing happen until the GoR runs out is quite a threat. It also provides cover fire for Oklahoma because it makes it seem like them going to The Big Ten is a compromise for them.

Will you STOP doing that!? DAMNIT man! I HATE agreeing with you so completely on this!

(07-01-2015 02:13 AM)jrj84105 Wrote:  There are two programs, UT and OU, that would individually increase the per school value to any P5 conference. There are 8 schools that would individually decrease the per school value of any P5 conference. For as long as the GoR is intact, the BigXII will persist UNLESS a P5 conference figures out that it can increase per school revenue by bundling some of those 8 schools.

Really, it's only a question of whether or not the PAC or ACC can monetize those additions. Unless TCU, Baylor, ISU and KSU can deliver DTV, it's probably a no go for the PAC. The only small possibility I can see is if getting into Texas and the central time zone with schools like Baylor, TCU, KSU, ISU, and an Indy arrangement with UT would be enough to tip the scale for the ACC network.

Actually there are 5 programs that could add value depending upon where they go or the other 4 go. West Virginia could add to the ACC by adding to the football rep. Considering that WVU is paid more now than the ACC schools that is doable.

Oklahoma State could add some value to the SEC if Oklahoma went elsewhere and other valuable targets were not available.

Kansas adds value for basketball, but how much that would mean to the Big 10 or SEC is probably not that great. They might be able to work better for the PAC.

Texas and Oklahoma add anywhere.

Don't rule out the possibility that if Oklahoma and Texas decide to move now that they both have enough where with all to simply pay the negotiated exit value of the GOR. If both FOX and ESPN keep the rest of the Big 12 payouts for the remaining term of their contract the GOR buyout wouldn't be that much as damages would be more confined to perceived damages rather than an actual and provable deficit in earnings. I'm not sure if anyone knows how that would play out in court.

(06-30-2015 09:51 PM)NestaKnight1 Wrote:  You're high right? Rice couldn't even get out of CUSA, and has their asses handed to them regularly by the likes of Marshall. Lol, I mean c'mon man!

Wasn't it about 20 months ago Rice played Marshall, and whipped them, for the conference championship? Yeah, I think it was.

(07-01-2015 08:13 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-01-2015 02:13 AM)jrj84105 Wrote:  There are two programs, UT and OU, that would individually increase the per school value to any P5 conference. There are 8 schools that would individually decrease the per school value of any P5 conference. For as long as the GoR is intact, the BigXII will persist UNLESS a P5 conference figures out that it can increase per school revenue by bundling some of those 8 schools.

Really, it's only a question of whether or not the PAC or ACC can monetize those additions. Unless TCU, Baylor, ISU and KSU can deliver DTV, it's probably a no go for the PAC. The only small possibility I can see is if getting into Texas and the central time zone with schools like Baylor, TCU, KSU, ISU, and an Indy arrangement with UT would be enough to tip the scale for the ACC network.

Actually there are 5 programs that could add value depending upon where they go or the other 4 go. West Virginia could add to the ACC by adding to the football rep. Considering that WVU is paid more now than the ACC schools that is doable.

Oklahoma State could add some value to the SEC if Oklahoma went elsewhere and other valuable targets were not available.

Kansas adds value for basketball, but how much that would mean to the Big 10 or SEC is probably not that great. They might be able to work better for the PAC.

Texas and Oklahoma add anywhere.

Don't rule out the possibility that if Oklahoma and Texas decide to move now that they both have enough where with all to simply pay the negotiated exit value of the GOR. If both FOX and ESPN keep the rest of the Big 12 payouts for the remaining term of their contract the GOR buyout wouldn't be that much as damages would be more confined to perceived damages rather than an actual and provable deficit in earnings. I'm not sure if anyone knows how that would play out in court.

In my opinion, Kansas adds more value to SEC, Big 10, and Pac-12 than the ACC because each has a conference network. Basketball won't drive an ESPN/Fox deal much but conference networks get little premier content except in basketball.

(07-01-2015 08:30 AM)loki_the_bubba Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 09:51 PM)NestaKnight1 Wrote:  You're high right? Rice couldn't even get out of CUSA, and has their asses handed to them regularly by the likes of Marshall. Lol, I mean c'mon man!

Wasn't it about 20 months ago Rice played Marshall, and whipped them, for the conference championship? Yeah, I think it was.

He never responded to my post about Rice either once I put him in his place. I think he somehow didn't understand that rice was one of the richest schools in the country with Ivy academics.

Pretty funny having a directional commuter school fan talk smack to Rice. He got quiet once I let him know they have a 5+ Billion $ endowment.