(01-28-2015 04:26 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:10 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 02:55 PM)memphissince86 Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 02:08 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 02:02 PM)Sundanceuiuc Wrote:  To drag this back from invective (there are some good conversations here despite ourselves), I do find the discussion on 'identity' interesting. I will say that identity is not just a nomenclature of '2-3' or 'DDM'. It can be a spiritual

There are things that you know your team will do. I will say that last year's team did have an identity of sharing the ball and being very unselfish.

When people say we don't have an identity, they aren't being perceptive or honest. The poster that listed the 15 teams that have an identity listed quite a few that either play man to man or zone. We play almost exclusively man to man defense so that is definitely an identity. We are known as athletic. Traditionally, we score a lot of points, shoot a high field goal percentage and rank highly in steals per game.

I also remember last year from the coach himself....that we would PRESS all the time b/c of our guards or whatever etc. It didn't happen and that tells me you don't know how you want to play after 6 yrs.

So does he have a defined style of play every year, or does he change or want to change it every year?

IMO you should pick a style, stick with it, and recruit the players that fit your style.

And still no one has been able to give a definitive answer to what our identity or style is.

And I gave you 15 teams that do.....and there's more.

You can define all teams as athletic, doesn't mean that's a style.

The team would have been able to press under the old rules. The new rules were a killer.

I don't buy that as the reason for abandoning the press. Teach them how to press without fouling.

That's silly. VCU presses.

Hell, WVU has become "Press" Virginia this year because Huggins recognized he didn't have the 1-5 talent to sit back and play his regular brand of play. He DID realize he had one really good player (Staten) and nine other guys who are about the same. So he plays 10 guys like a mofo.

Double point: pressing still works under whatever rules and coaches (no matter how old) can evaluate talent to best fit what they need to accomplish and modify accordingly.

(01-28-2015 04:34 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:26 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:10 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 02:55 PM)memphissince86 Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 02:08 PM)Stammers Wrote:  When people say we don't have an identity, they aren't being perceptive or honest. The poster that listed the 15 teams that have an identity listed quite a few that either play man to man or zone. We play almost exclusively man to man defense so that is definitely an identity. We are known as athletic. Traditionally, we score a lot of points, shoot a high field goal percentage and rank highly in steals per game.

I also remember last year from the coach himself....that we would PRESS all the time b/c of our guards or whatever etc. It didn't happen and that tells me you don't know how you want to play after 6 yrs.

So does he have a defined style of play every year, or does he change or want to change it every year?

IMO you should pick a style, stick with it, and recruit the players that fit your style.

And still no one has been able to give a definitive answer to what our identity or style is.

And I gave you 15 teams that do.....and there's more.

You can define all teams as athletic, doesn't mean that's a style.

The team would have been able to press under the old rules. The new rules were a killer.

I don't buy that as the reason for abandoning the press. Teach them how to press without fouling.

That's silly. VCU presses.

Hell, WVU has become "Press" Virginia this year because Huggins recognized he didn't have the 1-5 talent to sit back and play his regular brand of play. He DID realize he had one really good player (Staten) and nine other guys who are about the same. So he plays 10 guys like a mofo.

Double point: pressing still works under whatever rules and coaches (no matter how old) can evaluate talent to best fit what they need to accomplish and modify accordingly.

Dixon was an elite defender at Missouri. Did he all of a sudden get untaught how to defend? Geron was called the best defender at the summer camps. JJ was an above average defender. Crawford didn't work overly hard but he was intuitive and had a nose for the ball.

The rules killed us plain and simple. Dixon and Geron spent half their time trying to jump out of the way to not foul on defense. The new rules didn't suit our players.

(01-28-2015 04:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:34 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:26 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:10 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 02:55 PM)memphissince86 Wrote:  I also remember last year from the coach himself....that we would PRESS all the time b/c of our guards or whatever etc. It didn't happen and that tells me you don't know how you want to play after 6 yrs.

So does he have a defined style of play every year, or does he change or want to change it every year?

IMO you should pick a style, stick with it, and recruit the players that fit your style.

And still no one has been able to give a definitive answer to what our identity or style is.

And I gave you 15 teams that do.....and there's more.

You can define all teams as athletic, doesn't mean that's a style.

The team would have been able to press under the old rules. The new rules were a killer.

I don't buy that as the reason for abandoning the press. Teach them how to press without fouling.

That's silly. VCU presses.

Hell, WVU has become "Press" Virginia this year because Huggins recognized he didn't have the 1-5 talent to sit back and play his regular brand of play. He DID realize he had one really good player (Staten) and nine other guys who are about the same. So he plays 10 guys like a mofo.

Double point: pressing still works under whatever rules and coaches (no matter how old) can evaluate talent to best fit what they need to accomplish and modify accordingly.

Dixon was an elite defender at Missouri. Did he all of a sudden get untaught how to defend? Geron was called the best defender at the summer camps. JJ was an above average defender. Crawford didn't work overly hard but he was intuitive and had a nose for the ball.

The rules killed us plain and simple. Dixon and Geron spent half their time trying to jump out of the way to not foul on defense. The new rules didn't suit our players.

I agree...and that's where a strong team of assistant coaches comes in handy. Coaches who can teach a defender to alter his style of playing defense within the confines of whatever new rules exist, and still remain an elite lock-down defender. Can't put that on the players...teaching players to adjust to the rules is the responsibility of the coaches.

(01-28-2015 04:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:34 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:26 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:10 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 02:55 PM)memphissince86 Wrote:  I also remember last year from the coach himself....that we would PRESS all the time b/c of our guards or whatever etc. It didn't happen and that tells me you don't know how you want to play after 6 yrs.

So does he have a defined style of play every year, or does he change or want to change it every year?

IMO you should pick a style, stick with it, and recruit the players that fit your style.

And still no one has been able to give a definitive answer to what our identity or style is.

And I gave you 15 teams that do.....and there's more.

You can define all teams as athletic, doesn't mean that's a style.

The team would have been able to press under the old rules. The new rules were a killer.

I don't buy that as the reason for abandoning the press. Teach them how to press without fouling.

That's silly. VCU presses.

Hell, WVU has become "Press" Virginia this year because Huggins recognized he didn't have the 1-5 talent to sit back and play his regular brand of play. He DID realize he had one really good player (Staten) and nine other guys who are about the same. So he plays 10 guys like a mofo.

Double point: pressing still works under whatever rules and coaches (no matter how old) can evaluate talent to best fit what they need to accomplish and modify accordingly.

Dixon was an elite defender at Missouri. Did he all of a sudden get untaught how to defend? Geron was called the best defender at the summer camps. JJ was an above average defender. Crawford didn't work overly hard but he was intuitive and had a nose for the ball.

The rules killed us plain and simple. Dixon and Geron spent half their time trying to jump out of the way to not foul on defense. The new rules didn't suit our players.

The rules didn't kill us. Teaching the players the correct way to play within the confines of said rules is what killed us.

(01-28-2015 04:46 PM)RCM1029 Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:34 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:26 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:10 PM)Stammers Wrote:  The team would have been able to press under the old rules. The new rules were a killer.

I don't buy that as the reason for abandoning the press. Teach them how to press without fouling.

That's silly. VCU presses.

Hell, WVU has become "Press" Virginia this year because Huggins recognized he didn't have the 1-5 talent to sit back and play his regular brand of play. He DID realize he had one really good player (Staten) and nine other guys who are about the same. So he plays 10 guys like a mofo.

Double point: pressing still works under whatever rules and coaches (no matter how old) can evaluate talent to best fit what they need to accomplish and modify accordingly.

Dixon was an elite defender at Missouri. Did he all of a sudden get untaught how to defend? Geron was called the best defender at the summer camps. JJ was an above average defender. Crawford didn't work overly hard but he was intuitive and had a nose for the ball.

The rules killed us plain and simple. Dixon and Geron spent half their time trying to jump out of the way to not foul on defense. The new rules didn't suit our players.

I agree...and that's where a strong team of assistant coaches comes in handy. Coaches who can teach a defender to alter his style of playing defense within the confines of whatever new rules exist, and still remain an elite lock-down defender. Can't put that on the players...teaching players to adjust to the rules is the responsibility of the coaches.

As was noted earlier, Memphis under Pastner has a gambling style defense. They overplay the lanes, jump the passes on the perimeter, etc. That gets ya a lot of steals, but it also puts ya in contact with the offensive player.

317 other schools had to play by the same rules. Most schools that "did what they" before the rule change kept on keepin on after.

Again, the failure at the top to put his players in positions to succeed is the issue, but the blame always has to fall somewhere else.

(01-28-2015 04:57 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:46 PM)RCM1029 Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:34 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:26 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  I don't buy that as the reason for abandoning the press. Teach them how to press without fouling.

That's silly. VCU presses.

Hell, WVU has become "Press" Virginia this year because Huggins recognized he didn't have the 1-5 talent to sit back and play his regular brand of play. He DID realize he had one really good player (Staten) and nine other guys who are about the same. So he plays 10 guys like a mofo.

Double point: pressing still works under whatever rules and coaches (no matter how old) can evaluate talent to best fit what they need to accomplish and modify accordingly.

Dixon was an elite defender at Missouri. Did he all of a sudden get untaught how to defend? Geron was called the best defender at the summer camps. JJ was an above average defender. Crawford didn't work overly hard but he was intuitive and had a nose for the ball.

The rules killed us plain and simple. Dixon and Geron spent half their time trying to jump out of the way to not foul on defense. The new rules didn't suit our players.

I agree...and that's where a strong team of assistant coaches comes in handy. Coaches who can teach a defender to alter his style of playing defense within the confines of whatever new rules exist, and still remain an elite lock-down defender. Can't put that on the players...teaching players to adjust to the rules is the responsibility of the coaches.

As was noted earlier, Memphis under Pastner has a gambling style defense. They overplay the lanes, jump the passes on the perimeter, etc. That gets ya a lot of steals, but it also puts ya in contact with the offensive player.

317 other schools had to play by the same rules. Most schools that "did what they" before the rule change kept on keepin on after.

Again, the failure at the top to put his players in positions to succeed is the issue, but the blame always has to fall somewhere else.

All we heard about during the off-season was how we were going to become a pressing team. We pressed for like what, 2 seconds? I call BS on blaming that on the rules change, but if that really is your reasoning, then why continually have your guards up on their man 35 ft from the basket picking up senseless fouls and allowing blow-bys...which, in turn, resulted in your bigs picking up senseless fouls?

(01-28-2015 05:04 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:57 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:46 PM)RCM1029 Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:34 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  That's silly. VCU presses.

Hell, WVU has become "Press" Virginia this year because Huggins recognized he didn't have the 1-5 talent to sit back and play his regular brand of play. He DID realize he had one really good player (Staten) and nine other guys who are about the same. So he plays 10 guys like a mofo.

Double point: pressing still works under whatever rules and coaches (no matter how old) can evaluate talent to best fit what they need to accomplish and modify accordingly.

Dixon was an elite defender at Missouri. Did he all of a sudden get untaught how to defend? Geron was called the best defender at the summer camps. JJ was an above average defender. Crawford didn't work overly hard but he was intuitive and had a nose for the ball.

The rules killed us plain and simple. Dixon and Geron spent half their time trying to jump out of the way to not foul on defense. The new rules didn't suit our players.

I agree...and that's where a strong team of assistant coaches comes in handy. Coaches who can teach a defender to alter his style of playing defense within the confines of whatever new rules exist, and still remain an elite lock-down defender. Can't put that on the players...teaching players to adjust to the rules is the responsibility of the coaches.

As was noted earlier, Memphis under Pastner has a gambling style defense. They overplay the lanes, jump the passes on the perimeter, etc. That gets ya a lot of steals, but it also puts ya in contact with the offensive player.

317 other schools had to play by the same rules. Most schools that "did what they" before the rule change kept on keepin on after.

Again, the failure at the top to put his players in positions to succeed is the issue, but the blame always has to fall somewhere else.

All we heard about during the off-season was how we were going to become a pressing team. We pressed for like what, 2 seconds? I call BS on blaming that on the rules change, but if that really is your reasoning, then why continually have your guards up on their man 35 ft from the basket picking up senseless fouls and allowing blow-bys...which, in turn, resulted in your bigs picking up senseless fouls?

Yep. Or bringing the bigs up top to follow their man on some stupid pick.

(01-28-2015 04:57 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:46 PM)RCM1029 Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:34 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:26 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  I don't buy that as the reason for abandoning the press. Teach them how to press without fouling.

That's silly. VCU presses.

Hell, WVU has become "Press" Virginia this year because Huggins recognized he didn't have the 1-5 talent to sit back and play his regular brand of play. He DID realize he had one really good player (Staten) and nine other guys who are about the same. So he plays 10 guys like a mofo.

Double point: pressing still works under whatever rules and coaches (no matter how old) can evaluate talent to best fit what they need to accomplish and modify accordingly.

Dixon was an elite defender at Missouri. Did he all of a sudden get untaught how to defend? Geron was called the best defender at the summer camps. JJ was an above average defender. Crawford didn't work overly hard but he was intuitive and had a nose for the ball.

The rules killed us plain and simple. Dixon and Geron spent half their time trying to jump out of the way to not foul on defense. The new rules didn't suit our players.

I agree...and that's where a strong team of assistant coaches comes in handy. Coaches who can teach a defender to alter his style of playing defense within the confines of whatever new rules exist, and still remain an elite lock-down defender. Can't put that on the players...teaching players to adjust to the rules is the responsibility of the coaches.

As was noted earlier, Memphis under Pastner has a gambling style defense. They overplay the lanes, jump the passes on the perimeter, etc. That gets ya a lot of steals, but it also puts ya in contact with the offensive player.

317 other schools had to play by the same rules. Most schools that "did what they" before the rule change kept on keepin on after.

Again, the failure at the top to put his players in positions to succeed is the issue, but the blame always has to fall somewhere else.

Yep...I think we agree.

(01-28-2015 05:06 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:04 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:57 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:46 PM)RCM1029 Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  Dixon was an elite defender at Missouri. Did he all of a sudden get untaught how to defend? Geron was called the best defender at the summer camps. JJ was an above average defender. Crawford didn't work overly hard but he was intuitive and had a nose for the ball.

The rules killed us plain and simple. Dixon and Geron spent half their time trying to jump out of the way to not foul on defense. The new rules didn't suit our players.

I agree...and that's where a strong team of assistant coaches comes in handy. Coaches who can teach a defender to alter his style of playing defense within the confines of whatever new rules exist, and still remain an elite lock-down defender. Can't put that on the players...teaching players to adjust to the rules is the responsibility of the coaches.

As was noted earlier, Memphis under Pastner has a gambling style defense. They overplay the lanes, jump the passes on the perimeter, etc. That gets ya a lot of steals, but it also puts ya in contact with the offensive player.

317 other schools had to play by the same rules. Most schools that "did what they" before the rule change kept on keepin on after.

Again, the failure at the top to put his players in positions to succeed is the issue, but the blame always has to fall somewhere else.

All we heard about during the off-season was how we were going to become a pressing team. We pressed for like what, 2 seconds? I call BS on blaming that on the rules change, but if that really is your reasoning, then why continually have your guards up on their man 35 ft from the basket picking up senseless fouls and allowing blow-bys...which, in turn, resulted in your bigs picking up senseless fouls?

Yep. Or bringing the bigs up top to follow their man on some stupid pick.

The way our bigs play the pick and roll is beyond stupid.

(01-28-2015 05:25 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:06 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:04 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:57 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:46 PM)RCM1029 Wrote:  I agree...and that's where a strong team of assistant coaches comes in handy. Coaches who can teach a defender to alter his style of playing defense within the confines of whatever new rules exist, and still remain an elite lock-down defender. Can't put that on the players...teaching players to adjust to the rules is the responsibility of the coaches.

As was noted earlier, Memphis under Pastner has a gambling style defense. They overplay the lanes, jump the passes on the perimeter, etc. That gets ya a lot of steals, but it also puts ya in contact with the offensive player.

317 other schools had to play by the same rules. Most schools that "did what they" before the rule change kept on keepin on after.

Again, the failure at the top to put his players in positions to succeed is the issue, but the blame always has to fall somewhere else.

All we heard about during the off-season was how we were going to become a pressing team. We pressed for like what, 2 seconds? I call BS on blaming that on the rules change, but if that really is your reasoning, then why continually have your guards up on their man 35 ft from the basket picking up senseless fouls and allowing blow-bys...which, in turn, resulted in your bigs picking up senseless fouls?

Yep. Or bringing the bigs up top to follow their man on some stupid pick.

The way our bigs play the pick and roll is beyond stupid.

Agreed. The real question is why is it allowed to continue to happen?

(01-28-2015 05:28 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:25 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:06 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:04 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 04:57 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  As was noted earlier, Memphis under Pastner has a gambling style defense. They overplay the lanes, jump the passes on the perimeter, etc. That gets ya a lot of steals, but it also puts ya in contact with the offensive player.

317 other schools had to play by the same rules. Most schools that "did what they" before the rule change kept on keepin on after.

Again, the failure at the top to put his players in positions to succeed is the issue, but the blame always has to fall somewhere else.

All we heard about during the off-season was how we were going to become a pressing team. We pressed for like what, 2 seconds? I call BS on blaming that on the rules change, but if that really is your reasoning, then why continually have your guards up on their man 35 ft from the basket picking up senseless fouls and allowing blow-bys...which, in turn, resulted in your bigs picking up senseless fouls?

Yep. Or bringing the bigs up top to follow their man on some stupid pick.

The way our bigs play the pick and roll is beyond stupid.

Agreed. The real question is why is it allowed to continue to happen?

Because the coach has a gigantic ego and thinks it's the right way?

(01-28-2015 12:00 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  CUSA was what 11th or 12th in conference RPI during those years?

oh phooey

Josh himself said it was the best conference in America as far as he was concerned. The league was full of great coaches, quality players, well coached teams.

Ben Braun had won like 2000 games and Kameni was a pro.

(01-28-2015 05:31 PM)MemphisTiger15 Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 12:00 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  CUSA was what 11th or 12th in conference RPI during those years?

oh phooey

Josh himself said it was the best conference in America as far as he was concerned. The league was full of great coaches, quality players, well coached teams.

Ben Braun had won like 2000 games and Kameni was a pro.

Ben Braun, I'm sure, is also a dear, dear friend.

(01-28-2015 05:33 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:31 PM)MemphisTiger15 Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 12:00 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  CUSA was what 11th or 12th in conference RPI during those years?

oh phooey

Josh himself said it was the best conference in America as far as he was concerned. The league was full of great coaches, quality players, well coached teams.

Ben Braun had won like 2000 games and Kameni was a pro.

Ben Braun, I'm sure, is also a dear, dear friend.

EVERYBODY'S GOOD!!!!

(01-28-2015 05:30 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:28 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:25 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:06 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:04 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  All we heard about during the off-season was how we were going to become a pressing team. We pressed for like what, 2 seconds? I call BS on blaming that on the rules change, but if that really is your reasoning, then why continually have your guards up on their man 35 ft from the basket picking up senseless fouls and allowing blow-bys...which, in turn, resulted in your bigs picking up senseless fouls?

Yep. Or bringing the bigs up top to follow their man on some stupid pick.

The way our bigs play the pick and roll is beyond stupid.

Agreed. The real question is why is it allowed to continue to happen?

Because the coach has a gigantic ego and thinks it's the right way?

If executed properly, hedging on the screen can be a very effective strategy...Our bigs tend to hedge too aggressively and stay too long...

We also seem to want to hedge against every team...If the ball handler is not that good of a shooter the guard should just go under the screen. You have to adjust your gameplan based on the team you play

(01-28-2015 05:40 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:30 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:28 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:25 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:06 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  Yep. Or bringing the bigs up top to follow their man on some stupid pick.

The way our bigs play the pick and roll is beyond stupid.

Agreed. The real question is why is it allowed to continue to happen?

Because the coach has a gigantic ego and thinks it's the right way?

If executed properly, hedging on the screen can be a very effective strategy...Our bigs tend to hedge too aggressively and stay too long...

We also seem to want to hedge against every team...If the ball handler is not that good of a shooter the guard should just go under the screen. You have to adjust your gameplan based on the team you play

Josh worries about the 3 too much. Sometimes it's warranted but we ain't playing Klay Thompson or Kyle Korver every night.

(01-28-2015 05:40 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:30 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:28 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:25 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 05:06 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  Yep. Or bringing the bigs up top to follow their man on some stupid pick.

The way our bigs play the pick and roll is beyond stupid.

Agreed. The real question is why is it allowed to continue to happen?

Because the coach has a gigantic ego and thinks it's the right way?

If executed properly, hedging on the screen can be a very effective strategy...Our bigs tend to hedge too aggressively and stay too long...

We also seem to want to hedge against every team...If the ball handler is not that good of a shooter the guard should just go under the screen. You have to adjust your gameplan based on the team you play

You've nailed it. We don't adjust. We didn't adjust last year when our guards were up on their man 35 ft from the basket. We have yet to adjust this year when we hedge out to half court almost. It seems like we never have a plan B.

(01-27-2015 01:34 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  

(01-27-2015 01:32 PM)Mimi Wrote:  Pastner has also been good.

This down year among many good ones notwithstanding.

But yes- he has not been great to date and that makes this down year seem worse than it is.

Dude, seriously, we lost to CBU...

At the end of the season I don't think you'll find it ................


.