(02-17-2015 01:52 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:32 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(02-16-2015 07:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

Quote:Confirmed 2015 QHPs: 10,520,242 as of 2/15/15
Estimated: 11.90M (9.04M via HCgov) as of 2/15/15
state-level targets (revised)
Estimated 2015 ACA Policy Enrollment: 32.0M
(18.6M Paid QHPs (10.4M Exchange-based +8.2M OFF-Exchange), 13.4M Medicaid/CHIP)

Don't upset them. It's only Tuesday.

It is amazing how posting some simple numbers without any editorial comment can get so many panties in a wad.

Because they want it to fail.

How on earth can people believe they are patriotic and at the same time want an American policy to fail?

True that.

(02-17-2015 01:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:32 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(02-16-2015 07:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

Quote:Confirmed 2015 QHPs: 10,520,242 as of 2/15/15
Estimated: 11.90M (9.04M via HCgov) as of 2/15/15
state-level targets (revised)
Estimated 2015 ACA Policy Enrollment: 32.0M
(18.6M Paid QHPs (10.4M Exchange-based +8.2M OFF-Exchange), 13.4M Medicaid/CHIP)

Don't upset them. It's only Tuesday.

It is amazing how posting some simple numbers without any editorial comment can get so many panties in a wad.

I'll admit that it wads my panties because I'm f*cked no matter which route I take and it's extremely frustrating. You find me something I can afford and I'll stop getting pissy in ACA threads, AND as a bonus, I'll unwad my underwear.

(02-17-2015 01:57 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:52 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:32 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(02-16-2015 07:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

Don't upset them. It's only Tuesday.

It is amazing how posting some simple numbers without any editorial comment can get so many panties in a wad.

Because they want it to fail.

How on earth can people believe they are patriotic and at the same time want an American policy to fail?

True that.

What's American about "Pay for my policy or pay a penalty?"

(02-17-2015 01:23 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:20 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:15 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 11:38 AM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 04:24 AM)GoodOwl Wrote:  For most citizens, if they actually take the time to do the math, paying even a high penalty New TAX is the smarter decision than actually enrolling in any "insurance" offered through the ACA. Wait until you get sick enough to make it more affordable to sign up than not. Pay cash out of pocket for any ancillary doctor visits/actual medical needs. In most cases, the vast majority of people can negotiate major discounts for medical care as most doctors/hospitals/providers (but not all of them) will take the certainty of significantly less cash up front for much less than having to file/get denied by ACA "insurance" panels.

The truth is that the smartest and sanest decision the vast majority (but not all) Americans can make these days is to go un"insured' as long as possible, and only sign up at the very last minute and only when healthcare cost becomes catastrophic. That is the best play to beat this shell game/ponzi scheme that the government has whitewashed the people with.

Just hope you don't get cancer or have a heart attack in the spring because you will be uninsured until January 1st 2016.

Not true, I can just marry some random dude and get covered immediately. After all, that is a qualifying life changing event. Then I'll quit my job, estimate my next years income at $0, and you can pay for my healthcare AND all my medical treatment. Im going for the finest treatment I can screw you out of as well, so start working some overtime. Or you will need to cut back on your wifes medication. I dont care which. Just be prepared to pay.

How's that plan sound to you?

Scam artists will always be out there. Thanks for the warning.

Scam. hahaha Its the law. It is Obamacare. Now, get to work and pay your fair share. I might stub my toe later today and need to go to the emergency room.

regardless of the wound and regardless of the insurance (or lack of).....'they' will take care of it.....

(02-17-2015 01:55 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-16-2015 07:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

Quote:Confirmed 2015 QHPs: 10,520,242 as of 2/15/15
Estimated: 11.90M (9.04M via HCgov) as of 2/15/15
state-level targets (revised)
Estimated 2015 ACA Policy Enrollment: 32.0M
(18.6M Paid QHPs (10.4M Exchange-based +8.2M OFF-Exchange), 13.4M Medicaid/CHIP)

The 2/16/15 update puts the confirmed number up to 10,526,912 and the estimated number at 12 million.

Wanna see that number go up to 20,000,000? Just have Obama cancel 10,000,000 more policies.

(02-17-2015 02:07 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:57 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:52 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:32 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  Don't upset them. It's only Tuesday.

It is amazing how posting some simple numbers without any editorial comment can get so many panties in a wad.

Because they want it to fail.

How on earth can people believe they are patriotic and at the same time want an American policy to fail?

True that.

What's American about "Pay for my policy or pay a penalty?"

That's how they do it in Kenya.

(02-17-2015 02:12 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:07 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:57 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:52 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  It is amazing how posting some simple numbers without any editorial comment can get so many panties in a wad.

Because they want it to fail.

How on earth can people believe they are patriotic and at the same time want an American policy to fail?

True that.

What's American about "Pay for my policy or pay a penalty?"

That's how they do it in Kenya.

I guess when you're able to get a subsidy, it's easy to support such a horrible, unaffordable plan. How arrogant he is to tell us that basically, if you don't pay for an insurance plan, that's ok, because I'll just gouge your stingy ass at tax season. How dare any of us want to pay for our own plan, or forgo insurance if we so choose. The nerve a free American has.

(02-17-2015 02:33 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:12 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:07 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:57 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:52 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  Because they want it to fail.

How on earth can people believe they are patriotic and at the same time want an American policy to fail?

True that.

What's American about "Pay for my policy or pay a penalty?"

That's how they do it in Kenya.

I guess when you're able to get a subsidy, it's easy to support such a horrible, unaffordable plan. How arrogant he is to tell us that basically, if you don't pay for an insurance plan, that's ok, because I'll just gouge your stingy ass at tax season. How dare any of us want to pay for our own plan, or forgo insurance if we so choose. The nerve a free American has.

Just for the sake of clarity Congress actually are the ones that did that. Remember only the Legislative branch can make law. The President just signs it or vetoes it.

(02-17-2015 02:06 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:32 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(02-16-2015 07:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

Quote:Confirmed 2015 QHPs: 10,520,242 as of 2/15/15
Estimated: 11.90M (9.04M via HCgov) as of 2/15/15
state-level targets (revised)
Estimated 2015 ACA Policy Enrollment: 32.0M
(18.6M Paid QHPs (10.4M Exchange-based +8.2M OFF-Exchange), 13.4M Medicaid/CHIP)

Don't upset them. It's only Tuesday.

It is amazing how posting some simple numbers without any editorial comment can get so many panties in a wad.

I'll admit that it wads my panties because I'm f*cked no matter which route I take and it's extremely frustrating. You find me something I can afford[b][/b] and I'll stop getting pissy in ACA threads, AND as a bonus, I'll unwad my underwear.

Didn't I already do that for you a few months back.

(02-17-2015 02:46 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:33 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:12 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:07 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:57 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  True that.

What's American about "Pay for my policy or pay a penalty?"

That's how they do it in Kenya.

I guess when you're able to get a subsidy, it's easy to support such a horrible, unaffordable plan. How arrogant he is to tell us that basically, if you don't pay for an insurance plan, that's ok, because I'll just gouge your stingy ass at tax season. How dare any of us want to pay for our own plan, or forgo insurance if we so choose. The nerve a free American has.

Just for the sake of clarity Congress actually are the ones that did that. Remember only the Legislative branch can make law. The President just signs it or vetoes it.

So what is obamacare? Because the Affordable Care Act is lacking greatly in the "affordable" part for lower middle, and middle class Americans. I thought this was designed to help us.

(02-17-2015 02:49 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:06 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:32 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(02-16-2015 07:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

Don't upset them. It's only Tuesday.

It is amazing how posting some simple numbers without any editorial comment can get so many panties in a wad.

I'll admit that it wads my panties because I'm f*cked no matter which route I take and it's extremely frustrating. You find me something I can afford and I'll stop getting pissy in ACA threads, AND as a bonus, I'll unwad my underwear.

Didn't I already do that for you a few months back.

What is the cheapest plan you can get me, dawgitall? You get me something I can afford and you can be my agent.

Remember, I can't afford the plan my employer offers, and I don't qualify for a subsidy, BECAUSE my employer offers health insurance.

Edit: I'm 36, I'm single, I'm a non smoker, and I'm in the Webster Parish area of Louisiana.

(02-17-2015 02:49 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:46 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:33 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:12 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:07 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  What's American about "Pay for my policy or pay a penalty?"

That's how they do it in Kenya.

I guess when you're able to get a subsidy, it's easy to support such a horrible, unaffordable plan. How arrogant he is to tell us that basically, if you don't pay for an insurance plan, that's ok, because I'll just gouge your stingy ass at tax season. How dare any of us want to pay for our own plan, or forgo insurance if we so choose. The nerve a free American has.

Just for the sake of clarity Congress actually are the ones that did that. Remember only the Legislative branch can make law. The President just signs it or vetoes it.

So what is obamacare? Because the Affordable Care Act is lacking greatly in the "affordable" part for lower middle, and middle class Americans. I thought this was designed to help us.

I'll give you an example. My wife's cousin's wife has gone a few years without health insurance. They hate Obama. She has some health issues of late, a stroke, possible early stages of Dementia and a few other things. They hate Obama (did I already mention that?). Anyway her Mother-in-law hates Obama. Pretty much everybody hates Obama. They have been stressed financially because of health expenses and the Mother-in-law who doesn't have much financially has had to help them out some. My wife's cousin's wife finally figured out that she had to have insurance but dang it was going to be over $300 a month and she just couldn't afford it. So they are all bitching and complaining and low and behold they were doing some of this in front of my Mother-in-law. My Mother-in-law doesn't hate Obama. She asked them a simple question. "Why don't you go on line to the exchange and see if you can find an affordable policy"? Well that just wouldn't do because remember, they hate Obama and nothing that he had anything to do with was worth squat. But finally, facing $300+ premiums or no insurance at all they went to the exchange and checked it out. She now has a comprehensive health insurance policy with a reasonable deductible and co-pay that runs just under $100 a month after the tax credits. And they all still hate Obama!

They are lower middle class and they are being helped considerably.

(02-17-2015 02:52 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:49 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:06 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:32 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  Don't upset them. It's only Tuesday.

It is amazing how posting some simple numbers without any editorial comment can get so many panties in a wad.

I'll admit that it wads my panties because I'm f*cked no matter which route I take and it's extremely frustrating. You find me something I can afford and I'll stop getting pissy in ACA threads, AND as a bonus, I'll unwad my underwear.

Didn't I already do that for you a few months back.

What is the cheapest plan you can get me, dawgitall? You get me something I can afford and you can be my agent.

Remember, I can't afford the plan my employer offers, and I don't qualify for a subsidy, BECAUSE my employer offers health insurance.

Edit: I'm 36, I'm single, I'm a non smoker, and I'm in the Webster Parish area of Louisiana.

Well I am iced in today, but dang LSU I looked all that stuff up for you one time already. I was planning on starting to put together a big pot of chili so can't you do it this time? What is affordable is relative to what you value. I imagine you can find a bare bones bronze plan or maybe even a silver for under $300 a month. But if you haven't at least started applying before now it is to late. You are stuck without until the first of next year unless you have a life changing qualifying event. There is a possibility that when you file your taxes you will get a last second chance to avoid the tax by purchasing a policy then but it is unclear if that will be offered or not. I wouldn't count on it.

(02-17-2015 03:24 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:52 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:49 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:06 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 01:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  It is amazing how posting some simple numbers without any editorial comment can get so many panties in a wad.

I'll admit that it wads my panties because I'm f*cked no matter which route I take and it's extremely frustrating. You find me something I can afford and I'll stop getting pissy in ACA threads, AND as a bonus, I'll unwad my underwear.

Didn't I already do that for you a few months back.

What is the cheapest plan you can get me, dawgitall? You get me something I can afford and you can be my agent.

Remember, I can't afford the plan my employer offers, and I don't qualify for a subsidy, BECAUSE my employer offers health insurance.

Edit: I'm 36, I'm single, I'm a non smoker, and I'm in the Webster Parish area of Louisiana.

Well I am iced in today, but dang LSU I looked all that stuff up for you one time already. I was planning on starting to put together a big pot of chili so can't you do it this time? What is affordable is relative to what you value. I imagine you can find a bare bones bronze plan or maybe even a silver for under $300 a month. But if you haven't at least started applying before now it is to late. You are stuck without until the first of next year unless you have a life changing qualifying event. There is a possibility that when you file your taxes you will get a last second chance to avoid the tax by purchasing a policy then but it is unclear if that will be offered or not. I wouldn't count on it.

Yeah and what you found was the same as what I found.

I was being 100% serious, but I can see you don't have anything but some sarcastic bullshiit for a response so I'll mosey on out of this thread and stop wasting both of our time.

(02-17-2015 03:37 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 03:24 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:52 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:49 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 02:06 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  I'll admit that it wads my panties because I'm f*cked no matter which route I take and it's extremely frustrating. You find me something I can afford and I'll stop getting pissy in ACA threads, AND as a bonus, I'll unwad my underwear.

Didn't I already do that for you a few months back.

What is the cheapest plan you can get me, dawgitall? You get me something I can afford and you can be my agent.

Remember, I can't afford the plan my employer offers, and I don't qualify for a subsidy, BECAUSE my employer offers health insurance.

Edit: I'm 36, I'm single, I'm a non smoker, and I'm in the Webster Parish area of Louisiana.

Well I am iced in today, but dang LSU I looked all that stuff up for you one time already. I was planning on starting to put together a big pot of chili so can't you do it this time? What is affordable is relative to what you value. I imagine you can find a bare bones bronze plan or maybe even a silver for under $300 a month. But if you haven't at least started applying before now it is to late. You are stuck without until the first of next year unless you have a life changing qualifying event. There is a possibility that when you file your taxes you will get a last second chance to avoid the tax by purchasing a policy then but it is unclear if that will be offered or not. I wouldn't count on it.

Yeah and what you found was the same as what I found.

I was being 100% serious, but I can see you don't have anything but some sarcastic bullshiit for a response so I'll mosey on out of this thread and stop wasting both of our time.

Ok but I'm 100% serious as well. What is considered affordable is relative. If $300 a month isn't affordable to you then I guess you will have to just pay the tax and hope you don't have any major medical expenses. If you make 50k a year you will have to pay 1k tax. If that is the case then you saved $2,600 if you have no medical expenses. Please just don't get sick this year.

(02-16-2015 07:49 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-16-2015 07:47 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  Dawg, that's like kicking everyone out of their homes and then announcing the next day that home sales are up.

No it is just the numbers, but spin it whatever way you like.

Actually, the numbers themselves are spin... as is the headline.

I could report how many people were born today, or I could report how many people died. That choice, in and of itself is a 'spin' on population growth.

OF COURSE large numbers of people are complying with the new laws
1) It's the law and most people obey the law
2) for the vast majority of these people, compliance is free.

The left certainly does take this number to imply some sort of 'happiness'... but the reality is that in the months after your state required every driver to carry auto liability insurance, the number of people with auto liability insurance increased significantly. This isn't a measure of anything more than the number of people complying with the law.

I'd also note that any poor person who presents to an Emergency room without insurance is 'enrolled' in such a policy... NOT because they want it, but because the hospital wants to get paid for the services they are required to deliver... and this is how they attempt to get paid. We used to do the same thing through Medicaid, and nobody ever reported, much less 'bragged' about how many people had signed up for Medicaid assistance.

(02-17-2015 03:55 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  Ok but I'm 100% serious as well. What is considered affordable is relative. If $300 a month isn't affordable to you then I guess you will have to just pay the tax and hope you don't have any major medical expenses. If you make 50k a year you will have to pay 1k tax. If that is the case then you saved $2,600 if you have no medical expenses. Please just don't get sick this year.

Not bothering to read the rest of this thread... but it is important to note that you can pay the tax AND spend $2500 on healthcare and STILL be ahead of the game... and you could have spent $3500 last year and still been ahead... and of course that ignores the multiple OOPs for the bronze plan. If you have a $2500 OOP, that's $6,000.

Essentially a relatively healthy person buying a bronze plan for $300/month is spending $3600 on 2-3 office visits per year plus a catastrophic policy that most people will rarely/barely use.

Far too many people just don't get what insurance is... fundamentally.

(02-17-2015 05:39 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 03:55 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  Ok but I'm 100% serious as well. What is considered affordable is relative. If $300 a month isn't affordable to you then I guess you will have to just pay the tax and hope you don't have any major medical expenses. If you make 50k a year you will have to pay 1k tax. If that is the case then you saved $2,600 if you have no medical expenses. Please just don't get sick this year.

Not bothering to read the rest of this thread... but it is important to note that you can pay the tax AND spend $2500 on healthcare and STILL be ahead of the game... and you could have spent $3500 last year and still been ahead... and of course that ignores the multiple OOPs for the bronze plan. If you have a $2500 OOP, that's $6,000.

Essentially a relatively healthy person buying a bronze plan for $300/month is spending $3600 on 2-3 office visits per year plus a catastrophic policy that most people will rarely/barely use.

Far too many people just don't get what insurance is... fundamentally.

As I have said repeatedly, affordability is relative. If someone is comfortable with rolling the dice health wise then just pay the 2% tax. They will get health care regardless, but if they have a major medical issue that year they may well deplete their savings if they have any and go deeply into debt. All I ask is that they pay their bills (after negotiations) and don't leave the doctors and hospitals eating the cost, thus costing the taxpayers. If paying for insurance knowing that you might not use at least an amount equal to what you pay out is okay because you are protected if expenses exceed what you spend then buy it. There will always be people that choose the former, just take full responsibility if you do.

(02-17-2015 06:06 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 05:39 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 03:55 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  Ok but I'm 100% serious as well. What is considered affordable is relative. If $300 a month isn't affordable to you then I guess you will have to just pay the tax and hope you don't have any major medical expenses. If you make 50k a year you will have to pay 1k tax. If that is the case then you saved $2,600 if you have no medical expenses. Please just don't get sick this year.

Not bothering to read the rest of this thread... but it is important to note that you can pay the tax AND spend $2500 on healthcare and STILL be ahead of the game... and you could have spent $3500 last year and still been ahead... and of course that ignores the multiple OOPs for the bronze plan. If you have a $2500 OOP, that's $6,000.

Essentially a relatively healthy person buying a bronze plan for $300/month is spending $3600 on 2-3 office visits per year plus a catastrophic policy that most people will rarely/barely use.

Far too many people just don't get what insurance is... fundamentally.

As I have said repeatedly, affordability is relative. If someone is comfortable with rolling the dice health wise then just pay the 2% tax. They will get health care regardless, but if they have a major medical issue that year they may well deplete their savings if they have any and go deeply into debt. All I ask is that they pay their bills (after negotiations) and don't leave the doctors and hospitals eating the cost, thus costing the taxpayers. If paying for insurance knowing that you might not use at least an amount equal to what you pay out is okay because you are protected if expenses exceed what you spend then buy it. There will always be people that choose the former, just take full responsibility if you do.

now we're getting into the philosophical side.....

if one doesn't have means to support life, then one doesn't have means......that means the doctors that went to school have to suffer and believe in the 'creed' they took......lmfao....just like raising ones right hand before serving testimony or becoming a priest

therefore, why would 'those' give a shite? (sorry, prolly not how lib prof taught thingys)

there is no doubt a multi-tiered system is asinine (between those that can and those that cannot)

however, one is going to pay for it regardless.....if one is 50 yrs of age, one has seen how the cost of insurance has changed over time.....

it's amusing that people think obummer is the reason......he has zero to do with it.....

I am going to continue to say the premise has to happen or businesses have to be destroyed for equitable survival....

I challenge anyone to argue otherwise.....(unless you're in my camp of something that can't talked about yet)

euthanasia after limiting birth.....but that's a hundo down the road where people pray to god their kids don't live long enough to see.....dammit boy....I said it......lmfao.....

(02-17-2015 06:20 PM)stinkfist Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 06:06 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 05:39 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(02-17-2015 03:55 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  Ok but I'm 100% serious as well. What is considered affordable is relative. If $300 a month isn't affordable to you then I guess you will have to just pay the tax and hope you don't have any major medical expenses. If you make 50k a year you will have to pay 1k tax. If that is the case then you saved $2,600 if you have no medical expenses. Please just don't get sick this year.

Not bothering to read the rest of this thread... but it is important to note that you can pay the tax AND spend $2500 on healthcare and STILL be ahead of the game... and you could have spent $3500 last year and still been ahead... and of course that ignores the multiple OOPs for the bronze plan. If you have a $2500 OOP, that's $6,000.

Essentially a relatively healthy person buying a bronze plan for $300/month is spending $3600 on 2-3 office visits per year plus a catastrophic policy that most people will rarely/barely use.

Far too many people just don't get what insurance is... fundamentally.

As I have said repeatedly, affordability is relative. If someone is comfortable with rolling the dice health wise then just pay the 2% tax. They will get health care regardless, but if they have a major medical issue that year they may well deplete their savings if they have any and go deeply into debt. All I ask is that they pay their bills (after negotiations) and don't leave the doctors and hospitals eating the cost, thus costing the taxpayers. If paying for insurance knowing that you might not use at least an amount equal to what you pay out is okay because you are protected if expenses exceed what you spend then buy it. There will always be people that choose the former, just take full responsibility if you do.

now we're getting into the philosophical side.....

if one doesn't have means to support life, then one doesn't have means......that means the doctors that went to school have to suffer and believe in the 'creed' they took......lmfao....just like raising ones right hand before serving testimony or becoming a priest

therefore, why would 'those' give a shite? (sorry, prolly not how lib prof taught thingys)

there is no doubt a multi-tiered system is asinine (between those that can and those that cannot)

however, one is going to pay for it regardless.....if one is 50 yrs of age, one has seen how the cost of insurance has changed over time.....

it's amusing that people think obummer is the reason......he has zero to do with it.....

I am going to continue to say the premise has to happen or businesses have to be destroyed for equitable survival....

I challenge anyone to argue otherwise.....(unless you're in my camp of something that can't talked about yet)

euthanasia after limiting birth.....but that's a hundo down the road where people pray to god their kids don't live long enough to see.....dammit boy....I said it......lmfao.....

huh?