http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2015/...boren.html

The only candidate who is both willing/available and in a position to bring added value to the league is BYU. So, for at least as long as BYU remains Independent you'll know that the BigXII is not serious about expansion.

(06-25-2015 09:49 AM)Native Georgian Wrote:  The only candidate who is both willing/available and in a position to bring added value to the league is BYU. So, for at least as long as BYU remains Independent you'll know that the BigXII is not serious about expansion.

I would say Cinci brings value too.

If they were smart, they'd grab BYU and Cinci.

There's just one problem with OU's point of view.

Everyone sold their soul to keep Texas in the Big 12. Texas calls the shots. If Texas wants 12 they go to 12. If Texas wants 10 they stay at 10.

Whatever Texas wants Texas gets. And everything I've heard is that Texas doesn't want to share their share of the pie with anyone else. I don't believe his comments are accurate that the money goes up if they add. That's just not how the TV thing works.

(06-25-2015 09:49 AM)Native Georgian Wrote:  The only candidate who is both willing/available and in a position to bring added value to the league is BYU. So, for at least as long as BYU remains Independent you'll know that the BigXII is not serious about expansion.

The whole idea of added value doesn't seem to be as big of an issue as most would have us believe.

Quote:He added that expansion would not mean a smaller piece of the financial pie for each Big 12 member, as the conference's TV contract accounts for the possibility of expansion.

"If we grow from 10 to 11 or 11 to 12, their payments to us grow proportionally," he said. "So everybody's share stays the same."

In its report on Boren's speech, Espn proposes North Dakota State as the leading BigXII expansion candidate. Really.

http://espn.go.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/...ck-in-news

In terms of the TV money split, I can see that staying constant with expansion, but it has also been mentioned that the playoff money and Ncaa money would in fact be diluted.

(06-25-2015 10:29 AM)cotton1991 Wrote:  In its report on Boren's speech, Espn proposes North Dakota State as the leading BigXII expansion candidate. Really.

http://espn.go.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/...ck-in-news

In terms of the TV money split, I can see that staying constant with expansion, but it has also been mentioned that the playoff money and Ncaa money would in fact be diluted.

You are dead on about the playoff and tourney dollars.

As for the TV, you have to consider which teams are they going to add that's going to keep them at $21 to $22 million per team that they are currently getting.

BYU's blockbuster TV deal with ESPN pays them about $4 to $5 million per year. So, even if you double what BYU is worth in a conference vice being an independent it's still going to decrease the average annual value per school. Likewise, if Cincinnati was that valuable of a TV property they would have already been selected by a P5.

The only way you could do this and not cause a decrease in value to the current members would be to force the two incoming members to agree that they would not be guaranteed any revenue sharing and would have to receive less than everyone else in the conference.

The Big12 is actually ill and will soon go on life support.

(06-25-2015 10:39 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  

(06-25-2015 10:29 AM)cotton1991 Wrote:  In its report on Boren's speech, Espn proposes North Dakota State as the leading BigXII expansion candidate. Really.

http://espn.go.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/...ck-in-news

In terms of the TV money split, I can see that staying constant with expansion, but it has also been mentioned that the playoff money and Ncaa money would in fact be diluted.

You are dead on about the playoff and tourney dollars.

As for the TV, you have to consider which teams are they going to add that's going to keep them at $21 to $22 million per team that they are currently getting.

BYU's blockbuster TV deal with ESPN pays them about $4 to $5 million per year. So, even if you double what BYU is worth in a conference vice being an independent it's still going to decrease the average annual value per school. Likewise, if Cincinnati was that valuable of a TV property they would have already been selected by a P5.

The only way you could do this and not cause a decrease in value to the current members would be to force the two incoming members to agree that they would not be guaranteed any revenue sharing and would have to receive less than everyone else in the conference.

But you also should probably consider that whichever team(s) is eventually added to the B12 their value will rise to a certain extent because they are now a member. BYU is worth $4-5 M to espn as an Independent, but they will be worth much more by virtue of B12 mmbership alone. I'm not sure if the difference would bridge the entire gap, but IDC because it's not my money.

(06-25-2015 08:38 AM)USMSTUD Wrote:  http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2015/...boren.html

Boren also stated it was something that should happen long term, not short term. In other words, don't look for anything to happen soon.

(06-25-2015 10:15 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  There's just one problem with OU's point of view.

Everyone sold their soul to keep Texas in the Big 12. Texas calls the shots. If Texas wants 12 they go to 12. If Texas wants 10 they stay at 10.

Whatever Texas wants Texas gets. And everything I've heard is that Texas doesn't want to share their share of the pie with anyone else. I don't believe his comments are accurate that the money goes up if they add. That's just not how the TV thing works.

This whole line of thought is getting old now. It's not that simple anymore. The Longhorn Network has been a complete failure and will not be around for much longer in its current format. Texas doesn't dominate on the field or on the court anymore and the conference hasn't suffered because of it.

(06-25-2015 10:48 AM)paintedblue2 Wrote:  

(06-25-2015 10:39 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  

(06-25-2015 10:29 AM)cotton1991 Wrote:  In its report on Boren's speech, Espn proposes North Dakota State as the leading BigXII expansion candidate. Really.

http://espn.go.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/...ck-in-news

In terms of the TV money split, I can see that staying constant with expansion, but it has also been mentioned that the playoff money and Ncaa money would in fact be diluted.

You are dead on about the playoff and tourney dollars.

As for the TV, you have to consider which teams are they going to add that's going to keep them at $21 to $22 million per team that they are currently getting.

BYU's blockbuster TV deal with ESPN pays them about $4 to $5 million per year. So, even if you double what BYU is worth in a conference vice being an independent it's still going to decrease the average annual value per school. Likewise, if Cincinnati was that valuable of a TV property they would have already been selected by a P5.

The only way you could do this and not cause a decrease in value to the current members would be to force the two incoming members to agree that they would not be guaranteed any revenue sharing and would have to receive less than everyone else in the conference.

But you also should probably consider that whichever team(s) is eventually added to the B12 their value will rise to a certain extent because they are now a member. BYU is worth $4-5 M to espn as an Independent, but they will be worth much more by virtue of B12 mmbership alone. I'm not sure if the difference would bridge the entire gap, but IDC because it's not my money.

Hey. Thanks. That's a great point of view. Did you happen to read the part I bolded above?

(06-25-2015 11:13 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  

(06-25-2015 10:48 AM)paintedblue2 Wrote:  

(06-25-2015 10:39 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  

(06-25-2015 10:29 AM)cotton1991 Wrote:  In its report on Boren's speech, Espn proposes North Dakota State as the leading BigXII expansion candidate. Really.

http://espn.go.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/...ck-in-news

In terms of the TV money split, I can see that staying constant with expansion, but it has also been mentioned that the playoff money and Ncaa money would in fact be diluted.

You are dead on about the playoff and tourney dollars.

As for the TV, you have to consider which teams are they going to add that's going to keep them at $21 to $22 million per team that they are currently getting.

BYU's blockbuster TV deal with ESPN pays them about $4 to $5 million per year. So, even if you double what BYU is worth in a conference vice being an independent it's still going to decrease the average annual value per school. Likewise, if Cincinnati was that valuable of a TV property they would have already been selected by a P5.

The only way you could do this and not cause a decrease in value to the current members would be to force the two incoming members to agree that they would not be guaranteed any revenue sharing and would have to receive less than everyone else in the conference.

But you also should probably consider that whichever team(s) is eventually added to the B12 their value will rise to a certain extent because they are now a member. BYU is worth $4-5 M to espn as an Independent, but they will be worth much more by virtue of B12 mmbership alone. I'm not sure if the difference would bridge the entire gap, but IDC because it's not my money.

Hey. Thanks. That's a great point of view. Did you happen to read the part I bolded above?

It doesn't matter how much value BYU or any team brings to the conference. The Big XII signed a 13 year deal with ESPN in 2012 that will pay each team $20 million a year. It has a pro rata clause in the contract that would match shares if league expands. The only loss in revenue would be from NCAA credits and CFP money getting split more ways, but this would be offset by revenue gained from having a conference championship game.

(06-25-2015 10:11 AM)Niner National Wrote:  I would say Cinci brings value too.

I'm not convinced. But maybe.

Quote:If they were smart, they'd grab BYU and Cinci.

That is not outside the realm of possibility. I admit that if they are looking for #12, then UC will be a big part of that discussion. But if they are looking for #12 they must be looking for #11, too. And in that case, it would be bizarre/irrational to not take BYU first.

(06-25-2015 10:18 AM)USMSTUD Wrote:  

(06-25-2015 09:49 AM)Native Georgian Wrote:  The only candidate who is both willing/available and in a position to bring added value to the league is BYU. So, for at least as long as BYU remains Independent you'll know that the BigXII is not serious about expansion.

The whole idea of added value doesn't seem to be as big of an issue as most would have us believe.

To the people who are actually making these decisions, what's more important than $$$?

(06-25-2015 11:29 AM)USMSTUD Wrote:  

(06-25-2015 11:13 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  

(06-25-2015 10:48 AM)paintedblue2 Wrote:  

(06-25-2015 10:39 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  

(06-25-2015 10:29 AM)cotton1991 Wrote:  In its report on Boren's speech, Espn proposes North Dakota State as the leading BigXII expansion candidate. Really.

http://espn.go.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/...ck-in-news

In terms of the TV money split, I can see that staying constant with expansion, but it has also been mentioned that the playoff money and Ncaa money would in fact be diluted.

You are dead on about the playoff and tourney dollars.

As for the TV, you have to consider which teams are they going to add that's going to keep them at $21 to $22 million per team that they are currently getting.

BYU's blockbuster TV deal with ESPN pays them about $4 to $5 million per year. So, even if you double what BYU is worth in a conference vice being an independent it's still going to decrease the average annual value per school. Likewise, if Cincinnati was that valuable of a TV property they would have already been selected by a P5.

The only way you could do this and not cause a decrease in value to the current members would be to force the two incoming members to agree that they would not be guaranteed any revenue sharing and would have to receive less than everyone else in the conference.

But you also should probably consider that whichever team(s) is eventually added to the B12 their value will rise to a certain extent because they are now a member. BYU is worth $4-5 M to espn as an Independent, but they will be worth much more by virtue of B12 mmbership alone. I'm not sure if the difference would bridge the entire gap, but IDC because it's not my money.

Hey. Thanks. That's a great point of view. Did you happen to read the part I bolded above?

It doesn't matter how much value BYU or any team brings to the conference. The Big XII signed a 13 year deal with ESPN in 2012 that will pay each team $20 million a year. It has a pro rata clause in the contract that would match shares if league expands. The only loss in revenue would be from NCAA credits and CFP money getting split more ways, but this would be offset by revenue gained from having a conference championship game.

This is correct. I had forgotten about that clause in the contract. Good catch.

You forgot about ULL. I hear they are shoe in for the BIG12. Just go read raginpagin.com and you will see they are going to get the invite.

Welp there is the Cajuns Big 12 spot!

(06-25-2015 10:15 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  There's just one problem with OU's point of view.

Everyone sold their soul to keep Texas in the Big 12. Texas calls the shots. If Texas wants 12 they go to 12. If Texas wants 10 they stay at 10.

Whatever Texas wants Texas gets. And everything I've heard is that Texas doesn't want to share their share of the pie with anyone else. I don't believe his comments are accurate that the money goes up if they add. That's just not how the TV thing works.

But neither Texas or the Big XII can afford to lose Oklahoma. They've already lost TX A&M, Missouri, Nebraska & Colorado. Oklahoma is the one (1) school with a very big stick in this relationship. Lose OU from the Big XII, and EVERYTHING changes for Texas.

The 11th spot in the Big XII should go to BYU. But why would the 12th spot go to Cincinnati instead of Houston? Houston has a bigger TV market, a shared history with most of the Big XII schools and a much better location for most of the schools already in the Big XII. About the only advantage I can see for adding Cincinnati would be as a travel partner for W VA.